Photo book alternative to Blurb

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Pietrach

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Hi, I recently printed a photo book for a local brewery, as a token of thank you for allowing me to spend a day with them to document their activities. They liked it so much that they now want to print more copies for family and friends. The book I printed was a small 20x25cm soft cover book, around 40 pages on a premium paper. The quality is fantastic, but the book was around £40. If ordered 10+ copies then this drops to around £25 per copy. Do you know any good quality alternatives which would be cheaper than that? Also I am not looking for the lay-flat books, it needs to be a traditional binding (one that does not allow to open the book flat) as I much prefer it.

Thank you
 
My suggestion for large orders would be something like Mixam or Dox Direct.

I think @Ed Sutton has used Dox before so I'll tag him :)

Mixam has specific paper sizes - "Letter" (216mm x 279mm) being the closest to your requirements but would probably require a redesign. Standard sizes probably make it cheaper.
10 copies on 170gsm silk paper (which is the nicest for internal pages. I kinda reviewed their papers here) with 40 pages (80 sides) and a glossy 200gsm cover rolls in at £55 ex. VAT & postage. 20 copies is £90 and the more you order, the more it scales down. Obviously if you meant 40 sides (20 pages) that'll be a lot cheaper.

If it's a local brewery, they may be interested in selling it on the counter (do they deal direct to the public as well as to breweries?), or handing it out as promo to the pubs they supply.

If you want samples, the thread I linked to is our zine exchange where people may be willing to send you a copy of their zines so you can see the quality. I'd send you one of mine but they're all black & white which won't help you see how the colours work. In particular @MrDrizz "Tourist" (glossy cover), @Mr Perceptive "White Heat" (soft touch cover) and @viewfromthenorth "The Industrial Tourist" (silk cover I think) are all great examples.

Apologies for tagging half the world....
 
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Yes I have a spare knocking about. Happy to send so you can judge quality.
But keep in mind they where printed on the cheap. Couple pound per copy, A5 size.
 
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MrDrizz said:
Yes I have a spare knocking about. Happy to send so you can judge quality.
But keep in mind they where printed on the cheap. Couple pound per copy, A5 size.
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Thank you for the offer. I think I will just order a copy to make sure I compare apples for apples.
 
Harlequin565 said:
My suggestion for large orders would be something like Mixam or Dox Direct.

I think @Ed Sutton has used Dox before so I'll tag him :)

Mixam has specific paper sizes - "Letter" (216mm x 279mm) being the closest to your requirements but would probably require a redesign. Standard sizes probably make it cheaper.
10 copies on 170gsm silk paper (which is the nicest for internal pages. I kinda reviewed their papers here) with 40 pages (80 sides) and a glossy 200gsm cover rolls in at £55 ex. VAT & postage. 20 copies is £90 and the more you order, the more it scales down. Obviously if you meant 40 sides (20 pages) that'll be a lot cheaper.

If it's a local brewery, they may be interested in selling it on the counter (do they deal direct to the public as well as to breweries?), or handing it out as promo to the pubs they supply.

If you want samples, the thread I linked to is our zine exchange where people may be willing to send you a copy of their zines so you can see the quality. I'd send you one of mine but they're all black & white which won't help you see how the colours work. In particular @MrDrizz "Tourist" (glossy cover), @Mr Perceptive "White Heat" (soft touch cover) and @viewfromthenorth "The Industrial Tourist" (silk cover I think) are all great examples.

Apologies for tagging half the world....
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Thank you so much. A perfect reply. I will certainly give them a try.
 
Pietrach said:
Thank you for the offer. I think I will just order a copy to make sure I compare apples for apples.
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Makes sense. I believe they do proof copies - worth giving them a ring.
 
Pietrach said:
Hi, I recently printed a photo book for a local brewery, as a token of thank you for allowing me to spend a day with them to document their activities. They liked it so much that they now want to print more copies for family and friends. The book I printed was a small 20x25cm soft cover book, around 40 pages on a premium paper. The quality is fantastic, but the book was around £40. If ordered 10+ copies then this drops to around £25 per copy. Do you know any good quality alternatives which would be cheaper than that? Also I am not looking for the lay-flat books, it needs to be a traditional binding (one that does not allow to open the book flat) as I much prefer it.

Thank you
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Just a general thought.......

To me "traditional binding" is old school, as in (hard)case bound with stitched in page 'sets'. However, if you mean a paperback like binding that is 'Perfect Bound' IMO you need to be sure the printer will use a best of practice method i.e. even if not designed as a lay flat binding it will resist spine splitting/breaking if pushed flat.

I'll look forward to seeing/hearing what you choose and how well it goes down with the brewery.
 
Box Brownie said:
Just a general thought.......

To me "traditional binding" is old school, as in (hard)case bound with stitched in page 'sets'. However, if you mean a paperback like binding that is 'Perfect Bound' IMO you need to be sure the printer will use a best of practice method i.e. even if not designed as a lay flat binding it will resist spine splitting/breaking if pushed flat.

I'll look forward to seeing/hearing what you choose and how well it goes down with the brewery.
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Yes tou are right, perfect bound is the one I have on the book from Blurb. Thank you for the advice.
 
Mr Perceptive said:
Since I was tagged by @Harlequin565, a couple of points I would add

1) Mixam do allow custom sizes (though the price does go up)
2) The Soft Touch cover is nice, it makes for a much more premium tactile feel
3) Don't make the inside pages too thick, they just don't turn over as well
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Thank you. Regarding point three, the pages from Blurb were 148gsm so the closest from Mixam are 150gsm. Any experience how far 120gsm is from that in terms of feel? Would I be able to tell a difference?
 
Harlequin565 said:
My suggestion for large orders would be something like Mixam or Dox Direct.

I think @Ed Sutton has used Dox before so I'll tag him :)
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Yes I have used Doxdirect. They're formats are limited to 'A' sizes and the quality maybe not quite as good as Mixam, the options certainly fewer.

I've done perfect bound books with Blurb and with Mixam. Mixam is as good as Blurb for quality. However, it's not as simple to make the PDFs for Mixam as it is to use Blurb's software. You'll have to make one for the spine, for example, if you want the book's details on it. Then there are things like 'bleeds' to get your head around!
 
Ed Sutton said:
Yes I have used Doxdirect. They're formats are limited to 'A' sizes and the quality maybe not quite as good as Mixam, the options certainly fewer.

I've done perfect bound books with Blurb and with Mixam. Mixam is as good as Blurb for quality. However, it's not as simple to make the PDFs for Mixam as it is to use Blurb's software. You'll have to make one for the spine, for example, if you want the book's details on it. Then there are things like 'bleeds' to get your head around!
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This is an extremely valid point regarding the BookWright software from Blurb. It is very easy to assemble a book. What do you use for preparing a book for Mixam? Also how would you recommend to 'convery' a BookWright project into a ready for print Mixam pdf? Thank you.
 
Pietrach said:
the pages from Blurb were 148gsm so the closest from Mixam are 150gsm. Any experience how far 120gsm is from that in terms of feel?
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I decided to try 130gsm paper weight pages on my last zine. It was a huge disappointment. I would go 150 or 170. Mixam will send you a swatch if you ask.

Pietrach said:
What do you use for preparing a book for Mixam? Also how would you recommend to 'convery' a BookWright project into a ready for print Mixam pdf? Thank you.
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I use Affinity Publisher (which very often has deep discounts). But IIRC, Blurb Bookwright allows you to save as a pdf. Also, the Lightroom book module uses a cut down version of BookWright and definitely allows a save to pdf. The only issue is that your stated size in the OP isn't standard Mixam so I don't know what would happen if you put your 200x205mm book onto (for example) a 216x279mm Mixam template.
 
Pietrach said:
This is an extremely valid point regarding the BookWright software from Blurb. It is very easy to assemble a book. What do you use for preparing a book for Mixam? Also how would you recommend to 'convery' a BookWright project into a ready for print Mixam pdf? Thank you.
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Harlequin565 said:
But IIRC, Blurb Bookwright allows you to save as a pdf. Also, the Lightroom book module uses a cut down version of BookWright and definitely allows a save to pdf. The only issue is that your stated size in the OP isn't standard Mixam so I don't know what would happen if you put your 200x205mm book onto (for example) a 216x279mm Mixam template.
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IIRC the Blurb produced PDFs are very low quality. probably to prevent people using them to get books printed elsewhere!

As @Harlequin565 I use Affinity Publisher these days. Depending how complicated your layout is a general office programme can do the job, but may prove clunky. I've used Open Office in the past, I assume Microsoft's equivalent would work too.

As you will have to start from scratch to make the PDF it might be worth considering a slight redesign to work in a standard Mixam format.
 
Ed Sutton said:
IIRC the Blurb produced PDFs are very low quality. probably to prevent people using them to get books printed elsewhere!
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Didn't know that - thanks!

Edit to add - we do have a book/zine making thread here which may have a lot more info.
 
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Pietrach said:
Thank you. Regarding point three, the pages from Blurb were 148gsm so the closest from Mixam are 150gsm. Any experience how far 120gsm is from that in terms of feel? Would I be able to tell a difference?
Click to expand...
Harlequin565 said:
I decided to try 130gsm paper weight pages on my last zine. It was a huge disappointment. I would go 150 or 170. Mixam will send you a swatch if you ask.
Click to expand...

Agree with @Harlequin565
 
My experiences with Blurb were all good. Their 'standard' paper worked well - ie there was no bleed-through - and it was more flexible than the 'premium' papers (though only by degree & not a game-changer). It seemed that the impression of quality was more dependent on the cover choice than the paper choice - a softcover seemed a bit inescapably cheap whilst a hardcover with dustjacket seemed much more convincing.

As a footnote, I used the pdf to book route, which actually seemed easier than using their template-based software.
 
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I've looked at Mixam, and their page sizes and cover options are somewhat constrained. Otherwise I'd be very tempted.

A printed hard cover seems rather Haines car manual to me. A plain linen cover would be far better, with or without dustwrapper.

My focus is for the feel of a book rather than that of an 'album', which layflat options seem to embody.
 
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