help with nd filter!

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Jonny_C

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Jonny
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Hi
I had a bit of a wasted session today as you can see from a couple of the extreme examples of the problem I encountered. I was trying to do some long exposure seascapes using a hama ND2-400 filter. I'm not reallt sure what went wrong, would anyone be able to advise please?:help:
Thanks
Jonny

monmor011.jpg


monmor012.jpg
 
Thats what you get using a cheap vari filter with a wide lens Im afraid.
Its bascily two polarisers put together, and this is exactly what it does.
Id invest in some decent rectangular ND grads if this is the kind of photos you want to take.
 
TCR4x4 said:
Thats what you get using a cheap vari filter with a wide lens Im afraid.
Its bascily two polarisers put together, and this is exactly what it does.
Id invest in some decent rectangular ND grads if this is the kind of photos you want to take.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that, it is photography I like - can anyone recommend any filters? I guess it will have to be a Lee Big Stopper, the price is a bit high though!
 
Have a look for the hitech pro stop if you want a 10 stop filter, about £70. You will of course need a holder and adapter ring, so budget another £50 ish for that.
 
TCR4x4 said:
Have a look for the hitech pro stop if you want a 10 stop filter, about £70. You will of course need a holder and adapter ring, so budget another £50 ish for that.
Click to expand...

You can also get them in P square with a choice of density of 6 to 10 stops, that drops the price down a fair bit:

http://www.srb-griturn.com/hitech-pro-stop-nd-filters-2169-p.asp

SRB Griturn are selling them for £48, add on about £10 - £15 for a holder and adapter ring and it comes to just about £60. Little bit cheaper!
 
Last edited:
I ended up getting a B & W 10 stop to use on my 10-20 sigma after being not very pleased with the hi-tech 10 stop that I purchased a while age...( I think the new version hi-tech 10 stop filters are pretty good though )

Anyway the image below was from my B & W 10 stop and I am kind of pleased with it...

7186691970_a95a7fe913_c.jpg
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Steve-B said:
I ended up getting a B & W 10 stop to use on my 10-20 sigma after being not very pleased with the hi-tech 10 stop that I purchased a while age...( I think the new version hi-tech 10 stop filters are pretty good though )

Anyway the image below was from my B & W 10 stop and I am kind of pleased with it...

[/URL][/IMG]
Click to expand...

Steve

How long did you keep the shutter open for? I did my first attempt on Sunday as I was walking, I don't really understand what determines how long to keep the shutter open. I will upload my pictures, I was not worried so much about composition, more about whether the filter worked.

Thanks

Mani
 
Mani Gill said:
Steve

How long did you keep the shutter open for? I did my first attempt on Sunday as I was walking, I don't really understand what determines how long to keep the shutter open. I will upload my pictures, I was not worried so much about composition, more about whether the filter worked.

Thanks

Mani
Click to expand...

The exposure time basically depends on how bright the light is, just as with any exposure, then you can moderate it to get the effect you want with lens aperture and ISO.

Meter the scene as normal, then count back the shutter speed according to the density of your filter. Eg, if it says 1/1000sec and you have a ten stopper, then the correct exposure will be one whole second. Use that as a starting point, but all filters vary a bit from the marked density.

Solid tripod. Cover the viewfinder. If you have a slot-in filter, makes sure it is completely sealed at the front.
 
HoppyUK said:
The exposure time basically depends on how bright the light is, just as with any exposure, then you can moderate it to get the effect you want with lens aperture and ISO.

Meter the scene as normal, then count back the shutter speed according to the density of your filter. Eg, if it says 1/1000sec and you have a ten stopper, then the correct exposure will be one whole second. Use that as a starting point, but all filters vary a bit from the marked density.

Solid tripod. Cover the viewfinder. If you have a slot-in filter, makes sure it is completely sealed at the front.
Click to expand...

Thanks Richard, appreciate the advice. I will attempt again on Sunday.
 
Mani Gill said:
Thanks Richard, appreciate the advice. I will attempt again on Sunday.
Click to expand...

You're welcome Mani :)

Forgot to say that you must also do a custom white balance unless you're post processing, in which case you can correct the colour there. All extreme ND filters have a native colour cast that needs tweaking at least, sometimes quite a lot!
 
Hi mani, I think Richard has explained it all...

The image in question if I remember was an exposure of around 40 seconds which worked out well as it was fairly early in the morning and I was trying to capture it before the sun was up and it got too light..I also wanted to flatten the water of so the long exposure was needed...
 
Thanks for the help and advice guys.

Steve - thats a cracking shot, i'll come back when I have something that's vaguely close in terms of quality - may take some time....:D
 
Steve-B said:
Hi mani, I think Richard has explained it all...

The image in question if I remember was an exposure of around 40 seconds which worked out well as it was fairly early in the morning and I was trying to capture it before the sun was up and it got too light..I also wanted to flatten the water of so the long exposure was needed...
Click to expand...

Cheers Steve, I will try give that a go, at the moment I do not have a shutter release cable so I'm using the timer, I will need to order one from eBay or amazon at some point.

Thanks again.
 
Mani Gill said:
Cheers Steve, I will try give that a go, at the moment I do not have a shutter release cable so I'm using the timer, I will need to order one from eBay or amazon at some point.

Thanks again.
Click to expand...

I tend to use the Canon RC-1 IR remote release - it works with a 550D though the range isn't huge. Velcro it to your tripod.

A good tripod is essential. Don't extend the centre column as that's death to stability and enable mirror lock-up.
 
HoppyUK said:
I tend to use the Canon RC-1 IR remote release - it works with a 550D though the range isn't huge. Velcro it to your tripod.

A good tripod is essential. Don't extend the centre column as that's death to stability and enable mirror lock-up.
Click to expand...

Thanks again, I've had a look on the net and it seems the RC-06 is the canon IR remote for the 550D, it has a shutter release function and also a 2 second delay function. Do you think the shutter release function would work in bulb mode? Especially with it being an infra red remote.

Also, I hope this is not a silly question, how do you enable mirror lock up? I know it reduces vibration, just not sure how to do it.

Cheers in advance.
 
Mani Gill said:
Thanks again, I've had a look on the net and it seems the RC-06 is the canon IR remote for the 550D, it has a shutter release function and also a 2 second delay function. Do you think the shutter release function would work in bulb mode? Especially with it being an infra red remote.

Also, I hope this is not a silly question, how do you enable mirror lock up? I know it reduces vibration, just not sure how to do it.

Cheers in advance.
Click to expand...

RC-1 works the same as RC-06, with or without delay, on B, mirror lock-up too.

See the handbook for mirror lock-up, it's in custom functions.
 
I'd go for a timer remote. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Timer-Remot...0IKO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337211623&sr=8-1

You can decide how long you want your Bulb shutter open, program it into that remote, set it off and forget about it. Also the infra-red sensor is on the front of the camera which I'd guess makes it more awkward when you are configuring your settings, counting time value and then having to trigger it.

Mirror lock-up is in one of the Custom Functions Menu settings. Page 195 http://www.css.washington.edu/w/images/1/18/T2i_Manual.pdf
 
TCR4x4 said:
Have a look for the hitech pro stop if you want a 10 stop filter, about £70. You will of course need a holder and adapter ring, so budget another £50 ish for that.
Click to expand...

I was trying to educate myself on filters and I read multiple times that they came in a big range of stops, most common 1-3. They said you would rarely ever need more than this. I know that you are very knowledgeable so before I buy one could you shed some light on the subject. Thanks.
 
shaylou said:
I was trying to educate myself on filters and I read multiple times that they came in a big range of stops, most common 1-3. They said you would rarely ever need more than this. I know that you are very knowledgeable so before I buy one could you shed some light on the subject. Thanks.
Click to expand...

You may be thinking of ND Graduated filters that commonly come in the 1-3 stops range. They're dark at the top, fading to clear, and used for darkeing the sky in landscapes.

You can also get plain NDs around this density. They're used for various things, often to reduce the exposure in bright light so that you can use a very low f/number for shallow depth of field effects, or with flash to keep the shutter speed below the x-sync ceiling (usually around 1/200sec).

This thread is about extreme ND filters, around 8-10 stops. They appear totally black to the naked eye and dramatically lengthen exposure times so you can use very long shutter speeds in daylight, to blur water, or make clouds go streaky etc. Ten stops is a reducion of 99.9%, cutting 1/1000sec down to 1 full sec.
 
HoppyUK said:
You may be thinking of ND Graduated filters that commonly come in the 1-3 stops range. They're dark at the top, fading to clear, and used for darkeing the sky in landscapes.

You can also get plain NDs around this density. They're used for various things, often to reduce the exposure in bright light so that you can use a very low f/number for shallow depth of field effects, or with flash to keep the shutter speed below the x-sync ceiling (usually around 1/200sec).

This thread is about extreme ND filters, around 8-10 stops. They appear totally black to the naked eye and dramatically lengthen exposure times so you can use very long shutter speeds in daylight, to blur water, or make clouds go streaky etc. Ten stops is a reducion of 99.9%, cutting 1/1000sec down to 1 full sec.
Click to expand...

Didnt know that. Thanks for that bit of info. :thumbs:
 
shaylou said:
I was trying to educate myself on filters and I read multiple times that they came in a big range of stops, most common 1-3. They said you would rarely ever need more than this. I know that you are very knowledgeable so before I buy one could you shed some light on the subject. Thanks.
Click to expand...

What Hoppy said!
 
AndyB1976 said:
I'd go for a timer remote. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Timer-Remote-Control-RS-60E3-Canon/dp/B003WD0IKO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337211623&sr=8-1

You can decide how long you want your Bulb shutter open, program it into that remote, set it off and forget about it. Also the infra-red sensor is on the front of the camera which I'd guess makes it more awkward when you are configuring your settings, counting time value and then having to trigger it.

Mirror lock-up is in one of the Custom Functions Menu settings. Page 195 http://www.css.washington.edu/w/images/1/18/T2i_Manual.pdf
Click to expand...

Andy

Thanks for the links, I hope I don't find out about anymore things which I need to buy. I thought it would stop at a camera kit, but it is never ending.
 
Hi then guys, this is my very first attempt with a ND filter and a tripod. I did not have a remote shutter, so I used timer on the camera. I was not concerned with composition, I just wanted to test out the filter. I have received advice on this thread which I was not aware of at the time. I was not pleased with my first attempt, I would have liked to have some of the vibrant colours as I have seen in various pictures, taken by some very talented people on TP.

The first picture is a normal exposure.

Please advise me where I have gone wrong. I think there may be many.

Long_Exposure_ND-1.jpg


Long_Exposure_ND-2.jpg


Long_Exposure_ND-4.jpg


thank you all in advance.

Mani
 
Mani Gill said:
Hi then guys, this is my very first attempt with a ND filter and a tripod. I did not have a remote shutter, so I used timer on the camera. I was not concerned with composition, I just wanted to test out the filter. I have received advice on this thread which I was not aware of at the time. I was not pleased with my first attempt, I would have liked to have some of the vibrant colours as I have seen in various pictures, taken by some very talented people on TP.

The first picture is a normal exposure.

Please advise me where I have gone wrong. I think there may be many.
Mani
Click to expand...

It looks like you are getting there with regards to slowing down the shutter and the subsequent effect on water and clouds.:thumbs:
Composition aside, always check the horizon is level;). I know these were just test shots but it often can creep off a few degrees when you are composing and aligning GND filters amongst other things. It maybe wise to exclude nearby foliage - if windy if can maybe look like a blurred mess detracting from the image.

The vibrant colours you are talking about are likely achieved in-camera with a Graduated ND Filter rather than a ND Filter. This will in effect hold the exposure of the sky allowing for more exposure time on the foreground revealing more colour/detail - rather than a silhouette effect. If you buy slot in filters and a filter holder then GNDs and NDs can be stacked to give you ultimate exposure control. A circular polariser can also increase apparent vibrance.

Using cheaper filters can also increase the likelihood of a 'ghost'/reflection from a bright light source as evident in the last pic. Also these 'ghosts' aren't always obvious when looking back at the LCD in the field so just be aware. They aren't exclusive to cheap filters either, but more expensive filters can help reduce them.
 
AndyB1976 said:
It looks like you are getting there with regards to slowing down the shutter and the subsequent effect on water and clouds.:thumbs:
Composition aside, always check the horizon is level;). I know these were just test shots but it often can creep off a few degrees when you are composing and aligning GND filters amongst other things. It maybe wise to exclude nearby foliage - if windy if can maybe look like a blurred mess detracting from the image.

The vibrant colours you are talking about are likely achieved in-camera with a Graduated ND Filter rather than a ND Filter. This will in effect hold the exposure of the sky allowing for more exposure time on the foreground revealing more colour/detail - rather than a silhouette effect. If you buy slot in filters and a filter holder then GNDs and NDs can be stacked to give you ultimate exposure control. A circular polariser can also increase apparent vibrance.

Using cheaper filters can also increase the likelihood of a 'ghost'/reflection from a bright light source as evident in the last pic. Also these 'ghosts' aren't always obvious when looking back at the LCD in the field so just be aware. They aren't exclusive to cheap filters either, but more expensive filters can help reduce them.
Click to expand...

Andy, thank you for taking the time and feeding back, I do appreciate it. I use a B&W 10 stopper with a 24-105 L and I still got ghosting :(

I will take on board what you have advised and try again, do you think I can add a polariser to the front of the B&W ND filter?

Possibly may bring in some vibrancy. I've been looking at the picture which was posted earlier? There are some amazing colours in there, maybe I need to get out a little earlier and away from the sun.

Cheers again.
 
Mani Gill said:
Hi then guys, this is my very first attempt with a ND filter and a tripod. I did not have a remote shutter, so I used timer on the camera. I was not concerned with composition, I just wanted to test out the filter. I have received advice on this thread which I was not aware of at the time. I was not pleased with my first attempt, I would have liked to have some of the vibrant colours as I have seen in various pictures, taken by some very talented people on TP.

The first picture is a normal exposure.

Please advise me where I have gone wrong. I think there may be many.

thank you all in advance.

Mani
Click to expand...

Why don't you post them in landscapes
 
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