EOS M4 - full frame?

Jolyon Ralph

Jolyon Ralph

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As those who've been following what I write will probably know, I've got a bit of fascination for the EOS M mirrorless cameras.

Some recent evidence has come up which leads me to believe that a full-frame EOS M camera is going to come sooner rather than later.

Add into that plenty of informed (but otherwise idle) speculation and you have this article I wrote:

http://www.everyothershot.com/will-the-eos-m4-be-full-frame/

Would YOU buy a full-frame EOS M camera?
 
So if the M4 is full frame what happens to all the current M lenses?

I don't think it will happen, especially as Canon have always treated the whole M system in a lukewarm way.
 
The article explains what I think will happen with the existing lenses. They'll still work with full-frame bodies, but in crop mode.

This isn't really new, Sony E mount lenses work in the same way - cropping APS-C E mount lenses when fitted to a full-frame body.
 
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Jolyon Ralph said:
The article explains what I think will happen with the existing lenses. They'll still work with full-frame bodies, but in crop mode.
Click to expand...

Other than a small gem of info in your article:

The only real reason why EF-S lenses don’t work on full-frame cameras is that the EF-S lenses protrude too far into the camera and can collide with the mirror.
Click to expand...

I think this would be the same for M lenses on full frame.

Your author even says:
Will the EOS M4 be full frame?

Probably not. Canon are about to launch a new EF-M lens (EF-M 15-45mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM) which again is a cropped sensor lens. I doubt they’d bother if they were going to skip to full-frame immediately.
Click to expand...

It's not going to happen, EOS M is the poor ginger step child, Canon aren't going to suddenly make a flagship full frame M device for a long time, if ever.
 
There are things with the M series that make it work for the people that use them, one of them is the small form, For those that want a mirrorless FF camera, id expect they want some sort of viewfinder as this will be the norm for FF shooters. I dont think the hotshoe adapter is a good alternative to an in body EVF. The sensor size may not impact the lens mount but it could affect the bodies overall dimensions. With both of these its then a SONY A7 competitor. But the Sony has the glass for its mount.

What about glass? for it to become a selling point it will need a compliment of glass, how long has fuji been developing the x mount lenses? it may happen but i think it will not be wit the the next M series body.
 
A full-frame M would be a very nice addition, and I've seen rumours somewhere (Canonrumors?) that Canon have big plans for the range. I'm not getting my hopes up though.
 
Dave1 said:
I think this would be the same for M lenses on full frame.
Click to expand...

No. There isn't a mirror to collide with :) EF-S lenses will work perfectly fine on a full-frame camera without a mirror, it's only a problem of the image circle being too small to fill the sensor. Some third-party EF-S lenses, such as the 1st generation 8mm Samyang Fisheye can be connected onto a full-frame body because they don't protrude that far but don't get anywhere close to filling the image, you have to crop out effectively the APS-C area of the image when using the lens - but it's still perfectly useful.

Canon must be worried about relying on mirror technology when the rest of the world is moving towards mirrorless. The Eos M was certainly not a major commercial success for Canon, but they tried it again with the M2 (not a huge difference) and the M3 (a much better camera). And now they've finally launched the M3 in the US. Let's wait and see what happens... I'm perfectly set to jump to Sony if Canon DON'T launch a FF mirrorless next year, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.
 
Jolyon Ralph said:
No. There isn't a mirror to collide with :) EF-S lenses will work perfectly fine on a full-frame camera without a mirror, it's only a problem of the image circle being too small to fill the sensor.
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Are you just being argumentative? Especially only quoting the first line of my reply.

Dave1 said:
I think this would be the same for M lenses on full frame.

Your author even says:
Will the EOS M4 be full frame?
Probably not. Canon are about to launch a new EF-M lens (EF-M 15-45mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM) which again is a cropped sensor lens. I doubt they’d bother if they were going to skip to full-frame immediately.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Note the comment referring to cropped sensor lenses.

As it looks like you have a closed mind it's probably not worth further discussion.

You go and wait for the full frame EOS M4 over there ------------>
 
Dave1 said:
As it looks like you have a closed mind it's probably not worth further discussion.

You go and wait for the full frame EOS M4 over there ------------>
Click to expand...

Wow. And I thought this was a friendly place. Ok, I'm not going to rise to it, I'm going to be friendly. I don't want to argue, and I am glad you took the time to comment to my post.

Anyway, as I was saying there's no reason that EF-S lenses with an adaptor OR EF-M lenses without an adaptor would NOT work on a full frame camera.

The sensor is in the same position, the mount is the same, the only difference is the sensor is wider. Unlike with a DSLR there's no physical reason for it not to work other than if they changed the mount or put some electronic block to stop it working, both of which would be counterproductive.

Maybe I'm a little more optimistic about the prospects of a FF EOS mirrorless than you. Maybe you're right. But the fact that Canon aren't abandoning the mirrorless format after three models that have all received relatively lacklustre reviews in the mainstream press makes me hope that they're learning from their mistakes and will do better.
 
Canon EOS M cameras are far more popular in Asia than they are in the west. I saw more Canon Ms whilst I was in HK the last 3 years compared to most of the mirrorless cameras excluding Sony and Oly.
There is no reason why the SLR Canon lenses shouldn't fit on a new M, My old EOS-M v1 worked fine with EF lenses with the supplied adapter. As long as the register distance is the same then any SLR lens (manual) should be able to be bolted on..

No idea whether they'd bother with a FF EOS-M, But if there is a market, then why not.

Take a chlll pill, kids.
 
if it is full frame what sensor would it use ???? a new one ???
 
I can't see Canon wanting to produce a full framed M body. The whole point of the M is that it's small and convenient, especially with its native lenses. Start putting on big full frame lenses on it and bang, straight away you've gone from a small convenient camera to a big heavy lump! I know you can do this with the existing m's if you choose but if Canon make a full frame version they would surely be needing to make native FF lenses for it?

Makes no sense.

It'll be like buying a 4x4 to go off road then lowering it.
 
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odd jim said:
The whole point of the M is that it's small and convenient, especially with its native lenses. Start putting on big full frame lenses on it and bang, straight away you've gone from a small convenient camera to a big heavy lump!
Click to expand...

Earlier this year I went up to London for the day and took my M with my 16-35f4L - I had a Manfrotto Pixi with me, and found that using that was the most comfortable way to shoot (by using it as a grip), given the size and weight disparity between body and lens. The images were reasonable, but when I went up again a couple of weeks ago I left the M at home and took my 5D2 instead.
 
With the rather mediocre performance of the M and the limited native lenses I think that anything other than a quantum leap forward in both performance and lens choice would leave it so far behind the Sony offerings that I can't imagine anyone other than Canon die hards taking a serious look at it.
 
My favourite EF Lens combination with the EOS M3 is the 100mm f/2.8L Macro - it sounds on paper like a terrible combination, but I really like it.

But other than that, stick the 22mm EF-M on the camera and you really can't complain about portability.

But I do agree that Canon have a lot of catching up to do. Sony's special masterstroke was the exclusive deal with Zeiss/
 
will be a great concept buit has serious competition from sony and leica
 
woof woof said:
With the rather mediocre performance of the M and the limited native lenses I think that anything other than a quantum leap forward in both performance and lens choice would leave it so far behind the Sony offerings that I can't imagine anyone other than Canon die hards taking a serious look at it.
Click to expand...
I agree, when the original M was launched Sony was on their 3rd generation nex and yet the M fell short of even the first gen nex cameras. Too little too late for Canon.
 
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