How portraits lie

I wish he'd do less clickbaity titles. "How Some Photographs Lie" would be a better representation (in my opinion!!)

As he says, there is a difference between "good" and "truth" with the migrant mother. For me, a good portrait is one that invokes an emotional reaction in the viewer. The one I'm always looking for is "that's them" and a smile and a nod. So in that way, and for me, good does equal true. However I'm not being employed as a photographer to "document" something, nor am I being paid to "brand" someone/thing.

I really like Jamie Windsor's stuff, but those titles...
 
I wish he'd do less clickbaity titles. "How Some Photographs Lie" would be a better representation (in my opinion!!)

I watch all his videos, so didn't really notice the title, and I'm still working on what makes a good photograph :)
 
Portraits, photographs nor cameras can ever lie.

Only humans can lie and manipulate media in this context.
 
Another interesting video from Jamie Windsor.

Although I knew the famous Dorethea Lange homesteader photo had some controversy behind it, I didn't realise how much, but this is only a small part of the video.

I knew the homestead photo but I wasn't aware of the controversy. What a shame and every time things like this happen I lose a little faith in peoples ability to be honest and that leads into thoughts of if we can trust, who can we trust? I suppose this has always happened and will always happen. These days I suppose we'd call it fake news. Shame on all those who peddle it.
 
Well, he's famous and he almost certainly has more money than me but I think he's wrong. He may of course be right about himself and others in his world.
 
Well, he's famous and he almost certainly has more money than me but I think he's wrong. He may of course be right about himself and others in his world.
Everyone who takes photographs has an agenda. They might just not know they have.
 
Only humans can lie and manipulate media in this context.

I suppose this has always happened and will always happen. These days I suppose we'd call it fake news

Not sure I want to get into this, but every single photograph ever produced has been manipulated and while some can be trusted more than others, none can be trusted to fully reflect reality or fully tell the truth.

As soon as you exclude something from a photograph you are forcing your view of reality onto the viewer. Excluding that power station from your sunset across the estuary, or "only" photographing boarded up shops in your high street.

Neither might reflect the "reality" of the estuary or the high street, even though both may be telling the "truth" in terms of what the photograph contains.

The "reality" of visiting the estuary or walking down the high street, may be completely different from the "reality" presented in the photograph.

On the assumption that no photograph can fully represent reality, how far a photograph can acceptably "misrepresent" reality depends on context, use and intent.

As far as I am aware, the plight of the homesteaders was desperate, and Lange's commission was to document homesteaders life.

Her experience of what it was like to be a homesteader would have been built on all her senses, and from interacting with many homesteaders. Maybe, once boiled down to a single image, this photograph was a better representation of the "reality" of being a homesteader, than the others, she had made.

It's always possible that the background to the people in the photograph didn't come to light until after it had been published and had made its acknowledged contribution to bringing help to the struggling homesteaders.

My views on this are far less confident than my words might suggest, but I am fairly confident that a belief that any photograph is a truthful representation of reality, is misplaced.
 
Everyone who takes photographs has an agenda. They might just not know they have.

I think there's a difference between having an agenda and other motives for pressing the button. I think agenda has more negative connotations than I'm happy with.
 
Not sure I want to get into this, but every single photograph ever produced has been manipulated and while some can be trusted more than others, none can be trusted to fully reflect reality or fully tell the truth.

As soon as you exclude something from a photograph you are forcing your view of reality onto the viewer. Excluding that power station from your sunset across the estuary, or "only" photographing boarded up shops in your high street.

Neither might reflect the "reality" of the estuary or the high street, even though both may be telling the "truth" in terms of what the photograph contains.

The "reality" of visiting the estuary or walking down the high street, may be completely different from the "reality" presented in the photograph.

On the assumption that no photograph can fully represent reality, how far a photograph can acceptably "misrepresent" reality depends on context, use and intent.

As far as I am aware, the plight of the homesteaders was desperate, and Lange's commission was to document homesteaders life.

Her experience of what it was like to be a homesteader would have been built on all her senses, and from interacting with many homesteaders. Maybe, once boiled down to a single image, this photograph was a better representation of the "reality" of being a homesteader, than the others, she had made.

It's always possible that the background to the people in the photograph didn't come to light until after it had been published and had made its acknowledged contribution to bringing help to the struggling homesteaders.

My views on this are far less confident than my words might suggest, but I am fairly confident that a belief that any photograph is a truthful representation of reality, is misplaced.

I'll accept that no photograph can fully capture reality as we form an impression and view which is ours and may differ wildly from that of others but it can perhaps capture a slice of it and that could be an honest slice for many people. A sunset scene may be terrifying to some but for many it may be what the photographer intended, a beautiful picture. I suppose we don't have to take a picture to have these difference of opinion. If I look at something I may see something and feel something which is radically different to you and I suppose each is truth, for us.

Re the homestead photograph, the worst case scenario is that you're being very generous to the point of incredulity. If we accept any fakery justifying it by saying that it points to some wider alternative or truth that couldn't be photographed at the time then we can't trust any photograph, video or news report and why limit this way of thinking to recorded images? An event didn't happen but we say it did and present it as if it did happen because in doing do we highlight the issue? I can't see that as acceptable. There have to be some standards and some limits and those making a reputation and a living out of misrepresentations and dishonesty aren't people I'll look up to.
 
I'll accept that no photograph can fully capture reality as we form an impression and view which is ours and may differ wildly from that of others but it can perhaps capture a slice of it and that could be an honest slice for many people.

Re the homestead photograph, the worst case scenario is that you're being very generous to the point of incredulity. If we accept any fakery justifying it by saying that it points to some wider alternative or truth that couldn't be photographed at the time then we can't trust any photograph, video or news report and why limit this way of thinking to recorded images?

I think we agree on your first point, I did say doesn't "fully" capture reality and you are saying captures "a slice of reality" and you also suggest that different people have different "truths" which was a fundamental point of my argument.

I also suggested that we need to make an assessment of how much we believe a photograph by looking at it in terms of "...context, use and intent", so yes I don't "automatically" trust any recorded image, or reported event, and certainly not on the basis of a single photograph or news story.

As regards the Homestead photograph, I wasn't justifying fakery, I suggested that she may not have known the background of the individuals she photographed, and even once you find out they weren't actually homesteaders, that picture still doesn't falsely represent how the homesteaders were living.

I think this situation is different to deliberately setting out to falsify a reality (fakery) e.g photographing a homesteader family sitting down to a luxurious meal (provided by the government just for the benefit of the photograph) when the majority (all) were starving, or the opposite, of selectively photographing only a starving family when the majority were doing just fine.
 
Along the same lines, Tony Northrup posted this video suggesting it was photographers and media editors who prompted the loo roll panic, unwittingly or not, basically by selecting and emphasising something that was neither true nor representative of the wider situation. He has a point.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfoolWoDBsU
 
Along the same lines, Tony Northrup posted this video suggesting it was photographers and media editors who prompted the loo roll panic, unwittingly or not, basically by selecting and emphasising something that was neither true nor representative of the wider situation. He has a point.

Not sure if I can bring myself to watch the video, but we have discussed at home how much the news reports showing empty supermarket shelves has influenced how people bought toilet rolls (and other items) when they found a shop that had them in stock.
 
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