First couple of hours with the Panasonic GX80 - First impressions.

Crotal Bell said:
So a 12-60 lens would help and be better at DOF than my 100-300?
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It depends on the subject and how you frame it and is dependent on understanding perspective. I'll not try to explain it because the forum's resident experts/nerds/geeks will say I'm wrong. So I'll let them confuse you with science.
 
Ed Sutton said:
It depends on the subject and how you frame it and is dependent on understanding perspective. I'll not try to explain it because the forum's resident experts/nerds/geeks will say I'm wrong. So I'll let them confuse you with science.
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I didn't try either Ed, thought about taking a couple of photos to show it then thought better of that too.
My understanding came from a book that explained it very well, it just clicked there and then.
 
Crotal Bell said:
I was after as much as possible in focus near and far, it's something I struggle with.
All comments welcome and taken in the right spirit.
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These were taken with the 100-300 on a G80.
Photos are not intended to be good, just to show what happens.
Unfortunately the light changed slightly in the time it too me to change from f5.6 to f22
The yellow numbers show the distance from where I was standing
While f22 wouldn't be right for the bird, if the main point was to get as much in focus as possible, it is still useable.
Not disagreeing in any way with what has been said, just that sometimes it is worth trying outside the ideal to get what you want.

f5.6s.jpg
f22s.jpg
 
tijuana taxi said:
Alan mentioned perspective, that's another can of worms and often not understood properly.
It changes the whole "perspective" if you keep the subject filling the same space in the frame.
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I find perspective easy to understand as you don't need a camera to see it. You see it naturally all the time and you see it as you walk towards or away from a scene.
 
woof woof said:
I find perspective easy to understand as you don't need a camera to see it. You see it naturally all the time and you see it as you walk towards or away from a scene.
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We are talking about how it translates to photography which many people don't find easy to grasp .
 
tijuana taxi said:
We are talking about how it translates to photography which many people don't find easy to grasp .
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Bit it's the same isn't it?

Perspective is decided by viewer to subject distance, you don't even need a camera to see it. For example imagine a person standing in front of a building in the background. As you walk away the building looks bigger relative to the person and it towers way over their head but move closer and the person looks bigger relative to the building and the building now hardly comes up to their waistline. You can see this as you walk down a road.

Unless I've missed something obvious, and I don't think I have :D

Anyway. My point is that perspective might be an easier thing to get to grips with than DoF and circles of confusion.
 
tijuana taxi said:
Using those larger apertures has made a big difference, bird and car are good examples of that.
Its hard to get front to back sharpness with a long focal length like the one used in no 4

Alan mentioned perspective, that's another can of worms and often not understood properly.
It changes the whole "perspective" if you keep the subject filling the same space in the frame.

My advice would be get the 12-60 and as you suggested try it at different focal lengths and apertures.
You will see the changes it makes and then commit that knowledge to memory or even a notebook for reference.

Going well and even the learning is fun, start to see things in a whole new way.
Concentrate on one aspect at a time, too confusing if you try to learn everything at once.
As you progress new issues will crop up and they can be dealt with then and the knowledge already accrued.

One other thing might be to find someone local who is more experienced to give you a few tips.
Ages ago I went for a stroll with a novice and hopefully passed on some useful advice, think it helped a bit.
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Thanks Rich
 
Sangoma said:
These were taken with the 100-300 on a G80.
Photos are not intended to be good, just to show what happens.
Unfortunately the light changed slightly in the time it too me to change from f5.6 to f22
The yellow numbers show the distance from where I was standing
While f22 wouldn't be right for the bird, if the main point was to get as much in focus as possible, it is still useable.
Not disagreeing in any way with what has been said, just that sometimes it is worth trying outside the ideal to get what you want.

View attachment 357046
View attachment 357045
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Very interesting, where did you aim your focus point on the images please?
I'm going to guess - the Ford badge on the foreground car ?
 
Crotal Bell said:
I've noticed that, lenses at F1.2 are expensive.

This is something that confuses me, you have 22 F stops on the camera but the lenses have far less, are they basically restricting what the camera can do ?
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The camera doesn't in itself have f stops. It has the ability to control the aperture of the lens. When you turn the camera on it talks to the lens to find out what the capabilities of the lens are.

If you look intoi the lens when you take a pic with a small aperture/large f number you will see the lens aperture blades close up when the pic is taken.

I think the sequence on an original slr was shutter pressed ->lens aperture set -> mirror up -> 1st curtain -> film exposed - shutter timer runs -> 2nd curtain -> mirror down -> lens wide open
Winding on the film also wound the shutter curtains back.
 
Crotal Bell said:
I haven't tried focus tracking yet, it needs to be small steps for me or my brain starts to melt.
I think my biggest problem with DOF is focus point, the best way for me to learn is take photos. I'm not great at reading advice because i'm a very visual person, I have to see it to understand it (if that makes sense) I also think i expect too much sometimes.
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I don't know if you'd find it useful but one option is to have a notebook and jot down key points about each pic you take, what the focus point was, what the exposure meter setting was and what you wanted to achieve and then take a photo of the notebook. so that when you are reviewing pics later you have photo, photo details, photo, photo details.
Obviously you have the exif info on the pics, but other subjective info as well might help.
 
who? said:
I don't know if you'd find it useful but one option is to have a notebook and jot down key points about each pic you take, what the focus point was, what the exposure meter setting was and what you wanted to achieve and then take a photo of the notebook. so that when you are reviewing pics later you have photo, photo details, photo, photo details.
Obviously you have the exif info on the pics, but other subjective info as well might help.
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That makes sense, thank you.
 
Crotal Bell said:
Been using the FZ82 super zoom bridge camera until now, so here goes......


The overall quality jump from the FZ82 is obvious.

1. EVF is stunning !
2. Shutter is whisper quiet.
3. Flippy screen (the advantages are yet to be explored)
4. Dials and buttons are plentiful and crisp.
5. Heavy ! (How the heck do you pros lug big cameras around all day when you do weddings !)
6. Manual zoom far better, no waiting for a super zoom to roll out to the length you want.
7. Found it a bit small and fiddly, but soon forgot that when started taking shots, funny how quickly your hands adapt.

8. Photos ...... hmm...well so far not impressed. Yes the added ISO levels are helpful, but results are no better (so far) than the FZ82. The 1200mm zoom with the fZ82 gets me so close, and in good light it can be really sharp. Cropping shots from further away achieves nothing with the 100mm - 300mmon the GX80 that the FZ82 can't do, ad that's the big problem. Lenses lenses lenses, money money money. If I want to take closer photos I'll need another £100 minimum for a shorter lens. Money money money.........

It's early days, and far too soon to make conclusions, but right now the FZ82 is laughing at me from the shelf, It can do nice close ups, super distant 4K video, great images at various distances, all for £300. If you have the cash for all the gear then the advantages of better cameras are obvious, but if you don't, then the advantages of a bridge camera are obvious.

But these are initial thoughts, and the quality of the G80 is obvious, but to unlock the potential will be expensive, maybe too expensive for me?

I will spend the weekend walking and shooting with the GX80. I want to change my mind, I want to love this camera, but can I afford to love it? Maybe a cheap Nikon D3300 with modest shot count would have made more sense, with a general purpose lens? With the the FZ82 for the long reach stuff.

I enjoy my photography with the FZ82, and I have very limited funds, maybe I have delved to deep and need to make for the shallow end? Time will tell

Anyway, the weekend beckons. Here's the first shots with the GX80 after work today in the garden, just getting a feel for it, and I realise I need to expand and get out there to really find out what I can do with this camera. But right now, I do think it's a quality camera ....if you can afford what you need to use it properly?....early days and all that.


Cropped a bit, I like the stronger bokeh on the GX80
View attachment 356699

This one I liked. The added ISO meant i just needed to crop and sharpen a bit.
View attachment 356701

This one would have been terrible with the FZ82, it's a dark shaded corner. Shutter priority to the DOF is rubbish, my bad.
View attachment 356702
This ones ok but the added zoom on the FZ82 means I can do better with that, and no more lenses needed.
View attachment 356703
This one was a quick chance snap but I like like it. Birds heading home for the evening.
View attachment 356704
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Did you look at the FZ2000 as an upgrade from your original bridge camera, its a great all rounder if your happy with a 1" sensor, and it's supper zoom is great, not to mention cheaper than investing in more glass.
 
paul.w said:
Did you look at the FZ2000 as an upgrade from your original bridge camera, its a great all rounder if your happy with a 1" sensor, and it's supper zoom is great, not to mention cheaper than investing in more glass.
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Hi Paul
So many options , and the FZ2000 does look a serious camera, and of course you don't have to worry about contaminating the sensor !

To be honest though, I think the G80 has impressed me overall this weekend, and I won't be buy loads of lenses, just one more smaller lens. I'll keep the FZ82 as well, because that 1200mm zoom is very handy when the lights good.
 
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