Photographing Running Dogs

AlanoDale

AlanoDale

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Mick
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Good Morning All,

I'm here for some advice. A friend of mine, who is a Police Dog Handler has asked me to come along to an event next week and take photos of him and his collegues working their dogs. It's going to be obidience style work, assault courses etc and a few exercises where the dogs get to bite "criminals" in padded suits.

The problem is I've never photogrpahed this kind of action shots and only have basic kit (Sony A200 with 18-70mm kit lens).

For safety reasons I'll be kept about 20 - 30 metres from the action.

Just hoping that some of you guys with experience of this kind of thing could advise on how to get the best results. Should I be using af or manual focus on a point I think the dog is going to run into etc?

Any help greatly appriciated

PHOTOS ADDED ON PAGE 2, DISAPOINTED BY YESTERDAYS WEATHER
 
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I dont think a 70mm lens will be long enough if you are going to be about 90ft. from the action.
I do not know your camera,s capability but it will need quite a fast shutter speed to capture it,or panning at a slower speed to capture the dogs.:)
 
You'll struggle with the equipment you have I'm afraid.
 
Agreed with what the guys are saying - you need a longer lens or get closer... a good shot to get is a wide/close shot of the teeth right in the lens...the handler judges the distance while you sit on the ground at the dog's eye-level...
It's a pretty standard shot we take with the Army's Search and Attack dogs...

If the dogs are properly trained they'll not just 'go' for you unless the handler sets them deliberately, though accidents have occurred...
You need to asess if can get the right shots from 30m or not...personally I'd be right on top of them with a wide lens, especially over the obstacles, where I'd be in or under them.

Wear gloves, a hat and long sleeves...oh and put a UV filter on the lens: dog-drool goes everywhere...
 
Your going to want a 210mm+ lens atleast f/4 with and shoot with a high shutter speed... My German Shepherd can out run a car doing 20ish mph thats no joke!

Reason for long len is you dont want to distract the dogs either 70mm is fine if they are having a little break but when they are in work mode you dont want to be that close lol.

Get some practice in a park and like already mentioned take a tennis ball :)
 
Thanks everyone for quick replies, You have confirmed my fears.
I was thinking that if this was the case, going out this weekend and buying the Sony 75 - 300 mm lens, which I had planned to get in a few months anyway.

AWP, you say 400mm? would the 300 not cut it? Sorry to ask I'm a total beginner. My budget cant stretch to anything like that i'm afraid
 
Just get closer! You can also crop. It's always hard to say exactly without being there.
 
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BandyQuill said:
pffffffft you could get closer if you want to Andrew :P
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Would love to, but the guys are being assesed and I'd hate to think that they dropped points because the dog got distracted by me being there. Thats my excuse and I'm sticking to it:D
 
Arkady said:
Agreed with what the guys are saying - you need a longer lens or get closer... a good shot to get is a wide/close shot of the teeth right in the lens...the handler judges the distance while you sit on the ground at the dog's eye-level...
It's a pretty standard shot we take with the Army's Search and Attack dogs...

...
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Thanks for that Arkady, I will be getting a little more up close with the dogs and handlers after the assesment part of the day is over. These guys are RAF Police dog handlers
 
Once the assesments are over get as close as you like :) take a 50mm prime ;) wouldnt go out and buy a Sony 75-300mm if this is the first time... Try hiring a lens or look at getting a tamron or even a beercan? Choice is yours depends on budget etc.
 
If they will let you closer it would be a great help

This is from some I did a few years ago - there was just the dog, handler, helper and myself and providing I did not get in the way of the dog I had the freedom of the field

100mm (Canon 350D and 70-200 2.8 IS)

IMG_4351.jpg



I started this post a while ago before you posted that they were being assessed. The dogs should be so focused on what they are doing that unless you really get in the way it should not make a difference but if you stay in the same place, and do the same things with each dog no-one can complain. During one trial they had me posted behind one of the hides where I had to stay all day
 
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BalSanghera said:
Once the assesments are over get as close as you like :) take a 50mm prime ;) wouldnt go out and buy a Sony 75-300mm if this is the first time... Try hiring a lens or look at getting a tamron or even a beercan? Choice is yours depends on budget etc.
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Thanks for the advice. Do you not recommend the Sony? I won't be buying it just for this event. I am off to the Falkland Islands later in the year and was hoping on trying out some wildlife photography down there.
 
my apologies for a slight thread hijack, but this question might help mick as well.

Do any of you dog photographers have problems with focusing issues when dogs are running directly at you?

I find nearly all of my photos have the dogs neck or chest area in focus even when the focus point is on the dogs face. I assume the lens is stuggling with the pace of the dog but i use the 50mm 1.8 most of the time and i thought this was one of the fastest focusing lens'. any thoughts?
 
burrachaga said:
my apologies for a slight thread hijack, but this question might help mick as well.

Do any of you dog photographers have problems with focusing issues when dogs are running directly at you?

I find nearly all of my photos have the dogs neck or chest area in focus even when the focus point is on the dogs face. I assume the lens is stuggling with the pace of the dog but i use the 50mm 1.8 most of the time and i thought this was one of the fastest focusing lens'. any thoughts?
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No apologies needed. This was something I was thinking about, I read in a magazine about using manual focus to focus on an area that you know the dog is going to run into and then then continous shoot. Its certainly something i was going to try next week
 
You mean like this


willow flight by PsiFox, on Flickr

Taken with all 51 focus points and 3d tracking on AF-C
 
yep exactly like that,

i tend to use a single, central focusing point which i can keep on the dog quite easily but i have tried 3d as well. I definately use af-c. which lens was used here foxxy?
 
Just for reference, here is a shot with my 7D and 100mm lens at a distance of 13.2m. This is Jazz, my staffie cross (whippet?), so she is smaller than a GSD. If you assume a distance of 30m the dog would be only 44% as large in the frame in terms of height. With a 70mm lens thrown into the mix she would be just 31% as large - less than 1/3 of the height. That's a pretty titchy blob.

20100622_120249_9736_LR.jpg


Now, a GSD is bigger, so that runs in your favour, but if you want worthwhile shots I certainly think you need more focal length than 70mm. I think a 70-300 would be in the right ballpark, especially if you need the flexibilty to include jumps and people in the frame.

Another point to consider - shooting at a distance, like 30m, is much easier on the AF system. Relatively speaking the closing speed is slower than with the dog close to you, so the farther away you can shoot, but using a longer lens to compensate, the easier things will be. You'll also get a narrower field of view, which will concentrate attention on the dog and not a potentially distracting background.

I would say that for a reasonable chance of blur free shots you should be looking at shutter speeds not less than 1/1000. Don't be shy of raising ISO if you need to. A noisy shot is infinitely preferable to a blurry one.

You should also consider lighting direction. As you will note from my example, with a dark dog it is very easy for details to disappear, even if the exposure is basically good for the scene itself. So try to position yourself on the sunny side of the dog if you can. Shooting into the shadow side will make things harder for the AF and just generally make your job more difficult.

Here's my lurcher, Zippy. Sadly no longer with us, he was about GSD sized. This was shot at 30.3m with a 400mm lens on a 1D3, which I think would make 300mm about right on a smaller crop body.

20090516_170812_7249_LR.jpg
 
burrachaga said:
yep exactly like that,

i tend to use a single, central focusing point which i can keep on the dog quite easily but i have tried 3d as well. I definately use af-c. which lens was used here foxxy?
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70-200 VR
 
I'd get some practice with the AI-Servo mode (using single focus point) and I probably wouldn't go faster than 2.8 as it could end up being too difficult to acheive focus on the correct parts and the dof could be too shallow.

Depending on if you are panning or not then you'll need a surprisingly high shutter speed. I've been doing a fair bit with my wee American Beagle and he's like a bloody rocket - and staffy's are surprisingly fast as well!!!

Another factor to look out for is if you are going to use AI-Servo then you may not be able to have the fps too high as the AF may not be able to keep up.

Try going to a park where there are lots of dogs running about to test, explain to the owners and I'm sure they'd be fine with it.
 
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Some very good advice and example shots here. :)

If it were me, I'd prefer more reach than 70. I've done a few shoots of lurchers etc hurdling/racing and simulated coursing and always shot in TV with 900+ shutter speed as punters like sharp shots, not panned with a slower shutter speed.

Try to shoot level with the dog. I used to take some sort of padded pillow to kneel on. Hard ground kills the knees if you're doing it for hours on end.

Good luck and don't forget to post some shots when you've done it.

Lisa
 
This one was taken at 2.8 again with the 70-200VR in 51 point 3d track AF-C


Salty sea dog by PsiFox, on Flickr

I find the 70-200 and the 300 F4 are great lenses for very fast closing objects. Not many are out of focus.
 
Safety wise you'll be fine, they are very well trained :lol:

cat_police_dogs.jpg
 
AlanoDale said:
Thanks for that Arkady, I will be getting a little more up close with the dogs and handlers after the assesment part of the day is over. These guys are RAF Police dog handlers
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Ah, perfect - I know exactly what you're covering then.
Use a long-lens for the assessment shots and then do some 'set-up's afterwards when everyone's calmed down...

They'll have the dogs jumping all over the place for you as long as you promise a CD afterwards...
 
Thanks everyone for your replies, very much appriciated. I'm going to be looking at either buying a longer lens or renting one and seeing what i can come up with
 
I'll just repeat what has been said. 200mm lens is a minimum. At 200mm it is still quite difficult as they are too close and too fast, or too far away in the distance. 300mm is more like it. Zoom doesn't really help much as you won't have time to conciously change it. Perhaps look for old Sigma 300mm or 400mm primes as long as they are still compatible with your sony.
 
AlanoDale said:
Thanks for the advice. Do you not recommend the Sony? I won't be buying it just for this event. I am off to the Falkland Islands later in the year and was hoping on trying out some wildlife photography down there.
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AlanoDale said:
Thanks everyone for your replies, very much appriciated. I'm going to be looking at either buying a longer lens or renting one and seeing what i can come up with
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I couldnt recommend the lens as I dont own it and cant afford it lol, thats the reason it may be wise to look at alternatives as well, see what the price differnce is going to be... As you could save enough to buy another lens :naughty:
 
I'd ask Chairman Mao

Mao said:
If there is to be revolution, there must be a revolutionary party. Without a revolutionary party, without a party built on the Marxist-Leninist revolutionary theory and in the Marxist-Leninist revolutionary style, it is impossible to lead the working class and the broad masses of the people in defeating imperialism and its running dogs.
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but he's a bit dead these days.
 
Not much left to say really, just try to get the fastest shutter speed you can with the equipment you have. I've taken some what I consider excellent shots of fast moving dogs @ 70mm but they have been at about 10 feet distance. I'd try to get at least a 70-200 lens and if you can get a fast 300mm all the better. Don't bother with IS or VR
 
daugirdas said:
I'll just repeat what has been said. 200mm lens is a minimum. At 200mm it is still quite difficult as they are too close and too fast, or too far away in the distance. 300mm is more like it. Zoom doesn't really help much as you won't have time to conciously change it. Perhaps look for old Sigma 300mm or 400mm primes as long as they are still compatible with your sony.
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Nah you dont need a minimum of 200mm, I've got some cracking shots of my dog running using just my 18-135.
 
Ah, I just re-read the OP's post, I missed the bit about the distance!
 
Thanks everyone for the replies :thumbs:. I went out and bought a tamron 70-300mm lens at the weekend. Unfortunately, due to todays horrible weather, all spectators were moved back to a shelter about 70 metres away:(

So just looking through the pics now, but with the weather / distance / my lack of experience or skill, I'm not very hopeful.

Still always look on the brightside, today was another learning day for photography
 
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