I've got a question/dilemma

munchycarrot

munchycarrot

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Stef
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At the moment I am in a bit of a dilemma as to what kit i want/have/need :naughty:

I am really wanting to get a 300mm prime, can't afford the 2.8 so it'll be the f4. I will be taking wildlife pics with it.

At the moment I have the following Nikon lenses:

18-70mm, 70-300mm, 50mm 1.8, 24-70mm 2.8 & 70-200mm 2.8.

I use the 70-300 all the time for the length, never use the 18-70 (came with my cam) as we have the 24-70 which we need for our portrait business.

I am thinking of selling the 70-200 to fund the 300 f4 & look to getting a converter at a later stage (after payday!)

A few people i've spoken to are saying keep the 70-200 & get a 1.7 tc but I don't want to rely on that for all of my shots & as it is, I don't use the 70-200 at all and it's just sitting in it's bag upstairs.

Can anyone offer any advice who has used one or the other, or both?! :thinking:

I have put a post on FB to see if there's any intertest out there but i've not really 100% made up my mind yet... Arghhhh, i wish i could just buy one of everything :bonk:
 
If you don't mind manual - m42 - tair 300mm f4.5 for around 80 ukp on ebay.
Also there are 400mm and 500mm lenses popping up and selling for around 40-80 ukp...


If you aren't using the lens - sell it - its only gathering dust, wanting to be used.


Cant help with the usage tho - don't have zooms anymore and missus wont let me get the tair lol :) Picture quality seems to vary - check on pixel peeper or flickr - I had an 18-200 vr mki - i found it soft. Yet on flickr there are really crisp pics with it...

If you can try it first!
 
Thanks for the reply :)

I want the ability to AF, I'm pretty sure i'd get frustrated with only mf, would rather have the choice. I'd buy the 300 f4 new so would be no worries there :thumbs:
 
I have a AF 300 f/4 with a 1.4TC.. Focus is very slow, but IQ is very good and very sharp. I imagine the AF-S 300 f/4 would be much better focus wise.
 
If you don't use the 70-200 at all AND you want the 300 for the length, then get the 300. That said, a 1.4 on the 200 vs the 300 isn't too much different. I'd trade you straight up on my 300/4 for a 70-200, buy myself a 1.4, and be happy with it (not that I'm suggesting it). But, that's because I want a x200/2.8 zoom also. The image quality on the 300 is great and you won't be disappointed. I love mine and don't know that I could part with it.

Thanks
Rick
 
Hi Tom, thanks for that... i keep going towards the 300 then looking around and finding it hard to make a decision LoL

The IQ is the big thing for me so what you have said is nudging me in the right direction i feel ;)

Just need to sell the 70-200 to fund it, i'm itching for a new toy :D

*edit* Sorry Rick, i think we replied together... i'd be looking at definitely using the 300 with a tc, 1.4 or even looking at the 1.7. For the time being i'd use the lens without until i could spare the extra £ to get the tc, just getting used to a prime would be the fun at first i think :) Is yours the AF-S ?
 
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300mm is actually pretty much the bare minimum for seriously tackling wildlife photography, particularly if birds form part of your intended subjects. I have the 300mm 2.8 and it's rarely used without a converter unless the birds are particularly close, and the reality is they often aren't. The lens is almost always used with either a 1.4 TC (420mm) or a 2XTC (600mm). Thankfully, the lens is a prime of sufficient quality to still yield good results with either converter.

There's no getting away from the fact that primes are better than zooms, but the difference isn't always night and day and I think you'd do well to think in terms something longer than 300mm.

The 100-400L is an obvious choice. I used this lens for a long time and it's capable of excellent results with a realistic amount of reach for smaller birds.

The 400mm f/5.6L is absolutely tack sharp being a prime and would be my choice if money is an issue and let's' face it - it's an issue for all of us at times.

I wouldn't discount the Sigma 50-500 - I've seen some cracking results from that lens and the focal length is a big bonus.

Soz - I can only talk in Canon terms - not being too familiar with Nikon offerings.
 
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Nikon don't have anything in the same range as the 100-400 Canon unfortunately :| The old 80-400 was rumoured to be being replaced but when...

I would love longer but money wont allow it & it will be a long way off in our present situation to look at longer than 300 with a 1.4/1.7 tc on.

The Sigma... hmmm, i've looked at the 150-500 & had chance to borrow one with a view to buy, a while back (from someone off here) but the results weren't as good as i'd expected... I know, that was only one & you get good & bad with a lot of lenses :thinking:

I'm wondering if hiring both would be wise to try them both out for a day or two :suspect:
 
D300 + 300mm f4 AF-S with 1.7TC (ISO3200) @f7.1 which is pretty much wide open.

I do not even notice when the 1.4TC is used with it.

Focuses fine with either TC.

With a minimum focus of 1.35m it is a useful lens for butterfly and dragonfly shots.

161_120.jpg





.
 
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munchycarrot said:
I'm wondering if hiring both would be wise to try them both out for a day or two :suspect:
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Well it's not a bad idea - although I'd say take the shots tripod mounted to get a fair idea of relative sharpness particularly if you're shooting birds.Tiny camera movements and minor focusing errors can really give the wrong impression by taking the critical edge off sharpness.
 
Martyn, i think you have just sold it to me! Wow :thumbs: Thanks for taking the trouble to post that... it would be the exact same set up i'd have if i go this route :D

CT... good point, wouldn't be a fair test hand holding.

Thanks again for the replies, it's all helping, i just want one now!
 
Martyn... said:
D300 + 300mm f4 AF-S with 1.7TC (ISO3200) @f7.1 which is pretty much wide open.

I do not even notice when the 1.4TC is used with it.

Focuses fine with either TC.

With a minimum focus of 1.35m it is a useful lens for butterfly and dragonfly shots.

161_120.jpg





.
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Sorry to go off topic for a moment, but is that really ISO 3200 on a D300? :eek: I've always found ISO 1200 to be pretty noisy on my D300 (I don't tend to go much over ISO 800 very often), what did you use for noise reduction?

Cheers
Aled - absolutely gobsmacked!
 
Aledafis said:
Sorry to go off topic for a moment, but is that really ISO 3200 on a D300? :eek: I've always found ISO 1200 to be pretty noisy on my D300 (I don't tend to go much over ISO 800 very often), what did you use for noise reduction?

Cheers
Aled - absolutely gobsmacked!
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Noiseware LINK the Community Edition is free if you are on windows :thumbs:

This is it without noise reduction, (the D700 is even better)

161_120a.jpg
 
Stef sorry to go off the subject slightly, but Aled, this is with my D700 @ 6400 ISO ... no noise reduction applied

230_031.jpg
 
Yes that D700 is absolutely amazing (and most definitely on my wish list!!)

I'll give Noiseware a go, thanks for the link.

Cheers
Aled
 
idigitize said:
Just out of curiosity, when you say fine, would you say it's perfectly usable with the 1.7, or is it a case of bright sunshine only?

Impressive shot btw, thanks for posting.

(btw, im Stefs o/h)
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With the 1.7TC I would stick to single focus point, I have not had any problems with it, but I do use rear button focusing, which means once I have focus I can let go of the button and it will not latch onto something else in the background or foreground.

It nailed this at ISO3200 (so gloomy) amongst all the clutter, no problem

300 + 1.7TC

158_063.jpg
 
Noticed this on the Nikon website:
Autofocus with teleconverters
Even with compatible Nikon TC-E teleconverters and Nikon AF-S lenses, autofocus may not be possible. Autofocus systems used in SLR cameras use the light passing through the lens to acquire focus. If there is not enough light transmitted though the lens the camera will be unable to take readings and therefore focus properly. Nikon states that autofocus may not function if the maximum aperture of a lens is smaller than f/5.6. It is at this value that light transmission maybe insufficient for autofocus to be achieved. However this is a general rule and will infact depend on the illumination value of the light source, with AF performance still being possible at f/5.6 under very bright light conditions.

As mentioned above, when a teleconverter is used with a lens there is a loss of light transmitted by the lens. Therefore a fast aperture lens such as a f/2.8 lens will effectively have an aperture of f/5.6 if used with a 2x teleconverter. A lens with an aperture of f/4 when used with the 2x converter will therefore exceed the required f/5.6 maximum aperture value and autofocus may not be possible.
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So reducing the light by using a converter affects autofocus but the limits seem quite narrow; if as suggested by Nikon, autofocus is unpredictable at f5.6 or above then a 300 f4 with a 1.4 TC is at f5.6 and anything more than a 1.4 is going to be well above.
So is there a danger that the faster AF-S advantage of the 300mm f4 could be seriously compromised by the use of a TC?
The pics in the posts above are all very clear but it doesn't appear that there is much movement that would affect the autofocus - what would have been the result if used with a bird in flight?
 
gramps said:
So reducing the light by using a converter affects autofocus but the limits seem quite narrow; if as suggested by Nikon, autofocus is unpredictable at f5.6 or above then a 300 f4 with a 1.4 TC is at f5.6 and anything more than a 1.4 is going to be well above.
So is there a danger that the faster AF-S advantage of the 300mm f4 could be seriously compromised by the use of a TC?
The pics in the posts above are all very clear but it doesn't appear that there is much movement that would affect the autofocus - what would have been the result if used with a bird in flight?
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The guides from the Nikon site were written years ago, AF technology has moved forward and improved, I have never had a problem with stationary or moving targets using either the 1.4 or 1.7 TC on my D300.

I would advise using only single centre point, rear button focusing, and setting the limiter on the lens 3m to infinity to improve things, it is not as snappy with the 1.7 as it is without, but there is not much in it.

According to the Nikon site, and instructions the 1.7TC will not work with my 200-400 f4, or my 500 f4 either ... but it does no problem.

I generally stick to the 1.4TC on whichever lens I am using, but that is more to do with available light and being able to shoot at f5.6, now the summer is here and light is improved I will revert to the 1.7 for the added reach.

I would suggest getting the 300 AF-S and 1.4TC first, as this will give you plenty of reach on the D300 body, then save for the 1.7TC later.
 
Martyn... said:
The guides from the Nikon site were written years ago, AF technology has moved forward and improved, I have never had a problem with stationary or moving targets using either the 1.4 or 1.7 TC on my D300.

I would advise using only single centre point, rear button focusing, and setting the limiter on the lens 3m to infinity to improve things, it is not as snappy with the 1.7 as it is without, but there is not much in it.

According to the Nikon site, and instructions the 1.7TC will not work with my 200-400 f4, or my 500 f4 either ... but it does no problem.

I generally stick to the 1.4TC on whichever lens I am using, but that is more to do with available light and being able to shoot at f5.6, now the summer is here and light is improved I will revert to the 1.7 for the added reach.

I would suggest getting the 300 AF-S and 1.4TC first, as this will give you plenty of reach on the D300 body, then save for the 1.7TC later.
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Thanks for your experience, having yesterday ordered the 300 f4 and 1.4TC it is what I wanted to hear :D
 
Having just got the 300mm F4 AF-S I would agree with the above comments. In actual use I find the autofocus easily fast enough using the 1.7 with the focus range limited, allowing the lens to focus on the whole range it slows it down. Obviously when the teleconverter is removed I notice an increase in speed. I use it with a D300s and the only problems I encounter are due to me getting used to hand holding the equivalent of a 500 mm lens. I have the 70-200 VR ( first version ) and use it with the 1.7 but don't find it as good as with the 300. The first time I used the 300 with 1.7 was a dark day and expected it to struggle - it did not and I was very impressed by the sharpness with the lens wide open. I had read various comments before so was not sure the combination would work but it certainly does - so good that I tend to use the 1.7 more than 1.4 converter now although to start with I used the 1.4 to gradually get used to using the combination hand held. The first trip out with the 1.7 resulted in a bit of a disaster down to me really using the combination as a 300 and a pretty strong breeze blowing it about. A tripod would have given better results. The second trip out was much better as I knew where I had been going wrong.

Without a teleconverter the lens is a strong performer. Very fast autofocus and sharp wide open. The lack of VR is not a problem for me as I am not a great fan of it anyway and tend to keep it switched off on the lenses that have it.
 
gramps said:
Thanks for your experience, having yesterday ordered the 300 f4 and 1.4TC it is what I wanted to hear :D
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:thumbs:

When I got the 200-400 I had intended to sell the 300, I still have it as it is nice to have something compact (compared to my bigger tele's) when I travel, or a light set up for a quick trip out.

Optically superb without question.
 
Well i think after a lot of reading last night & now the replies here from people with first hand experience I have definitely made my decision.

I am going to go for the 300 f4 & hopefully a 1.4 asap. I will have time to get used to the prime before i go longer with the tc :)

Thanks to you all for taking the time to reply & add pics too :thumbs:

So, does anyone want to buy a 70-200? :D
 
Another 300mm f4 AF-S user with both 1.4 and 1.7 TC. AF works fine if light levels ok. I find irmainly down to contrast between subject and background at lower light levels.
 
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munchycarrot said:
Can i ask where you got them from or is that nosey? :D
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Not nosey at all - the 300mm I got from Mifsuds, excellent price and next day delivery (arrived today extremely well packed - wife asked "what size camera is that for heavens sake?").
The TC I've ordered from Microglobe, reportedly loads in stock and next day delivery ... we'll see.
 
Thanks Gramps & MDR :)

Hope the tc comes quick then Gramps & you can play to your hearts content... lucky! :D

MDR, just looking at digital rev, bit worried about buying from overseas but I guess a lot of people say that... ?
 
munchycarrot said:
MDR, just looking at digital rev, bit worried about buying from overseas but I guess a lot of people say that... ?
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I made a test purchase of a cheaper item from them first and was happy with that so ordered the lens and some other items. I ordered from their web site so all taxes were paid and I paid for the DHL service. I was very happy with their service. I could follow the tracking with DHL and it arrived within a few days. They are also on this forum and respond very quickly if you contact them. Have a look in the shopping section.
 
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munchycarrot said:
Thanks Gramps & MDR :)

Hope the tc comes quick then Gramps & you can play to your hearts content... lucky! :D

MDR, just looking at digital rev, bit worried about buying from overseas but I guess a lot of people say that... ?
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I've bought from Digital Rev. No problems with service.

My stuff was on the tax repaid which was in my account in 24 hours.
Buying abroad you should always work out the full costs of importing VAT and import tax to calculate what you may have to pay. If no cheaper then buy local.

I say this because on other overseas purchases I have always put aside the duty but am often surprised at how little HMRC often charge.

Also bear in mind that certainly with Nikon, lenses have an International warranty, bodies are local and if a fault develops on a body (during warranty) it will have to be shipped to HK or wherever. DR do have a UK no and shipping times are very quick.
 
Well, I have provisionally sold my 70-200 so it's looking promising that I will be putting in an order to Digital Rev in the next few days :) Still apprehensive with never having tried the 300mm prime but hey, i don't suppose many people do with online purchases...
 
Just ordered it, can't wait now :) Just need to save a few more pennies to get the converter but i'll spend some time getting used to the lens when it gets here :thumbs:
 
munchycarrot said:
According to DHL it's still in Hong Kong, i'm getting slightly nervous LoL
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Hope it arrives soon for you. The DHL service was very good when I bought mine from DigitalRev.

Tried mine out with the 1.7 on my D90 the other day. Slower to focus than with the D300s (not a surprise as it is the same with my other lenses) but still accurate.
 
Thanks for the reply, it's in the East Midlands (60 miles from me!) now so i'm hopeful for delivery today... maybe ;) Really looking forward to trying it out & getting used to the 'no zooming'

Hopefully i can get the tc next month, still undecided on 1.4 or 1.7, i don't want to be greedy & get more length at the cost of slower AF or compromised IQ...
 
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It was at the airport from midnight thurs til this morning at 5am, it's now out for delivery today so i'm happy. Some hold up apparently with clearance at East Mid but hey ho, today's the day :)

*edit. It arrived at lunchtime, pretty amazing bit of kit. Can't wait to get out & give it some proper testing at the weekend :)

:thumbs: to Digital Rev, shipped on weds, arrived monday
 
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