Help with DIY AF assist beam

bass_junkie83

bass_junkie83

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I would like to be able to use an AF assist beam while using my manual wireless triggers, but it is not possible to use the AF assist built into the flash.

I have been doing some searching on DIY solutions and cam across this. Is anyone here electronically minded and able to shed any additional light onto this?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/malow/5226622853/
 
bass_junkie83 said:
I would like to be able to use an AF assist beam while using my manual wireless triggers, but it is not possible to use the AF assist built into the flash.

I have been doing some searching on DIY solutions and cam across this. Is anyone here electronically minded and able to shed any additional light onto this?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/malow/5226622853/
Click to expand...



Not sure why you say its not possible. I put a speedlight in hot shoe, disable flash output, and you still get the AF assist beam. Works with the SB900 at least.
 
What would you like to know ?
At first glance It looks as if he`s using the old rf602 which is not very reliable to say the least, and putting that on your hotshoe has a good chance of frying your camera.
Plus when you watch the video it seems to be the worst af assist ever... I don`t think a human or animal subject is going to be very pleased with you sticking that thing in their face it`s much too bright.
Your easiest solution is to buy a hand held led torch (you can get them small and quite powerful) hang it round your neck and develop a technique when holding the camera and the light to get focus then just drop the light, not ideal I know but I have seen some togs use it with great success.
 
lensflair said:
Not sure why you say its not possible. I put a speedlight in hot shoe, disable flash output, and you still get the AF assist beam. Works with the SB900 at least.
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I think what he was saying was , with the wireless trigger already occupying the hotshoe you can`t obviously attach a normal flash.
 
djinn said:
I think what he was saying was , with the wireless trigger already occupying the hotshoe you can`t obviously attach a normal flash.
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Plug the trigger into the PC sync port on flash or camera. If your flash and triggers can't do this buy some that can. Surely got to be easier than a DIY solution that probably won't be as reliable.

Anyway just saying how I do it, has the advantage of a flash in the hotshoe which you can use for a bit of fill if you need it.
 
Ok, maybe a bit more background as to what I am trying to do will be helpful.

Working in a club, i like to keep my flash off camera and with it being so dark af assist is essential.

I currently use an ettl cable, but wireless would be nice.

As it is pretty fast paced, and I take several hundred photos in a night, i need something that is automatic as per the standard af assist found in the flash.
 
An led torch works......

light1-1169.jpg
 
bass_junkie83 said:
Ok, maybe a bit more background as to what I am trying to do will be helpful.

Working in a club, i like to keep my flash off camera and with it being so dark af assist is essential.

I currently use an ettl cable, but wireless would be nice.

As it is pretty fast paced, and I take several hundred photos in a night, i need something that is automatic as per the standard af assist found in the flash.
Click to expand...


OK 2 choices that will work well.


1. put a speed light in the camera hotshoe, disable flash output on speedlight and you still get AF assist beam from it. Plug a wireless trigger into camera or speedlight sync port to fire your off camera speedlight.


2. put an infrared commander unit like the nikon SU-800 or canon ST-E2 in the hot shoe to fire your off camera flash and you get the benefit of the assist light in the commander too.
 
oops a third choice I didnt think of.

3. put a speed light in the camera hotshoe, put it into commander mode and point the flash head at your off camera flash. Set the on camera output to --- and the off camera flash to remote. You will need to use speed lights that can do this like SB800 etc.
 
another one similar to the first but a neat no cable trigger.

Use something like the new pocket wizard flex, I think there are some cheaper non TTL alternatives too, that fit into the camera hotshoe but have a hot shoe on top of the trigger to mount a speed light. This way you dont even need sync ports on the camera or flash and can still fire a remote flash with another flash in the hotshoe. Disable the output of the flash in the hotshoe and just use the AF assist beam.
 
Some good suggestions guys. The led torch is looking the way forward.
Probably something not too bright so not to show up in the exposure or blind the subjects. But if it is not bright enough to focus on, plan be is to make a bracket to place a push switch to the left of the shutter button to momentarily light an led until focus is achieved. (I use back button focusing).
 
I use a small head torch, bought from your favourite outdoor shop, minus all the strap. It's small enough to always be in the bag and slip into your pocket. With an on/off button it's perfect for focussing in dark environments. Don't forget to look for contrast edges to help focus.
 
Well, i did a bit of testing last night.

I picked up a pair of single led bike lights from tesco, one white and one red and taped one to the top of the flash trigger mounted on my camera.

Red works a lot better than white light for some reason, i guess that's why the flash af beams are red. But with it being permanently on it shows up in the shots.
So moving on to the white light, this didn't work as well, took a bit longer to find focus, sometimes failing all together, but i did manage to get through about 4 hours of shooting with it last night.

So from that, i think i will crack on with my plan B.
 
Hi glad it`s working out for you.
If I could make a couple of suggestions :
I dont think it would be to hard to modify the switch on the lamp and run a couple of leads off it to your own non-retaining switch (light only stays on only while you are pressing it) which could picked up from any Maplins and this switch could be operated by your left/right hand only for as long as you need to get focus.
The red will work better because of the way the camera sees (not sure why )and an infrared light source would work even better and not show up on the pic`s.
You could always change the led in the lamp to an infrared one then you would`nt have to turn it on/off, again try maplins.
 
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Old trick - for couples and small groups, pre-focus at 2m or so, use a high f/number and you'll have maybe a couple of meters of DoF - no need to focus at all :D

Edit: see what you need and check what you get with that technique here http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html
 
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bass_junkie83 said:
Well, i did a bit of testing last night.

I picked up a pair of single led bike lights from tesco, one white and one red and taped one to the top of the flash trigger mounted on my camera.

Red works a lot better than white light for some reason, i guess that's why the flash af beams are red. But with it being permanently on it shows up in the shots.
So moving on to the white light, this didn't work as well, took a bit longer to find focus, sometimes failing all together, but i did manage to get through about 4 hours of shooting with it last night.

So from that, i think i will crack on with my plan B.
Click to expand...



LOL so when you finally give up on all that go back and try one of the methods I suggested using a speed light or commander unit, it works, everytime, no beam in your shots, no extra buttons or torches to push. ;)
 
djinn said:
Hi glad it`s working out for you.
If I could make a couple of suggestions :
I dont think it would be to hard to modify the switch on the lamp and run a couple of leads off it to your own non-retaining switch (light only stays on only while you are pressing it) which could picked up from any Maplins and this switch could be operated by your left/right hand only for as long as you need to get focus.
The red will work better because of the way the camera sees (not sure why )and an infrared light source would work even better and not show up on the pic`s.
You could always change the led in the lamp to an infrared one then you would`nt have to turn it on/off, again try maplins.
Click to expand...
Interesting, I shall give the infra red route a try.

HoppyUK said:
Old trick - for couples and small groups, pre-focus at 2m or so, use a high f/number and you'll have maybe a couple of meters of DoF - no need to focus at all :D

Edit: see what you need and check what you get with that technique here http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html
Click to expand...
I have tried that before, but for noghtclub shots, you really need a relatively large aperture to get the atmosphere, and i am rarely at consistent distances to the subjects.

lensflair said:
LOL so when you finally give up on all that go back and try one of the methods I suggested using a speed light or commander unit, it works, everytime, no beam in your shots, no extra buttons or torches to push. ;)
Click to expand...
But a lot more expensive. :lol:
 
bass_junkie83 said:
But a lot more expensive. :lol:
Click to expand...

By the time you finish going down the DIY route finding all the things that don't work to your satisfaction you might find a couple of my suggestions would have cost little more if you bought second hand. All of the other methods I suggested gets your off camera flash off that tethered cable which gives you more options for off camera flash. You can get someone else to hold it or put it on a table or little clamp and move around your subject without the flash moving. They also don't required you to be messing with an extra task like turning a focus assist light on and off while trying to get the shot. Of course it's up to you, but a second hand speed light or commander wouldn't be that expensive surely? What about one of those chinese knockoffs everyone talks about, Yong-something?
 
lensflair said:
By the time you finish going down the DIY route finding all the things that don't work to your satisfaction you might find a couple of my suggestions would have cost little more if you bought second hand. All of the other methods I suggested gets your off camera flash off that tethered cable which gives you more options for off camera flash. You can get someone else to hold it or put it on a table or little clamp and move around your subject without the flash moving. They also don't required you to be messing with an extra task like turning a focus assist light on and off while trying to get the shot. Of course it's up to you, but a second hand speed light or commander wouldn't be that expensive surely? What about one of those chinese knockoffs everyone talks about, Yong-something?
Click to expand...

While I agree with the gist of your post, the Yongnuo ST-E2 master controller clone isn't supposed to be much good for the AF-assist beam thing.

I've not tried one, though I'd like to since it seems like an absolute bargain for £70, but some people have bought one for just this purpose and while it does everything else very well and better than the Canon ST-E2, the one thing it falls down on is the qaulity of the AF-assist beam. A used Canon jobbie would seem like a plan though.
 
My understanding of the ST-E2 was it needed a direct line of sight to the front of the flash unit, which i can rarely achieve, and due to it being a light trigger, wouldn't be much use in a nightclub full of flashing lights?
 
bass_junkie83 said:
My understanding of the ST-E2 was it needed a direct line of sight to the front of the flash unit, which i can rarely achieve, and due to it being a light trigger, wouldn't be much use in a nightclub full of flashing lights?
Click to expand...

It should work I think. The IR beam radiates sideways to a reasonable degree, and the gun would be close. You'd be unlucky to get a laser or something hitting the receiver at just the wrong moment and over all the light level is obviously very low, hence the focusing problem. You can bodge these things to a degree, with a little reflector on the front of the ST-E2 to direct the signal, but then you're back to DIY a bit.

Fall back on that would be just use it for AF assist with radio trigger out of the PC socket. Used one are quite cheap and a lot of people buy them for just that purpose.

TBH I think that's worth a try. Could solve all your problems, and you'd retain full E-TTL. Failing that, what's wrong with the E-TTL cord you've got? I'm assuming you're holding the gun at arm's length...
 
HoppyUK said:
Fall back on that would be just use it for AF assist with radio trigger out of the PC socket. Used one are quite cheap and a lot of people buy them for just that purpose.
Click to expand...

This might be a good idea for me too.
 
HoppyUK said:
Fall back on that would be just use it for AF assist with radio trigger out of the PC socket. Used one are quite cheap and a lot of people buy them for just that purpose.
Click to expand...

can you put a link for something like this to understand exactly what do you mean?
in the radio trigger I am using there is no AF assist
 
guyprives said:
can you put a link for something like this to understand exactly what do you mean?
in the radio trigger I am using there is no AF assist
Click to expand...

No, radio triggers don't have any AF assist beam, but the ST-E2 does (and so do most flash guns). So you just stick that on top of the camera and borrow its AF assist facility. It's basically just working as a torch, but a very convenient and accurately targeted torch, and the red light is less intrusive.

The radio trigger is then plugged into the x-sync PC socket (if your camera has one) via cable and the flash/es fired that way.
 
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