Portrait of a young woman

EdinburghGary

EdinburghGary

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Gary
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Just going with my gut again and trying to shoot what feels right. Feedback & crit, good and bad welcome. I will also explain some of my choices....

The photo:
http://www.inspirephoto.co.uk/onBla...www.inspirephoto.co.uk/examples/Inspire08.jpg

The bright skin.
As I have said in loads of threads now, I definitely prefer to shoot what I guess is close to over exposure. I like the look more than a more middle exposure, feels cleaner and more comtemporary. I could be off my rocker, feel free to tell me :)

The arm on the right
Have chosen to crop it to stop the ring of black. I broke it out on the thirds. Also placed her eyes on a third, and her erm, other bits.

The arm on the left
Yeah yeah I know, it's a pain in the ass. On the other hand, she may look like an amputee without that wee hint? Dunno....

The arm on the right again
I forgot to say. This is where the bright skin could maybe be toned down, just a smidgen though!

The arm on the right again...and then some
Is the whole "mass of skin" on the arm, and under arm area, too big in relation to her face?


What do you think, don't hold back :D

Gary.
 
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My biggest criticism is that arm and I think you have answered most of what's wrong.
 
Gary thats a belter. The hair is so lush in colour and so vibrant. Eyes are crisp and clean. Personally I think its great.

The colour of her top neautralizes the hair colour and balances the shot well. It gets my vote, would be very happy with that one (y)
 
Great shot and good colour, only thing is the skin is blown own, try get lil detail back into the skin and thats a winner! makes her look like she has no arm pit!
 
Cheers guys,

I kinda suspected the arm might cause problems, I may play with it - not sure yet. I will sleep on it! It's not detracting hugely for me at the moment, but it is starting to bug :D

Gary.
 
The bright skin.
As I have said in loads of threads now, I definitely prefer to shoot what I guess is close to over exposure. I like the look more than a more middle exposure, feels cleaner and more comtemporary. I could be off my rocker, feel free to tell me :)
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Over exposure results in blown highlights - whilst this can work as a technique, it is also a risk. And you'll find that there are clients who don't like risk. Some of the time we need to shoot to sell. But then, you could become a trendsetter - do you have the time and the money to develop that trend whilst the clients get used to it?


The arm on the right
Have chosen to crop it to stop the ring of black. I broke it out on the thirds. Also placed her eyes on a third, and her erm, other bits.
Click to expand...

Get into the habit of referring to body parts by their name - if you are embarrassed even in jest, you will help your clients to feel embarrassed too. It's your job to help them relax and feel comfortable. The crop of the arm isn't the problem here.


The arm on the left
Yeah yeah I know, it's a pain in the ass. On the other hand, she may look like an amputee without that wee hint? Dunno....
Click to expand...

The patch of light is distracting - the image looks far better when you crop the little bit of arm out. As it is, this is something that spoils the image. Try turning your image upside down and you'll see how your eye is drawn to that patch of light.


The arm on the right again
I forgot to say. This is where the bright skin could maybe be toned down, just a smidgen though!
Click to expand...

It's too bright, and this is where the eye falls first - do the same exercise of turning the image upside down.

The arm on the right again...and then some
Is the whole "mass of skin" on the arm, and under arm area, too big in relation to her face?
Click to expand...

Yep, too much mass of skin - I was also always taught that it's a no-no to show underarm unless you are doing glamour. But in terms of the mass of skin - any body part that is straight on to camera will look bigger in relation to other body parts. And this is what has happened here. You could have softened it down a bit with bringing her hair over her shoulder.

What do you think, don't hold back :D

Gary.
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There you go, that's what I think and I didn't hold back :D

If you are asking the questions, there is a high chance you know the answers - even if you might not like them.
Z
 
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Gary - i think you have answered your own questions. What i would like to add though is the wonderful use of complimentary colours between her hair and top. The image is beautiful and i think you are on the road to excellence. Not sure if its my monitor but is her skin a bit pinky/peach?
 
ZoZo said:
Over exposure results in blown highlights - whilst this can work as a technique, it is also a risk. And you'll find that there are clients who don't like risk. Some of the time we need to shoot to sell. But then, you could become a trendsetter - do you have the time and the money to develop that trend whilst the clients get used to it?

If I like it, I'll just do it and if Clients don't like it, I'll take that as the most important guide I guess.

Get into the habit of referring to body parts by their name - if you are embarrassed even in jest, you will help your clients to feel embarrassed too. It's your job to help them relax and feel comfortable. The crop of the arm isn't the problem here.

I don't like naughty words :naughty:


The patch of light is distracting - the image looks far better when you crop the little bit of arm out. As it is, this is something that spoils the image. Try turning your image upside down and you'll see how your eye is drawn to that patch of light.

Reckon I should clone it? Ideally I would have spotted...but

It's too bright, and this is where the eye falls first - do the same exercise of turning the image upside down.


Yep, too much mass of skin - I was also always taught that it's a no-no to show underarm unless you are doing glamour. But in terms of the mass of skin - any body part that is straight on to camera will look bigger in relation to other body parts. And this is what has happened here. You could have softened it down a bit with bringing her hair over her shoulder.


There you go, that's what I think and I didn't hold back :D

Good! :D I like it rough :cool:

If you are asking the questions, there is a high chance you know the answers - even if you might not like them.

What's not to like, good advice, and I already know how quickly you can improve by using these forums properly....

Z
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jeniveeev said:
Gary - i think you have answered your own questions. What i would like to add though is the wonderful use of complimentary colours between her hair and top. The image is beautiful and i think you are on the road to excellence. Not sure if its my monitor but is her skin a bit pinky/peach?

It might be off (skin colour), although I did gray card the shoot. Thanks for the compliments, I think it's massively important to crit your own work if you see a fault, but I don't think you need to bin an image as a result. Take a step back and look at it overall, and when I do that, I am pleased with the result, just not thrilled.
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Ta everyone :)

G.
 
Gary,
I really like the image, the only 2 niggles I have are
The under arm amount of skin showing, as yourself and others said and I also find that my attention is drawn to the bra strap, to the point that it is all I see each time I look at the image, It is one of my peeves, I just really dislike bra straps showing :shrug:
 
Can't comment on colour on my works monitor as it's a crappy Dell, but everything seems OK except the lack of shape on the right arm (Her left arm) does make it look a tad amorphous. when I looked at it first glance I thought it was on backward. Perhaps a little more shading there might lend it a bit more dimensionality and help cut down on the apparent size?
 
That's too bright for me, Gary. It's lost all definition in her left arm and her faceis too close to overexposure for me. Apart from that I can live with the other arm and really dig it. It's close, but not quite. This is all subjective, of course.
 
Gary, I'm actually with you on the exposure and colour is spot on, as with most posters and even yourself, the raised arm is the problem. It is too much of a draw away from her face and makes her head appear smaller. As Zoe commented, it's just a bit too glamour for this image too. Other than that it's a triumph!
 
It's a bit on the edge, and although the absolute mass of white skin is a little bit distracting where her underarm and upper arm is I like this. The saturation of the colours coupled with the edging on over exposure and the shallow DOF really makes it work.

Also, it goes to show how subjective any of our work is. One mans meat is another mans poison, so to speak?
 
Davec223 said:
Gary,
I really like the image, the only 2 niggles I have are
The under arm amount of skin showing, as yourself and others said and I also find that my attention is drawn to the bra strap, to the point that it is all I see each time I look at the image, It is one of my peeves, I just really dislike bra straps showing :shrug:
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Cheers dude :) I don't mind the strap personally, but can understand why it may detract for some.

Denyerec said:
Can't comment on colour on my works monitor as it's a crappy Dell, but everything seems OK except the lack of shape on the right arm (Her left arm) does make it look a tad amorphous. when I looked at it first glance I thought it was on backward. Perhaps a little more shading there might lend it a bit more dimensionality and help cut down on the apparent size?
Click to expand...

Cheers, I will try and see if I can make the arm more pleasing.

The23rdman said:
That's too bright for me, Gary. It's lost all definition in her left arm and her faceis too close to overexposure for me. Apart from that I can live with the other arm and really dig it. It's close, but not quite. This is all subjective, of course.
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Cheers duder, it's absolutely bright :D Dunno why this appeals to me, it never used to.

V8burble said:
Gary, I'm actually with you on the exposure and colour is spot on, as with most posters and even yourself, the raised arm is the problem. It is too much of a draw away from her face and makes her head appear smaller. As Zoe commented, it's just a bit too glamour for this image too. Other than that it's a triumph!
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Ta mate, I'm going to be thinking about arm positioning more on my next shoot. Plenty of shoots coming up, so will get loads of practice in.

Marcus Geezer said:
It's a bit on the edge, and although the absolute mass of white skin is a little bit distracting where her underarm and upper arm is I like this. The saturation of the colours coupled with the edging on over exposure and the shallow DOF really makes it work.

Also, it goes to show how subjective any of our work is. One mans meat is another mans poison, so to speak?
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Absolutely, the subjectivity is what makes this gig so interesting (crit back & forth)...

G.
 
MagicMynx said:
I looked at it a while ago, went away and had a ponder. The only thing that I don't like, is that her arm furthest away looks bendy, because of the angle. Would love to see it in mono though!
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I'm not sure yet on how I should best go about a mono portrait....besides, I love colour too much I think :D

Gary.
 
I hear the critism and it all makes sense, particularly the bright arm on the right, which when it's pointed out, looks too prominent. On the other hand my first impression is "wow! what a great photo of a lovely looking girl with amazing hair", which, I'm guessing is the objective.

The hand through the hair draws attention to it and the armpit does hint to glamour which, I'm guessing, is part of the objective?

If you lose the hand through the hair you may get a technically "better" shot but do you lose the sensuality?
 
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ShawWellPete said:
I hear the critism and it all makes sense, particularly the bright arm on the right, which when it's pointed out, looks too prominent. On the other hand my first impression is "wow" what a great photo of a lovely looking girl with amazing hair, which, I'm guessing is the objective.

The hand through the hair draws attention to it and the armpit does hint to glamour which, I'm guessing, is part of the objective?

If you lose the hand through the hair you may get a technically "better" shot but do you lose the sensuality?
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You got it in one I reckon. I really wanted to create an edge, and a real hint femininity. I guess I hinted at it in the thread title, but did not want to push it too much.

G.
 
keep the arm.

it's brilliant. it's drawing my eye through the shape of her body up to her face.

I think it works really well. Makes her hair look amazing as well, and her hair is beautiful, so it's a good point to draw attention to.

the 'over-exposure' is good on her face, goes well with her 'celtic' skin/hair tones. but is too much on the arm, drawing my eye a little bit.

It's definitely an eye catching portrait. I've got to be honest, I'm not a fan of most studio portraiture, think it has a tendency to feel stale and emotionless. But this is pushing the boundaries a bit and making it feel more natural.
 
I think it's excellent as a whole - love the processing plus the vibrant eyes and hair.

The only slight negative is the arm looks to be too flat with no detail but any non-photographer woudl be blown away by that image! Great work and I hope i can product portraits like that at some point in my life.(y)
 
k1026143 said:
Love her hair!
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It's lovely, very rich.

Gordon Scott said:
Lovely photo Gary and interesting to see high key skin rendition with a black background. I bet the young lady is very happy. If I was being very critical then she has a bit to much mascara on compared to her eyebrows.
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Cheers Gordo :)

sambam said:
keep the arm.

it's brilliant. it's drawing my eye through the shape of her body up to her face.

I think it works really well. Makes her hair look amazing as well, and her hair is beautiful, so it's a good point to draw attention to.

the 'over-exposure' is good on her face, goes well with her 'celtic' skin/hair tones. but is too much on the arm, drawing my eye a little bit.

It's definitely an eye catching portrait. I've got to be honest, I'm not a fan of most studio portraiture, think it has a tendency to feel stale and emotionless. But this is pushing the boundaries a bit and making it feel more natural.
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Ta :)

rbrown74 said:
I think it's excellent as a whole - love the processing plus the vibrant eyes and hair.

The only slight negative is the arm looks to be too flat with no detail but any non-photographer woudl be blown away by that image! Great work and I hope i can product portraits like that at some point in my life.(y)
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Of course you can, easy peasy. If I can do it, anyone can! :rules:
 
Nice work Gary,

I like the shape she makes overall and I think it works well - I only have two niggles, one is her bra strap - can you clone it and the other is her eyes they look over done somehow, and the catchlights not quite matching from left eye to right doesn't seem right

Cheers

Hugh
 
Ta dude,

I will try the bra strap and see how it looks, appreciate the feedback.

Gary.
 
Hi Gary,
I like this.

I'd maybe tone down the rawness of her skin a little, other than that I think her top colour and her HAIR is fantastically lit against the black background!!:clap:
 
Hi Gary - lots of good and valid crit on here but one of, if not THE, most important people to ask for crit is the subject. Can you tell us what she thinks of this image

After all the client is paying so it is ultimately what makes them happy that counts in a commercial sense.
 
nikonal said:
Hi Gary,
I like this.

I'd maybe tone down the rawness of her skin a little, other than that I think her top colour and her HAIR is fantastically lit against the black background!!:clap:
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Cheers :D I will try a few options on the skin.

haggis said:
Hi Gary - lots of good and valid crit on here but one of, if not THE, most important people to ask for crit is the subject. Can you tell us what she thinks of this image

After all the client is paying so it is ultimately what makes them happy that counts in a commercial sense.
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Haven't a clue, not had them back for the viewing yet.....I've not had much in the way of bad feedback yet, so I am confident it will go down well.

G.
 
Hi Gary,

Sometimes I think it's far too easy to sit and criticise an image rather than simply accept that it's good work regardless of its flaws... This is one such image! It doesn't take much to deconstruct an image but compliments seem to be harder to give than criticism.

I think you've got a portrait here that the young lady in question would be more than happy with and if that's the case, so should you be. :)

She's a beautiful young lady and your shot has done her justice.

Cheers,
Si
 
Love it , her hair and her eyes override any possible niggles above. Beautiful, well done. I know this post is of no critical use but I love it.
 
Spiritflier said:
Hi Gary,

Sometimes I think it's far too easy to sit and criticise an image rather than simply accept that it's good work regardless of its flaws... This is one such image! It doesn't take much to deconstruct an image but compliments seem to be harder to give than criticism.

I think you've got a portrait here that the young lady in question would be more than happy with and if that's the case, so should you be. :)

She's a beautiful young lady and your shot has done her justice.

Cheers,
Si
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ianfulcher said:
Love it , her hair and her eyes override any possible niggles above. Beautiful, well done. I know this post is of no critical use but I love it.
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Thank you both very much, I'm looking forward to letting her see them.

Gary.
 
Gary I didn't read all the comments so sorry if I'm repeating anything.

I think it's a fabulous portrait with only really a couple of things wrong for me - although one is major.

1. The main issue is the arm and over exposure of the skin tone - The exposure although bright looks fine for the face but the arm just looks white and is too over exposed - there's almost no detail there at alll - reds are clipped way too much and the other channels are close to clipping.

I'm all for the high key look and whilst I love the image that arm detracts too much. THe only eare with close to any detail is the arm pit.......

2. The second issue is minor - the hair below her arm. Looks too blurred? Did you edit that?

I love your work and think this could have been a fabulous image but for the lack of detail and white skin. But as you say that's what you like so...... How did the client like it? I'd think she loved it!
 
EOS_JD said:
Gary I didn't read all the comments so sorry if I'm repeating anything.

I think it's a fabulous portrait with only really a couple of things wrong for me - although one is major.

1. The main issue is the arm and over exposure of the skin tone - The exposure although bright looks fine for the face but the arm just looks white and is too over exposed - there's almost no detail there at alll - reds are clipped way too much and the other channels are close to clipping.

I'm all for the high key look and whilst I love the image that arm detracts too much. THe only eare with close to any detail is the arm pit.......

2. The second issue is minor - the hair below her arm. Looks too blurred? Did you edit that?

I love your work and think this could have been a fabulous image but for the lack of detail and white skin. But as you say that's what you like so...... How did the client like it? I'd think she loved it!
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Cheers mate,

The arm is questionable and a lot of others have also raised issue with it (as I did myself in the OP)....

With regards to the hair, no editing, I may have shot this at f1.4 though, I can't remember.

She not seen yet, viewing later this week :)

Gary.
 
EdinburghGary said:
The bright skin.
As I have said in loads of threads now, I definitely prefer to shoot what I guess is close to over exposure. I like the look more than a more middle exposure, feels cleaner and more comtemporary. I could be off my rocker, feel free to tell me :)
Click to expand...

Gary, I looked at the image before I read the thread and my first impression was that it was maybe a 1/3 stop over exposed but then I read your thread. Clearly you meant to expose the image that much so it is technically what you wanted but MY preference would be for normal exposure.
 
Everyone knows by now I'm a skin tones freak, so I wont go there, but the biggest issue for me is that arm Gary, it's just blown - no detail in the armpit where there should be some modelling if you're going to show it. The arm just dominates the image - there's too much of it and it looks really awkward, which is a shame as she's a cracking model.

The bra strap showing is a minor niggle which could be fixed anyway, but there's no getting away from that arm.

It's all experience mate! ;)
 
Spiritflier said:
Hi Gary,

Sometimes I think it's far too easy to sit and criticise an image rather than simply accept that it's good work regardless of its flaws.
Click to expand...

Now you see, this is where I find myself getting confused - Gary asked for critique, there are things that can be improved on, so I guess I don't get the value in saying to him 'good work' when there are flaws that he could learn from so that he improves.

Is the critique section for praising each other then, have I misunderstood the nature of this part of the forum? :thinking:

I've started another thread on this topic - I need enlightening, being a blonde photographer of very little brain :p
 
ZoZo said:
Now you see, this is where I find myself getting confused - Gary asked for critique, there are things that can be improved on, so I guess I don't get the value in saying to him 'good work' when there are flaws that he could learn from so that he improves.

Is the critique section for praising each other then, have I misunderstood the nature of this part of the forum? :thinking:

I've started another thread on this topic - I need enlightening, being a blonde photographer of very little brain :p
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I know by asking for critique I will get a good dose of it, if people like what they see, then it's good to know that despite the flaws, it can still be pleasing. I have had extremely valuable crit in this thread, and for that I am very much appreciative.

Gary.
 
There's a lot that's good, but I find the arm too distracting. While the high key effect isn't something I've yet learned to fully appreciate, I can just see enough detail in her face to like it, but her arm is too big (from that angle) and too bright. I've got a pic of my wife in a similar pose (she was taking the mick of me and my camera) which I've compared your shot to, and I think your model bringing her elbow towards the camera a little would help reduce the width of her armpit area. That and reducing the exposure (on her arm) would help from my point of view.
EdinburghGary said:
With regards to the hair, no editing, I may have shot this at f1.4 though, I can't remember.
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I don't know about the hair down her back, it looks slightly foreign to the rest. I don't know if that's due to lighting or focus (or hairstyle). Doesn't look like the shot was at f1.4 on a full frame - what were your settings, body & lens?
 
Triggaaar said:
There's a lot that's good, but I find the arm too distracting. While the high key effect isn't something I've yet learned to fully appreciate, I can just see enough detail in her face to like it, but her arm is too big (from that angle) and too bright. I've got a pic of my wife in a similar pose (she was taking the mick of me and my camera) which I've compared your shot to, and I think your model bringing her elbow towards the camera a little would help reduce the width of her armpit area. That and reducing the exposure (on her arm) would help from my point of view.
I don't know about the hair down her back, it looks slightly foreign to the rest. I don't know if that's due to lighting or focus (or hairstyle). Doesn't look like the shot was at f1.4 on a full frame - what were your settings, body & lens?
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Cheers for feedback mate. 85mm, D3....F stop to be confirmed...
 
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