Modifications to Oulton Park. Possibly the first of many :(

You can see from the bridge in the distance and the track comes past you at druid’s corner
Then disappear down the straight
 
couple of pictures

1
MKS_5199.jpg


2
MKS_5204.jpg


3
MKS_5226.jpg
 
Here is a shot from the 19th from a similair locvation, if not a bit further up :shrug:

IMG_5793.jpg


BTW not arguing, just trying to work it out :LOL:
 
I think the fence stop there but now you can walk round the corner to the next straight
You have to cut down the new gate where you saw the no enter sign it is open to the public now.

dont cut the gate down just wallk down the side off it
 
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Well mat what you think of the new spectator’s area.
 
There was a massive discussion/argument about the changes Castle Combe made during last Winter, as the main 'easy' position was essentially killed off by a massive fence. Ironically, the pictures from this season have been the best in a couple of years in my opinion, as people have been more far more creative. The new fence shown in the picture from grandslammer actually makes no difference to 99% of photos anyway, I've only missed 2 events all year and have only seen one or two people ever venture into the spot now blocked by the fence.

I for one am hoping Club Chicane at Thruxton gains a dirty big fence one day, should force the '400mm, 6fps and hope' crowd to move elsewhere and try new things ;)

I guess what I'm saying is, you will find a way around whatever problems get thrown at you...and probably be better for it.
 
ukaskew said:
There was a massive discussion/argument about the changes Castle Combe made during last Winter, as the main 'easy' position was essentially killed off by a massive fence. Ironically, the pictures from this season have been the best in a couple of years in my opinion, as people have been more far more creative. The new fence shown in the picture from grandslammer actually makes no difference to 99% of photos anyway, I've only missed 2 events all year and have only seen one or two people ever venture into the spot now blocked by the fence.

I for one am hoping Club Chicane at Thruxton gains a dirty big fence one day, should force the '400mm, 6fps and hope' crowd to move elsewhere and try new things ;)

I guess what I'm saying is, you will find a way around whatever problems get thrown at you...and probably be better for it.
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Sorry but anyone who can say that fences wherever they are improves things in my opinion is wrong. Yes it sends people to find other spots and angles etc but what is going to happen for amateurs ( who don't lick enough ass for a Media Pass) god forbid it, if say the whole circuit at Combe would be Debris Fence lined! And secondly some amateurs like to watch the racing as well as take a few shots so usually end up at a prime overtaking spot on raceday which usually is a "Easy Photo Spot". Not everyone wants to walk round all day!

In my origional post I was not actually refering to Photography at all at Combe (Although probably a bit off topic then!) it was in a general comment about over zealous safety measures now even blighting Combe more and more. Especially at that point at Avon Rise as I have said where any incident is going to go towards the infield.

IMO the spots on all our circuits where we have unhindered views wherever they be should be valued extremely highly
 
Paddockman said:
who don't lick enough ass for a Media Pass
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ahh, so thats how you get a media pass. we get quite a lot of people asking how to get one. i'll add that to the FAQ

the thing about fences is that these people who complain about health and safety and too many fences etc are still going to try and sue someone when a car flies off and puts them in hospital.
The fences are often put there on the request of the liabilty insurance companies, if they dont do it then they dont get any insurance.
 
badgerbaiter said:
ahh, so thats how you get a media pass. we get quite a lot of people asking how to get one. i'll add that to the FAQ

the thing about fences is that these people who complain about health and safety and too many fences etc are still going to try and sue someone when a car flies off and puts them in hospital.
The fences are often put there on the request of the liabilty insurance companies, if they dont do it then they dont get any insurance.
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That is what annoys me. If you dont like the danger of getting hurt, dont go. :bang:

Bring back the 50's-80's IMO. Better drivers, better cars, better action and less fences :)
 
Matt Sayle said:
Bring back the 50's-80's IMO. Better drivers, better cars, better action and less fences :)
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and less injury lawyers

but be honest, if you were a spectator and got seriously injured so much that you couldnt pay your mortgage or feed your kids would you:
a) think, ah well at least there was no fence in my photo
b) sue the circuit in an attempt to not lose your house and not have to live on incapacity benefit for the rest of your life (about £50 a week when i was on it)
 
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badgerbaiter said:
and less injury lawyers

but be honest, if you were a spectator and got seriously injured so much that you couldnt pay your mortgage or feed your kids would you:
a) think, ah well at least there was no fence in my photo
b) sue the circuit in an attempt to not lose your house and live on incapacity benefit for the rest of your life (about £50 a week when i was on it)
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Tbh, I dont know. I dont think I could sue the track. I was there in full knowledge that I could get that serisouly injured or worse. Also there are enough signs to warn me that it is dangerous.
 
Safety Fences are a necessary evil. I think the current balance for most circuits in the UK is about right and all the typical problem areas have been sorted out.

There are one or two drivers who manage to have an accident in unusual places but thats a freak occurance and if you start planning for every eventuality you'll have cars racing in see through tunnels like hamsters.

Rallying seems to be more of a problem area than circuit racing.
 
Matt Sayle said:
Oh. My. God :|:(
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Have you never seen that one before Matt? It's a horrific accident.

Anyway, back on topic; Fences are a necessary evil. I don't think any true motorsport fan likes them, but, as has been said, there is no way circuits could get insurance, and hence run meetings and trackdays without them. It's only going to get worse, we should all make the most of it while we can. In 20 years, every track will have big debris fences, the cars will be heavily silenced (or electric), and the sport as we know it will be dead :(
 
RichardC27 said:
or electric
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going OT a little more, i wish someone wound invent a proper battery, or a way to get proper electricity into a car.

IMHO a theoretical electric car (not one that ran on a crap battery) would easily beat a petrol car in a race. Much much more torque than a petrol or diesel. Theres a reason why the fastest trains in the world arent petrol powered :)
 
I'm very rarely behind any kind of fencing,except the recently added protection on the marshal's posts,so I don't experience the fans sometimes restricted view,or the togs frustration on getting 'the' shot, to any extent
One of the places to justify the installment of debris fencing,was the startline at Combe
Remember this one from last year ?
http://www.turnpikeracing.co.uk/combe-2007_10_06/Castle Combe 6-10-2007 Martin Hillier/target71.html

..and the aftermath
castlecombecarnivaloct6xv1.jpg

Hope this is still vaguely on topic ?
 
Let me clear one thing up first I still hate fences but I can now see a reason for them more than ever. I personally wouldnt have wanted that Lancer to land on top of me nor that burning Merc.

Fair play. They are total buggers but ,christ almighty, are they needed.
 
Paddockman said:
Sorry but anyone who can say that fences wherever they are improves things in my opinion is wrong. Yes it sends people to find other spots and angles etc but what is going to happen for amateurs ( who don't lick enough ass for a Media Pass) god forbid it, if say the whole circuit at Combe would be Debris Fence lined! And secondly some amateurs like to watch the racing as well as take a few shots so usually end up at a prime overtaking spot on raceday which usually is a "Easy Photo Spot". Not everyone wants to walk round all day!
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I think that's a little OTT, there will always be safe spots to view the action unhindered, the majority of spectators like to see as much of the circuit as possible, which usually means they are often in the opposite places to the amateur togs such as myself. The biggest concentration of spectators at Combe is usually Quarry (many of which happily sit behind the fence) and Camp (nice high view), likewise at Thruxton most people are usually sat up on the banking. Avon Rise is inherently 'unsafe' because most cars are technically unstable at some point and it's the fastest point of the circuit, whilst the risk of a car going towards the Armco is small, if and when it does happen, it's normally pretty spectacular (as a few occasions in the past year or so have more than proved)

With the exception of the recent fence at Tower, none of the fences from the past couple of years have had any real impact on spectators.

I just think it's part of the territory when it comes to amateur motorsport shooting, zoo photographers have worked their way around fences for years, I can't see 'us' struggling too much, there are always ways around it.
 
ukaskew said:
I think that's a little OTT, there will always be safe spots to view the action unhindered, the majority of spectators like to see as much of the circuit as possible, which usually means they are often in the opposite places to the amateur togs such as myself. The biggest concentration of spectators at Combe is usually Quarry (many of which happily sit behind the fence) and Camp (nice high view), likewise at Thruxton most people are usually sat up on the banking. Avon Rise is inherently 'unsafe' because most cars are technically unstable at some point and it's the fastest point of the circuit, whilst the risk of a car going towards the Armco is small, if and when it does happen, it's normally pretty spectacular (as a few occasions in the past year or so have more than proved)

With the exception of the recent fence at Tower, none of the fences from the past couple of years have had any real impact on spectators.

I just think it's part of the territory when it comes to amateur motorsport shooting, zoo photographers have worked their way around fences for years, I can't see 'us' struggling too much, there are always ways around it.
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Really don't think we will agree on this one.

I guess as my avatar shows I am just an old dinousaur from the late 70's and eighties who totally deplores the way the "Nanny State" has ruined my spectator/Photography Viewing/Shooting at most UK Circuits over the last 30yrs.

I have seen people Killed at UK Circuits right in front of me both drivers and spectators but "That is the risk you take" and no-one will ever persuade me that losing the real thrill of being close to the action and actually being able to admire the skill of areally quick driver was ever a good thing for Motorsport.

Hey next thing they will be trying to iron out the bumps on Avon Rise, great can't wait!
 
Circuits should acknowledge the presence of the amateur photographers - certainly for club events which is the vast majority of events. These people are all spending their cash with the circuit, so their needs should be considered as well as the ordinary spectator.

A few gaps here and there, or small flaps in fencing to shoot through wouldn't be too much to ask.
 
andrewc said:
Circuits should acknowledge the presence of the amateur photographers - certainly for club events which is the vast majority of events. These people are all spending their cash with the circuit, so their needs should be considered as well as the ordinary spectator.

A few gaps here and there, or small flaps in fencing to shoot through wouldn't be too much to ask.
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That is a great idea, Andrew :)
 
andrewc said:
Circuits should acknowledge the presence of the amateur photographers - certainly for club events which is the vast majority of events. These people are all spending their cash with the circuit, so their needs should be considered as well as the ordinary spectator.

A few gaps here and there, or small flaps in fencing to shoot through wouldn't be too much to ask.
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Yep agree on that one.
 
Eg at Snetterton: Exit of Bombhole corner. Break in the fencing which gives a great view of the corner. Two people can use this gap for photography and if a car came towards you you're still safe.

Brands hatch has the TV flap as well which is often vacant.

We're often paying £ 10 - £ 15 to get in, we ought to team up and form a lobby group. Fences - in moderation, with some thought to the needs of different spectators.
 
badgerbaiter said:
going OT a little more, i wish someone wound invent a proper battery, or a way to get proper electricity into a car.

IMHO a theoretical electric car (not one that ran on a crap battery) would easily beat a petrol car in a race. Much much more torque than a petrol or diesel. Theres a reason why the fastest trains in the world arent petrol powered :)
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Trouble is the batteries are so heavy, it negates any possible advantage. What you need is a continuous metal grid lining the circuit that could be used to transmit power --- hang on - I've realised what all the fences at circuits are actually for! Formula dodgems!!
 
andrewc said:
Trouble is the batteries are so heavy, it negates any possible advantage. What you need is a continuous metal grid lining the circuit that could be used to transmit power --- hang on - I've realised what all the fences at circuits are actually for! Formula dodgems!!
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i'm thinking full size scalextric would be cool!
 
Paddockman said:
I have seen people Killed at UK Circuits right in front of me both drivers and spectators but "That is the risk you take"
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thats some of the biggest nonsense i've seen on TPF

OK, so you could say that if a spectator gets killed then thats fair enough because its the risk they take (which i dont agree with anyway). but what about the rest of that persons family? do you think it'll make it easier for them to know that their son / father / mother etc knew the risks?
 
badgerbaiter said:
thats some of the biggest nonsense i've seen on TPF

OK, so you could say that if a spectator gets killed then thats fair enough because its the risk they take (which i dont agree with anyway). but what about the rest of that persons family? do you think it'll make it easier for them to know that their son / father / mother etc knew the risks?
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Yes I think it would actually, to a small degree.

As I have said when you have experianced a sport for as long as I have you do not welcome everything just in the name of safety. I went to an Enduro last week to shoot and one rider broke a collar bone and another a double leg fracture, both hit trees as far as I am aware. Will they then cut the trees down? no, as I have said they know the risks.

But hey thats probably more nonsense.
 
badgerbaiter said:
going OT a little more, i wish someone wound invent a proper battery, or a way to get proper electricity into a car.

IMHO a theoretical electric car (not one that ran on a crap battery) would easily beat a petrol car in a race. Much much more torque than a petrol or diesel. Theres a reason why the fastest trains in the world arent petrol powered :)
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I read about a year ago that Intel, or some other big technology company, had invented a new kind of battery that would make that possible, i.e. you could power a pretty fast electric car from a battery pack about the size of a ream of A4 paper. Something similar to that anyway. An optimised electric car would run rings around an internal combustion powered car, as electric motors have huge torque available from pretty much 0rpm, and it can be delivered directly to the driven wheels.

The only problem is they'll all be silent, and forgive me for being a little old fashioned, but I like standing at the side of a track having my ear drums blasted out of my head by the cars out there (I'm talking about international and historic meetings here, not club level stuff, where they're already heavily silenced).
 
Paddockman said:
Yes I think it would actually, to a small degree.

As I have said when you have experianced a sport for as long as I have you do not welcome everything just in the name of safety. I went to an Enduro last week to shoot and one rider broke a collar bone and another a double leg fracture, both hit trees as far as I am aware. Will they then cut the trees down? no, as I have said they know the risks.

But hey thats probably more nonsense.
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its one thing to get a broken collar bone doing an enduro (if you havent broken your collar bone then you arent a real biker), but you were talking about spectators being killed
 
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