Beginner ND filters

Messages
20
Edit My Images
Yes
I know this has recently been covered but....I'm confused. I need someone to explain in really stupid person terms what I need.

I want to take landscape pictures with a wide aperture and a long exposure in the hope of getting a nice soft water shot. Whenever I try it's too bright. So I need an nd filter right?

I have a nikon d3200 with kit lens and a 50mm 1.8. So I would use the kit lens. How do I know what size nd filter I need? Which one? Are the cheapo ebay ones a waste of time, even just to practice with?

I know it must be really annoying to have to deal with people that have no clue, but I did post in the beginner section so don't be too irritated with me. ;)
 
Hi Ness, I got a set of bog standard filters from Amazon for Xmas last year so I could have a play and find out what 'strength' filter I would use the most - they are not fancy but my plan was to get some practice and then at some point invest in 1 or 2 decent filters once I knew where the right place to put my. Money was as they are pretty pricey so I didn't want to waste my money. I think the set was £15 and has mounts to fit a variety of lens threads so unless your lens is some crazy wierd type, I'm sure this kit would suit you very well..

This is the kit, or if it's not the exact one, it's pretty similar https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B0...7e8f-501d-88cd-b69886010a84&pf_rd_i=332181031

High quality? Prob not. Get what you pay for? Prob. But if you're Learning the ropes, in my eyes, you can't go wrong with this.
 
Last edited:
I know this has recently been covered but....I'm confused. I need someone to explain in really stupid person terms what I need.
Not stupid, just needs an explanation you understand :)

I want to take landscape pictures with a wide aperture and a long exposure in the hope of getting a nice soft water shot.
Generally you use a narrower aperture (a higher f number e.g. f11) than a wider one ( a lower f number e.g. f3.5) ... the wider the aperture the faster the shutter speed at the same iso.

Whenever I try it's too bright. So I need an nd filter right?
Yes, these increase the exposure time required by a number of stops (in essence 1 stop equals 1 unit of exposure)

I have a nikon d3200 with kit lens and a 50mm 1.8. So I would use the kit lens.
Good choice :)

How do I know what size nd filter I need?
for a screw in one, look at the end of the lens, it will give the filter ring size, which from memory will be 52mm on the kit lens.

Which one?
There are many available, but generally you get what you pay for ... I've used Hoya before and they were ok as were tiffen but others may have a more up to date recommendation.

Are the cheapo ebay ones a waste of time, even just to practice with?
No real idea tbh, sorry.

I know it must be really annoying to have to deal with people that have no clue, but I did post in the beginner section so don't be too irritated with me. ;)
Nope, not annoying :)
 
Have a butchers at this Ness http://www.leefilters.com/index.php/camera/index

This site will give you some help and insight of what you may need or what your trying to achieve, It doesn't mean you need to buy Lee filters but just a reference.
I use Lee filters as I think they are best but they are expensive, other makes at hitech, cokin etc. Hope that helps.
 
No problem, Ness, everyone starts somewhere.

For ND filters you have a choice of screw in filters or square filters.

Screw in filters, as the name suggests, screw into to threads on the front of your lens.
Somewhere on the lens will be a number, probably followed by mm, that is the thread diameter. On my kit lens (it is not a Nikon but I think it is faily similar for most makes) it is on the front of lens. Once you know the thread size then all you need is a screw in ND filter of the strength you want in that size. The drawback with screw in filters is each one will only fit one size of lens so if you want to use an ND filter on a lens with a different thread size, you'll need to buy another filter


Square filters get over the above problem by the use of adaptor rings. If the thread diameter of the lens you want to use is 52mm then you buy a 52mm adaptor ring. This screws into the lens thread and a square filter holder fits onto the adaptor ring. Square filters of whatever density you want can be fitted into slots at the front of the holder. If you want to use another lens with a different thread size all you need is a different adaptor ring, which is cheaper than buying a new filter.

Square filter are made in different sizes and each size will accommodate a number of different focal lengths of lens. You need to be careful if you want to use very wide angle lenses with some square filters. If the filter is too small than vignetting can occur if it is used with a very wide angle lens. The filters I use are 85mm and are fine for my kit lens at the wide angle end of it range (ie 18mm). However, if I wanted to use a wider lens I would probably need 100mm filters.

I do not know the ND filters sold by this company - http://srb-photographic.co.uk/ - but their grad filters, adaptor rings and filter holders are good and reasonably priced.

Dave
 
Hi,
not a stupid question, ND filters are a bit confusing.
I bought one of those cheap kits that @dan_yell mentioned, but found it rather dissatisfying; even with trying to stack up multiple filters, I couldn't get long enough exposures in daylight and they just attracted dust and dirt.
I then bought a variable ND filter but found it gave odd vignetting when you turned it.
I now have a Zomei ND1000 (ie 10 stop) filter, which I can't fault for the price. I don't do enough to justify expensive Lee filters, but for the odd long exposure, it's great and don't cause problems with colour cast.
A 52mm version is available for about £28, which is pretty good. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Zomei®-Multi-Coated-SCHOTT-Density-Neutral/dp/B00IZCEI8U/
 
Super, thanks guys, this is exactly what I needed to know. l had a look and it is a 52mm and I doubt I'll use it on another lens so I'll get a screw in one. I'm looking forward to giving it a go.

Ps. Oops about the wide aperture mistake! I did know that, honest.
 
Last edited:
I have the same kit and the 52mm screw in filters from ebay. For silky water, an exposure over one second will start to give the effect. This can be achieved with the correct settings, F22 and a 1.2 second shutter speed, obviously mounted on a tripod. However, go for the cheap Chinese screw on filter sets as a start off. Ive learnt with them for a year now and got some very good results, but now noticing the quality is poor, the more I learn. We all have to start somewhere.
 
I recently purchased a variable ND filter off eBay. I found it be adequate for my needs.

Things I've learned. Make sure the ISO is set to its lowest settings. With a variable filter you could try it at its weakest and slowly adjust your settings from their. Their also good for normal shots for when the scene is too exposed I've found. Useful things.
 
Can anyone offer advice on this kit? Has everything I need except a polarizer. How would it compare to Hitech?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/72mm-Adap...036828?hash=item568b1bb71c:g:fxoAAOSwe-FU5Jgb

I don't know about that particular kit, but it's a Zomei filter, which is the same as my 10 stop screw in filter, which is great (although cheaper to buy that that full kit). There's practically no colour cast on my Zomei filter (at least not that I can detect), in fact, I used it yesterday to take this. 10 stops allowed me to have a 25second exposure in the midday sun.
Five Arches by Alistair Beavis, on Flickr
 
I don't know about that particular kit, but it's a Zomei filter, which is the same as my 10 stop screw in filter, which is great (although cheaper to buy that that full kit). There's practically no colour cast on my Zomei filter (at least not that I can detect), in fact, I used it yesterday to take this. 10 stops allowed me to have a 25second exposure in the midday sun.

The Zomei 10 stops have a slight blue cast, but nowhere near as strong as Haida or the Lee Big Stopper. You probably wont even notice it on sunny days, it's a bit more noticeable in dull conditions.
 
Whenever I try it's too bright. So I need an nd filter right? ;)
'no' you need less exposure.. the problem you identify here is in your technique, not your gadget bag; to get less exposure you 'may' want an ND... but if the picture's too bright, it's your settings that's wrong NOT your gear, and if you don't sort the technique, an ND wont do it for you, and you will carry on over exposing, and probably more so, not less.
Start here Exposure - Exposed!
I want to take landscape pictures with a wide aperture and a long exposure in the hope of getting a nice soft water shot.;)
Please ask yourself whether the world hasn't already got enough of them, first.... they are a rather over done cliche.. but still.
Question of settings, and many people think 'long exposure' and so set FAR too slow a shutter.

AND, thing with milking waterfalls is, you are capturing highlights.. that are moving, streaking accross the frame, filling it with more highlights than actually exist in 'real time'.

Imagine metering the scene not to 'milk' the water, but 'freeze' it, with a very short shutter speed, maybe 1/1oooth. Camera averages the scene, highlights and low-lights, and offers an aperture to give an exposure in the middle.

Now you drop the shutter to 1/60th.. the camera's meter is still metering the same 'scene', so it will suggest you stop down the aperture 3 stops to maintain the same exposure.... BUT... with the shutter open four times as long, you will get the highlights dragged across the frame covering perhaps four times as much area.. hence you get 4x the amount of highlights blotting out the low-lights, and what you get appears over exposed.

You know what you want the picture to look like, but the camera only knows what its looking at... so you need to better understand 'exposure', and that this is one of the situations where you probably need to use a little 'compensation', and choose settings to under expose the scene from what you meter to compensate for multiplying the highlights during the longer exposure period... the camera doesn't 'know' they are going to move and drag accross the frame, you do.

OK... slap on an ND filter.... this will NOT solve your 'problem'.

Camera will still meter through the lens, AND the filter. It will still meter the scene as it sees it and suggest settings between high-light and low, and will STILL not know that the highlights will drag accross the frame, and so suggest settings that will give more exposure than you actually desire.

Doesn't matter how heavy an ND you try using, the problem will persist and you will likely still suffer over exposure; And an ND dimming the scene as metered, suggesting longer and longer shutters though, will likely make it WORSE, as the longer shutter will increase the amount of highlight dragging during the exposure, making the effective exposure brighter than metered.

Make sense?

Nail the 'exposure', how much compensation you need to bring the picture back from what you metered, to get what you want, and you may not 'need' to use an ND at all.

The ND only dims light going into the camera; it will only really 'help' if you are against the buffers, and at the shutter speed you want, you cant stop the aperture down enough to get the exposure you want.

On which notion, the 'trap' if milking water falls IS to presume to need far to long an exposure, and turn the water to a milky textureless streak, and NOt get the 'delicate' smokey effect you are probably hoping to achieve.

So, a more concervative shutter speed, is likely to be more help; you can still get a lot of streaking, depending on how fast the water is moving, and your framing, but freeze it 'enough' that you dont have all the highlights streaking over one another, and can retain detail and texture and 'subtelty' you hope for... AND you are less likely to run into teh buffers and run out of low enough ISO's or small enough appertures, and NOT need to resort to filters to get you back in range.

Its ALL win, and a situation, in which, to solve the 'problem' you suggest, its in your technique not your gadget bag, and without the technique, a filter is likely to actually make it harder for you to acheive what you hope, rather than easier.

To wit; my suggestion is forget the filter for now, work on the technique. Start with faster shutter speeds and see just how much milking they still give; without needing so much exposure correction or running out of available aperture/ISO settings... then go up the shutters, NOT down... see how fast you have to go before you actually freeze motion and loose all milking.. BEFORE you come back down, and need to start adding compensation for highlight streaking..

Do that.. a lot! In different lights; different times of days, different angles, different framing on different waterfalls, to learn how much you need to compensate to get the exposure you want, rather than the camera measures. and forget about the filter, until you are hitting the buffers on the aperture&ISO.. and even THEN.. consider whether it would be 'better' to come back later in the day, or earlier in the morning when its naturally darker, or to choose a different framing or view point, rather than reach straight for the 'gadget'.

Like I said, problem is in your technique, not your gadget bag; ND filter isn't the 'solution' to the problem; and there are many ways to skin a cat; and alternatives to get the effect you desire without using a filter.

The 'cliche' has been created as this is a traditional academic exercise to teach THIS lesson on technique, and that you need that technique, YOU need to have the know how, and do the work, the gear wont do it for you.
 
Last edited:
You've misunderstood the question Mike. The OP wants a long exposure (whether you like the effect or not) and needs an ND filter to achieve it.
 
Back
Top