Beginner Finding photographers to work with!!

Taylor Gathercole

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Taylor
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I've been trying to contact photographers in my area(Norfolk) to ask if they needed a assistance but no one wants one. And it's rather annoying, as I'm trying to get as much experience in as many styles as I can. I'm just wondering if I'm doing something wrong?
I've told them I'm 15, ect That I'll be going to College next year and I look to proceed my future in photography. (Photo journalism to be specific!). I do get offers to do work for free magazines every now and then but that's only one style, I'm interested in opening my mind to different styles and different types of photography. What am I do wrong? Or am I just being out of luck choosing the wrong photographers?

Thanks.
 
You're 15 - so legally still a child which presents certain problems for a business that might offer you a placement. You probably need to address your concerns in your approach. When Connections were still running the work experience placements in Norfolk they were fantastic to deal with as an employer - but since they've been lost to the cuts I'm generally advising clients to not offer work experience placements because the schools are placing the least experienced members of staff in charge and providing no support whatsoever. But you do have one significant advantage, I can already tell you're interested in the job you'll want work experience of - which doesn't apply to 90%+ of students doing WE.

How are you making your approach?
  • Is it to a named person? - if it's to "Dear Sir/Madam" it's going in the bin as soon as it's opened. A shaved chimp with internet access should be able to identify a relevant named contact in pretty much any business these days.
  • Is it in writing? - email is to easy to press X to delete, pen and paper shows a strong degree of effort on your part.
  • Are you clearly defining what you want from the placement and what the employer might get out of it? - don't tell a commercial photographer that you want "as much experience in as many styles as I can" because it sounds like you haven't made any effort to find out what they do before you've approached them (see shaved chimpcomment above).
  • Are you persisitant? - one letter might not be enough, you might need to get innovative.

Practicalities - where are you in Norfolk? - it's a big county, and where can you get to? - it's a big empty county with s**t public transport connections.
 
If you want to go into photo journalism . Why not use your experiences of trying to get a position. To write an article and try to sell it. Not only would this give you practice but also a possible foot in the door with a publisher.
 
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You're 15 - so legally still a child which presents certain problems for a business that might offer you a placement. You probably need to address your concerns in your approach. When Connections were still running the work experience placements in Norfolk they were fantastic to deal with as an employer - but since they've been lost to the cuts I'm generally advising clients to not offer work experience placements because the schools are placing the least experienced members of staff in charge and providing no support whatsoever. But you do have one significant advantage, I can already tell you're interested in the job you'll want work experience of - which doesn't apply to 90%+ of students doing WE.

How are you making your approach?
  • Is it to a named person? - if it's to "Dear Sir/Madam" it's going in the bin as soon as it's opened. A shaved chimp with internet access should be able to identify a relevant named contact in pretty much any business these days.
  • Is it in writing? - email is to easy to press X to delete, pen and paper shows a strong degree of effort on your part.
  • Are you clearly defining what you want from the placement and what the employer might get out of it? - don't tell a commercial photographer that you want "as much experience in as many styles as I can" because it sounds like you haven't made any effort to find out what they do before you've approached them (see shaved chimpcomment above).
  • Are you persisitant? - one letter might not be enough, you might need to get innovative.

Practicalities - where are you in Norfolk? - it's a big county, and where can you get to? - it's a big empty county with s**t public transport connections.

Hi Alastair. Thanks for looking! Being 15 is an issue I can understand. I'm very interested in Photography, have been for a fair while.

I can cross off the first one, as I didn't say Dear Sir/Madam! I have done all of mine via email, so I should try using pen and paper? From just reading what I sent to photographers, I did state I was interested in the area they were offering, but I can truthfully say I don't think I was clear enough. I can be persistent, if need be and if this is what it takes, then yes.

I'm in Thetford area, so I have easy access to places like Norwich, Cambridge, Kings Lynn etc.

If you want to go into photo journalism . Why not use your experiences of trying to get a position. To write an article and try to sell it. Not only would this give you practice but also a possible foot in the door with a publisher.

Okay thank you, I'll give it a try. I know it's not going to be easy as it sounds.
 
I think you need to be taking the pen and paper approach, and putting quite a bit of effort into just one or two target businesses. I don't know any studios in Thetford but I can think of a studio in Norwich that might be worth a a try. Going for a studio is likely to be better than a one-man band, because they generally have a higher activity level, your time can be divided between several people, and there's also the chance to get more production/admin experience as well - professional photography is very much a business first and photography second so gaining admin experience is more useful than it sounds.

If you want help the letters you're sending or the name of the studio I'm thinking of in Norwich, drop me a PM.
 
Its just very hard finding anything at the moment,as you start College you will be able to find placement i would think much easier,sometime its just a matter of patient good luck :)

Sorry plus what other style are you looking in try ?
 
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a pro would be wary of taking a child on any jobs as his public liability insurance may not cover you also you would be a big risk.
also when you show someone how to do your job some of them then go off to do that job full time so you end up getting lass work as they are now doing it
so you are in effect cutting your own throat taking out a trainee it may sound harsh but its the truth.
 
Try local sports events, they are great for improving skills. Whack them on here and I'm sure that people will offer advice.
 
I think you need to be taking the pen and paper approach, and putting quite a bit of effort into just one or two target businesses. I don't know any studios in Thetford but I can think of a studio in Norwich that might be worth a a try. Going for a studio is likely to be better than a one-man band, because they generally have a higher activity level, your time can be divided between several people, and there's also the chance to get more production/admin experience as well - professional photography is very much a business first and photography second so gaining admin experience is more useful than it sounds.

If you want help the letters you're sending or the name of the studio I'm thinking of in Norwich, drop me a PM.

Okay I will go about writing hand letters. I will be going to College in Norwich, so that would be quite handy! There is one Studio here in Thetford, which I have recently tried to contact but got nout all back from them. Okay cool. I'll message you later tonight.

Its just very hard finding anything at the moment,as you start College you will be able to find placement i would think much easier,sometime its just a matter of patient good luck :)

Sorry plus what other style are you looking in try ?

Yeah, I can tell from trying! You're not only one that's said that, going to college will help I suppose. As they get you into stuff, which is part of the units they set. Yep, sure am going to have to be patient!

Other styles, well obviously Photo Journalism as already said. But I'd be open to anything, things like Portraiture, Weddings (I have been booked to do a wedding next year in July), Commercial, and so on!!

a pro would be wary of taking a child on any jobs as his public liability insurance may not cover you also you would be a big risk.
also when you show someone how to do your job some of them then go off to do that job full time so you end up getting lass work as they are now doing it
so you are in effect cutting your own throat taking out a trainee it may sound harsh but its the truth.

I suppose so, I can exactly help that and I'm going to obviously just have to wait.. But saying that, someone might just give me ago! :)

Try local sports events, they are great for improving skills. Whack them on here and I'm sure that people will offer advice.

Yes, that's a good idea! Now it's just trying to know when they are on! hmmm.
 
If you want to be a photo journalist why are you trying to find placements with studios etc - that isnt going to help with photojournalism ?

Also realistically if you are asking for work experience, then you aren't an assistant (note the spelling), so what is actually in it for the pro concerned ?

My strong suggestion would be to shelve that idea until after your 16th birthday when the college will help you find a placement relevant to your course (they may have contacts that can open doors you'll never open on your own) (also once you are 16 try to get your own transport like a 50cc scooter)

In the mean time if you want to "open your mind to different forms of photography" you don't need a placement to do that - books, magazines, this forum, others, photographers websites, blogs etc and then get out and practice practice practice

Now it's just trying to know when they are on! .

Show some initiative - google is your freind despite knowing nothing about the area and being 400 miles away I found 20 different options in the thetford area (including all the mainstream sports at amateur and more unusual ones like dog sledding) in less than a minute... i'm not going to spoon feed them to you as that wouldnt do you any favours , as a photojournnalist you'd need initiative in spades, so start developing some now by doing your own research
 
Be gentle with him!
Friend (note the spelling), bsm is right, I google cycling events, running events and hey presto - your dairy ;) is full of dates!
 
If you want to be a photo journalist why are you trying to find placements with studios etc - that isnt going to help with photojournalism ?

Also realistically if you are asking for work experience, then you aren't an assistant (note the spelling), so what is actually in it for the pro concerned ?

My strong suggestion would be to shelve that idea until after your 16th birthday when the college will help you find a placement relevant to your course (they may have contacts that can open doors you'll never open on your own) (also once you are 16 try to get your own transport like a 50cc scooter)

In the mean time if you want to "open your mind to different forms of photography" you don't need a placement to do that - books, magazines, this forum, others, photographers websites, blogs etc and then get out and practice practice practice



Show some initiative - google is your freind despite knowing nothing about the area and being 400 miles away I found 20 different options in the thetford area (including all the mainstream sports at amateur and more unusual ones like dog sledding) in less than a minute... i'm not going to spoon feed them to you as that wouldnt do you any favours , as a photojournnalist you'd need initiative in spades, so start developing some now by doing your own research

Just because I want to go into photojournalism doesn't mean I can't try out other things? Personally I think more experience I have the better, no matter what field it's in. This Saturday, I've been ask to do photography for two events going on in Wymondham and Attleborough, ones a Swimming event and the other a boxing match, of which both will be published in the local magazine. So that's a start.

Yeah that's very true. Transport wise, we'll have to see what happens. Money can be an issue.

And I do open my mind to other styles, I go out at least 4/5 times a weekday to do Landscape, Wildlife, anything really. Prime examples are on my flickr - https://www.flickr.com/photos/taylorgathercole/

I know how to find them, it was more a figure of speech than anything. I'll also go to local leisure centers are look at whats coming up and also ask them too.

Be gentle with him!
Friend (note the spelling), bsm is right, I google cycling events, running events and hey presto - your dairy ;) is full of dates!

It's fine, I'd rather him be straight up with me! I'll go have a look, actually forgot to say, I did email a group the other day that organize MTB racing events in Thetford Forest, and I asked about photographing the events and they agreed to it!!
 
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Just because I want to go into photojournalism doesn't mean I can't try out other things? Personally I think more experience I have the better, no matter what field it's in. This Saturday, I've been ask to do photography for two events going on in Wymondham and Attleborough, ones a Swimming event and the other a boxing match, of which both will be published in the local magazine. So that's a start.

Yeah that's very true. Transport wise, we'll have to see what happens. Money can be an issue.

And I do open my mind to other styles, I go out at least 4/5 times a weekday to do Landscape, Wildlife, anything really. Prime examples are on my flickr - https://www.flickr.com/photos/taylorgathercole/

I know how to find them, it was more a figure of speech than anything. I'll also go to local leisure centers are look at whats coming up and also ask them too.



It's fine, I'd rather him be straight up with me! I'll go have a look, actually forgot to say, I did email a group the other day that organize MTB racing events in Thetford Forest, and I asked about photographing the events and they agreed to it!!

Well thats a good start,the 2 events (y)
 
Another suggestion. If you do want some studio work experience, sometimes a knock on the door or a follow up telephone call after your letter can help.

When I was emplpoyed as a Health & Safety Officer, I used to be heavily involved with WE placements as I worked in a large manufacturing company. The persistent ones or eager, easily showed through, thats hard to do sometimes via email. Sometimes it's good to talk and with technology advancement its getting less and less all the time.
 
when you read the bio's of people who've made it big in photo journalism the unifying factor is nearly always that they've made it happen for themselves, and they've taken big risks to do it and not taken no for an answer or worried about obstacles

money a problem - get a job (yes i know thats dificult at 15 - but at 16 more options are open to you)

difficult to find placements - make your own way, find something to cover and cover it well

don't know where to find it - do your own research

and so forth

with regard to the W.E question , no it doesnt mean you can't try other things - but if you want to suceed in one feild single mindedly pursuing that feild is a better use of time than dipping your toe in lots of different things.

and that aside the other point is that if you want people to give you a W.E placement you've got to approach it from the point of view of whats in it for them, they don't give a monkeys about what your dreams hopes and desires, what they want to know is how giving you a placement will benefit them... and the answer is tha it won't in a meaningful way, then this explains why you struggle with getting a placement
 
Okay fair enough. By no means am I saying you have suggested that I have taken no as an Answer, all I'm doing is asking other photographers to make myself better in getting to where I want to be. Sometimes more brains is better than one. Anyway, I understand where your coming from, and yes you are right.

I'll do my research :)
 
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as well as @Alastair 's great advice I would also add that its worth talking about what you bring that will benefit the photographer. Simply saying you want experince probably won't get too far. Explaining what you bring in exchange for that may yield better results
 
I would say one of the things your doing wrong is contacting local photographers , I'd not be keen teaching someone what has taken me years of money, trial and error to learn for them to undercut me in 2 years time and become my competition and also live at the end of my street.
Why not try further afield , may require more travelling but if your keen.......
 
you need to do this through your school then they carry the insurance can.
No, they don't. Students on work experience come under the employers insurance whilst on the employers workplace/premises - in the same way that a general visitor does.
 
I'm at the other end of the age scale and would LOVE someone to go to an event with, get back and sort out the images, discuss what looks good or not, how I/we might improve etc etc.
Maybe I should put an ad in the lonely photographers section of the newspaper ....
 
The schools I have dealt with provide insurance cover but as you like
The insurance industry and the Association of British Insurers have agreed that students on work experience are to be considered as employees for the purposes of insurance - see https://www.abi.org.uk/Insurance-an...-liability-insurance/Work-experience-students

Schools are generally the worst places to get accurate information about work experience from - see my earlier comment about responsibilty usually being assigned to the least qualified member of staff.

Contrary to some earlier comments, I generally find that most employers want to give work experience placements but are put off by:
  • Previous experience with disinterested students
  • Poor/nonexistant support from enabling agencies (as I mentioned earlier, Connections made WE in Norfolk very easy for employers but now they've been axed and it's down to the school to organise it's not worth the hassle)
  • Schools not getting their act together - dropping in students at short notice, not providing basic information necessary to allow the employer to comply with relevant legislation
 
I'm at the other end of the age scale and would LOVE someone to go to an event with, get back and sort out the images, discuss what looks good or not, how I/we might improve etc etc.
Maybe I should put an ad in the lonely photographers section of the newspaper ....

Try the find a buddy section. If you live in or near south Manchester I would be happy to have company some times.
 
On the Sheffield/Barnsley border - Dark Peak bit. My better half is into the portrait/landscape when on our travels. I prefer sports (not football, rugby etc) - running, fell races, cycling and just had a go at cyclo-cross.
Try to get over the "feel" of the sport and improving bit by bit. Find Lightroom 5 a good prog but have so much to learn about what is the optimum image I could achieve from a "neg".
 
I'm at the other end of the age scale and would LOVE someone to go to an event with, get back and sort out the images, discuss what looks good or not, how I/we might improve etc etc.
Maybe I should put an ad in the lonely photographers section of the newspaper ....
Where's the "find a buddy" section?

Or check out the meeting place, there is always something happening around and about :)

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/meeting-place.45/
 
as well as @Alastair 's great advice I would also add that its worth talking about what you bring that will benefit the photographer. Simply saying you want experince probably won't get too far. Explaining what you bring in exchange for that may yield better results


This ^^^

If you can't give me a good reason that'll benefit the photographer, and ideally their clients as well, then you're just a hindrance and a potential problem - that's how most will see it

Offer something useful the the photographer you want to work with and they MIGHT invite you along for a chat to see if they like you - sell yourself and the benefit of having you along or you've no chance

Dave
 
This ^^^

If you can't give me a good reason that'll benefit the photographer, and ideally their clients as well, then you're just a hindrance and a potential problem - that's how most will see it

Offer something useful the the photographer you want to work with and they MIGHT invite you along for a chat to see if they like you - sell yourself and the benefit of having you along or you've no chance

That

although without wanting to be harsh its hard to see what benefit a 15 year old with no experience, basic equipment, and no transport can bring... saying "well I can carry your bags , and i make great tea" isnt going to cut it with most togs

This is why i say wait and do it through the college - as the tog may get more out of a relationship with the college , and thus be more willing to take W.E students
 
That

although without wanting to be harsh its hard to see what benefit a 15 year old with no experience, basic equipment, and no transport can bring... saying "well I can carry your bags , and i make great tea" isnt going to cut it with most togs

This is why i say wait and do it through the college - as the tog may get more out of a relationship with the college , and thus be more willing to take W.E students

There have been time when i wish somebody could carry my bags :D
 
I take the wife to do that ;)
 
I take the wife to do that ;)

Did take the other half on two working photos trips abroad,1st on wasn't to bad,2nd one by the time we were on the the plane home,let say we were sitting in different sit all the way back,she was a pain in the bum the whole trip :(:D
 
That

although without wanting to be harsh its hard to see what benefit a 15 year old with no experience, basic equipment, and no transport can bring... saying "well I can carry your bags , and i make great tea" isnt going to cut it with most togs

True - that's not a benefit, I'm not yet an OAP :D

I'd be wanting an obvious skill-set, like... Learning how to light a cross-lit OCF set-up and having the gear too so I can just walk my couple over and shoot without any time delay myself; or

Being able to show me a set-up for a mini-studio type shoot of an evening with a simple approach, no wires, and evidence of making it work well too; or

Show me a good set of Street Photography images showing a great style, composition, timing & technique that'd make me think you shooting the guests like that would be useful to add as an option to my B&Gs

But bag carrying, no

Oh and whatever you did as an offer, I'd want a link to somewhere I could see a range of images you've taken (including of people) that showed you were far better than just a snapper with a nice camera - think of that benefit you can offer, post it for comment and good luck to you :)

Dave
 
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