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New Macbook Pro quad core monsters & Lion
- Thread starter cowasaki
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time to get out more
67 posts vs 7,628
Pot kettle black :bonk:
Joke, but seriously the hours, days, weeks of problems i had with pc computers. Blue screen of death, been mac since 2005 and never had a single problem ever. imac g5, imac core2duo, Powerbook ti, powerbook al, macbook, macbook pro. Not one single problem and for that it is worth the premium it.
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Things have moved on in the PC world since 2005
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Things have moved on in the PC world since 2005
Indeed they have...it's called vista and it was a pile of poo.
Will be a shame to lose the Rosetta support but I am sure someone will hack it to work.....bring on the Lion.
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cowasaki
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Windows 7 is actually pretty good to be honest. I quite like it. The biggest issue I have with Windows is that every piece of hardware or software that you seem to add wants to then add more processes into the startup sequence and you end up running dozens of things you don't really want or need. If you know what you are doing you can remove these and get the speed back but most users just blindly accept them and their computer gets slower and slower which is something that doesn't happen as much with Apple machines. I have just fixed my son's partner's laptop which was running 35 programs on startup! Also a lot of Windows kit is very price orientated so you end up with quickly knocked together drivers that are not as well tested. I find the the drivers supplied by MS are usually very stable and the certification process they brought in has helped too. I would use Windows 7 myself without too much issue but I just prefer MacOS now after using it as my main OS for several years. My biggest annoyance is video cards and the like. When a new video card comes out it is available for Windows PCs straight away but it can be quite a while getting to the Mac (where it is also more expensive). It looks like this might be coming to an end as the current Lion build has drivers for generic 6950 video cards and numerous others that Apple have not used! We might be at the point of being able to just grab a PC video card and stuff it in soon (obviously that just goes for us Mac Pro owners!)
(obviously that just goes for us Mac Pro owners!)
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Vista post SP1 was actually a very good OS. It is what W7 is based on after all! Its always a shame when people base their opinion on what they read on the internet!
On another note, when is Lion due? My PC is finally showing its age (mainly because of the size of the RAW files from my 7D!) and I wouldn't mind giving a iMac a go as I haven't had a mac in a while. One of the imminent new spec iMacs and lion would be quite nice, I think!
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cowasaki
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I wouldn't worry about when its due (probably July ish) as new OS upgrades from Apple tend to be CHEAP. Snow Leopard was £29.
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Snow leopard was cheaper than they usually are, correct? I am in no great hurry as my current PC works fine and I can put up with a little slowness, just as long as it doesn't conk out. Mind you, the wife does keep trying to break it!
joescrivens
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I hope you can turn off the auto save feature on some programs
When I code in flash for example often i'm just arsing around and i often want to go back to the state I had before I clicked save. Could be pretty annoying if it was always saving my mistakes
When I code in flash for example often i'm just arsing around and i often want to go back to the state I had before I clicked save. Could be pretty annoying if it was always saving my mistakes
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cowasaki
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Leopard was £79 but remember these are the FULL uncut versions of the OS much like "Windows 7 64bit Ultimate retail" and include everything for 32 and 64 bits so whether it is £29, £59 or £79 it isn't bad value for a new OS. Having looked at the features there is nothing monumental about the new OS but a few welcome additions. They have dropped the networking support for older methods so it should be far more compatible with Windows.
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Windows 7 is actually pretty good to be honest. I quite like it. The biggest issue I have with Windows is that every piece of hardware or software that you seem to add wants to then add more processes into the startup sequence and you end up running dozens of things you don't really want or need. If you know what you are doing you can remove these and get the speed back but most users just blindly accept them and their computer gets slower and slower which is something that doesn't happen as much with Apple machines. I have just fixed my son's partner's laptop which was running 35 programs on startup! Also a lot of Windows kit is very price orientated so you end up with quickly knocked together drivers that are not as well tested. I find the the drivers supplied by MS are usually very stable and the certification process they brought in has helped too. I would use Windows 7 myself without too much issue but I just prefer MacOS now after using it as my main OS for several years. My biggest annoyance is video cards and the like. When a new video card comes out it is available for Windows PCs straight away but it can be quite a while getting to the Mac (where it is also more expensive). It looks like this might be coming to an end as the current Lion build has drivers for generic 6950 video cards and numerous others that Apple have not used! We might be at the point of being able to just grab a PC video card and stuff it in soon
Great post Darren
I highlighted the bit that's most important - it's just like the choice between Nikon & Canon. Apples and PCs of similar spec are both great bits of kit and it just comes down to the UI really...joescrivens
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Great post Darren
exactly, and I don't really get why people always say:
£????? how much!!!! I could buy a PC with the same spec for exactly half that!!!
Last week I just bought a new VW golf, it cost £14,500
It has 5 doors, a 1.4 engine, 4 wheels, some headlights etc. and it gets me from a to b and c at the weekends
Does that mean all of you who own this
which is pretty much the same spec think I'd stupid for spending £5000 more? I mean this does all the same things as my golf right at 2/3rd of the cost.
People who buy a VW over a nissan visia do so for the same reason people buy a mac over a pc. TO US we are buying something we prefer to use/drive because we enjoy it more, for US it's better. That's all.
It doesn't matter how many other cheaper versions you can get that do the same thing, it's not about the hardware spec it's about the using of it, whether that be driving the car or using the OS, and for this we'd rather pay more money. It's the same in all walks of life - the chippy down the road makes chips and fish just like the one 2 streets over, but i prefer one over the other and pay more for it.
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+1 - Auto save is a major PITA in my opinion......comes in handy once in a blue moon and works against you loads I love being able to revent to a previous version of docs and it can be a pain when it saves stuff that you are mucking around with.
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Thanks. I think I might get miffed splashing out another £79 having just got a new computer!
I have time to wait anyway, as I am waiting specifically for the next imac spec bump before making my decision.
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I think it's because there is a general perception that Apple must be better hardware when they're not. They are exactly the same under the covers....
Except the VW and Nissin aren't the same under the bonnet. They have similar specs, but they aren't the same but with just a different dashboard (i.e. UI)...
joescrivens
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I think it's more that the general perception is that apple has better software, not hardware. Apple buyers don't go boasting that the motherboard is better or the ram is better, they say things like - it's easier to use, crashes less, just works. This is all to do with the software. I personally do think the software is better, but thats just personal opinion. It's not a fact.
pedant! you know what i mean.
Ok instead lets compare a bmw with a mini or a passat and a skoda. Same companies make the same bits, but the bmw and the vw are more expensive. My point is that pc users are always saying that a pc ill do exactly the same thing as the mac - but it's not about matching it spec for spec, we buy a mac because the experience of using it over windows is better for US and we're happy to pay more money for a better experience.
If you find a better experience from a PC and it's cheaper then thats a big bonus for you, you get what you want for less money. My wife has this experience with mobile phones -she hates fancy phones that cost more, she wants a cheapo phone and thats what she gets - costs her less and she likes it more. Me on the other hand I have to pay more to get what i want.
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I hope the new version of Mac OS comes with AntiFanboy protection...
Anyway:
This is very true but at the end of the day that isn't Windows' fault. It's the software developers' faults for including adware in their installers (Google toolbar, Yahoo toolbar, Google Chrome, to name a few) and insisting on putting in startup entries. BUT, even then, most of this aforementioned adware and startup entries are optional.
Like I said though, it isn't the operating system's fault that there are a lot of crap programs out there. MS can't exactly deny all installers from creating startup entries as that would break some programs and also takes away your freedom of choice. As usual, MS is damned if they do, damned if they don't, and stupid people who don't READ will always find a way to break it anyway.
Anyway:
This is very true but at the end of the day that isn't Windows' fault. It's the software developers' faults for including adware in their installers (Google toolbar, Yahoo toolbar, Google Chrome, to name a few) and insisting on putting in startup entries. BUT, even then, most of this aforementioned adware and startup entries are optional.
Like I said though, it isn't the operating system's fault that there are a lot of crap programs out there. MS can't exactly deny all installers from creating startup entries as that would break some programs and also takes away your freedom of choice. As usual, MS is damned if they do, damned if they don't, and stupid people who don't READ will always find a way to break it anyway.
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cowasaki
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I didn't actually say it was MS's or Windows's fault! In fact I stood up for MS in relation to their certified drivers. BUT Windows machines have the problem I said and it IS a problem (unless like us we know enough to remove this carp bloatware). I am not going to get into a discussion about which is best because to be honest I couldn't give a monkeys what somebody else uses or what they think or either platform. I really like MacOS but the video card issue annoys me as does the lack of Borland DELPHI
but Windows machines have their issues to....The reality is this......
- BOTH do the job
- BOTH do the job well if YOU know what you are doing
- BOTH have their issues
- BOTH have their advantages
- A QUALITY Windows PC's hardware is as reliable as a Mac (A modern Mac is just a PC anyway!).
- A QUALITY Windows PC plus genuine Windows costs a little bit less than the equivalent MacOS machine BUT.........
higher purchase price - higher selling price = lower purchase price - lower selling price
So you are not actually much better off!
My 17" Macbook Pro 1920x1200 2.6Ghz 4Gb 500Gb 7K2 laptop cost £2000 about two and a half years ago. If is STILL worth £1100 giving me a cost of about £900...... If I had bought an equivalent £1200 Windows PC it would probably be worth about £400 and so it has cost me £100 more to have the MacOS laptop for 2.5 years OR about 11p a day...... I'm happy with that and I bet the MacOS machine is much nicer to use.
BUT
With say a Windows desktop PC you could probably slap a new graphics card and RAM in and save having to upgrade.
Its all horses for courses. We ALL choose what is right for US and that's it. I know of several people who have gone BACK from MacOS machines to Windows for various reasons.
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i got a new air other day and im happy
Does that make me a fanboy because i wanted less for paying more?
Does that make me a fanboy because i wanted less for paying more?
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See now you're getting defensive which makes me think there is still some hint of fanboyism in there that is crying out (bear with me).
I never said you that you said it was MS or Windows fault, but in the context that you used to describe this problem with, and I quote, "The biggest issue I have with Windows" makes it sound like you believe the problem is with Windows rather than with the users, the software, and the companies who make it.
It's a similar argument to all those who slated Vista for its apparently poor device support, well it's not Microsoft's fault that the manufacturers were slow to release drivers.
Correct but as I have explained above, just because the majority of MS machines may have the problem does not mean that the cause is MS themselves. A correlation doesn't equal a direct cause. Your point = null and void (you acknowledged this yourself already), therefore I question why you even bothered bringing it up.
. I am not going to get into a discussion about which is best because to be honest I couldn't give a monkeys what somebody else uses or what they think or either platform. I really like MacOS but the video card issue annoys me as does the lack of Borland DELPHI
The reality is this......
A MacOS machine is similar to owning a VW Golf rather than a Citroen
- BOTH do the job
- BOTH do the job well if YOU know what you are doing
- BOTH have their issues
- BOTH have their advantages
- A QUALITY Windows PC's hardware is as reliable as a Mac (A modern Mac is just a PC anyway!).
- A QUALITY Windows PC plus genuine Windows costs a little bit less than the equivalent MacOS machine BUT.........
higher purchase price - higher selling price = lower purchase price - lower selling price
So you are not actually much better off!
My 17" Macbook Pro 1920x1200 2.6Ghz 4Gb 500Gb 7K2 laptop cost £2000 about two and a half years ago. If is STILL worth £1100 giving me a cost of about £900...... If I had bought an equivalent £1200 Windows PC it would probably be worth about £400 and so it has cost me £100 more to have the MacOS laptop for 2.5 years OR about 11p a day...... I'm happy with that and I bet the MacOS machine is much nicer to use.
BUT
With say a Windows desktop PC you could probably slap a new graphics card and RAM in and save having to upgrade.
Its all horses for courses. We ALL choose what is right for US and that's it. I know of several people who have gone BACK from MacOS machines to Windows for various reasons.
I know all of this - you're preaching to the choir.
Don't get me wrong Darren, I don't have a problem with YOU personally. I just take great issue with statements such as yours that clearly leak of bias, when in the very same breath you're all too quick to bark that you're more neutral than pH 7 and that all platforms are equal etc. It's obvious that you don't actually think that, which is perfectly fine, but using biased statements to put across a false point is part of the reason why there are so many misinformed "self techies" running around out there.
Rant done
Ps. I don't hate Apple.
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Although I am very happy with my Apple set-up for my self and family; I have to agree with this list
I'm a very strong advocate of all things Apple & Microsoft, somehow there's an oxymoron in there
, but both deliver an outstanding and robust platform.Except that to use any computer you need an OS, therefore the OS is just as much "under the covers" as the ECU in a car to carry on the analogy (Yes you can build a Hackintosh and get the same OS but thats not a simple thing to do for many). Also it shouldnt just have to be about the hardware and not the "cover" itself - many people buy expensive cars (at least) partly for the design, but this seems to be dismissed as unimportant when discussing PCs and Macs.
For me, theres far more to it than what hardware is used - OS, support, ease of use, and design all come into it. I prefer many things about my Macs, which is why I chose them over PCs.
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cowasaki
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I'm not getting defensive in relation to what I am saying but to people taking what I am saying out of context. and I quote, "The biggest issue I have with Windows" ? What about the rest of the sentence? If you read the FULL sentence then what I am saying is perfectly clear and correct.
What I have said is TOTALLY balanced and TOTALLY unbiased!!
I said several things that show a plus to Windows but also to MacOS.
It's a similar argument to all those who slated Vista for its apparently poor device support, well it's not Microsoft's fault that the manufacturers were slow to release drivers.
Correct but as I have explained above, just because the majority of MS machines may have the problem does not mean that the cause is MS themselves. A correlation doesn't equal a direct cause. Your point = null and void (you acknowledged this yourself already), therefore I question why you even bothered bringing it up.
I know all of this - you're preaching to the choir.
Don't get me wrong Darren, I don't have a problem with YOU personally. I just take great issue with statements such as yours that clearly leak of bias, when in the very same breath you're all too quick to bark that you're more neutral than pH 7 and that all platforms are equal etc. It's obvious that you don't actually think that, which is perfectly fine, but using biased statements to put across a false point is part of the reason why there are so many misinformed "self techies" running around out there.
Rant done
Ps. I don't hate Apple.
EH!! :shrug:
If you don't like going out in the car because the roads are busy then saying you don't like going out in the car is a fair statement!!!
NOTHING that I said is in the slightest bit biased, I actually use all three major OSes but I PREFER MacOS so my main machines run that but I have 3 machines running Windows and 2 running Linux.
I have NOT said that all three platforms are equal, I said that they all have advantages and disadvantages which is totally true. I listed some advantages and disadvantages of both. My biggest problem with using a Windows machines is as I have said issues with bloatware and this is not necessarily MS's fault.
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No, doesnt take that long to get used to it
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Spoken to Apple and it's £1784 for the 17" model for a student
Tell me more!
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cowasaki
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Just ring them up and they will give you the student price. There are several levels of student price though starting with college, then normal university then partner university. Not sure which university level that is for. Just waiting for my P60 so I can send it to my accountant and then send in my tax return so I can get the tax rebate to pay for it
That'll be the student price for Applecare and probably only available at the time of purchase.
I bought Applecare at the same time as my Macbook Air for £40. If I bought it later on in the year it would be the standard student price which I think is over £100