I love Apple, but.....

Tulipone

Tulipone

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Chris
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Yes
...I have to wonder about a company that shrouds itself and new products in secrecy. Most companies tend to shout about just how great their products are - they put early betas into magazines for review months before they come out - not so Apple. They quietly wait for someone to accidentally find out that the product range has been updated or 'slip' an early rumour to start some speculation in the knowledge that most of the updates won't be there.

I want to 'crave' the new thing that since seeing it in a magazine two months ago. I want to drool over pages of gadgets that are over priced, sleek and desirable.

Oh. I don't WANT to pay £55 for a new mouse either.

What do you think. Is the mystery/rumour of Apple the thing that sets it apart from others?

Chris
 
So Dell, HP, etc all tell everyone what they're going to release before it goes on sale?

TBH I don't mind the secrecy on the HW, but I do get annoyed at the lack of info on their Pro apps, Aperture in particular.

I just got the new Magic Mouse and although I paused at paying £55 for one, for me it's worth it now I've got one.

Pete
 
Tulipone said:
This is exactly my point. I can buy Stuff mag and see the new gadgets that they have physically got their hands on and reviewed. The best you ever get from Apple is rumours and speculation. Perhaps that is smart?

Chris
Click to expand...

But why does it bother you? Not being funny, just interested.
 
icecavern said:
But why does it bother you? Not being funny, just interested.
Click to expand...

Let me turn that around. Before the D3 arrived in the shops, there were discussions based on fact rather than rumour. Is it more fun to lust over something that you can shortly have - or something that is in the shops and that you can just go and buy?

I have no idea why it bothers me - I just want to know if I need to start desiring the new Apple Tablet or wait until it arrives then just go get one.

Chris
 
icecavern said:
But why does it bother you? Not being funny, just interested.
Click to expand...

if you're a business, it's useful to know what's /actually/ going to happen with the products that you use, rather than half guessing half gossiping...
 
itsdavedotnet said:
if you're a business, it's useful to know what's /actually/ going to happen with the products that you use, rather than half guessing half gossiping...
Click to expand...

If you're a business it shouldn't matter, you buy what you need, when you need it.
 
itsdavedotnet said:
if you're a business, it's useful to know what's /actually/ going to happen with the products that you use, rather than half guessing half gossiping...
Click to expand...

I'm more for early desire and mild masochism (buy it and leave it under the Christmas tree for a couple of weeks, rather than just enjoy it now). The whole business thing I suspect does not really work - but it is a good point :thumbs:.

Chris
 
I think it has to do with them experimenting and innovating way more than most other companies in the same sector. Let's face it, Dell for instance throw together a laptop that runs windows, the innovation here is limited.

Since the iPhone came out basically every other phone producing company has created a clone... Imagine the concept being publicly known half a year prior to release. The clones would have been around much earlier.

I think they do it to reserve some early market share with innovative products.
 
icecavern said:
So Dell, HP, etc all tell everyone what they're going to release before it goes on sale?
Click to expand...

There is no point because these companies use x86 architecture based on either an Intel or AMD CPU.
By the time these companies release a new PC anyone with any real interest already knows about the CPU.
The other components like HDD etc are just stock components.

However, on the other hand, when information leaks out about a new MS product wether it be hardware or software, a new CPU from the likes of Intel or a new technology, then this is real news.
 
...but the iPhone is on 3rd generation and it is no longer that innovative surely? If I were to pick up any of them, I would be hard pushed to know which gen it was. Woohoo - one of them (at least) has a camera in it.

Chris
 
Tulipone said:
...I have to wonder about a company that shrouds itself and new products in secrecy. Most companies tend to shout about just how great their products are - they put early betas into magazines for review months before they come out - not so Apple. They quietly wait for someone to accidentally find out that the product range has been updated or 'slip' an early rumour to start some speculation in the knowledge that most of the updates won't be there.

I want to 'crave' the new thing that since seeing it in a magazine two months ago. I want to drool over pages of gadgets that are over priced, sleek and desirable.

Oh. I don't WANT to pay £55 for a new mouse either.

What do you think. Is the mystery/rumour of Apple the thing that sets it apart from others?

Chris
Click to expand...

As a non Apple user / fan, I'm probably going to get flamed for this but hey ho...

£55 for a mouse, oh please.
What? I hear people say but it's looks good, it's sexy (why do Apple fans refer to Apple kit as sexy?) it fits in the hand better than any other mouse I have used!

It's because Steve Jobs is so far up his own arse he doesn't care about getting his potential customers excited about a new product.
All the owners of the Jesus phone think it's the best thing since sliced bread but just like any product, it comes with it's faults.

Yes I am a PC user and yes I do use MS OSes, however, I've slated them over the years for releasing crap products.
I've laughed at Bill Gates and his cronies with some of the cocks up they've made.
I fell on the floor laughing hysterically when the world wide introduction of Vista started with a blue screen of death.
I own a 4th Generation Ipod because at the time of purchase, there was no denying it was the best mp3 player on the market.
There might be something even better nowadays for all I know.

Don't get me wrong, I know not all Apple computer users throw money at every product Apple produce but I've yet to come across a single Apple fanboi who doesn't think the sun shines out of Steve Jobs arse.
 
Tulipone said:
Let me turn that around. Before the D3 arrived in the shops, there were discussions based on fact rather than rumour. Is it more fun to lust over something that you can shortly have - or something that is in the shops and that you can just go and buy?

I have no idea why it bothers me - I just want to know if I need to start desiring the new Apple Tablet or wait until it arrives then just go get one.

Chris
Click to expand...

It was all rumours until Nikon had the official release of the D3 just as it was all rumours before the official release of the Canon 1d IV. Yes some of those rumours were correct, but at the time nobody knew excaly what the specification each new product was going to be.

Apple may believe they have no need to spend months hyping up a product before launch, how many product fail to live up to the hype created by magazines that need the advertising revenue from those very same companies, but I do agree that they should be a little more forthcoming about the pro application like aperture.

As for the magic mouse, well yes £55 does sound a lot of a mouse, but it's the very first of it's kind with a touch sensitive surface. Now in time other will bring out similar mice at cheaper prices, but the same with any new technology, if you want to be an early adopter you just have to pay a high price.

The first Sony 46" LED TVs where $10,000 back in 2004, nobody would pay that nowadays, your looking more in $2000 range and the same will happen to touch sensitive mice.

Oh and Microsoft sell a Wireless Notebook Presenter Mouse 8000 for £85 , which makes the Apple Magic Mouse look dirt cheap.
 
It's just their policy. They are a business and have been around for quite a while. I am sure they must agonise over this very issue and I have no doubt that it is very hard to keep it under cover.

They do tend to have a 'relatively' long life span for products, so having people wait for 6-12 months because the next big thing is on it's way may cause huge cash flow issues (remember they are a hardware manufacturer too).

There have been major jumps all through Apple's life. System 7 was a massive upset as was moving over to Intel. It happens and you have to accept that things move forward.

Yes, the magic mouse is costly, but you can buy cheaper and even third party ones. I welcome the choice myself although I am very happy with the mighty mouse on the whole.

We Apple users are rightly pleased with our choice. They are fine computers running a fine operating system. There are certainly PC's which are better suited to some tasks and I am sure the people who researched and purchased them are equally happy.

But most people don't really care and just consider it a tool to do a job. And they are not wrong.

Graham
 
blue max said:
But most people don't really care and just consider it a tool to do a job. And they are not wrong.Graham
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more.
The same can be said about DSLR cameras, there tends to be harmless, friendly banter between Canon and Nikon users.
Yet some PC and Apple users will argue until they are blue in the face as to which is the best.
Both platforms are capable of doing the same things, they just do things in a different way.
It's the 'we are elite fanboi' attitude that annoys me. wether it be computers, cameras, game consoles or anything else that comes to mind.
 
hashcake said:
It's the 'we are elite fanboi' attitude that annoys me. wether it be computers, cameras, game consoles or anything else that comes to mind.
Click to expand...

And the fact that there is competition keeps the manufacturers striving to improve their products. If one is better than the other, it won't be long until the tables are turned.

I have rarely used a PC and never even handled a Nikon, so I don't feel qualified to claim my choices are the best for every situation. But I am happy although I do look over the fence and wonder if I'm missing something. However, sticking with your choice and mastering them is probably more important than jumping ship continually.

Graham
 
hashcake said:
As a non Apple user / fan, I'm probably going to get flamed for this but hey ho...

£55 for a mouse, oh please.
What? I hear people say but it's looks good, it's sexy (why do Apple fans refer to Apple kit as sexy?) it fits in the hand better than any other mouse I have used!

It's because Steve Jobs is so far up his own arse he doesn't care about getting his potential customers excited about a new product.
All the owners of the Jesus phone think it's the best thing since sliced bread but just like any product, it comes with it's faults.

Yes I am a PC user and yes I do use MS OSes, however, I've slated them over the years for releasing crap products.
I've laughed at Bill Gates and his cronies with some of the cocks up they've made.
I fell on the floor laughing hysterically when the world wide introduction of Vista started with a blue screen of death.
I own a 4th Generation Ipod because at the time of purchase, there was no denying it was the best mp3 player on the market.
There might be something even better nowadays for all I know.

Don't get me wrong, I know not all Apple computer users throw money at every product Apple produce but I've yet to come across a single Apple fanboi who doesn't think the sun shines out of Steve Jobs arse.
Click to expand...

So VERY, VERY true!
 
Apple must be doing something right. Despite the recession it seems that last quarter sales of computers in the US showed an increase over last year. It maybe something to do with style. The iMac seems to have hit the spot with the "All in One"look. Just plug it in and away you go. This probably differentiates them from the mass of PC's on the market. Plus I think the opening of Apple stores has put them in front of the public, who may not have been overly aware of them as a computer company. ( just iPod and iPhone)

One analyst pointed out that Apple had more cash in the bank than the total value of Dell. I wish I new how they did it
 
Read something a while ago that the Apple logo is now the most recognised logo on earth. Keeping it stealthy obviously pays off... ;)
 
blue max said:
It's just their policy. They are a business and have been around for quite a while. I am sure they must agonise over this very issue and I have no doubt that it is very hard to keep it under cover.

They do tend to have a 'relatively' long life span for products, so having people wait for 6-12 months because the next big thing is on it's way may cause huge cash flow issues (remember they are a hardware manufacturer too).

There have been major jumps all through Apple's life. System 7 was a massive upset as was moving over to Intel. It happens and you have to accept that things move forward.

Yes, the magic mouse is costly, but you can buy cheaper and even third party ones. I welcome the choice myself although I am very happy with the mighty mouse on the whole.

We Apple users are rightly pleased with our choice. They are fine computers running a fine operating system. There are certainly PC's which are better suited to some tasks and I am sure the people who researched and purchased them are equally happy.

But most people don't really care and just consider it a tool to do a job. And they are not wrong.

Graham
Click to expand...

I'm not keen on Jobs - he looks shifty.

Oh, by the way, Apple has made some duff kit; the eMate, the Performer range (the 6200 was baaaad) and that hockey puck mouse that shipped with original iMacs that gave you RSI in about half and hour.
 
I think part of the reason is most of the hardware is bought by pre existing Apple users (those "fanbois" people keep mentioning) who will be looking at the mac rumor site for example to get their fix.

These people won't be going for other equipment in the mean time, they WILL buy another Mac PC and they will replace their ipod with another so there is no need for them to leak their future products (the main reason companies release information and beta samples is to get people interested in the product so they won't run to another manufacturer, this is very evident in phones where people will wait a couple of months extra for the new phone rather than go for one out now). It has nothing really to do with Apple and their innovation as tbh they aren't any more innovative than a lot of other big companies (Sony, Panasonic and even Dell), the iPhone wasn't the first full touchscreen phone and the iPod wasn't the first good mp3 player, releasing information a couple of months in advance really wouldn't have made a difference.

It's also interesting to note that Apple aren't the only company that release information only a short while before they release the product, HTC (the phone company) regularly release phones that were only official a month before, for the same reason, they were one of very few business phones until recently, and since then they have increased their "preview" times.

As for the mouse price, I agree that quite a lot of the Apple products are overpriced for what they are, however £55 for a mouse isn't that much. "Gamer" mice are regularly £50+ and I bought a Microsoft laser mouse a couple of years ago for £45.
 
I think there's an element of protecting current sales too. A lot of people delay purchasing a camera (or whatever) because they've heard that there's a new model in the pipeline.

I've never owned a Mac anything, and don't know anyone who does, but my laptop is on it's last legs and I was tempted to try a 13.3" MacBook or MacBook Pro. I now find that the black models are discontinued, so that's the end of that idea. I know it doesn't effect the technology or the functionality, but I dislike white and aluminium laptops and I'm not prepared to spend so much money on something that just doesn't appeal to me.
 
The secrecy is basic marketing, you get a buzz going as people gossip, speculate and argue about what they think is one the way.
Notice how sites like Macrumors get lots of little tip offs, nothing concrete, just enough to spark ideas and discussion. Coincidence?
This all costs Apple nothing, but there are thousands of people suddenly talking about it. In fact, you've got third parties paying for the websites all this discussion takes place on. It's genius really.
Is there a MicrosoftRumors site?

ISTR a lot of bands used to do something similar (in the days before MySpace etc...) in recording a demo, letting some people hearing it and getting a buzz going, but not actually letting people have a copy. People start to wonder why they can't hear it, and to want to hear it.

Of course all this means you have to have the goods to live up to the hype!

Also, if you never publish a release date, a product can never be late :D
 
im defo a PC man, and dont really like apple. although i own an iphone and have to say its by far the best phone i have ever owned

but thats not because of the software that comes packaged woth it , its because of the jailbreak community that develop for it.

i think a lot of apple fans see apple as a "nice" company where they see microsoft as the big evil one trying to take over the world, and i think it just makes them buy more into apple that way
 
Well, heres something for you to speculate and wonder about...

Apple Patent Could Embed Ads in OS

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2355964,00.asp (url linky thing didnt work)

:p

I agree with what someone said above. If you're about to go out and spend £1000+ on a computer, you dont want to get home and find out theres a new super-dooper fast model coming out in 6 months. So by Apple keeping it hush hush, their sales will be consistent up to the point a new model comes out.
 
possibly as a way of subsidizing its hardware.
Click to expand...

:suspect::suspect:

You mean making more of a profit? There is no need for Apple to "subsidise" their hardware in normal terms...

Having said that that patent smacks of patent for the sake of making money, never particularly using it in their software but selling rights to use it to anyone else (due to it being essentially any type of electronic good)...
 
I'll confess I've not read all of the comments, but surely the fact you are starting threads about Apple's new products and the fact they don't advertise them would suggest they don't need to to get people talking about them.

Why spend money they don't need to? :shrug:
 
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