Is there a non DSLR with DSLR IQ & AF ability?

cambsno

cambsno

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Simon
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Quite simply I am still looking for a camera to take out instead of my D700. It needs to be a bit smaller and am open to it having a fixed lens or will just have a couple of primes. Needs to be DX or FF.

I had a X100 which I loved, but the AF was pants! Mostly shoot people (kids) so needs to be quick to AF. Using the pad on the back of the D700 is quick, easy and a dream and need something similar. Prefer a viewfinder too.

Like the XPro1 deal at moment but heard the AF is still not great, so possibly will look at the Pro2 when it comes out. Am a sucker for retro styling (would love an M9 but out of budget).

Dont think there is anything out there (XPro probably closest), but if anyone knows of anything, speak!
 
I read the new Fuji models (XE2, X100s) only use Phase in decent light, in low light it just reverts to only using Contrast so its not much better in low light situations compared to the older models, saw some videos on Youtube proving it and people who own both have told me the same thing.

M9 doesnt even have AF.
 
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daugirdas said:
Can you shop around for a new bag for d700 or something along the lines? Why does everyone suddenly have to make a tragedy for 200g and 5cm?! Oh, it is fashion...
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Weight isn't the only issue. Some people don't like bags. I can't get a D700 in my jacket pocket, but I can get an X10 or a Panny G2 w/pancake in. Probably an X100 too. Maybe that's the deal with wanting a smaller camera?
 
Ed Sutton said:
Weight isn't the only issue. Some people don't like bags. I can't get a D700 in my jacket pocket, but I can get an X10 or a Panny G2 w/pancake in. Probably an X100 too. Maybe that's the deal with wanting a smaller camera?
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Forgive if I am wrong, but X10 or anything similar will feel horrible in your jeans. 5" Samrtphone is about the biggest thing that is tolerable there, but given any chance I will put it in the jacket or suitcase. With x10 in your coat pocket it may be OK, just. However you may want some case for it, or it will get filthy (pocket lint getting everywhere) or scratched. There goes a pocket camera...

There is nothing wrong with wanting, but do you needed it (when there is a nice pro camera right in front already paid for and delivering top results)? I may have done a few impulse or fashion buys myself (ipad namely) but this goes right on top of the list. Fair enough if £500 is pocket money...
 
Canon 100D with a prime of your choice is relatively tiny with excellent AF and decent IQ. I've tried a bunch of mirrorless cameras and the 100D works better for me.

I've burbled a bit more about it here.
 
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Ed Sutton said:
Weight isn't the only issue. Some people don't like bags. I can't get a D700 in my jacket pocket, but I can get an X10 or a Panny G2 w/pancake in. Probably an X100 too. Maybe that's the deal with wanting a smaller camera?
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Thats right. On family days out I will often take the D700 with at least 2 lenses (normally one will be the 24-70). Have no issue carting such stuff around but there are times when I want something poocket size (or at least will fit in wifes handbag or be easy to carry in one hand) like parties, theme parks etc...
 
cambsno said:
Cheers guys...


Is it DSLR like to AF (or close to)? It was pretty much just the AF that I couldnt get on with!
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Its very much improved. 90% of the time its as good as an DSLR. In low light the DSLR still beats it but other then that
 
boyfalldown said:
Its very much improved. 90% of the time its as good as an DSLR. In low light the DSLR still beats it but other then that
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Useful to know, low light not a huge issue, its the moving of focus points quickly and easily thats important.
 
Hi dave
If you loved the x100 why no get a other
The problems it had are sorted now due to the new v2.0 firmware update very close to the 100s now
Or you can get yhe 100s on fuji refurb when available for around £850 ish
If you really want to be pixel peeping then look for the sony rx1
These have come down abit now

Chris
 
paulcamcas said:
Canon 100D with a prime of your choice is relatively tiny with excellent AF and decent IQ. I've tried a bunch of mirrorless cameras and the 100D works better for me.

I've burbeld a bit more about it here.
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....My daughter has a 100D which I occasionally use and it most definitely is not a pocketable camera - It's the same size as an average bridge camera. Excellent camera though.
 
daugirdas said:
With x10 in your coat pocket it may be OK, just. However you may want some case for it, or it will get filthy (pocket lint getting everywhere) or scratched.
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Camera cases are for tarts. Lens caps?
:lol:
The scratches mean it matches my DSLR - which is held together with gaffer tape. :thumbs:

Let's be perfectly honest here. Unless you make at least some of your living with a camera none of us need a camera at all. But if people can afford to buy themselves indulgent toys that's their business.
 
cambsno said:
Thats right. On family days out I will often take the D700 with at least 2 lenses (normally one will be the 24-70). Have no issue carting such stuff around but there are times when I want something poocket size (or at least will fit in wifes handbag or be easy to carry in one hand) like parties, theme parks etc...
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That counts the 100D out. Pocketable it ain't.
 
Why not just get a D3200 or D3100, you have a nice small dslr then, with AF that you want and use your existing lenses.

Just restrict what you use on it, stick on a 35mm and take nothing else.
 
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Ivan S said:
Why not just get a D3200 or D3100, you have a nice small dslr then, with AF that you want and use your existing lenses.

Just restrict what you use on it, stick on a 35mm and take nothing else.
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See above. Needs to be smaller than a dslr
 
In my quest for something truly pocketable I tried various micro four thirds cameras and before that a Nex - while with a small lens they will all fit in a jacket pocket, they both feel and look odd having a big bulge in there. :)

The only jacket pocket of mine they fit comfortably in is my big 'michelin man' style down jacket which I only wear on the coldest of winter days. So I ended up with an RX100 which although ideally could be a wee bit slimmer in depth does actually fit in most jacket pockets quite comfortably and even fits in a shirt pocket (just). Plus you get the flexibility of a zoom lens rather than being stuck with a prime.

Downside of course is the price - held off for ages but nabbed one at £329 on the one day Lightning Deal thing. Even then it's the most money I have ever paid for a camera (yes I know £330 is nothing to D800, 5DMkiii owners etc) - but my A57 dslr (slt) was £299 (refurb) for example, but even though it's a lot of money for a compact camera I think it's worth it so far as a truly pocketable take anywhere camera. Not perfect but pretty decent all rounder for photos and apparently the video is okay too (not used it yet, but some decent stuff on vimeo).
 
I think the X100s looks like the ideal small camera. It is supposed to be vastly improved over the original.
 
I would also have to recommend the rx100..although admittedly not tried tracking moving subjects but af is pretty snappy and the image quality is a well known quantity.
 
The new Sony A7 with an FE 35mm f/2.8 might fit the bill, as it has phase detect and full frame.

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/sony-alpha-7-7r/

Jury's out at the moment, but it should be in the shops within a couple of weeks. I'm increasingly likely to buy one for use with manual focus primes (because that's my thing).

e2a: Imaging resource published an IQ comparison with the 5D III and D800 yesterday. They reckon it beats the 5D for JPEGs.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/new...s-medium-format-quality-35mm-body-judge-yours
 
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I've got the X100 with updated firmware. My best buddy has X100s. Neither is good enough for fast moving kids. Not necessarily the speed of AF, the shutter lag although slight still makes it tough to use for anything moving.
Can't really see a non DSLR cutting it at the moment.
 
I had an X100 for a little while. Loved the retro appeal, IQ and portability but I gave up photographing anything that moved. I got a few nice shots of our toddler with it but only when she was sat still and I still generally ended up stopping down a little to reduce my chances of completely missing focus, which is a shame when you have a lovely F/2 lens to play with. For static stuff, it was wonderful.

My most recent attempt at downsizing is an OMD EM5. Have to say that in comparison to the Fuji the AF is a revelation. Very fast and accurate even in compromised light and no perceptible shutter lag. I do have a gripe with it though in the AF department and that is that it still can't really track movement. It'll get you some nice shots of things that move but you can't just track something like you can on a DSLR and then choose the moment you want to capture. It could still be an option though depending on how you work. On the IQ front, in most conditions it's superb. The only area where a full frame DSLR really shows it up is in low light, though it does do a fair job there too. In fact I've had shots that are not totally unusable at ISO 6400 but probably relatively low contrast scenes only.

Downsizing hasn't gone well for me, I'm selling the OMD soon and now have a D3. Just haven't found anything yet that matches a DSLR for ticking every box that I use a camera for and I don't really have the money for two stand alone systems.
 
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I've had x100, X-E1 and X-Pro1 and from these three the X-E1 is definitely my pick visibly faster than the X-Pro1 lighter the optical viewfinder is not very useful and the electronic is good enough. If you don't want to change lenses definitely the X100 the quality I would say is not as good as the X-E1 and X-Pro1 but it's such a hassle free camera, you just enjoy your time and take the occasional photo nothing too demanding, not carrying lenses around and you don't really feel restricted by the fixed lens as the range is great for almost anything.
 
A Panasonic LX7 has a great lens, is small and can print A3s with ease and doesn't cost £1000!

I use one with a viewfinder and get very reasonable results - it takes great raws and perfectly usable jpegs.
 
Yes and no, yes to the iQ, in fact I would go as far as to say the iQ on the X-Pro1 beats a lot of apsc dslr cameras into a cocked hat, especially at higher iso's but though the AF on the fuji X range has improved dramatically its still not as fast as a dslr and nor are the dual AF models yet, I say yet because the one thing fuji is good at is working to improve their firmware and releasing updates that make a difference to your current camera.

Conversely I hear the new OMD EM1 has blisteringly fast dual AF that even beats a good few dslr's but though the iQ is good its not as good as the fuji or a decent apsc dslr.

It's always a trade off between iQ, AF speed and size/weight I've found where often there has to be a slight sacrifice in one in order to gain the other.
 
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