Football Focus Magazine

Photodiva

Photodiva

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Name
Carol
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Hi. I've been contacted to provide images for an article in this mag - full color, 10x8 300dpi. I'm really not inclined to do this 'for credit' Has anyone any experience of this publication and their going rate?
Thanks.
 
Generally speaking, if the magazine is a fairly large circulation one charging £4.00 an issue, they'll be charging a fair bit for advertising. Unfortunately their rate card is unavailable. It might be worth phoning up and asking...then use the handily supplied Freelance Fees Guide to determine your starting price.

You'll probably have to work down and there'll be some haggling to make it work out...but it's a decent place to start from.
 
As with an publication the images are worth what they are prepard to pay. Freelance rates really are pie in the sky figure for these. Ask them what their rates are and then its up to you. May be £10, maybe £25 or £50 but doubt if any higher. It they offer just a credit then its upto you if you want to give them away, I know I wouldnt :shake:
 
Hi. I'll contact them and ask. I don't want to let the club down, but really I am not wanting to let them use them for free. They've also contacted one of the other club snappers too (we were both on the email) and I'll try to find out what he's going to do. He doesn't have such a good lens as me and rarely goes pitch side. I'd be happy with a token amount ...
 
Interesting conversation, the mag says all images are supplied by the clubs. When I mentioned that a lot of their images are also from Action Images, and I see that AI have a full page ad in the mag, I am told that they have an agreement with AI and don't pay to use their images ... Hmm ...
 
Hope you don't mind me butting in here.

2 things,
Firstly - If all the images are supplied by the clubs - why do they need you? That's your first bargaining point, they must have contacted you initially because they need something that you can supply.

Secondly - I hope this helps, its a point to start from if nothing else, I've just been paid for a job for The Times, their day rate is £135, (payment took 6 months, but that's another thread)

Unfortunately, 'for credit' jobs are a result of so many giving their work away for free.
 
The club are obviously keen to get an article in and I am one of just a couple of snappers who take halfway decent images. I guess someone needs to figure how much they want the images - I'm not wanting a small fortune.
 
Update well Friday is the deadline. Heard no more. I decided not to submit without some payment. I'll look forward to seeing the article.
 
Photodiva said:
Update well Friday is the deadline. Heard no more. I decided not to submit without some payment. I'll look forward to seeing the article.
Click to expand...

Which will no doubt have pictures from the other photographers you mentioned for free... So they get published in a magazine for free and you dont because ?... How does that make you feel?

If I knew for absoloutly 100% sure the other photogrpahers at the same game would be submitting for free then I would make sure my pics where in not theres.. But first I would ahve spoke to othe other photographes and see if we could all stick tgether forcing the mags hand..
 
KIPAX said:
Which will no doubt have pictures from the other photographers you mentioned for free... So they get published in a magazine for free and you dont because ?... How does that make you feel?

If I knew for absoloutly 100% sure the other photogrpahers at the same game would be submitting for free then I would make sure my pics where in not theres.. But first I would ahve spoke to othe other photographes and see if we could all stick tgether forcing the mags hand..
Click to expand...

Tony beat me to it,
I bet you'll find the "other" photographers work is in there!. You have to ask "is it ok"!, or has he "stolen a march" for future work??. One thing I can guarentee is he won't sell any work to that publication again!, but you may upon submission of something they need!. Kind regards Graham.
 
Bluesman graham said:
Tony beat me to it,
I bet you'll find the "other" photographers work is in there!. You have to ask "is it ok"!, or has he "stolen a march" for future work??. One thing I can guarentee is he won't sell any work to that publication again!, but you may upon submission of something they need!. Kind regards Graham.
Click to expand...

To be honest I doubt that magaze features that team more than once a decade... dodgy one for sure:)
 
Photodiva said:
Interesting conversation, the mag says all images are supplied by the clubs. When I mentioned that a lot of their images are also from Action Images, and I see that AI have a full page ad in the mag, I am told that they have an agreement with AI and don't pay to use their images ... Hmm ...
Click to expand...

would not have thought AI would give them away
 
Bluesman graham said:
Tony beat me to it,
I bet you'll find the "other" photographers work is in there!. You have to ask "is it ok"!, or has he "stolen a march" for future work??. One thing I can guarentee is he won't sell any work to that publication again!, but you may upon submission of something they need!. Kind regards Graham.
Click to expand...

May be he submitted, I don't know. Not to knock him, but his camera equipment doesn't get the pics I get (usually). I've never been able to capitalize on getting 'free' images into a publication. You don't get any work based on it. Won't be until the next issue at least, its not in the current one. So based on history, I'm just not going to 'give' stuff away. Their loss. (y)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Photodiva
Interesting conversation, the mag says all images are supplied by the clubs. When I mentioned that a lot of their images are also from Action Images, and I see that AI have a full page ad in the mag, I am told that they have an agreement with AI and don't pay to use their images ... Hmm ...

would not have thought AI would give them away
the agreement is possibly a Fixed annual fee for free reign on usage for the magazine!, this is becoming the norm for the large Agency's such as Getty etc!
 
I PM'd Carol with my take on the AI issue when she posted, and it was broadly the same as your views...

That's all I'm saying...:muted:
 
Bluesman graham said:
Quote:
would not have thought AI would give them away
the agreement is possibly a Fixed annual fee for free reign on usage for the magazine!, this is becoming the norm for the large Agency's such as Getty etc!
Click to expand...

I think you are correct, it was either the way it was said to me or I mis-understood. Anyhow, if they can pay AI they can pay me (albeit a tiny fee in comparison, I've no doubt). As Kipax said, its probably a one-off. I'll look out for the next issues to see if anything does get used.
 
Nothing won and nothing lost. Personally I think you did the right thing by standing your ground. You stated your pics are better than the others so if they gave theirs away then maybe it reinforces your view that if they want a better quality they will have to pay something. Next time they contact you they'll know the score (y)
 
snapzz said:
Nothing won and nothing lost. Personally I think you did the right thing by standing your ground. You stated your pics are better than the others so if they gave theirs away then maybe it reinforces your view that if they want a better quality they will have to pay something. Next time they contact you they'll know the score (y)
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Example, not mine, from an away match I didn't go to
http://www.thedarts.eu/2010-2011/adkins/231010/index.htm

Example, mine, from a home game
http://gallery.me.com/photodivauk#101408

Yeah, amateur, I know, but at least i'm trying.
 
And there is a difference but on the other gallery there are a couple that could be cropped to look presentable (subject to quality). I still think you were correct in asking for payment but could be you never was going to receive any as maybe they just dont pay!
 
I would be a little annoyed if the clubs had supplied my photos without my permission, especially if I'd given them for their use only.
 
Diamondsnapper said:
I would be a little annoyed if the clubs had supplied my photos without my permission, especially if I'd given them for their use only.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if they'll do that: most of the images I supply are 800x600 and watermarked. I usually send just the full res ones to the printers for posters etc. I'd be really surprised if they sent anything without saying.
 
snapzz said:
And there is a difference but on the other gallery there are a couple that could be cropped to look presentable (subject to quality). I still think you were correct in asking for payment but could be you never was going to receive any as maybe they just dont pay!
Click to expand...

Yeah, I wouldn't say its ONLY my shots that are good, but also I just feel my better or my best shots are worth some reimbursement. If they really don't pay then they are welcome to shots from someone who doesn't mind.
 
Pass the puke bag somebody....

seriously.. what a load of old tosh... If two photographers are at a football match... a magazine comes along and wants a pic... you know for absoloute certainty the other photogrpaher will give his for free. Its all a one off..... Me? I would make sure mine are in :)

And I wouldnt care what members of TP thought about it :)

BUT before that.. I would try to get the other photogrpaher to see sense and between us we could hold the mag to ransom.. But if he was gonna give his for free then...
 
Trouble is Tony, you dont ever know the other tog is giving it away or not, the paper/magazine will say he/she is giving freebies in some sort of attempt to twist your arm into doing the same, if it's only a one off then what you lost by saying no.

I suppose it all revolves round wether or not you have concrete evidence the other guy will give it away for free and thats something you'll never find out for sure.

I would try to get the other photogrpaher to see sense and between us we could hold the mag to ransom.
Click to expand...
Too late now but would probably have been the best course of action at the outset

I have an agreement with a local rag tog that if were both covering the same game and either of us is approached by the other teams press officer or other teams local paper that we both quote the exact same rate for 6 pics 7x5 inch at 300ppi, who ever gets picked doesnt matter as we share the money between us, swings and roundabouts, its worked for us for about 4 years.
 
the way i read it was that if OP didnt supply then they would get from the club for free ie the other photgorpaher.. its all up there or have i read it wrong?
 
The way I read it the mag contacted Carol for some pics, she said how much? The mag then went back to the club and obtained the pics from them presumably free. No further discussion full stop. Carol does not want to give her pics away free as she believes they have some value and compared to the other set I've seen I agree.

Tosh or not its her choice and obviously does not want to start off giving stuff away.Its very easy to do this and we all know how hard it can be to then start charging.
 
KIPAX said:
the way i read it was that if OP didnt supply then they would get from the club for free ie the other photgorpaher.. its all up there or have i read it wrong?
Click to expand...

Tony they contacted both of us via the club. What Dave does is up to him were both volunteers. I told him the outcome of my conversation and suggested he hold out for some payment if he submitted any pics. Not having heard more from the mag I'll just have to wait and see.

All I'm saying is I think my better shots are worthy of some payment. I'm a bit beyond getting a kick out of seeing them in the press for nowt.
 
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Photodiva said:
Tony they contacted both of us via the club. What Dave does is up to him were both volunteers. I told him the outcome of my conversation and suggested he hold out for some payment if he submitted any pics. Not having heard more from the mag I'll just have to wait and see.

All I'm saying is I think my better shots are worthy of some payment. I'm a bit beyond getting a kick out of seeing them in the press for nowt.
Click to expand...

thats exactly how i read the situation .... to be honest i would have made sure mine where in not his... paid or not.. deffo not good for business if the other guy gets magazine coverage and i dont because sure as hell nobody reading the mag will know or care... its a one off.. if it was weekly monthly or local rag then yes agreed but in this situation.. it wouldnt be about ego massage it would be about staying on top :)

oh and i have been published for years and get around 10 to 40 pics published a week... one match today i am covering for three papers and i still get a buzz.. when i dont then thats when i am on the road to giving up..
 
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