Garmin Pay usability.

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Suz
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Garmin have an NFC payment system like Apple do.

Has anyone got a Garmin watch with this feature? It's on the vivoactive 3 and a few others.

Battery life on the garmin watches is much better ie 6 or 7 days but a few things I've read suggest that the pay system doesn't seem to be accepted.

I have an older forerunner 35 and wouldn't upgrade unless the Garmin Pay is actually useful.
 
I have it in my VivoActive 3. It’s usable on UK contactless pads... but there are very few banks that Garmin have agreements with so very unlikely you have a card which works.

You can use it with boon a digital / online “pre pay” credit card, but it’s not really convenient and I tend to just use Apple Pay on my phone.
 
If it's not grown in 12 months that's even worse. I shall hassle a few banks.
 
Just found there is something called BPay from Barclays. They have a doodad that would clip over a normal watch strap to turn it into a contactless payment device. They also do wristbands, key fobs and even stickers!

https://www.bpay.co.uk/

I have ordered one. It works everywhere that takes contactless.
 
Seeing as almost all phones are running iOS or android is there a need for other nfc payment systems?
 
Just found there is something called BPay from Barclays. They have a doodad that would clip over a normal watch strap to turn it into a contactless payment device. They also do wristbands, key fobs and even stickers!

https://www.bpay.co.uk/

I have ordered one. It works everywhere that takes contactless.

Yeah - I once upgraded my Android phone to full contactless jWallet functionality. All it took was (1) my credit card (2) some clear parcel tape. I can send you instructions if you like :D

Seriously - all the banks need to do is make the chip pop out (like a sim - remember when they were credit card sized?) and then have a phone with either a slot or case to accept it. The other way (with hardened operating systems and encrypted conversations) really is reinventing the chip & pin wheel.

But all these things invovle banks talking to each other. And nobody wants that.
 
The BPay is basically a bank card chip stuffed in a plastic case. The contactless sticker they do can be stuck to the back of your phone/phone case if you want. They're basically doing what you wanted :)
 
The BPay is basically a bank card chip stuffed in a plastic case. The contactless sticker they do can be stuck to the back of your phone/phone case if you want. They're basically doing what you wanted :)

Yeah, now I wish I'd patented it......

BTW back to the topic: my new Garmin Pay watch should arrive on Wednesday. I'm hoping it will play nicely with my Santander card.
 
So the watch arrived at New Year. I *finally* got round to activating Garmin Pay today. Took 5 - 10 mins to set up including a text from my bank with auth code.

Popped out to the gym and stopped at Asda on the way. Garmin Pay worked.....perfectly. TBH slower than using a contactless card but about as fast as using a chip and pin. You have to enter a pin and without a keyboard it's a bunch of presses of the up and down buttons.

If I have my card with me I'd probably use card but if I don't it works and it works well.
 
So the watch arrived at New Year. I *finally* got round to activating Garmin Pay today. Took 5 - 10 mins to set up including a text from my bank with auth code.

Popped out to the gym and stopped at Asda on the way. Garmin Pay worked.....perfectly. TBH slower than using a contactless card but about as fast as using a chip and pin. You have to enter a pin and without a keyboard it's a bunch of presses of the up and down buttons.

If I have my card with me I'd probably use card but if I don't it works and it works well.

I think the entering the PIN bit would deter me from using it to pay for stuff.
 
You’d think you’d have to put the PIN in once you put the watch on to unlock its functions.

Yes but.....

Don't forget you can build a portable card skimmer pretty easily. Now most people get suspicious if you start running a mysterious black box near their pocket and lots of wallets now have RFID blockers but you wear a watch on your wrist. It would be pretty easy to go near somebody in a crowded place and rob them of £29.99. The risk is low because few watches have Garmin Pay - but I can understand why Garmin want a security setting that works when everybody buys their watches :)

Probably I'll mostly use my card. But if I forget my wallet, it's nice to know that I can just use my watch instead. It will be handy when I go sea swimming and decide to grab some food afterwards or (one of my bigger irrational fears) drive 150 miles from home, run low on petrol and realise I forgot my wallet. It's one less thing to carry and look after.
 
Yes but.....

Don't forget you can build a portable card skimmer pretty easily. Now most people get suspicious if you start running a mysterious black box near their pocket and lots of wallets now have RFID blockers but you wear a watch on your wrist. It would be pretty easy to go near somebody in a crowded place and rob them of £29.99. The risk is low because few watches have Garmin Pay - but I can understand why Garmin want a security setting that works when everybody buys their watches :)

Probably I'll mostly use my card. But if I forget my wallet, it's nice to know that I can just use my watch instead. It will be handy when I go sea swimming and decide to grab some food afterwards or (one of my bigger irrational fears) drive 150 miles from home, run low on petrol and realise I forgot my wallet. It's one less thing to carry and look after.

Apple Pay doesn’t store or have access to my card number. Does the Garmin system not work the same way?
 
Apple Pay doesn’t store or have access to my card number. Does the Garmin system not work the same way?

I don't know. I don't know how either system works - but the Apple Pay app must store some sort of token that links to your account. Whether that's your card number or not is irrelevant.

BTW the PIN I mentioned is not your card pin - it's a 4 digit number you use to lock the app. Presumably Apple Pay is locked and unlocked somehow. I'd hope using the fingerprint sensor.
 
I don't know. I don't know how either system works - but the Apple Pay app must store some sort of token that links to your account. Whether that's your card number or not is irrelevant.

BTW the PIN I mentioned is not your card pin - it's a 4 digit number you use to lock the app. Presumably Apple Pay is locked and unlocked somehow. I'd hope using the fingerprint sensor.

On my iPhone it uses Face ID, my Apple Watch is unlocked using a PIN when first put on. No one can use my Apple Pay.
 
No one can use my Apple Pay.

Um OK. I was bored so I Googled how it works

The first step in the second attack is for hackers to steal the payment token from a [targeted] victim's phone. To do that, they will use public Wi‑Fi, or offer their own 'fake' Wi‑Fi hotspot, and request users create a profile. From this point they can steal the ApplePay cryptogram [the key to encrypting the data].
Apple states that the cryptogram should only be used once. However, merchants and payment gateways are often set up to allow cryptograms to be used more than once.
As the delivery information is sent in cleartext, without checking its integrity, hackers can use an intercepted cryptogram to make subsequent payments on the same website, with the victim charged for these transactions.

That's 18 months' old so they may have fixed it now - https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/28/applepay_vuln/

I'd be very interested to learn how "enter once when you put on" tech protects you against handheld scanners on tube trains.

Meanwhile, Face lock is currently "probably fairly secure". Wired famously spent some time trying to break it but that was a while ago and these things move fast. Since Garmins have neither cameras for face recognition nor fingerprint scanners a 4 digit PIN is about as good as humans can do.
 
Turns out BPay is an utter waste of time.

The app is poor and it took several goes to get the device and account set up.

After all of that after a couple of months I get a snotty letter from BPay demanding ORIGINAL identity documents like a passport! Sod that. I'm certainly not risking valuable documents like a passport going missing.
 
3 months on - I find I'm using Garmin Pay way more than I thought.

I haven't figured out what relocks it yet (time or lack of pulse) but it stays unlocked for a number of purchases in a day. Couple of buttons and you've paid without even revealing where your wallet is :)
 
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