HS10 - macro to airshow in one lens. Pictures included.

overbez

overbez

Messages
4,088
Name
Graham
Edit My Images
Yes
This is by way of an intro for me, but also to post up some of my favourite shots taken with my HS10 (Fuji bridge superzoom).

I'm impressed and dissapointed at the same times with it. And am more and more considering moving up to DSLR, if it weren't for the price tag. I know if I do I won't regret it but wonder if I've fully exploited my HS10....

macro,

Fly by Mac 2012, on Flickr

using "best frame capture" mode

Flight of the........ by Mac 2012, on Flickr

close up

Let sleeping dogs lie by Mac 2012, on Flickr

landscape

Selsey beach replenishment ship by Mac 2012, on Flickr

airshow

Red Arrows formation by Mac 2012, on Flickr


Apache by Mac 2012, on Flickr

Would appreciate comments on any of the above, as well as my general position.....

as in -
  • can you see if I have more to learn before benefitting from going DSLR
  • Is the camera or me the limiting factor in these images being "better"
  • Would DSLR have much greater IQ than in any of these

Cheers,
 
To get that kind of close focus, wide angle, and zoom, on a dslr, it's going to cost a bundle! If the price of the body alone puts you off, the glass will cost even more. I shot with a fuji bridge for 3 years before moving to a dslr. I just couldn't afford the move at the time, and knowing the lenses I would want would require a bank loan! I moved up slowly, bought a used SOny entry level dslr and a 50mm lens. I stuck to that for months before buying a cheap zoom to play around with. Over the years I have bought and sold and haggled my way up through bodies and lenses. It's been a long process, but I tried to get the best out of whatever gear I had at any point.

Looks like you're doing pretty well with the bridge :) Fuji do make them good. But they are limited. Not as much in IQ as controls. The 8sec max, and variable aperture while zooming, and limited shutter speed 1/2000 mostly, also limited aperture of f/8. Am i right? that's from memory of my old fuji bridge at least. That was what frustrated me. I was dying to try some longer exposures, and wanted extra DOF for landscape and also wanted to shoot RAW because I love to process images myself rather than using on-cam presets.

You need to ask yourself, what is it you need beyond better image quality? And also, what you are willing to spend.
 
hmmmm thanks cagey - I'm well aware of the costs required to replicate zoom levels I currently have!

Don't get me wrong - the HS10 is not 'bad' , and it's got shutter 1/4000 to 30 sec, aperture f/2.8 wide narrowing to f/5.6 on zoom. (f/11 smallest). Has a twist to zoom lens rather than a button.

I find the focus doesn't always seem to be dead on - the images are not always that sharp, and the continuous shooting can take a while to write to the card.

It can shoot RAW - but with the various (free) editors I've tried, I can't even get close even to the JPG produced by the HS10. And RAW files also take an age to write.

Budget is likely to be around £500 (all in) if I did go, which isn't going to get me much more than body + kit lens. So I might opt to keep the HS10 which would, I suppose, give me a great opportunity to compare the two.
 
What about an entry level like a D3100 (about £300) and a Tamron 18-250mm superzoom, they are around £200 used.
 
thanks twist - Nikon D3100 was indeed one of the ones I've looked at. Or a 2nd hand D5100.

Rather than this be a what DLSR thread - I was hoping for more whether from the samples images above (the best of my best if you like), you can say that greater improvement would come from a better camera (larger sensor predominantly), or from greater shot selection, composing, exposing, etc.

So, is the weak(er) link the HS10, or me?
 
Do you print your images, how big?

The images look okay but thats at lower res flickr size, at larger size I think the issues with a smaller sensor are more apparent, like noise and smudging.

In my opinion I think the images could benefit from a larger sensor camera, a DSLR isnt going to be as flexible but if youre looking for overall image quality you need a DSLR.
 
Last edited:
TBH - mostly 6x4 for the albums... although I have had a few done as canvasses (kids and dog) for xmas presents for the grandparents....

I appreciate your kindness in that a better camera would be able to improve the images, rather than myself!

The HS10 has been great to find my way around the exposure triangle and processing. It really is a Jack of all Trades, but I'm starting to see where the "master of none" part could be applied.
 
Perhaps a move to CSCs might be a good compromise. Nearly the same sized sensor (the same if you went for Sony or Samsung) plus some truly excellent lenses in the micro 4/3rds stable (which the other competing formats don't have).

I "downgraded" (I'd prefer to say I saw the light ;)) from a full frame Canon 5D2 and some top quality L lenses to a Panasonic G5 with some pro quality lenses. I have not regretted it one bit - in fact the pictures I take now are better than before as I don't have so many missed focus shots and I have far better lenses.

I really think DSLR days are limited with the new crop of cameras coming along.
 
Youve had/got a bridge so know more or less what output youll get, I dont think another bridge will offer anything significant over your current model.

If you buy kit used you generally get your money back, so if you found the DSLR isnt doing what you expect sell it and buy another bridge. A cheap way of achieving great macro on a dslr for little money is a Raynox DCR250.
 
Last edited:
overbez said:
hmmmm thanks cagey - I'm well aware of the costs required to replicate zoom levels I currently have!

Don't get me wrong - the HS10 is not 'bad' , and it's got shutter 1/4000 to 30 sec, aperture f/2.8 wide narrowing to f/5.6 on zoom. (f/11 smallest). Has a twist to zoom lens rather than a button.

I find the focus doesn't always seem to be dead on - the images are not always that sharp, and the continuous shooting can take a while to write to the card.

It can shoot RAW - but with the various (free) editors I've tried, I can't even get close even to the JPG produced by the HS10. And RAW files also take an age to write.

Budget is likely to be around £500 (all in) if I did go, which isn't going to get me much more than body + kit lens. So I might opt to keep the HS10 which would, I suppose, give me a great opportunity to compare the two.
Click to expand...

It's a much better bridge than the old s1000fd I had for sure. I didn't know it shot RAW though, that's interesting. Pretty good camera for anyone starting out, jack of all trades as you say. I know that I did immediately notice the better image quality when I first got a dslr. And I only had an old 50mm lens. Even cropping in on the images taken with that were better than zoomed images with the bridge.

I would say keep this, and buy a used kit. You can add to it as you go along - start hinting at Christmas pressie now! ;)

Btw, the images you posted are all very good, though I'm only viewing them on here at the size posted. They look sharp and well exposed. I imagine if we look at the full res we'll see a little softness that you wouldn't get with dslr.
 
Last edited:
overbez said:
hmmmm thanks cagey - I'm well aware of the costs required to replicate zoom levels I currently have!

Don't get me wrong - the HS10 is not 'bad' , and it's got shutter 1/4000 to 30 sec, aperture f/2.8 wide narrowing to f/5.6 on zoom. (f/11 smallest). Has a twist to zoom lens rather than a button.

I find the focus doesn't always seem to be dead on - the images are not always that sharp, and the continuous shooting can take a while to write to the card.

It can shoot RAW - but with the various (free) editors I've tried, I can't even get close even to the JPG produced by the HS10. And RAW files also take an age to write.

Budget is likely to be around £500 (all in) if I did go, which isn't going to get me much more than body + kit lens. So I might opt to keep the HS10 which would, I suppose, give me a great opportunity to compare the two.
Click to expand...

I also have a HS10 - Your images look great - especially as you don't shoot raw. What is it you are disappointed about with the HS10?

I just wanted to say that I am learning Adobe Lightroom, (it is free to download the 30 day trial) and combined with a great book by Scott kelby (Loaned from a friend) my editing skills are coming along very nicely. It looks like I will be forking out for a licence. I feel it has moved me forwards no end. Nowadays I almost always shoot in RAW.

I have also found that faster shutter speeds help a great deal to eliminate blurry images. My only gripe is it is sometimes hard to get the shutter speed up and having to resort to high ISO's to do so.

I use a mono pod alot of the time when wandering around snapping at the wildlife.

I agree about the focussing sometimes being off though, so If I can I use manual focussing, did you know you can tap the AE/AF Lock to get the autofocus to close in on the subject and then manually tweak it from there?
 
twist said:
Youve had/got a bridge so know more or less what output youll get, I dont think another bridge will offer anything significant over your current model.
Click to expand...

100% correct - there's no way I would take a (in my view) sideways step to another bridge or anything with a smaller sensor than in a (non FF) DSLR.

What I want to ensure is that I would get a noticable / justifiable increase in IQ, sharpness, focus speed, write speed, shooting speed, but would not want to sacrifice features like AEB (only +/- 1EV at the moment), and continuous shooting.

Also, I know MP are not the be-all-and-end-all but I wouldn't want to go less than my current 10MP - especially as I'd be loosing zoom at the long end.

-------

And thanks again cagey - you've kinda got my idea and current thoughts spot on!

I think a 2nd hand DSLR to run alongside the HS10, and then the resale of the HS10 should go towards whatever lens I find I am lacking.

If I can get the same increase in 'everything' again by going to a DSLR, as I did when getting the HS10, from a 6 year old Samsung 5MP point and shoot, I'd be more than happy.

-------- edit...

Brian_of_Bozeat said:
I also have a HS10 - Your images look great - especially as you don't shoot raw. What is it you are disappointed about with the HS10?
Click to expand...

from a few posts up the page.
overbez said:
I find the focus doesn't always seem to be dead on - the images are not always that sharp, and the continuous shooting can take a while to write to the card.

It can shoot RAW - but with the various (free) editors I've tried, I can't even get close even to the JPG produced by the HS10. And RAW files also take an age to write.
Click to expand...

OK - maybe I'll try a Lightroom trial... I've found the silkypix the 'best', also tried RAWtherapee, Scarab, and a few others but havent been able to get better than JPG, so have given up on RAW for the time being.

I'll look into the AE/AF button a bit more. but I can't see Manual focussing working for me.
 
Last edited:
I can't see a lot wrong with the images you've taken, and I'd have had no idea as to what sort of camera you were using if you hadn't have said so. Sure, if you were printing big or in low light you'd see benefits in using an SLR, and of course there's normally the shutter lag issue on bridges. But if you're happy with what you've got / haven't the money to throw at an ungrade, keep going until you're frustrated by your cameras limitations.

I've said this before on Talk Photography but no-one pays any notice - a DSLR is not the answer to every 'what type of camera' question.
 
Thanks Andy - I think the Fuji Bridge is the camera for me at the moment - but as I said I'm starting to see the limitations - maybe not yet being hampered by them, but seeing them.

Another couple, from Whipsnade zoo, SOOC, JPG's. Now I think these are OK - I might print them for the family album, but the didnt make it onto my flickr.


S0120075 by Mac 2012, on Flickr

and

S0869977 by Mac 2012, on Flickr

Both around the 300-400mm (equiv) range.
 
overbez said:
100% correct - there's no way I would take a (in my view) sideways step to another bridge or anything with a smaller sensor than in a (non FF) DSLR.
Click to expand...
Micro 4/3 isn't that much smaller than APS-C and has excellent image quality.

overbez said:
OK - maybe I'll try a Lightroom trial... I've found the silkypix the 'best', also tried RAWtherapee, Scarab, and a few others but havent been able to get better than JPG, so have given up on RAW for the time being.
Click to expand...
SilkyPix is poor compared to Lightroom in raw conversion (detail is lost, highlights are blown) with the cameras I've tried. LR does take a bit of getting used to - it took me a year to fully get my head around how it worked (and I'd consider myself very computer literate...)
 
Pics look good to me, youll notice bigger differences in dimming light, most cameras even phones take great images in ideal conditions though.
 
OK - thankyou all!

Still not completely decided but at least I've learned I don't need to make an immediate leap - and a year to save should make things a bit easier.

Found a couple of old ones that illustrate my point - from a year ago nearly, but mid December day - could have done with faster shutter speed - but couldn't get it without much higher ISO than I thought I could get away with.

Full zoom (720mm equiv).

Was I expecting too much for these to be sharp in these conditions?
Would a DSLR have allowed me to get a better picture, say 300mm lens with 1.5 crop factor = 450mm equiv?


DSCF4198 by Mac 2012, on Flickr


DSCF4208 by Mac 2012, on Flickr
 
Last edited:
Those are @ ISO200, with a DSLR you wouldve bumped up to altleast ISO800 and the shot wouldve still been relatively noise free.
 
Heres some great examples of what I mean, this is a comparison of a D3100 vs HS10 noise.

Set the ISO set the cameras click the image area, I usually select the ladies face on the RHS. The D3100 JPG at 800 iso is as clean as the HS10 at ISO 80!. Compare 1600 to 400 and youll see ISO 1600 is really useable with a DSLR.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikond3100/17
 
Last edited:
i would say you have proved its the photographer and not the camera.

a very well done from me.
 
overbez said:
Was I expecting too much for these to be sharp in these conditions?
Would a DSLR have allowed me to get a better picture, say 300mm lens with 1.5 crop factor = 450mm equiv?
Click to expand...
Possibly. What you need to avoid blurring (of the bird I guess is what you are after) is shutter speed. The first image is 1/80th at 720mm f5.6. At that shutter speed you are going to get blurring in the subject if it is moving. You are also at the extreme focal length of the lens which is going to be not its best performing length.

If you move to DSLRs you will find that long lenses cost a shedload. Fast, long lenses cost several shedloads. If you stick to a 300mm lens, you will have to heavily crop for the same image and you be at the same aperture (f5.6) so will be relying on ISO to keep the shutter speed up. I have no idea what the bridge camera is like relative to other sensors from an ISO point of view, but ISO will be your only weapon at the long end to get faster shutter speeds.

I'll mention it again, but I think something like a Panasonic G5 is an ideal compromise. The 100-300 lens is relatively cheap (£400) and gives an equivalent focal length of 200-600mm. ISO performance isn't too bad - it's around the same as most entry level DSLRs (the latest Nikon/Sonys are a bit better though) but decent glass is a lot cheaper.
 
viewfromthenorth said:
I can't see a lot wrong with the images you've taken, and I'd have had no idea as to what sort of camera you were using if you hadn't have said so.
Click to expand...

Brian_of_Bozeat said:
I also have a HS10 - Your images look great - especially as you don't shoot raw.
Click to expand...

Cagey75 said:
Btw, the images you posted are all very good, though I'm only viewing them on here at the size posted. They look sharp and well exposed.
Click to expand...

twist said:
Pics look good to me, .
Click to expand...

straycat said:
i would say you have proved its the photographer and not the camera.

a very well done from me.
Click to expand...

Well - I thank you all again for your advice and suggestions.

I certainly have a few things to take forward, and I'll try to play to the strengths of the HS10, rather than focus on it's weaknesses and limitations.
 
Last edited:
Another bridge to look at is the XS-1, sensor is twice the size of the HS10, longer zoom etc.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top