Pocketwizards Vs the Chinese alternative - Why pay more?

TimB

TimB

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Hi all,

I'm getting into strobist/off camera flash work recently. I'm finding it quite fun and useful, plus starting to get some decent photos of of it.

I decided to do it 'on the cheap' as I didn't know if flash stuff and shooting models was for me, so I purchased 2 Yongnuo YN460 manual flash units and a set of 3 Yongnuo RF603 2.4Ghz wireless flash transceivers.

This little lot cost me about £80 all in which I though was very reasonable.

To be honest, I have used the set up a few times now and never had a single problem with any of it.

The RF603 wireless units are absolutely brilliant, they automatically detect if they are a transmitter or receiver and switch themselves accordingly when turned on. The range of them is huge and I have never had a flash fail to fire when using them.

They are very compact and battery life seems excellent so far.

So basically they do everything you expect perfectly and for about £15 per transceiver.

Which begs the question, why buy the more expensive ones such as the Pocketwizards which the American photographers seem to rave about? The basic model of pocket wizard with equivalent features are about £100 each and obviously you need a minimum of 2 of them!

I know you often 'get what you pay for' and I guess maybe in the long run the Pocketwizards and the like may prove to be better built or last longer, but for the money, I could lose/break 7 Yongnuo RF603's for the price of one Pocketwizard.

I'm a big believer that if it's an item that directly affects image quality such as a lens then I spend as much as I can, but if its a piece of ancillary electronics or an accessory I save as much as I can.

I also bought a Chinese battery grip for my D90, and what can I say, it fits perfectly, looks well made and does the job perfect.

Watch this.... The Yongnuo's will break the next time I go out... :D
 
Because you can't sync faster the. 250/ th second.... Not that's would pay £xxx's for that, I'm not a pro and the yongnuo's work fine for me too!
 
Yes, I have found the 1/250 limit myself when using them but this hasn't really been a problem to be honest... well, not yet anyway!

How much faster is the sync on the Pocketwizards I wonder?
 
And the answer is...
The Plus II also offers PocketWizard's bulletproof, "best in the biz" reliable triggering with a range of up to 1600 feet away at synch speeds of 1/250 (focal) or 1/500 (Leaf shutter)
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So... what's the difference between Focal or Leaf?? Does this mean they are indeed the same sync speed as the Yongnuo's?
 
TimB - leaf shutters are found on medium format (and I think, large format) digital systems so I believe.

I think one of the things with PWs is their compatibility with each other, even old ones. The Calumet/Phottix ones work with them too apparently. TBH, PWs don't offer any faster sync than 1/250th - I think trend and 'pro' price migh be a deciding factor in why many pros use them. Don't know if they have exceptional build quality - that might be a USP.
 
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specialman said:
PWs don't offer any faster sync than 1/250th - I think trend and 'pro' price migh be a deciding factor in why many pros use them.
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I tend to agree with you.

I reckon most of it has to do with "These are a lot more expensive than those other ones so they must be a lot better"
 
Pros and myself who am not a pro but a very keen amateur choose pocket wizards because I can shoot outside in bright conditions and use a very low aperture to control my depth of field better. These chinese triggers are ok if you don't mind using such small apertures or you can use a Nd filter to enable you to use small apertures but to be honest that's too much messing about especially at weddings etc. Attach pocketwizard use any aperture you like be in control don't fart about with filters and f18where diffraction can also effect quality. Pocket wizards are that price for a reason people.
 
scotsman said:
Pros and myself who am not a pro but a very keen amateur choose pocket wizards because I can shoot outside in bright conditions and use a very low aperture to control my depth of field better. These chinese triggers are ok if you don't mind using such small apertures or you can use a Nd filter to enable you to use small apertures but to be honest that's too much messing about especially at weddings etc. Attach pocketwizard use any aperture you like be in control don't fart about with filters and f18where diffraction can also effect quality. Pocket wizards are that price for a reason people.
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Eh?

There's no difference in the available camera settings between PWII system referred to above and the YongNuo triggers, both are limited by the camera's sync speed.

Unless, of course, you are referring to the TTL Pocket Wizards which can utilise FP flash sync, but that's comparing apples to (very expensive) oranges....
 
First of all to let you know where I stand I used to use Pocket Wizards but am currently using a set of YongNuo RF602

TimB said:
To be honest, I have used the set up a few times now and never had a single problem with any of it.
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The key phrase there is "a few times" ;)

Which begs the question, why buy the more expensive ones such as the Pocketwizards which the American photographers seem to rave about? The basic model of pocket wizard with equivalent features are about £100 each and obviously you need a minimum of 2 of them!

I know you often 'get what you pay for' and I guess maybe in the long run the Pocketwizards and the like may prove to be better built or last longer, but for the money, I could lose/break 7 Yongnuo RF603's for the price of one Pocketwizard.
Click to expand...

If you are relying on your kit to do the job professionally you need to be certain that it won't let you down and whilst the YN gear is, in general, fairly reliable it's not bulletproof and can suddenly die for no apparent reason.

I'm a big believer that if it's an item that directly affects image quality such as a lens then I spend as much as I can, but if its a piece of ancillary electronics or an accessory I save as much as I can.

I also bought a Chinese battery grip for my D90, and what can I say, it fits perfectly, looks well made and does the job perfect.
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Yup those grips fit perfectly, but there are many reports of them not reporting the battery strength correctly, causing cameras to suddenly die mid shot, shutter open, necessitating a rather costly trip back to Nikon...

Watch this.... The Yongnuo's will break the next time I go out... :D
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Probably. What they tend to do is just die in their sleep. You store them away, in perfect working order, and don't use them for a few weeks/months, bring them out again and nothing, zilch, they have stopped working.

The same thing can happen with their flashguns, they just pass away peacefully in their sleep when not used regularly, no idea why and no idea how to prevent or fix it, it just happens.

As you say though, you get what you pay for, accept that if you're using them for pro work you will need backups (and backups for the backups) and you'll be fine, although in the long run it probably won't work out any cheaper than buying the Pocket Wizards in the first place....
 
Flash In The Pan said:
Eh?

There's no difference in the available camera settings between PWII system referred to above and the YongNuo triggers, both are limited by the camera's sync speed.

Unless, of course, you are referring to the TTL Pocket Wizards which can utilise FP flash sync, but that's comparing apples to (very expensive) oranges....
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Sorry but tell me where in the initial post in mentions the plus11 ? Me personally use flextt1 &tt5. Your a guy I have seen before in George square I'm sure
 
Flash In The Pan said:
Eh?

There's no difference in the available camera settings between PWII system referred to above and the YongNuo triggers, both are limited by the camera's sync speed.

Unless, of course, you are referring to the TTL Pocket Wizards which can utilise FP flash sync, but that's comparing apples to (very expensive) oranges....
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Nope no mention of plus 11 pocketwizards so read again mr know it all lol
 
scotsman said:
Sorry but tell me where in the initial post in mentions the plus11 ? Me personally use flextt1 &tt5. Your a guy I have seen before in George square I'm sure
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It doesn't, the op mentions them in his third post (post #4) "The Plus II also offers PocketWizard's....."

I have been known to traverse George Square, but I'd like to point out one thing, that's not me in my avatar....:naughty:
 
scotsman said:
Pros and myself who am not a pro but a very keen amateur choose pocket wizards because I can shoot outside in bright conditions and use a very low aperture to control my depth of field better. These chinese triggers are ok if you don't mind using such small apertures or you can use a Nd filter to enable you to use small apertures but to be honest that's too much messing about especially at weddings etc. Attach pocketwizard use any aperture you like be in control don't fart about with filters and f18where diffraction can also effect quality. Pocket wizards are that price for a reason people.
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Why would you need f/18 if you're at 1/250th and on an ND filter? Yep, the sun is bright but not that bright.... ;)

I was in full sun yesterday getting 1/250th @ f/4 - 5.6 with speedlights on manual triggers. Did the job nicely; sun as key light, speedlight as fill.....

DSC6702.jpg


Obviously if I'd have wanted to shoot at f/2.8 then I'd have hit the ceiling as far as the ambient exposure wen. But the difference between f/4 and f/2.8 is so academic in this situation that I can live with the greater DoF. If I needed f/2.8 then I'd just whack an ND on that will stay on all day - not much faffing around IMO.

As for the OP's reference to PWs, I assumed that he was talking about triggers (i.e. Plus IIs) and not the flex system, which IMO is part of a lighting system in the same way as Nikon has CLS.

BTW, I use Phottix Strato triggers.
 
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At that price, you could almost buy a couple of spare sets too, and still have cash in the pocket

With any gear, If it works, does the job, continues to do the job then it is fine
 
specialman said:
Why would you need f/18 if you're at 1/250th and on an ND filter? Yep, the sun is bright but not that bright.... ;)

I was in full sun yesterday getting 1/250th @ f/4 - 5.6 with speedlights on manual triggers. Did the job nicely; sun as key light, speedlight as fill.....

Obviously if I'd have wanted to shoot at f/2.8 then I'd have hit the ceiling as far as the ambient exposure wen. But the difference between f/4 and f/2.8 is so academic in this situation that I can live with the greater DoF. If I needed f/2.8 then I'd just whack an ND on that will stay on all day - not much faffing around IMO.

As for the OP's reference to PWs, I assumed that he was talking about triggers (i.e. Plus IIs) and not the flex system, which IMO is part of a lighting system in the same way as Nikon has CLS.

BTW, I use Phottix Strato triggers.
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Yeah just wack an Nd filter on that will stay on all day just hold on bride n groom till I put this filter on and fart about getting my settings right rubbish you would look a **** at a wedding doing that son
 
I think, if you look carefully, Pat is not shooting a wedding in the example posted. I think he may be shooting a fishing competition, though I bow to your, obvious, superior knowledge and condescension.............:)
 
scotsman said:
Nope no mention of plus 11 pocketwizards so read again mr know it all lol
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scotsman said:
Yeah just wack an Nd filter on that will stay on all day just hold on bride n groom till I put this filter on and fart about getting my settings right rubbish you would look a **** at a wedding doing that son
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Sounds like your having a bad day..... ;)
 
scotsman said:
Yeah just wack an Nd filter on that will stay on all day just hold on bride n groom till I put this filter on and fart about getting my settings right rubbish you would look a **** at a wedding doing that son
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Erm, yes, because taking 2 minutes to pop a filter on will ruin there day. You'd cause a ***** storm if you had to change flash batteries :eek:
Oh no, what will they do!!!!!
 
Scotsman - you obviously know more about this than me. I'll just get back to preparing images for national magazines and wrestling with my ND filters.... the b****r has taken a mind-numbing 30 seconds to get off do far - oh the shame!!!.....;)
 
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specialman said:
Scotsman - you obviously know more about this than me. I'll just get back to preparing images for national magazines and wrestling with my ND filters.... the b****r has taken a mind-numbing 30 seconds to get off do far - oh the shame!!!.....;)
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QUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICKER!!!!!

4 posts so far, I think with that manner, he will be lucky to make it to 10 :lol:
 
scotsman said:
Yeah just wack an Nd filter on that will stay on all day just hold on bride n groom till I put this filter on and fart about getting my settings right rubbish you would look a **** at a wedding doing that son
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What has a wedding got to do with anything. There are other forms of photography out there you know.

and son???

Do you think you could maybe be a little bit more condescending? A teeny bit at least...?
 
RichardtheSane..... don't worry about it.....if it's not him being off, it's Purpleclouds sending me crappy PMs, calling me an idiot. I'm getting used to it.. :)
 
I love people like that :D
 
I'm more than happy with my Pocket Wizard Plus II copies from Phottix. My Phottix Atlas triggers have better build quality than the Pocket Wizards, work at a greater distance, have a hot shoe on the top and cost £65 delivered compared with the Pocket Wizard Plus IIs £145.

Review here

I have three and the best bit for me is they work with my Sekonic's radio trigger.
 
So the Sekonic trigger works with more than PWs :), I wonder if it'll work with my Cactus v5s
 
acetone said:
So the Sekonic trigger works with more than PWs :), I wonder if it'll work with my Cactus v5s
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No.

The phottix atlas triggers are pocketwizard compatible is all, which is the same as the sekonic trigger. That said, it's a great combination :)
 
specialman said:
TBH, PWs don't offer any faster sync than 1/250th - I think trend and 'pro' price migh be a deciding factor in why many pros use them. Don't know if they have exceptional build quality - that might be a USP.
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I read as well that PW/5D users have to use 1/160, same as I use with the RF603.

I really like the RF603. Transceivers, AAA batteries, solid construction for now. One downside is the lack of a lock, but I will probably "Velcro" them onto the flashhead and use a short PC cable. Other downside is the requirement for either Canon or Nikon TTL pin-contact for the transmitting unit to work - baeh.
 
I use PW plus 2. They work every time, all the time and go on forever. I don't need to worry if they misfire because they never have and are regarded for rock solid reliability. Admittedly the cheaper have moved on since and today I would go for Phottix PW clones.

I bought mine when I was shooting a lot of skate photography. Nothing better than watching a guy killing himself to get a trick down 10 stairs then have to say "Sorry my trigger messed up, I missed it" Once was enough to persuade me to change to PW.
 
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MJ Stebbings said:
Erm, yes, because taking 2 minutes to pop a filter on will ruin there day. You'd cause a ***** storm if you had to change flash batteries :eek:
Oh no, what will they do!!!!!
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Energiser lithium fresh before the shoot they won't run out believe me
 
specialman said:
Scotsman - you obviously know more about this than me. I'll just get back to preparing images for national magazines and wrestling with my ND filters.... the b****r has taken a mind-numbing 30 seconds to get off do far - oh the shame!!!.....;)
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Fair enough if you were working for a magazine and your messing about with cheap Chinese crap lol
 
Cistron said:
I read as well that PW/5D users have to use 1/160, same as I use with the RF603.

I really like the RF603. Transceivers, AAA batteries, solid construction for now. One downside is the lack of a lock, but I will probably "Velcro" them onto the flashhead and use a short PC cable. Other downside is the requirement for either Canon or Nikon TTL pin-contact for the transmitting unit to work - baeh.
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Nope 1/250th I get so you are wrong wee man
 
itsdavedotnet said:
strange, seeing as canon specify the sync speed as 1/200th...

http://www.canon.co.uk/For_Home/Product_Finder/Cameras/Digital_SLR/EOS_5D_Mark_II/index.aspx?specs=1
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Yes thats true you clearly don't understand what hypersync is its patented pocket wizard technology it's not hss both different things hypersync means you can use full flash power beyond the sync speed of the camera due to the pocket wizard technology please go to there website there is some good videos there to explain from mark Wallace. Basically hss uses small bursts of light and uses a lot of battery power and your flash has to be closer to subject because you will loose some power although pocket wizard has also refined the hss tech to make it use less power. Hypersync gives you normal flash power beyond the sync speed which is great for sports shooters ect and saving power.
 
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