Getting frustrated now. Cant improve.

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Well, how do I put this? I'm getting very frustrated now as I seem to be really stuck with my photography. I see all these amazing shots on here and another forum I frequent and I also make the mistake of viewing 500px regularly. Oh how I dream of being able to take photos like that. I just can't seem to achieve it. I know the basics and how to work the camera but don't seem to have the 'eye' that people refer to. Also, the processing baffles me at time when folk start talking about blending modes and using 156 different layers to get the desired result. Now I know what all these things are an how to use them but how do you know what they all seem to do?! People say to me that the only way to improve is to take more photos, well I'm doing this and seem to keep using thousands of pounds worth of pro kit to produce nothing more than snapshots, with the odd good photo in there. Is there something I should be doing differently? Maybe I'm just never going to be where I want to be an should throw the towel in now?
 
jst had a quick look at your 366 and see some good photos and positive feedback. maybe you just need to meet up with other togs :thumbs:
 
It's a hard one to answer. For me I started making improvement when I started paying for training to help me get an insight to how the experts do things. I'm still miles away from what many can do but I'm getting better. If there is a good camera club locally then that might help as well, I've found some to be really encouraging and some just not at the right level or the right mix of people but still worth investigating.

Check out the meeting place, see if there is a group from here getting together, that could also be good for some inspiration and guidance.
 
I know where you're coming from. I'm definitely my biggest critic and keep looking at my photos and think hmmm. Lots of people who see my photos are genuinely impressed by them and people have even bought some of them. But then I look on here and other forums and I begin to doubt myself again. I do know that I'm capable of taking good photos but just suffer from confidence. I'm sure that you are a very capable photographer yourself, you just need to take a chill out and believe what people are saying about your work.
 
Thanks for your replies. I guess it would help if I said what sort of thing I was interested in? I think I'd really love to get good at people photos. That's what appeals to me most, then maybe landscapes although I've never really done any of those.
 
I agree with the other comments that you need to get out with some other photographers and maybe do some courses.

I am in the same boat - trying to make a start in portraiture, but only having taken personal snaps and landscapes for many years.

I have done some landscape courses with a fairly local photographer, which have really helped me to open my eyes, but tomorrow I am on a course at Aspire in Cumbria and I hope that this will help my portrait business to get going. It's not cheap, but I have heard good reports about them, so I am really looking forward to it. Travelling up this afternoon to stay overnight.

I've recently been thinking about joining a camera club again, but have found in the past that I haven't really gained anything from it. Perhaps it was just the wrong club. I was invited out with a camera club trip last weekend, and we visited a portrait studio, which was very interesting.
 
Thanks for your comment. I have done studio days and such before. Depending on the format they can be good or bad. I've photographed a couple of weddings and quite a few studio style portraits with all the customers very happy with the results but I stopped that as it took the fun out of photography completely for me. So I don't want to do it for financial reward any more. Just for please, but I still want to get very good results.
 
mark1616 said:
It's a hard one to answer. For me I started making improvement when I started paying for training to help me get an insight to how the experts do things. I'm still miles away from what many can do but I'm getting better. If there is a good camera club locally then that might help as well, I've found some to be really encouraging and some just not at the right level or the right mix of people but still worth investigating.

Check out the meeting place, see if there is a group from here getting together, that could also be good for some inspiration and guidance.
Click to expand...

You have too many cameras!! lol :D
 
My advice is not to take more pictures, but to slow down, think of what you want the picture to look like when processed, that way you have something to aim for. You say you know the theory of getting the shot and the post processing, so use this to work backwards from your target, to get the result I want I will need to do xxx in Photoshop, to do xxx in photoshop I will need the raw file to have yyy depth of field and zzz framing etc.
 
TBH you seem to be equating £1000s of equipment with the ability to take the incredible pictures.

Did you ever consider that maybe your concentration on equipment and processing is actually the reason your skill is far less than your ambition.

When I got interested on photography many years ago in the days of film I couldn't afford mega cameras and though many of us lusted for Hasselblads and incredible lenses most of us were constrained to far lesser cameras - ether 2 1/4 square or 35mm and almost always with a fixed lens.

So we learned to make the most of the medium we had - and with just a few choices of films we had to judge the best for our subjects.

But those very limitations meant we could concentrate on the most important thing - the subject and how we wanted to portray it.

And there was very little wriggle room in the darkroom - mostly a case of get it right in camera or dump it.

So we learned the BASICS and progressed from there - painfully and slowly, with plenty of mistakes along the way - but we did progress.

And the help of our peers was inestimable even when their only advice was "dump it"!

So when I returned to photography about 8 years ago with a purchase of a 350D and the kit lens I simply started again from basics and progressed from there, using the kit lens for 2 years until purchasing a 75-300mm zoom and then about a year later the much better 70-300mm IS USM zoom.

And along the way I bought a cheap set of close up filters from Ebay and learned to get the best from them in macro photography.

I also learned how to get the best from Neat Image to produce almost noiseless pictures at high ISOs.

The finally, after 5 -6 years I realised that I finally need to progress so got a 450D and then my present camera - the Canon 1ds MkII.

So I finally returned to the 35mm format I had used all those years ago but with the new digital skills I had learned.

Just as I had learned in the old days.

Today we have such a plethora of incredible equipment that we often lose sight of the necessity of learning the basics first.

But without those basic skills and the knowledge they impart we get nowhere in anything.

Looking at your photos you have a decent level of skill and can produce sharp, well exposed pics.

But if you're comparing yourself with incredible photographers who have learned their skills little by little through sheer hard work and determination you're always going to be frustrated.

you should be comparing yourself with yourself and how YOU are progressing.

That's the only way to think about anything whatever field of endeavour you're in - to be the best YOU can be.

And if you're feeling jaded then STOP!

Give up photography - put it on the back burner and do other things, especially just LOOKING at the world.

Enjoy yourself until you suddenly know you HAVE to take pictures again.

Then start all over again!

Simples!

.
 
Don't worry about what other people are shooting, you should only ever create images that you like, i always ALWAYS pre visualize planned shots, sometimes for days in advance. If its a landscape, do i know the spot? What light would i like? Will i want the tide in or out? Rough or calm weather? What filters will i use? Still life... What is the subject? will i need props? What lighting will i use? What mood do i want to create?
These thought processes can run into days, even weeks sometimes and play out like a game of chess.
With this going on in your minds eye you will see your final image slowly coming to fruition.
Don't get too bogged down with the technicalities of what your doin, sure thing settings are important but they won't give an image feeling or emotion.
Just think of a shot you would like to take, make sure its something you WANT to photograph. Give yourself a week to think about it. Look at both the bigger picture and the fine detail before you shoot.
And more importantly have fun.
And i am sorry to say, the more expensive the camera won't mean the better the image.
 
Thanks for the detailed responses. I would just like to day , I KNOW that the better gear doesn't make the great images, I never said that I expect great images due to the gear I have. What I meant was, I feel like having all that stuff is wasted when I am only using it to get what I perceive as nothing more than snapshots.

As it is right now, I am not enjoying it at all and every time I come home and look at the photos, I can't help but be dissappointed.

I've arranged many times on the local model/photographer sites to shoot with models but then I never go through with it because I know I will get rubbish results and don't want to waste someones time like that.
 
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sounds like your in a bit of a rut. sorry to hear that. didn't mean anything by the expensive gear comment, was just saying.
are you a naturally creative type of person? do you draw, write? play instruments, cook?
i know that my wife finds it hard to visualise images or put into words what is floating around her head, but she is fiercely academic, far beyond my capability's, and where i struggle she excels, and vice versa.
i know that's a broad and generalised comment as everyone is individual and unique. what im trying to say is some people get it naturally others have to work for it.
how often do you shoot images? have you got a compact or a mirrorless you can take with you everywhere? or even a camera phone? get back to basics, work to the basic composition rules, concentrate on what's in front of the camera instead what you want on your pc screen or print.
instead of trying to emulate what you see on forums and websites, develop your own style.
take a part time college course, there will be a mixed ability throughout every class and the emphasis is on learning skills and fundamental understanding of photography, not about who makes awesome images.
so i just had a look at some of your posts and i dont know what wour worried about. the hockey players, great set of reportage images there, captured the moment.
 
To many beginner model profiles I've seen, a sharp well exposed shot would be a huge improvement on what they have when they sign up. So don't worry about it too much. Alternately pay an experianced model for her time, you will get better results and not have to worry about supplying the images.
 
I know how you feel, I've been trying to improve my shots for years. And because I get frustrated I keep putting the camera away and giving up. I'm determined this year though to stick with it and learn as much as I can, one of the reasons for joining this photography specific forum :)

I took my new circular polariser out yesterday, and was extremely disappointed. With myself mainly as I know extras I buy wont improve the shots, but actually learning and letting exposure/aperture etc sink in and getting a good understamnding. I'm hoping by joining in with the 52's by the end of the year I might have improved. *Hoping* :D
 
I often find days where everything works well and I'm pleased with a number of shots and then other days when nothing seems to work. LIke you, I have on a number of occassions thought I've taken some good pictures and then looked on a forum or at a gallery and thought that I'm miles off where I want to be. Looking back at my photos I took over a year ago which I once thought were really good (for me) however, I now see how much I have improved my skills. I may not be where I want to be, but I'm moving in the right direction. I'd suggest looking back over some of your older photos therefore and seeing how much you've improved. If not, then perhaps you are doing the same things you were doing before and need to change your approach. Maybe try one new thing each time and see if it makes a difference. This is often better than a radical attempt at changing too much in one go and not understanding what made the real difference.

As an example, for me just using proper graduated filters for coastal shots completely changed the quality of my pictures. I knew for some time they were of benefit but was amazed by how much. For portraits trying different flash set-ups has done the same.

Stick with it and as others have said before, judge yourself on where you are now compared to where you were first.
 
gazmorton2000 said:
Well, how do I put this? I'm getting very frustrated now as I seem to be really stuck with my photography. I see all these amazing shots on here and another forum I frequent and I also make the mistake of viewing 500px regularly. Oh how I dream of being able to take photos like that. I just can't seem to achieve it. I know the basics and how to work the camera but don't seem to have the 'eye' that people refer to. Also, the processing baffles me at time when folk start talking about blending modes and using 156 different layers to get the desired result. Now I know what all these things are an how to use them but how do you know what they all seem to do?! People say to me that the only way to improve is to take more photos, well I'm doing this and seem to keep using thousands of pounds worth of pro kit to produce nothing more than snapshots, with the odd good photo in there. Is there something I should be doing differently? Maybe I'm just never going to be where I want to be an should throw the towel in now?
Click to expand...

Major DITTO!!! :bonk::bang::help:

Without wanting to hijack your predicament & thread I am in exactly the same boat. What type of photography do you take?? I like landscape photography & I too know the basics, composition, workflow and have some good tools to work with, but like you I am failing.

I look at these people mostly...

Rob Cherry
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rob-cherry/

Gary Newman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bristol_bound/

Tony Spencer
http://www.flickr.com/photos/antonyspencer/

.. & I just can't reach them, I don't even come close! I get fair feedback from Flickr (which is always appreciated) but I am still left doubting.

FWIW, I am being told from various quarters that what some photographers think is technically brilliant to what actually appeals to Joe Public, and therefore what sells is totally different. But I know that to achieve a standard I'm happy with is still way off the mark.

For me, unfortunately, as someone who loves coastal photography, I live no where near any meaningful coastline, instead having to drive 2.5 hours to Dorset, Devon what have you and this is something I can barely afford to do every weekend. So living near your main interest is obviously a blessing.

Also I realize that I still need to make more of an effort, I for the life of me can't drag myself out of bed early and drive to reach location for sunrises, and even if I could it's still getting expensive.

As for processing techniques, there are still examples of style that I wouldn't even know where to begin with, let alone trying to perfect that which I am already doing.

The other thing of course is weather, poor weather. I know it works for some people but I just can't seem to adapt to it. I need good light a good sky with lots of sunset colours. I can deal with grey skies if there is contrast in the cloud but all too often it's flat dull heavy stratus which doesn't help me at all.

I don't really know what to suggest or advise. If I did I'd obviously take my own advice and try to improve. What would be ideal is to shoot with and process with the likes of your Rob Cherry's, Gary Newman's and Tony Spencer's but they don't want to know unless you pay them.

The only thing I can say is keep trying, shoot lots of the same composition 5 minutes apart and hope that one will be workable and better than the rest.

Scott
 
Mr Digifrog, I couldn't have put it much better. However, to be perfectly honest, I have barely tried landscape properly, but as you say, having to go to locations many, many times can be very expensive and I for one just can't afford to be doing that.

At the moment I am doing anything and everything just to get me using the camera but I really don't think that approach is helping me. As I said earlier, the two things that interest me most are people and landscapes. I have never really given either a proper go. I have a couple of people shots I am happy with but would love to do it more. Maybe I should just stick to that and get stuck in and learn about lighting etc etc.

As it is right now, I am so close to selling up (again). :(
 
Have you looked back at old images to see how far you've come, sometimes improvement is there but you can't actually see it because its so small, and it takes looking back to when you first started to show how far you've actually come
 
gazmorton2000 said:
Mr Digifrog, I couldn't have put it much better. However, to be perfectly honest, I have barely tried landscape properly, but as you say, having to go to locations many, many times can be very expensive and I for one just can't afford to be doing that.

At the moment I am doing anything and everything just to get me using the camera but I really don't think that approach is helping me. As I said earlier, the two things that interest me most are people and landscapes. I have never really given either a proper go. I have a couple of people shots I am happy with but would love to do it more. Maybe I should just stick to that and get stuck in and learn about lighting etc etc.

As it is right now, I am so close to selling up (again). :(
Click to expand...

If you like people then you probably wouldn't want to see this...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ggigapix/5345898641/in/photostream

I would say though, don't give up. Many do and this is when those that keep trying come to the fore. Find a style and stick to it. I keep telling myself I should do what Rob Cherry (BW square landscape long exposures) is doing and stick to it, but I can't do it, I still love standard landscape photography. I won't give up, I refuse to, I still enjoy being there in the fresh air and just doing it.
 
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People that shoot great pictures are people that know their subject. It's not about the photography, or the gear or the processing, it's about the subject.

Find a subject you're interested in, study it and the results will come. You'll soon realise that photographers can bore on multiple subjects, when you find a subject you know enough about to clear a room - then you'll be able to photograph it.
 
Phil V said:
People that shoot great pictures are people that know their subject. It's not about the photography, or the gear or the processing, it's about the subject.

Find a subject you're interested in, study it and the results will come. You'll soon realise that photographers can bore on multiple subjects, when you find a subject you know enough about to clear a room - then you'll be able to photograph it.
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If there was a 'like' button, I would like this. Simple and to the point and makes sense. Kind of like, be a master of one skill rather than a jack of all trades?
 
gazmorton2000 said:
If there was a 'like' button, I would like this. Simple and to the point and makes sense. Kind of like, be a master of one skill rather than a jack of all trades?
Click to expand...
Almost, but some photographers have more than one specialist subject.:geek:
 
gazmorton2000 said:
Mr Digifrog, I couldn't have put it much better. However, to be perfectly honest, I have barely tried landscape properly, but as you say, having to go to locations many, many times can be very expensive and I for one just can't afford to be doing that.

At the moment I am doing anything and everything just to get me using the camera but I really don't think that approach is helping me. As I said earlier, the two things that interest me most are people and landscapes. I have never really given either a proper go. I have a couple of people shots I am happy with but would love to do it more. Maybe I should just stick to that and get stuck in and learn about lighting etc etc.

As it is right now, I am so close to selling up (again). :(
Click to expand...

You say you ain't given them a proper go? Landscapes and people?
Im sorry for your predicament but honestly, it ain't gonna fall into your lap, its something you have to work at to get results.
 
I used to feel awful after enjoying taking the pictures, and then sometimes being let down after looking at them on the computer screen. I've learned to separate the capture and reviewing/editing though. I enjoy taking the pictures. :) It is not just a means to an end to get the final image. If I had a good time taking the pictures and the pictures turn out well, then twice the fun. :D

I'm obviously trying to improve all the time, but I think there is too much emphasize on comparing your images with other peoples. Looking at the highest rated images on 500pix, or any other online gallery, can be disheartening, an incentive, or just a place to enjoy some truly excellent images. :shrug:

Yes, aim to be better, but try to enjoy what you are doing yourself. If you think you can improve, (and who doesn't) try to see what you think your images lack and try to identify what you can do to improve. I know for my images there are things that I could do to improve, some of it is knowledge/technique, some of it is commitment, some of it is location/opportunities, and yes, some of it is equipment. :shrug:

Some of that I can change, some of that I can't, and some of that I can't be bothered to. :shrug: :lol: Everyone has to find their own balance. If it starts to get you down, take steps to improve, live with your limitations, or give up and find some other hobby. :shrug:

I've chosen to live within my limitations, :) but to keep trying to improve. ;)
 
Thanks for the replies. Glad this thread has benefited more than just myself too. I appreciate the time people take to write the detailed responses. I need to step back and have a good think what I want to do and where I want to go. The simple fact is, I do want to be better. I think it comes from playing sport all my life and striving to improve, and where I don't see photography as a competition with anyone else like I do sport, I see it as a competition with myself to strive to get better. Some people I talk to find that hard to understand I guess.

I need to choose a subject and give it some serious attention and as soon as I think of that, my mind gravitates towards people. I love people shots, leaning towards on location rather than studio based, although I do like those too. So I need to read and learn and practise and realise that the initial results are all part of the learning process. As long as I take something away from them and improve then maybe I am going in the right direction. Also wondering if it worth paying for some of the days that the pro's offer where they teach you about lighting and people interaction etc?
 
Like you I think I want to lean towards portraiture 'on location' as it were. For the time being though it isn't what I'm taking photos of. I'm trying to learn and improve my all round technique as well aslearning my equipment.

As someone has mentioned above, I don't have an artistic mind and have to really work on that side of things (amongst others!) most. I get plenty of technical advice from a work colleague that helps out a lot

I've been going about 18 months now and have only just taken some shots that I think are worthy of printing.... And they're nothing to do with people portraits!
 
gazmorton2000 said:
Also wondering if it worth paying for some of the days that the pro's offer where they teach you about lighting and people interaction etc?
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I'm sure it is for some, but finding a good course may be a minefield.

Personally first, I'd head over to the Strobist blog and have a read of the on-assignment sections. Then go over to google and watch Gregory Heisler whiteboarding his various shoots and carry on from there (Mcnally, Kelby, Jarvis, Dtowntv etc.). I barely watch anything these days that isn't educational.

Its also worth noting that Kelbytraining give 30 free day passes out every day. Be lucky, get one (I did), then make like a sponge and absorb. Or simply pay for a month and do the same. There really are a lot of good tutorials on there and things you just wouldn't pick up from reading (like getting the best out of people).

I'd echo what people have said about potentially shooting less. I can see the idea's behind 365's etc. but the best ones I've seen (continued growth), people have had or tried for distinctive ideas and concepts each day rather than using it as motivation to pick up the camera.

Also, sign up for Google+ and start searching out 'photographer hangouts'. There's a mass of good information being given out in hour long discussion slots which you can watch live or often later on for free. They also recommend others who are doing the same and it snowballs.

Maybe also beware of flickr and 500px comments. Its nice people saying positive things but the most helpful comments (I find) are the one which tell you what isn't right so next time you might just get it a bit better.

One last thing that I found (when I was having a stress over which kit to take), I dumped it all apart from the body and my cheapo fifty. It forced me to really think about what I was doing and I got some great shots. So much so in fact that I did it with lenses I thought I was neglecting on other occasions and rediscovered their capabilities.

Chin up. :)
 
Thanks Paul for your detailed response. Lots of things from this thread have helped me and given me things to think about. I was reluctant to start it but quite glad I did now. Just had a look at your website, those climbing photos are very, very good indeed! Wafer thin DOF in some. What are you shooting with dare I ask (I know it's the photographer and not the gear, just curious).
 
Thanks thats very kind.

It depends which ones you mean? Some were taken on an ab rope with a 5d mk II and the cheapo 50mm, others were taken with the 400mm f/5.6 that I bought to own just for that trip but haven't been willing to give up yet.

Feel free to drop me a pm if there's an aspect of a shot, or a shot you'd like to know more about (including processing etc.). I've learnt so much from other people (both online and very generous and skilled mates) that I'm happy to pass on any knowledge that may be of value.
 
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Thankyou. Those are the sort of photos I'd love to be able to get and had in mind when I began this thread. People, but people doing stuff!! That the sort of stuff that impresses me.
 
Like the idea. Would love too. Have asked a few folk but no one seems to be interested. Yet I have friends or hear of all these folk who get asked all the time to take their photos.
 
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