Important please read: Feeding birds

[Grave Robber]

It's obvious from this forum there are lots of animal and bird lovers here, so can I just sound a note of caution when it comes to feeding birds in order to attract them to your garden etc.

Please NEVER feed white bread to birds. It has virtually no nutritional value, and can be seriously bad for them. White bread can cause blockages in their digestrive tracts with fatal and distressing (for the birds) consequences.

If you want to feed bread to any bird - including ducks and swans - ONLY feed quality brown bread.

For more advice on feeding birds, visit here:
http://www.rspb.org.uk/advice/helpingbirds/feeding/whatfood/index.asp

Thanks


P.S. Admin could you consider making this sticky?

 

[DiddyDave]

That's sound advice I'm sure, but a local highly popular lake near us has hundreds of ducks, geese, swans, gulls on it and is fed daily by many dozens of people with mostly white bread leftovers - as indeed I did for years when the kids were young

Never seen a dead duck or any other bird there tbh

And your reference article doesn't say (or did I miss it?) don't feed white bread

:shrug:

DD

 

[Grave Robber]

That's sound advice I'm sure, but a local highly popular lake near us has hundreds of ducks, geese, swans, gulls on it and is fed daily by many dozens of people with mostly white bread leftovers - as indeed I did for years when the kids were young

Never seen a dead duck or any other bird there tbh

And your reference article doesn't say (or did I miss it?) don't feed white bread

:shrug:

DD

The page is about what you SHOULD feed to birds. This is under the link on that page 'Household scraps' where it says brown is better than white, but that isn't going far enough IMO. There are plenty of websites that confirm that white bread is no good and can cause digestive problems. It is probably less harmful to large wild water fowl because it goes in wet - if they were to eat it dry, it may swell up in their digestive tract and kill them.

I don't want to get all high & mighty but I don't think it's a topic for debate because the evidence is there to support it! It's up to people to decide what they want to feed birds - I'm just pointing out the facts

 

[CT]

I think we need a bit more info on this. While the intentions are commendable, I think the original post is just a bit too 'black and white' to be stickyfied at this stage?

I don't profess to be an authority on this, but my understanding of feeding birds white bread, is that as you quite rightly point out, it contains virtually no nutritional value for birds, so whilst it isn't necessarily harmful per se, it can be to the birds detriment in the long term, as it's an easy source of food for the birds which will affect their health if continually fed them, as it discourages them from looking for more nutritional food. At this time of year it's true that large pieces of white bread can get fed to chicks in nests causing fatalities.

If you're feeding birds with a view to getting photos, then my advice is don't do it on the cheap, all sorts of wild bird food is available from mixed seed, to more specialised seeds, fat balls and peanuts, and you'll get more shots feeding this stuff, as well as providing high nutritional food. Birds have a hard life and in bad weather they need all the help they can get.

 

[Grave Robber]

As I said, the recommended advice is never feed white bread to birds. Yes you can feed it to them - there is no law against it! It's like saying 'never feed your kids 2p ASDA sausages' - we all know really that it's bad for them, but no doubt we would do it anyway if the circumstances were conducive.

When I see a bird at the park, I don't know how much white bread has been fed to it that week. I prefer not to assume I'm the only one who feeds it, so I give it brown bread.

The advice is there on the web in published scientific reports - I didn't invent it! It's up to you what you do with it.

 

[fracster]

Or just go and capture them in the wild, much more fun in my opinion..........

Mrs Frac buys the specialist bird food for our feathered friends, our "past its best" wholemeal bread goes to the local mill pond for the geese and stuff.

 

[Grave Robber]

Or just go and capture them in the wild, much more fun in my opinion..........

Mrs Frac buys the specialist bird food for our feathered friends, our "past its best" wholemeal bread goes to the local mill pond for the geese and stuff.

Or buy a cat and let them do it for you!

Now I'll probably get abuse from all the cat lovers :shrug:

 

[CT]

The advice on not feeding white bread has been given here many times. Your idea of having a sticky post on the subject at the start of the thread is a good one, but I think you just need to pad it out a little more, and perhaps provide a link or two to authoritative articles on the subject. People are pretty sensible, and if you provide them with the evidence and a reasoned argument they tend to comply in the main. If you don't give them the evidence you get people like DD firing shots across your bows.

Good idea... just go write it up and we'll look at.

 

[Lufbrarunner]

Not sure where Cats come into this

 

[Jo]

Also, put something in about whole peanuts while you're t it too

 

[Grave Robber]

Right I'll re-post this later when I have links, which I'll get from that weird and wonderful site Google. Didn't know this was going to be such a provocative subject!

 

[mikeyb]

Hi,

Similar info was printed in our local papers a little while back, it mentioned that white bread causes some forms of disease/fungal infection in certain birds and most definitely should never be fed to ducklings, cygnets, goslings etc. I never feed bread in the garden anyway as all it attracts is seagulls starlings and crows which are never a good thing in the garden.

Mike.

 

[DiddyDave]

Didn't know this was going to be such a provocative subject!

It's not provocative, just confusing in light of tens of years experience of seeing no dead birdies in places where 1/2 a lorry load of bread (mostly white cos we're not posh round here) is thrown every day, and 2 lorries a day on Sat/Sunday

Look forward to the scientific reports

DD

PS - what's wrong with 2p sausages? Are you against all sausages, or just assuming 2p ones are crap? :shrug:

 

[jimbob]

i think its a case of moderation rather than a blanket ban,a bit of white bread on your garden wont do any harm and im sure on a damp rubbishy day when other natural food is harder to come by it may prove to be slightly usefull??i feed my garden birds tons of differant stuff but mainly sunflower hearts,but if i sling em a couple of crusts out they still get eaten by the blackbirds,woodies and starlings

 

[Cobra]

It's not provocative, just confusing in light of tens of years experience of seeing no dead birdies in places where 1/2 a lorry load of bread (mostly white cos we're not posh round here) is thrown every day, and 2 lorries a day on Sat/Sunday
DD

PS - what's wrong with 2p sausages? Are you against all sausages, or just assuming 2p ones are crap? :shrug:

I agree with the diddy fella
there is a lot in white bread that harms us humans and supposidly wild birds.
but the habbit of feeding it has been going on for years so it can't be doing them a lot of harm. Peanuts are also just the right size to get stuck in their throats and choak them, bacon rind another favourite can't be good for them either but we are again giving human traits to birds ( all that fat) so where do drawn the line?

BTW I can't find decent sausages at any price these days

 

[fracster]

They are out there, you just gotta look............

 

[Grave Robber]

Of course 2p sausages are crap - not that they're unique in that way, but it was an example. In fact the reports show that the ASDA 2p sausages are actually nutritionally better than many other budget, and some non-budget, sausgages from the likes of Tesco, Walls & Weight watchers! Not that this is a thread about sausages ...

You are what you eat, and you only need walk down any UK high street to see that

 

[Yv]

I agree with the diddy fella
there is a lot in white bread that harms us humans and supposidly wild birds.
but the habbit of feeding it has been going on for years so it can't be doing them a lot of harm. Peanuts are also just the right size to get stuck in their throats and choak them, bacon rind another favourite can't be good for them either but we are again giving human traits to birds ( all that fat) so where do drawn the line?

BTW I can't find decent sausages at any price these days

Apparently for birds, that saturated nasty fat on bacon rind is actually good for them, much more so than for us, thought oddly, I suspect all the salt isn't. As you say, white bread, peanuts, all have their problems, but I occasionally put a bit of white bread out, which the wood pigeons guzzle and seeing as they just increased their numbers quite dramatically after the fledglings appeared last week, I doubt its doing them too much harm even if its not exactly good for them. :shrug:


Sausages? Pah!! never a decent one around when you only got 4 pence in your pocket :nuts:

 

[Grave Robber]

but we are again giving human traits to birds ( all that fat) so where do drawn the line?QUOTE]

Nobody is giving human traits to animals - as I said, the evidence that it causes digestive problems in birds is there on the net - if anybody wants to find it, a simple Google search will do the trick. Peanuts have already been mentioned in this thread.

I reported the facts as I and many scientists and bird experts believe them to be, and if you disagree then you need a stronger argument than 'it never did me any harm' or 'we never see any dead birds'

 

[Cobra]

I reported the facts as I and many scientists and bird experts believe them to be, and if you disagree then you need a stronger argument than 'it never did me any harm' or 'we never see any dead birds'

I think as you have made a sweeping statement then the onus is on you to absolutley prove once and for all the white bread kills birds.
Me I can't be assed to run around the WWW. looking for proof one way or the other

 

[Grave Robber]

I think as you have made a sweeping statement then the onus is on you to absolutley prove once and for all the white bread kills birds.
Me I can't be assed to run around the WWW. looking for proof one way or the other

That's fine, but it cuts both ways - if you cba looking for evidence to the opposite, stay quiet. I already said I would re-post this with more evidence. Anybody who cares about the subject would take the time to check the facts - and if you don't care, why bother to waste your precious time arguing with me?

 

[fracster]

 

[Lufbrarunner]

"Phfft! Facts. You can use them to prove anything."
-- Homer Simpson

 

[Grave Robber]

There's no drama here - just ignorance and stupidity. Fortunately there is an ignore list and I think I shall start using it! Plus I won't bother making any more serious posts :bang:

 

[fracster]

Hey, I was kidding......

 

[Lufbrarunner]

There's no drama here - just ignorance and stupidity. Fortunately there is an ignore list and I think I shall start using it! Plus I won't bother making any more serious posts :bang:

So if it's on the internet it must be true?

 

[mikeyb]

So if it's on the internet it must be true?

It is posted at our local loch and in local papers round here about the harmful effects, so the OP is correct in his statement.

I can't believe some members are giving the OP grief and some terrible replies directed to someone trying to point out the harmful effects of feeding white bread to birds you should be ashamed of yourselves, I thought this forum was above that kind of thing. Instead of abusing the OP maybe they might be better off getting onto their lazy ars*s and doing a bit of research for themselves.

I think the gist of bread being harmful is based on the fact that it fills birds up with no nutritional value and as a result they don't eat anything else at the time so they end up malnourished.


:razz:

Mike.

 

[Lufbrarunner]

History shows us that scientists are not always correct, they tend to skew the evidence to suit the outcome they predicted. I don't have to get off my lazy ars* to do the research, as this is something that has been said for many years, and as stated by others the fact that we dont see loads of dead birds around would seem to say that it is not as big a problem as has been stated. I usualy take scientists findings with a pinch of salt as there is usualy a little truth in what they say, and then the scaremongers get hold of it and it becomes an end of the world scenario.

I am still at a loss to see what cats have to do with it.

 

[sawman]

Hey, I was kidding......

Now you have done it

My tuppence worth.
I am with CT on this. Yes I am using feeders to keep the birds interested. Probably costing in excess of £40 per month but I am really enjoying the photography again.
I think you will find most of the serious bird folk on this forum already are aware of the issues with feeding birds bread.

The larger birds like swans have a poor digestive system & it more or less goes straight through. I for my part do not feed bread. I buy good quality food from a good supplier Most of which is now being whipped buy the Squirrels!

That is another reason why I am taking proper advice this week on what to do with my Squirrel problem as mentioned in another thread.

I think this thread started with a good intent & for that it is to be commended. But I think you will find that a wee bit cannier an approach would get the message across without folk getting the hump.

 

[mikeyb]

Now you have done it

My tuppence worth.
I am with CT on this. Yes I am using feeders to keep the birds interested. Probably costing in excess of £40 per month but I am really enjoying the photography again.
I think you will find most of the serious bird folk on this forum already are aware of the issues with feeding birds bread.

The larger birds like swans have a poor digestive system & it more or less goes straight through. I for my part do not feed bread. I buy good quality food from a good supplier Most of which is now being whipped buy the Squirrels!

That is another reason why I am taking proper advice this week on what to do with my Squirrel problem as mentioned in another thread.

I think this thread started with a good intent & for that it is to be commended. But I think you will find that a wee bit cannier an approach would get the message across without folk getting the hump.

Hear, hear, well said Charlie

Mike.

 

[sawman]

Hear, hear, well said Charlie

Mike.

Ach I am just learning this diplomacy lark after ?? years as a bit of a hot heid with a loose canon. See what this forum has done to me

 

[mikeyb]

Ach I am just learning this diplomacy lark after ?? years as a bit of a hot heid with a loose canon. See what this forum has done to me

Don't think us Scots could ever be accused of being diplomatic Although I did once hear someone ask... " will ah hit im first or dae you want a go?

Mike.

 

[Veracocha]

I went to Slimbridge again recently and had a chat with some knowledgeable staff who said it was harmful (white bread) but feel free to feed them brown bread. He said the white bread also had a high salt content?

I'll go with the experts on this one. Quite surprised at some of the responses here though!

 

[Cobra]

That's fine, but it cuts both ways - if you cba looking for evidence to the opposite, stay quiet. I already said I would re-post this with more evidence. Anybody who cares about the subject would take the time to check the facts - and if you don't care, why bother to waste your precious time arguing with me?

Ok So here it is.
I have kept birds for years raising some from a couple of days old
I studied nutrition, behaviour & genetics at college
So I think I have a fair idea about what is and what is not a good diet.
I agree that bread is not the most suitable diet for wild birds but certainly whilst they are raising chicks
they do need all the help they can get. A quick trip "next door" to pick up a loaf or two is easier than spending an hour "grubbing around"
What I object to is sweeping statements like your opening arguement but I conceed that it was not your research
that produced the results and your were just trying to be helpful passing along someone elses,
( that may or may not have been proven, was an "LD 50" test carried out on white bread? I doubt it)
the good thing about research is you can make it point to which ever direction "you" ( the researcher)
wants it to, in an effort to get their vivour passed which incidentally has to be a unique peice of work.
There you have it in a nut shell
To feed white bread or not to feed? I guess the jury is still out on that one

 

[DiddyDave]

This is sadly turning into more of an argument about how to argue a point, than simply the OP's intention to help birds

An important part of an scientific study is of course observation. Many have observed birds eating white bread, en masse, for years with no evidence of them dying in from of them (choking) or indeed being washed up dead later

But that doesn't mean it's not harmful, just we don't see the evidence of that harm for some reason

But to tell people to stop doing something and that for proof of a reason they have to go find it themselves seems absurd to me - just post the link that initiated your thread ???

And please do make more serious posts - just back them up and all's well



DD

 

[Jo]

An important part of an scientific study is of course observation. Many have observed birds eating white bread, en masse, for years with no evidence of them dying in from of them (choking) or indeed being washed up dead later

But that doesn't mean it's not harmful, just we don't see the evidence of that harm for some reason



DD

To twist this another way, apart from road kill and cat kills when do you ever see dead birds? Not just from white bread poisoning, but natural causes too? does this mean unless they are killed by predators whether it be vehicle or beast .. they live forever?

I think not If someone could find some poor departed birds and do tests to see why they died, maybe that would give some answers ... unless they have done just that, and that is where the advice "Do not feed birds white bread or whole peanuts" comes from? :shrug: Without researching I don't know, but it's food for thought.

Anyway, well all know wholemeal bread is better for us than white. So why not give the birds the left overs of our wholemeal. Is it really that much of a big deal to do that, just in case the advise it very accurate?

Jo
xxx

 

[oldfart]

there are notices on all Glasgow parks saying white bread is bad for swans, ducks etc. The biggest problem is swans & ducks cant read the signs & the people dont bother. Basically i think its junk food to them.

 

[Lateralus]

good thread, grave = )