Mirrorless autofocus

Teagan

Teagan

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Gerard
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Hi I'm thinking of switching to mirrorless but just gathering information first.

How does the mirrorless autofocus compare to a Nikon D7100 for both still and moving subjects and is there a mirrorless camera that you would recommend? I'm not bothered by which manufacturer although ive doubts about Sonys quality.

Regards Gerard.
 
amusingly your 7100 probably has a sony sensor

af on a6000 is very fast on still subjects, and so is top oly camera, dunno about moving stuff on either

if you want quality get a sigma dp, af is poor tho
 
Focusing performance can range from downright slow through to better than DSLR for many things. If you want any form of focus on moving objects, you are very much dependent on the lens and camera body.
 
Teagan said:
Hi I'm thinking of switching to mirrorless but just gathering information first.

How does the mirrorless autofocus compare to a Nikon D7100 for both still and moving subjects and is there a mirrorless camera that you would recommend? I'm not bothered by which manufacturer although ive doubts about Sonys quality.

Regards Gerard.
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Build or image quality? Rhetorical question only but I personally wouldn't worry about either.

I've found the focus of my Panasonic MFT cameras to be comfortably fast enough for me for still shooting.

There's a roundup of CSC's v a top end DSLR for tracking here...

 
Teagan said:
Hi I'm thinking of switching to mirrorless but just gathering information first.

How does the mirrorless autofocus compare to a Nikon D7100 for both still and moving subjects and is there a mirrorless camera that you would recommend? I'm not bothered by which manufacturer although ive doubts about Sonys quality.

Regards Gerard.
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What do you mean by moving subjects? There's a world of difference between say, a couple walking slowly towards the camera, active kids or maybe a footballer running fast towards the camera. Mirrorless is getting better and should manage the walking couple okay, might score a few hits with kids if distances aren't changing too much and there's a bit of depth of field to cover errors, but won't stand a chance with a subject running fast towards the camera, with a longer lens and shallow depth of field. Nikon D7100 with decent lens and good technique will handle them all.

Don't believe all you read about mirrorless AF performance. Many of the claims are very carefully worded and highly qualified. Basically, if faster moving subjects are an important part of your work, stick with the DSLR.

Edit: that's an interesting video, showing the best of current mirrorless. But... it's all done in good light, and the depth of field differences flatter the mirrorless while disadvantaging the Nikon DSLR. He keeps making the point about how expensive the Nikon is by comparison, but cheaper DSLRs can do that just as well.
 
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Hi, thanks for the replies, when I mention doubts over Sonys build quality it is in reference to having bought two LCD tv's and a Sony laptop that all went kaput after a few months. I don't know how Sonys camera division QC fairs hence my doubts but I would hope its better than the tv and computer sections.

When talking about moving subjects I'm referring to moving birds both ground and flight. I'm currently using the D7100 with a 300 f4 and 1:4 tc but I'm starting to find carrying the set up difficult due to health issues thus I'm looking at maybe a lighter less bulkier setup both for family days out and birding trips.

Regards Gerard.
 
Teagan said:
I'm currently using the D7100 with a 300 f4 and 1:4 tc but I'm starting to find carrying the set up difficult due to health issues thus I'm looking at maybe a lighter less bulkier setup both for family days out and birding trips.
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TBH, you are probably going to find your choice restricted by lenses on mirrorless. There are very few options at that sort of focal length with "decent" lenses (i.e. wideish aperture, and fast focusing). It kind of discounts Sony (unless you want to lug the 70-400 f4-5.6 @1.5kg around and I think removes the Fuji completely. That leaves micro 4/3rds and the best of the current lens lineup is the Panasonic 100-300 f4-5.6 (which gives 600mm EFL). Don't think that will be as quick to focus as the lenses on the bodies in that video.
 
Teagan said:
Hi, thanks for the replies, when I mention doubts over Sonys build quality it is in reference to having bought two LCD tv's and a Sony laptop that all went kaput after a few months. I don't know how Sonys camera division QC fairs hence my doubts but I would hope its better than the tv and computer sections.

When talking about moving subjects I'm referring to moving birds both ground and flight. I'm currently using the D7100 with a 300 f4 and 1:4 tc but I'm starting to find carrying the set up difficult due to health issues thus I'm looking at maybe a lighter less bulkier setup both for family days out and birding trips.

Regards Gerard.
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For birding, the lens is the heavy bit and TBH they don't get much lighter than 300/4. If carrying is the problem, have you tried a sling-strap like Black Rapid? If it's hand-holding, use a monopod.
 
for family days a mirrorless small and light makes sense, but for birding a dslr makes a lot of sense, a sling strap will help a lot with weight, and so would a monopod or tripod
 
Teagan said:
Hi I'm thinking of switching to mirrorless ...
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For which reasons?

Your main question is about focus : what aspects of focus do you feel need to be compared to your 7100? It really isn't a simple question since it depends hugely on which body+lens combination is used.

For small and light with good "bird" focus have you considered that Nikon "1" series?
 
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I suppose when comparing to the D7100 I'm looking for a mirrorless that locks onto a moving bird just the same as the Nikon.

I currently use an optech sling strap. A monopod wouldn't be of much use as it would only get in the way when using binoculars.

I'll take another look at the Nikon 1 series of cameras and lenses.

Fuji I think are bringing out a telephoto lens next year for their mirrorless set up. Will be interesting to how good it is.

Regards Gerard.
 
Teagan said:
I suppose when comparing to the D7100 I'm looking for a mirrorless that locks onto a moving bird just the same as the Nikon.

I currently use an optech sling strap. A monopod wouldn't be of much use as it would only get in the way when using binoculars.

I'll take another look at the Nikon 1 series of cameras and lenses.

Fuji I think are bringing out a telephoto lens next year for their mirrorless set up. Will be interesting to how good it is.

Regards Gerard.
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If its like fujis other lenses its going to be very good, im confident it will be.
 
pingu666 said:
the problem is that mirrorless shape is quite bad with a long lens
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The problem is some mirrorless shapes are bad. Almost as bad as those making sweeping statements ;)
 
nikon 1 V3 & the 70-300 but it isn't a cheap option. If you haven't already you should read Thom Hogan's comments on it.
 
pingu666 said:
the problem is that mirrorless shape is quite bad with a long lens
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arad85 said:
The problem is some mirrorless shapes are bad. Almost as bad as those making sweeping statements ;)
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Or to clarify some mirrorless imitate dSLRs. Samsung NX1 for example. Everything is great, but why do you want to lose optical viewfinder for the same form factor? I wouldn't call it bad shape just because it provides a lot better hand grip. Grip is good, flat and small is for drones and car rigs.
 
daugirdas said:
Or to clarify some mirrorless imitate dSLRs. Samsung NX1 for example. Everything is great, but why do you want to lose optical viewfinder for the same form factor? I wouldn't call it bad shape just because it provides a lot better hand grip. Grip is good, flat and small is for drones and car rigs.
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WYSIWYG? Being able to see detail in the dark which would be invisible through an OVF? ? No front / back focus issues? In view histogram? Smaller overall form factor?
 
evf is weaker for bust shooting

but you need a decent amount to hold onto with a long lens, and a classic small mirrorless body is kinda poop for that, and negliable point swapping to a big mirrorless from what he's got
 
pingu666 said:
evf is weaker for bust shooting

but you need a decent amount to hold onto with a long lens, and a classic small mirrorless body is kinda poop for that, and negliable point swapping to a big mirrorless from what he's got
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300mm F4 vs 100-300 f4-5.6. Significant savings in weight and size there (1.2kg and 220mm long vs 500g and 125mm) let alone extra reach. Whether the lens and body will do what is needed is another question (which I don't know the answer to ;))

I keep saying it, the savings on mirrorless is in the lenses, not the bodies....
 
arad85 said:
300mm F4 vs 100-300 f4-5.6. Significant savings in weight and size there (1.2kg and 220mm long vs 500g and 125mm) let alone extra reach. Whether the lens and body will do what is needed is another question (which I don't know the answer to ;))

I keep saying it, the savings on mirrorless is in the lenses, not the bodies....
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Sometimes, often even, but not always. Mirrorless in general is not well served with longer focal lengths and if you take the Olympus 300/2.8 it is bigger, heavier and more expensive than the Canon 300/2.8.

Problem with the Panny 100-300 is it's nowhere near the same league optically as the OP's Nikon 300/4.
 
no what it's worth, my V1 is a LOT slower than the D700/D300/D7100, with native 1 lens or with the same DSLR Nikon lens using the FT-1

AF is OK but the final lock on "focus" time is longer
 
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So maybe now isn't the time to find a mirrorless with 300mm bird-tracking focus ...

The way things are progressing it might be best to hold onto the DSLR for another 12 months.

If the new Olympus 300mm actually appears then (for a price) I expect the E-M1 or its sucessor would be a capable choice.
 
HoppyUK said:
Sometimes, often even, but not always. Mirrorless in general is not well served with longer focal lengths and if you take the Olympus 300/2.8 it is bigger, heavier and more expensive than the Canon 300/2.8.
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It's also a 4/3rds lens, which is effectively dead.... but it also is more equivalent to the 500mm on crop or 600mm on FF :D

HoppyUK said:
Problem with the Panny 100-300 is it's nowhere near the same league optically as the OP's Nikon 300/4.
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Nope. But then it's 1/10th the price.... and I have been questioning whether it is good enough in my posts in the thread ;)
 
Mirrorless AF systems are improving but they still lag behind the fast focus of a Nikon / Canon DSLR in particular the post photokina models. I'm not anti mirrorless, I have a Fuji X-T1 which is pretty good, I have looked at the Sonys/Olympus but they are all a few generations away from catching up with the new DSLRs with 51 point AF focusing etc.
 
Blank_Canvas said:
I have looked at the Sonys/Olympus but they are all a few generations away from catching up with the new DSLRs with 51 point AF focusing etc.
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I'm not sure that's true.

Focus performance has to be a combination of lens + body so when making statements about what's best it's best to be specific. I think I'm pretty safe in saying that for focus tracking the very best DSLR+lens combination will be a bit better than the very best mirrorless body+lens combination as per the vid above (but the DSLR in that vid is a top of the range model and not all will be as good and also note the price) but I think (I think...) I'm also pretty safe in saying that the fastest autofocusing body and lens combination is mirrorless... exactly what it is today I don't know :D as the various manufacturers seem to claim to be the best when they bring out their latest model.

Of course one advantage of mirrorless is that focus is spread across the frame and you're not limited to specific focus points as you are with a conventional DSLR. Another advantage with mirrorless is that focus should be very accurate but proving the rule somehwhat that's something that Fuji may need to improve on :D Allegedly :D
 
my mums a6000 is bloody quick, not tried it with moving stuff though, for static or slow stuff a complete non worry
 
I've purchased a Nikon v1 with 10-30 kit lens. I'll also look for an FT-1 to attach my 300 f4. Ill give it a go and see what it's like. If I do like the mirrorless option then I might delve further into mirrorless photography.
Earlier in the year I purchased full frame lenses. Although they were brilliant lenses they were just too heavy to be lugging around so I sold all my gear. Here's hoping the mirrorless option works.

Regards Gerard.
 
woof woof said:
I'm not sure that's true.

Focus performance has to be a combination of lens + body so when making statements about what's best it's best to be specific. I think I'm pretty safe in saying that for focus tracking the very best DSLR+lens combination will be a bit better than the very best mirrorless body+lens combination as per the vid above (but the DSLR in that vid is a top of the range model and not all will be as good and also note the price) but I think (I think...) I'm also pretty safe in saying that the fastest autofocusing body and lens combination is mirrorless... exactly what it is today I don't know :D as the various manufacturers seem to claim to be the best when they bring out their latest model.

Of course one advantage of mirrorless is that focus is spread across the frame and you're not limited to specific focus points as you are with a conventional DSLR. Another advantage with mirrorless is that focus should be very accurate but proving the rule somehwhat that's something that Fuji may need to improve on :D Allegedly :D
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:agree:

Too many people dismiss contrast detect as rubbish because Canon/Nikon can't do it decently. Lens/sensor/algorithms are pretty good for some mirrorless these days (thinking GH series, OM- series with the pro level lenses in micro 4/3rds at least).
 
arad85 said:
:agree:

Too many people dismiss contrast detect as rubbish because Canon/Nikon can't do it decently. Lens/sensor/algorithms are pretty good for some mirrorless these days (thinking GH series, OM- series with the pro level lenses in micro 4/3rds at least).
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I'm currently thinking of moving to Fuji and one of the reasons is auto-focus related - "face detection"!

I know we're supposed to be gear snobs and worrying about all the minor technical details, but one thing that really gets me is having a nice camera, being out with the family and having someone (even another family member) offer to take a snap of us together. It's never in focus and that's because most people (understandably) don't know how to use a DSLR's focus effectively. Set the XT1 to face detect, hand it to them and ask them to take a couple of shots in case someone blinks and I'll have a much better chance of having a record of the day including myself! :)
 
A bit late in the day but I tested my K-01....it's a big chunk (but mirrorless) against my 600D with the kit lens and nifty 50 and the Pentax beat the Canon every time for focus speed, mind you though this is with the latest firmware as it was lousy with the original one that it came with. The downside was that the Canon beat the Pentax for accuracy overall.
 
Cuchulainn said:
I'm currently thinking of moving to Fuji and one of the reasons is auto-focus related - "face detection"!

I know we're supposed to be gear snobs and worrying about all the minor technical details, but one thing that really gets me is having a nice camera, being out with the family and having someone (even another family member) offer to take a snap of us together. It's never in focus and that's because most people (understandably) don't know how to use a DSLR's focus effectively. Set the XT1 to face detect, hand it to them and ask them to take a couple of shots in case someone blinks and I'll have a much better chance of having a record of the day including myself! :)
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But you could also do the same with a Nikon the latest models have face detection....
 
Blank_Canvas said:
But you could also do the same with a Nikon the latest models have face detection....
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I didn't know that. Had a look at it seems to be only on the full frame models at the moment for through the viewfinder recognition? Fair play to Nikon for adding it.
 
Blank_Canvas said:
But you could also do the same with a Nikon the latest models have face detection....
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Face detect is only an option in live view on my D5200.

Cuchulainn said:
....being out with the family and having someone (even another family member) offer to take a snap of us together. It's never in focus and that's because most people (understandably) don't know how to use a DSLR's focus effectively.
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Set your DLSR up before you hand it over - Program mode with the camera selecting the focus point. It'll be close enough for rock'n'roll.
 
Ed Sutton said:
Set your DLSR up before you hand it over - Program mode with the camera selecting the focus point. It'll be close enough for rock'n'roll.
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You'd think -but it never happens that way :) I've many a (deleted) blurry mess!
 
I usually get them sharp and well exposed - but with me a tiny spec in the middle of the frame!
 
Cuchulainn said:
I didn't know that. Had a look at it seems to be only on the full frame models at the moment for through the viewfinder recognition? Fair play to Nikon for adding it.
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There are a couple of new crop sensor Nikons just about to appear on the market D7200 plus one other. I expect this to follow the D810 / D750 lead and have Face Detection.
 
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