paralysis by analysis

pete1w

pete1w

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peter
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so i take my lovely shiny new dslr (nikon d3200) everywhere with me now. i have read all the books, all the magazine articles and watched whet feels like every video on you tube so i surely must know what i am doing. i see a subject i think would make a good photo and then spend an age studying the composition, the light conditions and fannying around with the settings on the camera. i take the shot and imagine my suprise when it looks s**t!!!!! why doesn't it look like the one in the magazine taken by the pro photographer? i then take a few token snapshots which invariably get deleted immediately and trudge off home disheartened to watch a few more you tube "how to" videos. am i the only one who suffers from this condition or can the moderators set a sub-thread for folk like me? PLEASE HELP!! cheers pete
 
Welcome to the club Pete, most of my shots are just like that more often it seems the ones that are taken rushed are the better ones, as if by accident rather than design :lol: Practice mate, you can read all the books and watch all the videos but when you've done that just keep shooting and you'll eventually start to take better photo's. Hopefully :)

Steve
 
You just need to practice. Of course if you are 'forcing' everything and having to think about it then it will not all come together. You need to take a break from reading all the how-to guides and watching the videos and just get out there and take more pictures.

If it was as easy as reading a few books to become a great photographer, wouldn't we all be there by now?
 
What Charlotte and Steve said.
I find reading books and YouTube videos help when I want to "find something out" but cant really beat practice.

Oh and stop being so hard on yourself Pete, ;), I am sure the pros didn't get there overnight.
 
thanks for all your replies guys. i'm off work next week and plan a photography week. im lucky to live near the city centre and also close to the countryside so i can pretty much pick and choose what subjects i choose to shoot. i will post my efforts(if any are up to scratch!!) and i promise to stop watching videos on you tube. cheers pete
 
Remember that not everything is about getting the 'right' (such a subjective word) settings and what others may like, it's about what you want - something that speaks to you, if others like it - bonus!
To quote Bruce Lee in Enter the Dragon "It is like a finger, pointing away to the moon. Don't concentrate on the finger or you will miss all that heavenly glory." :D
I took this photo of one of my dogs as she peered down the camera lens, it's got blown highlights, is completely out of focus, there's not a thing right about it - but I love it.
Take a breather from the reading, and just have a mess around, mix things up. Sure, try and get all the settings right - but remember with digital you can change 'em and try again with no extra cost! Have fun!
 
To take good photos, you need either an interesting subject, or great light, and preferably both. Without that, we're all stuffed and it's rarely possible to just wander out and come back with a guaranteed haul. Sometimes you can make the subject interesting, by choosing a different angle or selecting a good detail, but with those professional images you admire, what you're not seeing is all the rejects and out-takes, or all the time and preparation that went into them.

Landscapers for example, are always on the look-out for great views, often studying maps and other on-line resources for likely spots. Then they'll check the angle of the sun, knowing when the best light is around (often around sunrise or sunset) and then they'll go back time and again and again to get the best shot.

But whatever the results you get, it's always invaluable practise with good learning to be had. Nobody ever got good in five minutes just by buying a decent camera (though it helps). Practise, shoot, read, ask questions, shoot some more, and then repeat. You've got to put the work in :)
 
Faced with a beautiful subject and good light even I might manage to take a good picture :D

One thing you could try is really looking at what you think are your crap images to see is there's anything in there somewhere. You could try cropping, maybe even very heavily, and processing in different ways and you might get something that'll make you think "Hmmm, that's not too bad" and if you can do that and see something in the dross maybe that'll help you to visualise a good image in the situations that we all find ourselves in sometimes with initially boring subjects and poor light.
 
Pick up camera, take pictures, look at pictures. Repeat until the pictures you look at start to make you smile.
 
HoppyUK said:
Landscapers for example, are always on the look-out for great views, often studying maps and other on-line resources for likely spots. Then they'll check the angle of the sun, knowing when the best light is around (often around sunrise or sunset) and then they'll go back time and again and again to get the best shot.
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Yep, google earth, google streetview, The Photographer's Ephemeris, flickr mapping, tide times, weather forecasts, walking guides, OS maps all go into planning a landscape shoot for me.
 
Take it seriously and break it down a little. Practice yes, but practice what it is that makes a classy looking shot first. ....have you analysed what it is about your shots that fails them? Stuff like; Do they have ugly bits in each of them which distract the viewing of the main subject? Is the light dull, flat and mundane? Does the composition and framing of everything balance and lead the eye of the viewer onto your main subject matter?

Its all in the details, so keep it simple while you learn what it takes. Like this single well spaced, contrastingly pretty coloured, standing autumn leaf. ....Sitting on an immaculate, super flat bowling green. .....Smothered in wonderful soft and dappled light. ....Shot with a lovely silky narrow DoF, at leaf level. ....precisely focused for effect a, with flatteringly balanced framing to show it all off.
Its no coincidence it looks like this, its just attention to minor details.
thefallen.jpg
 
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It' a lot easier to take a crap photograph with a good camera than it is to take a good one. As Hoppy said, you need a good /interesting subject and good light. Luck can help with both but as with many other things, the more you practice, the luckier you'll tend to be.
Rather than deleting the failures in the field, look at them on a bigger screen and see if you can learn from the mistakes that you may have made.
 
pete1w said:
so i take my lovely shiny new dslr (nikon d3200) everywhere with me now. i have read all the books, all the magazine articles and watched whet feels like every video on you tube so i surely must know what i am doing. i see a subject i think would make a good photo and then spend an age studying the composition, the light conditions and fannying around with the settings on the camera. i take the shot and imagine my suprise when it looks s**t!!!!! why doesn't it look like the one in the magazine taken by the pro photographer? i then take a few token snapshots which invariably get deleted immediately and trudge off home disheartened to watch a few more you tube "how to" videos. am i the only one who suffers from this condition or can the moderators set a sub-thread for folk like me? PLEASE HELP!! cheers pete
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I mean no offence by this Peter, but do you really think watching a few online tutorials and reading your camera's manual and a few books will allow you to produce the results by seasoned professionals? Is that realistic?

Practice.. but beyond that, what are you doing to find out WHY they are not as good... or **** as you put it :) Have you asked? DO you ask for critique in here? If not... then how do you expect to learn?

It takes YEARS.... to get to a professional level in most cases. You've fallen for the digital myth... that it's easy, and every can be a photographer. Not so.

Practice, study... and above all post images up and prepare to get them critiqued to discover what exactly you need to do in order to fix the problems... and most importantly, what the problems are... because if you don't know that, how can you fix them?
 
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Get back to enjoying photography and watch it develop, wait for something to catch your eye, then take lots of pics trying different compositions and zoom lengths. Fill those memory cards :-) contrary to belief a pro doesn't simple stop walking, press the shutter, look at the screen and walk off thinking its a winner. The more you look and ask for feedback, the better the "keeper" rate will get.

If you want to study something, then pick one thing at a time, practice till you've got it right and learn something else
 
as above, practice practice and more practice makes will get you there eventually to what you want.

If you have to think too much about setting up the camera then maybe just leave it on av or tv and enjoy the photos for a while as if it doesnt come naturally on full manual controls then you may well miss moments.

As stated above, right and wrong settings are generally a relative term, my sunset shots are generally (as far as right and wrong go) totally wrong, I always under expose purposely if I am shooting a single exposure, sometimes by 2 stops as I personally like deep rich colours and often don't really like to mate multiple images together.

Keep at it and most of all, don't think about doing it right... just do it how it makes you enjoy
 
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For me the best thing to do is learn by playing, get out shoot, try stuff, most importantly don't force it, as if you do that you'll likely start to stop enjoying it, once you've been out and got some shots, post them up here for critique, you'll learn far more from critique of your photos than you'll get from reading any book or watching any video, as the comments and advice will be related directly to your photos :)
 
I haven't learnt anything useful from books, only experience. Also don't listen too much to critique, it isn't important unless you respect the person giving the critique. Be creative and take lots of photos! I had to take a LOT of bad ones to get better, I now take far less but they are generally better because I think about if the photo will work before pressing the shutter.
 
MWHCVT said:
For me the best thing to do is learn by playing, get out shoot, try stuff, most importantly don't force it, as if you do that you'll likely start to stop enjoying it, once you've been out and got some shots, post them up here for critique, you'll learn far more from critique of your photos than you'll get from reading any book or watching any video, as the comments and advice will be related directly to your photos :)
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:thumbs:

I'd add critiquing/studying other peoples shots on to that as well, understandably you might not want to post a reply as yet, but just understanding what others have said in reply and deciding why you might disagree or agree will help you 'see' more easily. Its far easier to be subjective, positive and honest when you study someone's else's shots, and easier to compare and improve you own shots of a similar level to those found during surfing/critique efforts.
 
You probably have some time in your schedule where you can go and take photos, so you do, no matter what the light is like. Pros go and take photos when they have the best light. Ansel Adams used to spend 4 hours trekking into the mountains, get there to find out the light isn't what he wanted, and trek home without getting his tripod out.

I think I've been less disappointed with my shots since I realised this. I've also taken to looking at the light whenever I'm out and about, whether I have a camera in my hands or not. Learn to recognise what's interesting light and what's flat, uninteresting light.
 
abdoujaparov said:
You probably have some time in your schedule where you can go and take photos, so you do, no matter what the light is like. Pros go and take photos when they have the best light. Ansel Adams used to spend 4 hours trekking into the mountains, get there to find out the light isn't what he wanted, and trek home without getting his tripod out.

I think I've been less disappointed with my shots since I realised this. I've also taken to looking at the light whenever I'm out and about, whether I have a camera in my hands or not. Learn to recognise what's interesting light and what's flat, uninteresting light.
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Absolutely, I sometimes go out at 4am and never even get a camera out, if the light isn't on your side nothing will make up for it. Either way it is nice being out and about at that time of day, even if coming home without results can be frustrating.
 
markmullen said:
Absolutely, I sometimes go out at 4am and never even get a camera out, if the light isn't on your side nothing will make up for it. Either way it is nice being out and about at that time of day, even if coming home without results can be frustrating.
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I've always known this, but have only recently "realised" it, if that makes sense.

I suspect understanding this is a key milestone on the road to improvement
 
pete1w said:
why doesn't it look like the one in the magazine taken by the pro photographer? i then take a few token snapshots which invariably get deleted immediately and trudge off home disheartened to watch a few more you tube "how to" videos. am i the only one who suffers from this condition or can the moderators set a sub-thread for folk like me? PLEASE HELP!! cheers pete
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Well to start with you're not a pro photographer and you're falling into the usual trap of comparing yourself to others who have vastly more resources and experience than you do.

If you want to progress the only valid comparison is with yourself; are the photos you took today an improvement (however slight) on those you took a month ago?

Areas to improve are everywhere and taking "token" pictures can also show you where you went wrong, if you did, and what you got right.

Do you set the exposure more accurately, can you use the histogram to ensure the highlights aren't burnt out or the shadows blocked up, are the pictures sharp where they should be sharp?

If you wonder why your pics aren't as good as the pros then find a hill near you, get a warm overcoat and a decent pair of hiking boots then go and climb it.

Once you've done that successfully then get your passport and a rucksack with a few things you might need and head for Everest.

And since you've successfully managed to climb a hill that shouldn't be a problem.

Right?

Well learning to take even good pictures is like climbing Everest, starting with a small hill and progressing in stages, learning all the time about the techniques and skills needed.

But unlike climbing everest, learning to take good pics NEVER ends because there is always something more to learn.

So take your camera and start climbing that little hill !
 
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markmullen said:
Absolutely, I sometimes go out at 4am and never even get a camera out, if the light isn't on your side nothing will make up for it. Either way it is nice being out and about at that time of day, even if coming home without results can be frustrating.
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I think 'knowing' when there is a photo opportunity comes with time and experience, and it takes a lot of disappointing pictures to get there. :rolleyes: As they say, the more pictures you take, the better you get. Hopefully. ;) :lol:

For a long time my pictures being worse most of the time would get me down. :( I would go out and take pictures, enjoy the experience of taking the pictures, be thinking I was getting some good pics, but once home the disappointing results got me down, and was threatening to ruin the hobby. At a certain point I mentally split the picture taking from the results, and I stopped being so disappointed. If the pictures didn't come out as well as I imagined/liked, then I at least enjoyed the picture taking process. If the pictures come out well, then I get two lots of enjoyment. :D

I would say don't underestimate the amount of image editing that goes into the pictures you see on the internet and in magazines. I'm not necessarily saying the that there is loads, most of the time, but there is some most of the time. Comparing what comes straight out of the camera can make you feel that you are not getting good results, but with a little tweaking, an image can be transformed. This is especially true with portraits. It is very hard to get the perfect image in camera, and that should always be your aim, but some image editing may get you images that you are happier with if you are not doing any already.

And remember, you only see peoples best pics most of the time, and to think that all your pics should be as good as everyone else's best pics is an unrealistic expectation imho. ;)
 
Thanks everyone for all your advice and kind words. I appreciate that I am trying to run before I can walk. I think I now look at the things around me slightly differently. As someone said what kind of light is it, would that make an interesting picture, how would I compose that scene. I guess there are days when everyone tries to make an image look interesting but with the best will on the world it ain't gonna happen.maybe I am trying too hard. At least now I know where to come for the best advice and support. Cheers pete
 
pete1w said:
i take the shot and imagine my suprise when it looks s**t!!!!! why doesn't it look like the one in the magazine taken by the pro photographer?
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As others have said - It's worth remembering that the picture in the magazine was more than likely his or her best shot (after PP) from a whole set of images, many of which would have also gone straight to the bin.

Even the best photographers will have days when they come home with a crock of rubbish.

It's all too easy to get disheartened but dont get down about it.

The best advice I was ever given was to take some time out to quietly review your duffers rather than delete them. Digital is good in that respect. Try to figure out why they haven't worked.
 
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