Nikon Range explained?

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DCCD

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Name
Andy
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Hi all,

I've just sold all my Canon kit (all professional L lenses and 1 series bodies).

I'm openly looking around at what's on the market and would like to understand the Nikon range of bodies (what has FF/crop etc).
I'm mainly into sports so high fps is a big factor (and excellent/best image Q). I've seen a D2Hs for sale and this looks to be in between a Canon 1D mark 1 and mark 2?

I'd like to understand the model numbers and what they mean....are single digit D1/D2/D3 etc regarded as professional, D300, D700 etc D80/D90..aimed at what level?

Also on the lenses front, I'm used to Canon L and would look to the Nikon equivelant, Nikkor? Any advice most welcome.

Also if any other manufacturer's spring to mind, I'd be intersted in exploring what's available.

I realise this may have cropped up before, so if anyone can point to previous threads to save re-inventing the wheel, much appreciated.

Thanks,
Andy
 
Why sell all your kit before doing the research? What happens if (god forbid) you don't find a Nikon you like?
The D3 and D3X are the top of the line bodies but very pricey at the moment with D3 body around 2k and D3x nearly 5k
 
D2H is a 4mp high speed PRO camera body, which produces some wonderful images, check if it has had its shutter replaced under warranty, I am sure there was a recall/accepted problem with this model that Nikon fixed FOC.

D1, D2 & D3 are the large PRO bodies.

D300 & D700 are classed by Nikon as PRO bodies also, but are a level below the single digit series.

D40, D60, D90 etc are the consumer level.

Having said that they will all take exceptional images in the right hands, the single digit range would be my choice if I was earning a living with them day in, day out, much more suited to the heavy treatment, shutters last longer.

D3 and D700 are Full Frame Sensors, all the others are 1.5x Cropped Sensors.

Nikkor do not have the 'L' designation, a lens is a lens to Nikon, price and f number should be your guide, having said that their kit lenses are pretty good, but I doubt fast enough for your purpose.
 
D3 is, I believe, the most popular Nikon for sports photographers. The newer, more expensive D3x actually has a lower fps.

Why on earth sell all your quality canon kit, what was the problem?
 
Martyn... said:
D2H is a 4mp high speed PRO camera body, which produces some wonderful images, check if it has had its shutter replaced under warranty, I am sure there was a recall/accepted problem with this model that Nikon fixed FOC.

D1, D2 & D3 are the large PRO bodies.

D300 & D700 are classed by Nikon as PRO bodies also, but are a level below the single digit series.

D40, D60, D90 etc are the consumer level.

Having said that they will all take exceptional images in the right hands, the single digit range would be my choice if I was earning a living with them day in, day out, much more suited to the heavy treatment, shutters last longer.

D3 and D700 are Full Frame Sensors, all the others are 1.5x Cropped Sensors.

Nikkor do not have the 'L' designation, a lens is a lens to Nikon, price and f number should be your guide, having said that their kit lenses are pretty good, but I doubt fast enough for your purpose.
Click to expand...


Thanks Martyn very useful.

So far I'm drawn to the D300 or this D2Hs. I guess I'll have to go on the hunt and track both down to get a play. The viewfinder in the Canon 1 series was always a positive for me (bigger with 100% coverage). It's one of the factors which I hate about the Canon XXD range. Will I have the same issues with Nikon 1.5 crop cameras?
 
PsiFox said:
Why sell all your kit before doing the research? What happens if (god forbid) you don't find a Nikon you like?
The D3 and D3X are the top of the line bodies but very pricey at the moment with D3 body around 2k and D3x nearly 5k
Click to expand...

Variety is the spice of life and I just got fed up with Canon. I may regret it, but I got sensible money for all my kit and I'd like to explore what else is on the market. I can always buy Canon again.....plenty of kit available s/h.
 
DCCD said:
Thanks Martin very useful.

So far I'm drawn to the D300 or this D2Hs. I guess I'll have to go on the hunt and track both down to get a play. The viewfinder in the Canon 1 series was always a positive for me (bigger with 100% coverage). It's one of the factors which I hate about the Canon XXD range. Will I have the same issues with Nikon 1.5 crop cameras?
Click to expand...

The D300 is 100%, all the D2 D3 will be 100%, the D700 is 95% but being FF is a large VF.
 
a lens is a lens to Nikon, price and f number should be your guide
Click to expand...
would that vary with each seller if s/h
also
AF Nikkor and digital DX lenses is that film camera lens vs digital
 
DCCD said:
So far I'm drawn to the D300 or this D2Hs. I guess I'll have to go on the hunt and track both down to get a play. The viewfinder in the Canon 1 series was always a positive for me (bigger with 100% coverage). It's one of the factors which I hate about the Canon XXD range. Will I have the same issues with Nikon 1.5 crop cameras?
Click to expand...

Not on the D300, it's almost 100%. I'd certainly look at the D300 before the D2Hs. The only reason I'd consider a D2 ahead of a D300 is if I were really going to hammer the body or work in really hostile conditions. The D300 is a superior camera in terms of performance.
 
If you let us know your budget, we could give you a much better idea of what you would get for it with Nikon.

Basically, D2H is 4mp, D2hs 4MP with some improved features over the H. £450ish

D2x - very similar to the H but 12MP with a 6 mp (i think) 2* crop mode £650ish

D3 and D700, 12mp FF 5MP Crop mode £3k and £2k (new)

D3X 24MP FF 10MP crop mode £5k (new)

Those are the pro models.

D300 - 12mp dx £800 or £1200 new
D200 10mp dx - £400

These are the semi pros.
 
barneyrubble said:
If you let us know your budget, we could give you a much better idea of what you would get for it with Nikon.

Basically, D2H is 4mp, D2hs 4MP with some improved features over the H. £450ish

D2x - very similar to the H but 12MP with a 6 mp (i think) 2* crop mode £650ish

D3 and D700, 12mp FF 5MP Crop mode £3k and £2k (new)

D3X 24MP FF 10MP crop mode £5k (new)

Those are the pro models.

D300 - 12mp dx £800 or £1200 new
D200 10mp dx - £400

These are the semi pros.
Click to expand...

Budget wise, probably looking at up to £1200 for a body.
In terms of priority:

1a Fast accurate AF
1b Very closely followed by high FPS
2a. Weather proofing/rugged (used mainly formotorsport use and outdoor sports)
2b. Large/100% viewfinder
 
Nikon themselves consider the D200 and D300 pro bodies...

http://www.nikon.co.uk/sites/NPSApplication/productlist.aspx

and the current pro range is here:

http://www.europe-nikon.com/family/en_GB/categories/broad/318.html

And also cite the D300 as having a 100% viewfinder too...

http://www.europe-nikon.com/product/en_GB/products/broad/1436/specifications.html

Loads more info for the OP on the Nikon website (funnily enough!)

The only thing to decide really is how much you want to spend and can you afford to loose the DX (1.5x crop) in favour of the FX (full frame). If you go FX you will be needing at least 300mm for most motorsport...

The AF on the D300/D700 and D3 is stonking, absolutely top notch with only the Canon 1D MkIII coming anywhere near...
 
DCCD said:
Budget wise, probably looking at up to £1200 for a body.
In terms of priority:

1a Fast accurate AF
1b Very closely followed by high FPS
2a. Weather proofing/rugged (used mainly formotorsport use and outdoor sports)
2b. Large/100% viewfinder
Click to expand...

I'd say you'd be looking at a 2nd hand D300 plus battery grip.

1a. fast AF (D300 has very good AF)
1b. Body alone is 6FPS, with the battery grip it's raised to 8fps
2a. The body isn't quite up to D3 standards, but is metal bodied not plastic so fairly rugged. it isn't fully waterproof but it does have some environmental sealing
2b. the viewfinder in the d300 isn't as big as the d700/d3 but it is 100% and it's not tiny. go have a look in a shop and see how you feel.

can probably get that for under £1200, the D700 and above are moer expensive, even second hand.

then of course you need to go a lens hunting. for motorsport one would imagine a 70/80-200 f2.8 would be an obvious contender, or a 300mm f4 prime might also be good.

if you're more well heeled then there's a 200-400mm f4 that would work well, or a variety of fast long primes...

dave
 
DCCD said:
Budget wise, probably looking at up to £1200 for a body.
In terms of priority:

1a Fast accurate AF
1b Very closely followed by high FPS
2a. Weather proofing/rugged (used mainly formotorsport use and outdoor sports)
2b. Large/100% viewfinder
Click to expand...

So a D300, as above, should be your obvious choice.

How much will you have to spend on glass if you buy the d300?
 
barneyrubble said:
So a D300, as above, should be your obvious choice.

How much will you have to spend on glass if you buy the d300?
Click to expand...

Glass must be fast and image quality top of the range.
I'd say around £1000 per lens.

Looking at in terms of priorty

1 Something like a 70-200
2 Something like a 16mm or wide zoom 16-35
3 Convertor for 70-200?

Going back to D300 v D2Hs, is the AF improved, same, worse on the D300?
I just think the D2Hs seems to offer a lot of for the money as its an old camera. I'm not put off by 4.1mp as I dont need to print large (12x8 is fine for me).
 
D300 AF is superior to the D2H. The D2H has the same generation AF as the D200... which was good for its time but not the stunning system Nikon were to obtain later.

As for your glass, a 70-200VR will see you spending about 1.4k at the moment, maybe more soon...

For a short but fast lens for motorsport you'll probably want the Nikon 24-70 - nothing else focuses nearly fast enough. Thats about a grand...

TC's are about 100 quid for a Kenko 1.4x or 200 quid for Nikon 1.4x or 1.7x - avoid the 2x for motorsport!
 
DCCD said:
The viewfinder in the Canon 1 series was always a positive for me (bigger with 100% coverage). It's one of the factors which I hate about the Canon XXD range. Will I have the same issues with Nikon 1.5 crop cameras?
Click to expand...

The D300 is a DX model so the sensor is similar in size to the Canon 'XXD' and 'XXXD' models, and while the D300 has a 100% viewfinder, it will not be as bright as the D700 and D3/D3x, or indeed the Canon 5D, 1D models and the Sony A900. If the viewfinder size is desirable then you would need to look at the 'full frame' models imho.
 
desantnik said:
D300 AF is superior to the D2H. The D2H has the same generation AF as the D200... which was good for its time but not the stunning system Nikon were to obtain later.

As for your glass, a 70-200VR will see you spending about 1.4k at the moment, maybe more soon...

For a short but fast lens for motorsport you'll probably want the Nikon 24-70 - nothing else focuses nearly fast enough. Thats about a grand...

TC's are about 100 quid for a Kenko 1.4x or 200 quid for Nikon 1.4x or 1.7x - avoid the 2x for motorsport!
Click to expand...

Thanks. I guess the better AF seals it then for the D300 :)

Any other wides to consider? 24 is ok but not great and if the crop factor is 1.5 this is equivelant to 36-105?
Is wide angle a weak spot in the Nikon 1.5crop bodies - what is the top of the range wide? There seem to be many choices?
 
The difficulty with a wide lens is finding one actually fast enough focusing to take motorsport!!

There are many, many options out there and quite a few optically good choices, but not many that can focus quick enough for such high speed action. Unless you fancy pre-focusing....

If you go down the FX body route, you'll obviously get wider... which is good at the wide end but a bummer at the long end. Mind you, then you are into only looking at lenses for FX... which limits your choices.... Basically, Nikon 24-70 f2.8 is your beast no matter how you dress it up.
 
desantnik said:
The difficulty with a wide lens is finding one actually fast enough focusing to take motorsport!!

There are many, many options out there and quite a few optically good choices, but not many that can focus quick enough for such high speed action. Unless you fancy pre-focusing....

If you go down the FX body route, you'll obviously get wider... which is good at the wide end but a bummer at the long end. Mind you, then you are into only looking at lenses for FX... which limits your choices.... Basically, Nikon 24-70 f2.8 is your beast no matter how you dress it up.
Click to expand...

Happy to pre focus or manual focus....main thing is getting something wide enough to say stand on inside of a corner and and follow cars as they drift round (forest rallying), so I dont think 24 will be wide enough on a 1.5 crop.

Happy to pay for good glass to get image quality and something equivelant to Canons 16-35 F2.8 L (that was 21-45 on my 1D) Or just a prime lens 14mmF2.8 (=21 on the D300) should be wide enough.
 
af-s 17-35 f.28 IF-ED... never used it though!
 
desantnik said:
D300 AF is superior to the D2H. The D2H has the same generation AF as the D200...
Click to expand...

Having had all three of these - the D300 is the best, but the D2h is not that far behind. The D200 is though.

The D2h used the D2x system - Multicam 2000
The D200 used the Multicam 1000

The D2h would do fine for motorsport AF. You lose the ability to crop as much though.

But, for image quality at up to ISO 800 and A4 prints, the D2h shades it.Personally, I would get a D2h rather than a D300.

As for Lenses, I would recommend my Lens Line up.

AF-s 17-35 F2.8 , AF-S 28-70 F2.8, and 70-200 VR.

All fast focussing, all Bright and fast, all extremely heavy :'(:'(

The first two can be picked up secondhand if you're lucky (like I was) and the VR is about 1.4K as said above.
 
barneyrubble said:
Having had all three of these - the D300 is the best, but the D2h is not that far behind. The D200 is though.

The D2h used the D2x system - Multicam 2000
The D200 used the Multicam 1000

The D2h would do fine for motorsport AF. You lose the ability to crop as much though.

But, for image quality at up to ISO 800 and A4 prints, the D2h shades it.Personally, I would get a D2h rather than a D300.

As for Lenses, I would recommend my Lens Line up.

AF-s 17-35 F2.8 , AF-S 28-70 F2.8, and 70-200 VR.

All fast focussing, all Bright and fast, all extremely heavy :'(:'(

The first two can be picked up secondhand if you're lucky (like I was) and the VR is about 1.4K as said above.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback. The other thing which appeals with the D2Hs is price so the difference helps the lens budget :)

I just need to find both now and have a play before deciding.
 
DCCD said:
Glass must be fast and image quality top of the range.
I'd say around £1000 per lens.

Looking at in terms of priorty

1 Something like a 70-200
2 Something like a 16mm or wide zoom 16-35
Click to expand...
Telephoto
Nikon don't give you the choice of 70-200s that Canon give you, so that makes life easier. The only one is the AF-S 70-200m f/2.8 G IF-ED VR. It's a great lens, very sharp if you're using a DX camera. (It's clearly been designed for DX and is not so sharp towards the corners on FX, but that won't matter to you.)

Wide angle
Here, Nikon don't give you quite so many options as Canon, and the choice isn't quite so straightforward. Some suggestions:
* The AF-S 14-24mm f/2.8 G IF-ED is staggeringly good if you can cope with the restrictive 24mm top end. If you also got yourself an AF-S 24-70mm f/2.8 G ED as well then you'd have top-spec glass from 14mm to 200mm.
* The AF-S 17-35mm f/2.8 D IF-ED is very good but has been discontinued. You can still find it on sale, but not very widely and it can therefore be expensive.
* The AF-S DX 17-55mm f/2.8 G IF-ED is another option. It's better built than the Canon equivalent but doesn't have IS/VR.
 
The AF-S 14-24 by all accounts totally rocks... apart from one *slight* problem in that it cannot mount any filters - none, zero, zip, nada not even a cokin type or anything. It has a front element that looks like the O2 dome...

If I was using really, really, exspensive wide angle glass up close and dangerous for rally or MX, I'd want a filter... and i *hate* filters!
 
Options on lenses, the 80-200 f2.8 AF S no VR, cheaper than 70-200VR, would be my choice, would have to be a used one.

Wide zooms, 17-35 f2.8 again only available used, although rumours of it being relaunched on some US forums, if you are going with the cropped body the 17-55 f2.8.

A relatively cheap bargain used, is the 35-70 f2.8D these are great lenses, however would be better suited on full frame, but optically superb lens.
 
Thanks for the info lads, all great stuff.

I may try and stretch my body budget to a s/h D3, so this may impact the lens choices.

A question or two on the lens model numbers:-

1 Is AF-S Nikon equivelant to Canon's EF-S therefore a crop multiplier is need to get the true FF equivelent.

2 The Canon EF-S lenses are not usable on FF models, is this the case also with Nikon?

3 What does the letter G or D signify, is this quality of glass used and similar to Canon's L suffix?

4 What does IF-ED or ED mean after the model number?

Thanks for everyone's input.

Regards,
Andy
 
DCCD said:
1 Is AF-S Nikon equivelant to Canon's EF-S therefore a crop multiplier is need to get the true FF equivelent.

2 The Canon EF-S lenses are not usable on FF models, is this the case also with Nikon?

3 What does the letter G or D signify, is this quality of glass used and similar to Canon's L suffix?

4 What does IF-ED or ED mean after the model number?
Click to expand...

right :)

1. no, AF-S means that the lens itself contains the focusing motor. older nikon AF lenses have the AF driven by a motor in the body and passed along to the lens by a little screw. The lens focal length is what it is but if you use the lens on a crop body, then you need to multiply by 1.5 to get he equivalent FoV

2. all nikon lenses are useable on all nikon bodies (with some caveats). if a lens is marked "DX" then it means it's designed for a cropped sensor and the image circle isn't big enough to fill a full frame. that said, you can still mount a DX lens onto a FF body and the camera will automatically crop it's sensor to DX size (so a 12mp D3 would crop down to about 5.5mp) . you can overrule this to use the full sensor if you wish, but you pictures would probably come out with black corners. If you get a D3 then you'l want to get full frame lenses, but if you need to borrow a lens and it's DX, it will work fine.

3. D means that the lens tells the camera what distance it's focused to, this is useful for some metering and flash stuff, but the camera will work quite happily without it (I've got a non-D lens and it's works fine). G signifies that the lens has no aperture ring and thus the aperture must be controlled from the body. this is only a problem if you're going to mount the lens on an old film camera, all the DSLR's (afaik) control the apertuer from the body anyway)

4. ED refers to the Extra-low Dispersion glass being used, ie there's some posh glass elements in there somewhere. IF means "Internal Focusing", ie the lens doesn't change length at different focal distances.

any more? ;)

dave
 
DCCD said:
Thanks for the info lads, all great stuff.

I may try and stretch my body budget to a s/h D3, so this may impact the lens choices.

A question or two on the lens model numbers:-

1 Is AF-S Nikon equivelant to Canon's EF-S therefore a crop multiplier is need to get the true FF equivelent.

2 The Canon EF-S lenses are not usable on FF models, is this the case also with Nikon?

3 What does the letter G or D signify, is this quality of glass used and similar to Canon's L suffix?

4 What does IF-ED or ED mean after the model number?

Thanks for everyone's input.

Regards,
Andy
Click to expand...

1 No this refers to the focussing AF-S means internally focussing. In Nikon's case the motor is in the lens.

2. No DX is the Nikon designation for crop sensor lens.

3. No this relates to metering and the presence of an appetuire ring on the lens. G lens have no appature ring and this can only be controlled from the body.

4. ED refers to the coating on some lens elements

Hugh
 
Actually (and I am no doubt going to get flamed for saying it) at the top of Nikon's game, which is what we are talking about here, the Sigma and Tamron etc stuff is not as good. Optically, maybe, but this is motorsport and we need fast accurate focus and quite simply the third party stuff is NOT as good. Kid yourself how you like, its not the same.
 
desantnik said:
Actually (and I am no doubt going to get flamed for saying it) at the top of Nikon's game, which is what we are talking about here, the Sigma and Tamron etc stuff is not as good. Optically, maybe, but this is motorsport and we need fast accurate focus and quite simply the third party stuff is NOT as good. Kid yourself how you like, its not the same.
Click to expand...

I have also experienced this with Canon using 3rd party. And my philosphy is you get what you pay for and if you want the best, it doesn't usually come cheap.
 
i have a D300, got it for 988 in currys

i have also a

70-200 F2.8
50mm 1.8

and other lenses great camera well worth it.

i have a D80, D70 for back ups and some cheaper sigma lenses
 
Martyn... said:
Options on lenses, the 80-200 f2.8 AF S no VR, cheaper than 70-200VR, would be my choice, would have to be a used one.

Wide zooms, 17-35 f2.8 again only available used, although rumours of it being relaunched on some US forums, if you are going with the cropped body the 17-55 f2.8.

A relatively cheap bargain used, is the 35-70 f2.8D these are great lenses, however would be better suited on full frame, but optically superb lens.
Click to expand...

I've been offered an old 80-200 F2.8 (push pull) about 10 years old, is this going to be a waste of time on a D3 or D300 due to it probably having a slow autofocus? Or will the AF not be an issue?
 
DCCD said:
I've been offered an old 80-200 F2.8 (push pull) about 10 years old, is this going to be a waste of time on a D3 or D300 due to it probably having a slow autofocus? Or will the AF not be an issue?
Click to expand...

You want the two ring version, not the older push pull, it will be too slow to AF for what you want.
 
I'm caught between a D300 and D3 now....the appeal of the D300 is the price and the appeal of the D3 is FF and high FPS.

Not being an owner yet, can someone answer me this question:-

If I use a DX lens on the D3 (e.g 17-55), I assume the focal length still has the crop factor applied and I'll be using it as if its a 26-85?

I know the sensor will use the crop and smaller image size, but just wondered what happened to the focal length of the lens - assume it still multiplies it.

Useful if I decide to buy a back up DX body - then the lens choice might become a bit more important.

Thanks,
Andy
 
it is only the FOV it will change, it doesn't actually increase the reach of the lens at all
 
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