Nikon Z* mirrorless

wilt said:
I had a play with a Z8 today at my local WEX.
I've one ordered but wanted to feel it in my hand. I've quite large hands and my little finger never made it on to my Z7II body even with a extension bracket.
I'm glad to say the Z8 allows it to make contact with it, but I may end up with an extension bracket on it as well.
It also dispelled any worry about battery life, taking over 2K images using only 6% of the battery. This was in 20fps bursts so not really a great indicator but shows I could get 1K easily shooting normally.
I used the 85mm f1.2 and it's a dream teamed with the Z8, as was the 400mm f2.8 with 1.4TC.
Eye and subject tracking wasn't flawless but certainly very very very good.
It's the improvement that'll give me confidence again that was lacking since moving from the D850 to Z6 then Z7II, to capture sports and wildlife.
I was going to sell my Z7II privately, but I don't think I'd even get the price I got quoted for trade-in against the Z8.

The rep did say the following but I'd maybe be a little sceptical.
He said Z7II was getting a firmware update soon.
Plenty of Z8 stockpiled for release and I should get day one.
Z9 to get anything Z8 has that it doesn't via firmware soon.
All lenses on the roadmap to be released this year, naming the 35mm f1.2 and 200-600mm specifically.
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Didn't realise Wex had demo models available. Must call down myself in that case. Wonder how long before Panamoz and E-infinity have stock.
 
I don't know if they have demo models. It was a Nikon rep there with them. I'd suspect they'll be leaving with him. I'd contact your local WEX and see if they're getting some or someone from Nikon into store with them to try out.
 
psybear said:
I've been using the Integral 128GB CFexpress Memory Card Type B for a couple of years now in my Z6 and Z7. I now have 3 of them and (touchwood) they've been rock solid for me. Fair bit less expensive than some other brands. £89.95 for 128gb from Amazon.
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Thank you, will check that one out. What reader do you use?
 
sep9001 said:
Thank you, will check that one out. What reader do you use?
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I use the Sony MRWG1.SYM Memory Card Reader which I got from Amazon. But I see they also have an Integral reader for less than 40 quid with great reviews. Based on my experience with their cards I'd be happy to go for that if I was in the market for one.
 
wilt said:
I don't know if they have demo models. It was a Nikon rep there with them. I'd suspect they'll be leaving with him. I'd contact your local WEX and see if they're getting some or someone from Nikon into store with them to try out.
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Ah would you believe it, I emailed my local store after seeing this and the Nikon rep was there today with it. You were in Belfast I take it?
 
wilt said:
He said Z7II was getting a firmware update soon.
Plenty of Z8 stockpiled for release and I should get day one.
Z9 to get anything Z8 has that it doesn't via firmware soon.
All lenses on the roadmap to be released this year, naming the 35mm f1.2 and 200-600mm specifically.
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Be very interesting if true. I do wonder what extra Nikon has wrung out of the dual Expeed 6 Processors in the II models. I would imagine it would be more of tweaks, bug fixes and maybe a few minor features or so (maybe Skin Softening for example from the Z8), rather than any meaningful changes or performance improvements to the AF system, which I guess they have already squeezed as much possible (otherwise we'd probably already have that firmware by now).

Any improvements to the firmware for my Z9 would obviously be appreciated.

I for one have been waiting (impatiently) for the 200-600 (or 180-600 if you believe NR) and it's probably the last lens that I really need for the Z series (won't stop me buying more though :D). I just hope even though it's allegedly not a S lens, that it doesn't at least extend it's length whilst zooming (similar to the Sony 200-600 unit).
 
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So I sold the Z9, and my Z6 so while I was waiting for the Z8 to arrive I picked up a Z30 as a walk around body. Have to say I think I made a mistake and should have gone with a Z50 or a z fc instead. I didn't think I would but I really hate the lack of the EVF. Took it out for the first time at the weekend and really missed having the EVF. Lovely camera, I just guess I'm oldskool and like to look though a viewfinder rather than hold the camera in front of me.
 
PeteStewardson said:
So I sold the Z9, and my Z6 so while I was waiting for the Z8 to arrive I picked up a Z30 as a walk around body. Have to say I think I made a mistake and should have gone with a Z50 or a z fc instead. I didn't think I would but I really hate the lack of the EVF. Took it out for the first time at the weekend and really missed having the EVF. Lovely camera, I just guess I'm oldskool and like to look though a viewfinder rather than hold the camera in front of me.
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Woops. Take it back.
 
So tempted to get a z8 instead of a Sony a1.
I currently have an a9 and a7iii and the Sony 200-600mm amongst a few others. Ive been saving up to get an A1, some more MP for cropping would be nice, but something doesn’t sit right with me, paying £4.5k+ for a 3 year old body, when I could get a brand new z8 for quite a bit less, especially if panamoz and e-infinity get stock. Or I could get z9 for even less again, but not sure I want a huge body.
The only thing really holding me back was the lack of 200-600, which I’m amazed Nikon haven’t released yet..
However I just saw an article that Meike have a E to Z autofocus adapter that is really thin and supposedly allows near complete compatibility between Sony lenses and Nikon z mount bodies.. best of all, it’s only about $150.

Could be a short term solution until Nikon release their 200-600 equivalent.
 
TCR4x4 said:
So tempted to get a z8 instead of a Sony a1.
I currently have an a9 and a7iii and the Sony 200-600mm amongst a few others. Ive been saving up to get an A1, some more MP for cropping would be nice, but something doesn’t sit right with me, paying £4.5k+ for a 3 year old body, when I could get a brand new z8 for quite a bit less, especially if panamoz and e-infinity get stock. Or I could get z9 for even less again, but not sure I want a huge body.
The only thing really holding me back was the lack of 200-600, which I’m amazed Nikon haven’t released yet..
However I just saw an article that Meike have a E to Z autofocus adapter that is really thin and supposedly allows near complete compatibility between Sony lenses and Nikon z mount bodies.. best of all, it’s only about $150.

Could be a short term solution until Nikon release their 200-600 equivalent.
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I wouldn't really worry about age of gear if it's still up to the task you're asking of it. The price is another matter though.
There's plenty of videos of people using adapted Sony lenses on Nikon Z cameras, I had toyed with the idea of getting a Sony 200-600 but got a Nikon 100-400.
I myself believe the 200-600 will be here very soon, it just couldn't be held off any longer.
 
Sootchucker said:
Be very interesting if true. I do wonder what extra Nikon has wrung out of the dual Expeed 6 Processors in the II models. I would imagine it would be more of tweaks, bug fixes and maybe a few minor features or so (maybe Skin Softening for example from the Z8), rather than any meaningful changes or performance improvements to the AF system, which I guess they have already squeezed as much possible (otherwise we'd probably already have that firmware by now).

Any improvements to the firmware for my Z9 would obviously be appreciated.

I for one have been waiting (impatiently) for the 200-600 (or 180-600 if you believe NR) and it's probably the last lens that I really need for the Z series (won't stop me buying more though :D). I just hope even though it's allegedly not a S lens, that it doesn't at least extend it's length whilst zooming (similar to the Sony 200-600 unit).
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I reckon if the Z7II does get any updates, they'll be very light on improvements or features.
The Nikon 200-600 will be a extending zoom, like the Sony and the F-mount 200-500. It'll end up about 4ft long at 600mm :eek::p
 
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PeteStewardson said:
So I sold the Z9, and my Z6 so while I was waiting for the Z8 to arrive I picked up a Z30 as a walk around body. Have to say I think I made a mistake and should have gone with a Z50 or a z fc instead. I didn't think I would but I really hate the lack of the EVF. Took it out for the first time at the weekend and really missed having the EVF. Lovely camera, I just guess I'm oldskool and like to look though a viewfinder rather than hold the camera in front of me.
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I'd have waited and seen if you'd have got a Z8 in the first batch. If you had then no need, if not I'd have went the Z50 route.
 
trevorbray said:
Woops. Take it back.
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The main issue is you can’t see the screen outside when it’s even mildly bright, and since there’s no evf you’re a bit stuck. Tbh I think the screen is worse than other Z cameras I’ve used as I’ve never had the screen so dark it’s not visible. Will have to ring up tomorrow and return. Would have been a good walk around otherwise.
 
PeteStewardson said:
The main issue is you can’t see the screen outside when it’s even mildly bright, and since there’s no evf you’re a bit stuck. Tbh I think the screen is worse than other Z cameras I’ve used as I’ve never had the screen so dark it’s not visible. Will have to ring up tomorrow and return. Would have been a good walk around otherwise.
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I'm still interested in the focussing issues you suffered with the Z6.
 
wilt said:
I reckon if the Z7II does get any updates, they'll be very light on improvements or features.
The Nikon 200-600 will be a extending zoom, like the Sony and the F-mount 200-500. It'll end up about 4ft long at 600mm :eek::p
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I agree on the 200-600, I can't see it being an internal zoom as it's not going to be a high end lens.
 
Nikon will need to be very careful on price then if it's a non S-Line lens. It's main competitor will be the Sony 200-600 which is part of their G-Master Pro series, and is very highly regarded over on the Sony forums, and that lens currently retails for £1,599 or £1,399 grey (E-Infinity) and that has internal zoom and focussing.

Also, what will make it non an S-Line lens out of interest. It can't be because it will be a variable aperture lens, as the Nikon Z 100-400 S is a variable aperture too (F4.5-5.6) ?
 
The S-line lenses are generally sharper edge to edge, have either no focus breathing, or very little, improved rendering over non-S lenses including removing aberrations etc. Basically they are just a higher quality lens, but more expensive. The non-S lenses also tend to be very good in all those areas, just not quite as good.
 
"I'm still interested in the focussing issues you suffered with the Z6."

As I've not myself experienced such issues, can we perhaps put this down to user error then?
 
Abdichoudxyz said:
"I'm still interested in the focussing issues you suffered with the Z6."

As I've not myself experienced such issues, can we perhaps put this down to user error then?
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No 'we' can't, however having looked at your post history ( since you seemed very keen to start up some kind of argument over my view ) it seems I was correct and not willing to engage.
 
PeteStewardson said:
No 'we' can't, however having looked at your post history ( since you seemed very keen to start up some kind of argument over my view ) it seems I was correct and not willing to engage.
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Actually I'm genuinely interested in what issues you had with focussing. I'm interested in discussion. I think it might be of use to others here too. But hey ho. If you want to be judgmental, that's your call.

I'm also interested in just how much people rely on AF technology, rather than using skill and intuition to anticipate situations. Having been weaned on MF cameras, and having to get focussing spot on without such aids, I'm mystified as to how some people cannot manage to get modern equipment to focus properly. Is it because people are reliant on the tech? Or other reasons?

I often shoot in very tricky, demanding situations. Such as very dark clubs/music venues, where just getting a decent vantage point is hard enough. The Z6's AF in such low light is so much better than anything else I've used. It can focus in light that I can barely see in! I tend not to use auto-select AF modes in such situations, as it tends to want to lock onto bright points such as lights, reflections etc, rather than my actual chosen subject. But single point AF, using the little toggle thingy, that works far better. Using longer lenses, eye-AF can still work very well in such situations, as the background is thrown OOF by the shallow DoF. In brighter conditions, I only use auto-select AF if the subject stands out clearly from the background. Such modes can be useful, but they are not infallible. And that's where the photographer's skill comes in. Relying 100% on the camera to do your job is never going to be 100% reliable.
 
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Unlocker said:
Interesting review on the teleconverters has just gone up on Photographylife, definitely worth a read!
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Some odd results in there. Having a TC fitted shouldn’t slow down the AF test they did. Which makes me wonder if that’s just a lack of data captured.

In actual images nobody will notice the sharpness and other IQ differences shown on the 1.4x, and indeed I’ve not been able to discern any image quality or speed differences on the 70-20@ or 400/4.5 who. It’s fitted.
 
The Z8 is still a little chunky for me and probably more than I need.
I'm interested to see what alterations the Z6iii and Z7iii will come with. These are perfect size for me with the L bracket fitted.
 
Skypilot said:
I'm interested to see what alterations the Z6iii and Z7iii will come with.
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Do you really think there will be Z6III and Z7III I honestly can't see it myself.
 
PeteStewardson said:
Having a TC fitted shouldn’t slow down the AF test they did.
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Why not?
The mirrorless cameras are very dependent on the amount of light to the image sensor for AF speed/accuracy... in fact the Z9's low light EV rating is based on having an f/1.2 lens attached (no DSLR has an f-stop associated with it's EV rating because it's irrelevant). Even the jpeg picture style (viewfinder brightness/contrast) affects the mirrorless AF speed/accuracy.

I do have some issue with the resolution results because he used the generic LR export upsampling for the lower resolution images. I also wonder somewhat if there wasn't some lower focusing accuracy to the wider FOV images... i.e. using DX mode helps with AF accuracy/speed (if the image is going to be cropped anyway).
 
sk66 said:
Why not?
The mirrorless cameras are very dependent on the amount of light to the image sensor for AF speed/accuracy... in fact the Z9's low light EV rating is based on having an f/1.2 lens attached (no DSLR has an f-stop associated with it's EV rating because it's irrelevant). Even the jpeg picture style (viewfinder brightness/contrast) affects the mirrorless AF speed/accuracy.

I do have some issue with the resolution results because he used the generic LR export upsampling for the lower resolution images. I also wonder somewhat if there wasn't some lower focusing accuracy to the wider FOV images... i.e. using DX mode helps with AF accuracy/speed (if the image is going to be cropped anyway).
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For many reasons

Firstly the test was just the lens racking between infinity and mfd. aperture has no impact on that. If it was testing af then the 70-200 result should be compared at f4 bare lens with f4 with the TC.

The only relevant test would have been when the lens+TC combo takes the minimum aperture beyond f5.6 as up until that point the focusing will always be performed at the selected aperture with or without a TC.

Tbh the test looks to have been performed that doesn’t understand the Nikon system and that it doesn’t focus wide open.
 
PeteStewardson said:
Firstly the test was just the lens racking between infinity and mfd. aperture has no impact on that. If it was testing af then the 70-200 result should be compared at f4 bare lens with f4 with the TC.
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It wasn't a 'racking test' it was a subject focussing test, from the article:

In the field, I clearly noticed that the focus tracking speed dipped with both teleconverters, especially with extreme combinations like the 2.0x TC with an f/5.6 or f/6.3 lens...

Note that for each test of focusing speed, I focused on my subject (which was at medium distance) five times from the close focusing distance and five times from the far focusing distance, while timing with a stopwatch. The “focusing speed” value is the average of those ten results, rounded to the nearest 1/10 second.
 
TCR4x4 said:
So tempted to get a z8 instead of a Sony a1.
I currently have an a9 and a7iii and the Sony 200-600mm amongst a few others. Ive been saving up to get an A1, some more MP for cropping would be nice, but something doesn’t sit right with me, paying £4.5k+ for a 3 year old body, when I could get a brand new z8 for quite a bit less, especially if panamoz and e-infinity get stock. Or I could get z9 for even less again, but not sure I want a huge body.
The only thing really holding me back was the lack of 200-600, which I’m amazed Nikon haven’t released yet..
However I just saw an article that Meike have a E to Z autofocus adapter that is really thin and supposedly allows near complete compatibility between Sony lenses and Nikon z mount bodies.. best of all, it’s only about $150.

Could be a short term solution until Nikon release their 200-600 equivalent.
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mark smith on youtube done a review on that adaptor with the 200-600 and z9
 
wilt said:
I had a play with a Z8 today at my local WEX.
I've one ordered but wanted to feel it in my hand. I've quite large hands and my little finger never made it on to my Z7II body even with a extension bracket.
I'm glad to say the Z8 allows it to make contact with it, but I may end up with an extension bracket on it as well.
It also dispelled any worry about battery life, taking over 2K images using only 6% of the battery. This was in 20fps bursts so not really a great indicator but shows I could get 1K easily shooting normally.
I used the 85mm f1.2 and it's a dream teamed with the Z8, as was the 400mm f2.8 with 1.4TC.
Eye and subject tracking wasn't flawless but certainly very very very good.
It's the improvement that'll give me confidence again that was lacking since moving from the D850 to Z6 then Z7II, to capture sports and wildlife.
I was going to sell my Z7II privately, but I don't think I'd even get the price I got quoted for trade-in against the Z8.

The rep did say the following but I'd maybe be a little sceptical.
He said Z7II was getting a firmware update soon.
Plenty of Z8 stockpiled for release and I should get day one.
Z9 to get anything Z8 has that it doesn't via firmware soon.
All lenses on the roadmap to be released this year, naming the 35mm f1.2 and 200-600mm specifically.
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What are your thoughts on the 400mm f2.8 with 1.4TC ?
 
shapeshifter said:
What are your thoughts on the 400mm f2.8 with 1.4TC ?
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Epic. The flick of a switch TC is just fantastic and would really spoil you. Not having to flaff with a separate TC and not having to removing the lens means it's way more convenient.
The weight wasn't as bad as I thought it'd be but you know about it, after using it for a while.
Focusing on the Z8 was very fast and accurate, the isolation f2.8 gives the subject at 400mm even with the 1.4tc engaged giving 560mm f4. It's super sharp too.
Overall, If I could afford it, I'd buy it.
 
PeteStewardson said:
Firstly the test was just the lens racking between infinity and mfd. aperture has no impact on that. If it was testing af then the 70-200 result should be compared at f4 bare lens with f4 with the TC.
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Well, it was from MFD to focusing on a subject at medium distance (not infinity).
PeteStewardson said:
If it was testing af then the 70-200 result should be compared at f4 bare lens with f4 with the TC.
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He gave an f/5.6 comparison across the board (f/4 doesn't work for the 2x). Personally, I'm more interested in an f/2.8 vs f/4 (1.4) vs f/5.6 (2x) comparison as that's max capability of each (light/resolution).

PeteStewardson said:
The only relevant test would have been when the lens+TC combo takes the minimum aperture beyond f5.6 as up until that point the focusing will always be performed at the selected aperture with or without a TC.
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Very good point... I forgot about that. And IDT there is any way to override it other than *maybe* selecting starlight view (?).

TC's also tend to add their own aberrations and reduce contrast; anything that impacts the viewfinder image will impact AF (e.g. adjust for ease of viewing/camera profile/etc). But I suspect the biggest difference is that when the subject is smaller in the viewfinder/FOV then the contrast is greater and the focus is coarser (smaller details invisible/combined).
 
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Skypilot said:
Ah, maybe I've been sucked in by the click baiters.
I'd like to think they'll come up with something that caters for the Z6/7 size though
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Well yes it would be nice to think so, I would probably say maybe for the Z6III, because not everyone wants higher pixel rates, but I think think the Z8 is the natural update for the Z7II.
 
TG. said:
Well yes it would be nice to think so, I would probably say maybe for the Z6III, because not everyone wants higher pixel rates, but I think think the Z8 is the natural update for the Z7II.
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I still think/hope there will be a Z7III and Z6III. Nikon are supposed to have ordered a load of the Sony 61mp sensors and it would make sense to stick them in a Z7III, along with various other updates. The Z8's larger form factor will stop a lot of Z6/Z7 users upgrading to it and even risk them jumping to Canon or Sony for the latest tech. Nikon can't afford to ignore them....
 
psybear said:
I still think/hope there will be a Z7III and Z6III. Nikon are supposed to have ordered a load of the Sony 61mp sensors and it would make sense to stick them in a Z7III, along with various other updates. The Z8's larger form factor will stop a lot of Z6/Z7 users upgrading to it and even risk them jumping to Canon or Sony for the latest tech. Nikon can't afford to ignore them....
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It seems an extra model line too many I fear, but sony carry off a lot of model lines fom A7, A7r, A9, and A1. What does A9 do that A7 doesn't and vice versa. A1, A7r, A9 seem sufficient but they got an extra one in.

I like the Z8 chassis, but the 45mp won't get me out of a D850, and neither would a Z7iii with 61mp as it is just too small and menu driven. But a 61mp Z8 would have me all sorts of FOMO GAS.
 
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SFTPhotography said:
It seems an extra But a 61mp Z8 would have me all sorts of FOMO GAS.
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Yes indeed, but I think that will be in the form of the Z8II which is another 2 years down the line :LOL:
 
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