Just got my First car!

neil_g said:
it should, not sure on a 1.1 french powerhouse though. also if its damp and/or diesely corner then it can be game over before you can blink. like i say depends on your reflexes :)
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I had a go in a Mk4 Escort on a rally driving experience in loose gravel a few years back. We were taught lift off oversteer to get the car into bends, was great fun and I recommend it to anyone for learning car control. Diesel, yes you've probably had your lot unless you are really fortunate, damp or wet road if you have decent tyres, you should be able to get it back under control.
I used to have a Mk1 Fiesta 950 and never had any trouble getting that back under control from under or oversteer, wet or dry.
 
Can we for once not just be happy for the Lad it is a big thing for him. he seems to be thinking about the right things. oh and by the way little point in telling him not to get that car as he already has it.
 
Pass plus will not teach you anywhere near as much as a RoSPA course.

But TBH if the only reason someone is interested in doing any form of additional driver training is for the insurance discounts as opposed to learning how to be safe and effective behind the wheel of what is for all intents and purposes a huge chunk of metal on wheels which can kill, then I shall continue to worry about my safety on the roads on a daily basis.

If you want to drive a forklift truck in a warehouse you have to do a refresher course at regular intervals to ensure you are still capable, and yet in order to drive a vehicle on public roads you do one test and then that's it unless you get caught speeding/lose your licence etc. Seems a bit crazy!

(and FWIW, I am not 'captain slow' - I get up to the legal speed limits so I don't drive everywhere at 30/40mph, I have drag raced and done track days and will be going on a skid-pan next week, so I do like my fun on 2 or 4 wheels - I just don't believe public roads are the place for that fun when there are so many deaths and injuries caused by idiots who believe they are invincible and the best driver ever!)
 
Kestrel said:
Pass plus will not teach you anywhere near as much as a RoSPA course.

But TBH if the only reason someone is interested in doing any form of additional driver training is for the insurance discounts as opposed to learning how to be safe and effective behind the wheel of what is for all intents and purposes a huge chunk of metal on wheels which can kill, then I shall continue to worry about my safety on the roads on a daily basis.

If you want to drive a forklift truck in a warehouse you have to do a refresher course at regular intervals to ensure you are still capable, and yet in order to drive a vehicle on public roads you do one test and then that's it unless you get caught speeding/lose your licence etc. Seems a bit crazy!

(and FWIW, I am not 'captain slow' - I get up to the legal speed limits so I don't drive everywhere at 30/40mph, I have drag raced and done track days and will be going on a skid-pan next week, so I do like my fun on 2 or 4 wheels - I just don't believe public roads are the place for that fun when there are so many deaths and injuries caused by idiots who believe they are invincible and the best driver ever!)
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Completely agree with the above!!!

Around 10 years ago I (voluntarily) attended a police run "Driver's advisory" course which consisted of 6 hours classroom tuition with Essex Police's top driving instructor (Think he held IAMs and RoSPA Gold) where we went through Roadcraft in a fair bit of detail. The guy said that we'd pretty much done the practical for the Advanced Driving Test and I had full intentions of following up and taking the test but unfortunately never got round to it.

I have to say the course itself was an eye opener!!! At that point I'd been driving for around 8 years (without incident) but I now believe that was more by luck than judgement...... Actually I'll go a step braver and say that I used to drive like a complete b*****d!!!! (I'm not proud but I'm man enough to admit it)

Whilst I do still drive "enthusiatically" at times, I have a lot more awareness thanks to the course.

Advanced Driving isn't just about "slow and steady", in fact far from it. It's about driving and adapting to the ever changing conditions on the roads, thinking ahead and anticipating.

The instructor kept on pointing out that driving is an art which nobody ever masters, you have to keep learning and improving. From the behaviour I see on the roads to/from work everyday there aren't many people who know that!
 
Probably not much help now but Saxos are notoriously expensive to insure, you would have been better off getting a Peugeot 106 which is essentially the same car but insurance is a lot cheaper- boy racers tend to chav up Saxos which makes insurance premiums for them higher.

My brother is currently learning to drive, the cheapest insurance we found for him was around the £1800 mark.
 
neil_g said:
yes i can. its widely known as the boy racer/chav car of choice :)
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this - take a look at www.barryboys.co.uk - a site dedicated to taking he p out of badly modified cars - about half the cars on their shed database are saxos - the other half are mostly corsa's
 
neil_g said:
to be fair barrysboys are morons.
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The people who modify cars badly or the people who inhabit the website ? anyone who looks at a 1.1 litre shopping trolley and thinks that needs a spoiler, body kit, lexus lights, M3 mirrors, mutifit alloys and an airbrushed striking cobra on the bonnet , is definitely a moron. (and thats leaving aside the sort of idiot who drills holes in brake discs , paints the braking side, fits a 2 litre red top but doesnt tell dvla or his insurers, chops 30mm off the springs with an angle grinder etc)

However my main point was that the number of halfwits who chose saxos (or corsas, punto, peougot 106s, lupos etc) for base vehicles for making a number of unsafe and/or poorly executed modifications and then drive them like total ****s frequently racing, drifting and otherwise behaving like an arse on the public highway , before crashing into each other or an innocent passerby , is one thing that pushes up the insurance for people like the OP

When I was a lad - which wasnt that long ago - my first car was a 20+ year old ford zephyr, 3rd party fire and theft insurance was £330 quid from direct line (and that included roadside assistance, relay, and motor legal) - a young chap with a comparable car now will be lucky to get away with paying ten times as much - and thats down largely to the number of ****witts crashing cars into things because of the gap between their perceived driving ability and the reality
 
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snipsnap said:
Which goes to show, that no matter how well qualified you are, most of us males when we're young, we can be so stupid and it only takes a moment to go from normal life to something much more major.
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This - When I was 21 , just after passing my advanced test I bought a VW sirroco , which was much faster and punchier than anything i'd driven before, and rolled it and wrote it off the same day. ( I accellerated hard into ba corner , tried to slide the back end round, lost it hit the verge and flipped)

There was no insurance claim as no one else was involved and the car was only on 3rd party fire and theft

I was extremly fortunate to walk away from that, and i havent done anything so stupid since.
 
stokecity_m said:
I didn't plan to crash my first car either, but I did. My insurance was £980 and the damage I did cost about £6k. No one was hurt and it taught me a great lesson.

Touch wood I don't crash again.
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This is what nearly always happens with young drivers, and the reason why insurance premiums are so high.

My youngest son wasn't going to have an accident either, but he did and wrote off both his own car and the other car, it cost a lot more than £6K. All that really mattered though was that
1. Nobody was hurt
2. He learned from it.

Both he and his sister, who was with him at the time, could easily have been killed. The other car hit his offside front wheel, if there had been a time difference of maybe 1/100th second it would have hit his door instead...

His car was another 'young drivers special', a Ford KA. After that he bought an old Merc, the insurance didn't cost a lot more, he was in a much safer car and driving a quality car seemed to slow him down and improve his attitude.
 
SimonUK said:
Yay! Got my first car yesterday, although i'm only 16, i turn 17 in a month, and needed to get a car at some point, so why not now!

Its a 1.1 Saxo, and got it for a really nice price, and according to my dad, who drove it home with me sat next to him, it drives really good!

I can't wait to get out and drive it! :D

However, insurance is silly expensive, i've been looking at the Smart-Box thing from Co-Op, Has anyone got any views on this? At the moment, it looks like i'll be able to insure the car to learn for cheap, but once i pass, i can't insure for less that 3 grand :/

Any ideas?
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Congrats Simon

Hope everything goes well with the driving (when you start) and your freedom when you pass.

I'm sure I've heard that there is a new system being tried which involves a video camera being installed (might be with black box aswell, not sure) which is aimed to reduce premiums as there is black and white evidence recorded should anything happen.

I also seem to remember hearing about black boxes and curfews imposed to reduce premiums, might be worth looking into these in more detail.

Anyway, hope you get on well and look forward to the photo of you removing your L plates - one of the best feelings as a 17 year old.!!!!
 
Kestrel said:
If you want to drive a forklift truck in a warehouse you have to do a refresher course at regular intervals to ensure you are still capable, and yet in order to drive a vehicle on public roads you do one test and then that's it unless you get caught speeding/lose your licence etc. Seems a bit crazy!
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Are you sure that isn't just something operated by certain companies. I know plenty of people who have forklift licenses at work, they don't even drive them full time, could even be weeks inbetween and none of them have had refresher courses.
 
nilagin said:
Are you sure that isn't just something operated by certain companies. I know plenty of people who have forklift licenses at work, they don't even drive them full time, could even be weeks inbetween and none of them have had refresher courses.
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Most of the companies I know do insist on refresher training but I don't believe it's a legal requirement. But it does go to show the large amount of people running these companies that recognise in order to operate dangerous machinery you should also keep your skills up to date :)
 
big soft moose said:
The people who modify cars badly or the people who inhabit the website ?
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mostly the ones on that website. change pretty much anything on a car and that lot will go off on one with the insults. lets face it like everything its personal taste.

there isnt really anything wrong with modifying a car, provided like you say it is done to a safe standard and everything is declared to dvla (if necessary) and the insurance. incidentally my 2nd spaxo was reasonably modded (wheels, shocks and springs, strut brace, large brake conversion, 4 branch manifold, stainless exh, enclosed induction system, bucket seats etc. was due for a cam and a large port head but didnt work out) and it was all declared at 21yo and i think i was paying £500fc :D

why did i do it? because i wanted to.
 
The point of barryboys is not slagging off performance modifications (although some folk think that is the jist of the site and proceed that way) but to point out glued on fake air vents, wood screws holding bumpers on, fake dump valve vents, insane lowering, spending £1000 on a french mini then spending allegedly £10k as a project then trying to sell it for £5k and getting £800 for it. Barryboy logic rather than engineering excellence. :LOL:

Also some stories of insurances companies using the site searching for undeclared mods and then cancelling the policies (if true) can only be a good thing in my eyes.:cool:
 
A strut brace is a brilliant modification for any road car ... and quite a few racing cars too! (y)

It's greatest real effect is that when you have a crash on one side of the car it takes all the forces over to the other side and doubles the repair bill! :LOL:
 
Yves Geza said:
A strut brace is a brilliant modification for any road car ... and quite a few racing cars too! (y)

It's greatest real effect is that when you have a crash on one side of the car it takes all the forces over to the other side and doubles the repair bill! :LOL:
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Depends on the strut brace. All Mk3 Mondeos have a seperate strut brace on each strut. They are not directly linked to each other, so no transfer of damage from one side to the other.
700px-Mk3_Mondeo_TDCI_Fuel_Filter_2.JPG

Ignore the red cirlce that's just highlighting the fuel filter.
 
Russ77 said:
I think it's pretty common for most FWD cars, especially if the rear tyres have less grip than the front ones ;)

Having said that, in the 11 years and 112K (enthusiatic) milesI owned my MK1 focus I never managed to provoke it into a tailslide :LOL:

Went on a Police run advanced drivers course which culminated in a trip to their skid pan, even the copper sitting next to me randomly pulling the handbrake couldn't get the thing to misbehave, he commented on what a well handling (if somewhat boring) car it was :LOL:
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I had a 205 gti some years ago, the lift off oversteer was almost like lifting the handbrake if timed right (or wrong!)

Loved that car.
 
nilagin said:
Depends on the strut brace. All Mk3 Mondeos have a seperate strut brace on each strut. They are not directly linked to each other, so no transfer of damage from one side to the other.
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Of course! But no need to worry about the damage going side to side! Ever since the Ford Motor Company bought Earle MacPherson's front suspension strut design, their products have had a long and dishonourable history of punching their front suspension straight up through the bonnet!! :LOL::LOL:
 
Yves Geza said:
Of course! But no need to worry about the damage going side to side! Ever since the Ford Motor Company bought Earle MacPherson's front suspension strut design, their products have had a long and dishonourable history of punching their front suspension straight up through the bonnet!! :LOL::LOL:
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Maybe upto about 40 years ago. I've not seen nor heard of a strut coming up through the bonnet on any cars built after that.
 
nilagin said:
Maybe upto about 40 years ago. I've not seen nor heard of a strut coming up through the bonnet on any cars built after that.
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It's reasonably common on BMWs and BMW MINIs for the struts to get forced upwards on heavy impact (a large pothole, for example) causing the top mounts to "mushroom", so there's probably still the chance of a strut hitting the bonnet....
 
Back to the OP, I seem to remember an insurance company offered a cheaper policy with a curfew, so if you're not planning on using the car at night, it might be worth looking at that.

Get your mum or dad added to your policy if they have a good record.

Get quotes for TPFT and fully comp. I've heard of people who have had cheaper FC quotes.

Not that I condone it but I can see why people don't take out car insurance at those sort of prices.
 
also look at third party only insurance - to be honest you don't need fire and theft because what you'll get for a saxo that age won't be much more than your excess anyway

also if you parents have a good record its worth speaking to their insurers because some places will do a faily discount for taking out additional policies
 
nilagin said:
Maybe upto about 40 years ago. I've not seen nor heard of a strut coming up through the bonnet on any cars built after that.
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Of course not!

I can't remember who it was - someone :whistle: - posted a picture of those huge, heavy, cast iron "strut braces" Ford have had to bolt under the bonnet to prevent it happening! :LOL: :LOL:
 
Yves Geza said:
Of course not!

I can't remember who it was - someone :whistle: - posted a picture of those huge, heavy, cast iron "strut braces" Ford have had to bolt under the bonnet to prevent it happening! :LOL: :LOL:
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If you are refering to my photo, they aren't cast iron nor heavy, they are pressed sheet metal, probably about 0.8mm thick, light but strong.(y)
 
davemk said:
Not that I condone it but I can see why people don't take out car insurance at those sort of prices.
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These days settlements run into millions where accident victims are left paralysed.

That's why premiums for young drivers are so high. £2000 to insure a small French hatchback doesn't really cover anything in terms of potential damages to third parties if they end up requiring a lifetime of care.
 
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