rain in the Sahara desert .. raises serious thinking

the black fox

the black fox

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Jeff
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a serious post from me for a change , been reading on the news over the last few days that scientists believe that installing WIND FARMS and SOLAR PANEL FARMS can increase surface disturbance and lead to higher than average rainfalls i.e rain in the Sahara desert . now this raises the question in my mind if it is expected to do it there ,where its not been installed yet what the hell is it doing to our climate where massive offshore and onshore wind farms have become the norm and theres a daily increase in solar panel installations and solar farms .
I'm not a scientist by any stretch of the imagination but you only need to be a certain age to realise that the weather patterns over the last twenty years have gone really abnormal . this obviously doesn't take in account global warming via greenhouse gases but are we as humans spreading the heat around by building fans hundreds of feet high . food for thought
 
Weather patterns will change and have changed naturally for millions of years. We've had an ice age, now it's getting hot and you can bet your bottom dollar that earth will see another ice age at some point.

These days nobody is happy. We burn fossil fuels and you upset somebody, you install wind turbines and upset the others. It's a lose lose situation. I say if turbines are spreading the heat, I'm all for it, this country could do with a bit more warmth but in all seriousness this sounds like a load of b*****ks. Even if it was true is it going to be any worse than burning tons of fossil fuels forever more (or until we run out)
 
Sounds like a variant of the "butterfly effect"???
 
It was on the bbc news earlier . Saw it somewhere else to
 
A link would be good, if you could please.

The reason I ask is because I agree that, on the face of it, it sounds like b****x, so I'd like to read more to make a better assessment.

Thanks
 
simon ess said:
A link would be good, if you could please.

The reason I ask is because I agree that, on the face of it, it sounds like b****x, so I'd like to read more to make a better assessment.

Thanks
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Yes, my thoughts exactly - sounds like the sort of fake news I'd plant if my economy depended on oil.
 
yep agree, sounds suspect, I suppose I can kind of, maybe see the windfarms disturbing, but solar farms? really, how?
 
Suvv said:
The BBC link gives more info. The proposed Sahara windfarm would cover 9 million km². That is about the size of the USA!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-45435593
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Right, so if we covered the Sahara with a US sized solar farm that would generate 4X the electricity we need, we could turn off all other power stations, stop worrying about power and it would rain a bit and this would largely be a good thing.

I say "what are we waiting for?".
 
JonathanRyan said:
I say "what are we waiting for?".
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100% agree.

All we need is for all the nations of the Sahara region to co-operate in a peaceful spirit of togetherness and for all extremists to recognise the needs of humanity as a whole.

Can't see a problem.

:D
 
Who knows but a big wind farm is removing a lot of energy from the atmosphere so it must have some effect and like most things there will be winners and loosers
 
sirch said:
Who knows but a big wind farm is removing a lot of energy from the atmosphere so it must have some effect and like most things there will be winners and loosers
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Or losers.
 
sirch said:
Who knows but a big wind farm is removing a lot of energy from the atmosphere.....
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No it isn't. It really isn't a "lot" of energy.
 
But what about all those tidal barrages? Where does the energy for them come from? The tides which are powered by the rotation of the moon. So when you take tidal power you are taking energy from the moon, which is hanging above the earth like a giant round sword of Damocles. Take enough energy and it will come crashing down and kill us all. These green power schemes just haven't been thought out!!! ;-)
 
simon ess said:
100% agree.

All we need is for all the nations of the Sahara region to co-operate in a peaceful spirit of togetherness and for all extremists to recognise the needs of humanity as a whole.

Can't see a problem.

:D
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One of the commenters on that BBC article observed that "This could be the richest region of the world if people let it be." Obviously that wouldn't be easy. But it would be interesting to compare the situation of the Saharan nations today, before the large scale development of their solar energy resources, with that of the Middle East say 100 years ago, before the large scale development of their oil resources. If it can be done in one region, why can't it be done in another?
 
StewartR said:
If it can be done in one region, why can't it be done in another?
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Well it can, absolutely.

I'm not sure though that we would accept the methods used then, together with the consequences that would follow in the modern world with the resources that opponents have now compared to what they had then.

It would take a series of lectures, or a book, to really explore your question but, put simply, the might of unfettered capitalism, supported by the firepower of the greatest empire in history vs desert tribes, compared to highly organised, well funded, well armed, media savvy, globally mobile, well supported hard men and nutters vs modern Western democracies.

Etc.
 
simon ess said:
100% agree.

All we need is for all the nations of the Sahara region to co-operate in a peaceful spirit of togetherness and for all extremists to recognise the needs of humanity as a whole.

Can't see a problem.

:D
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I think we'd probably need more solar cells than could be made with all the raw materials on this and several other planets an to employ 3X the world's population in keeping them clean. But those are just details for the foot soldiers. I say BUILD!
 
Well the major problem with Sahara is complete deforestation and erosion of soil. Once there is sand it is more or less game over regardless of rain. I am not sure if any work is being done to plant any forests or trees to stop the spread and then slowly recover the land but that should be #1 to do.

If you look at the same latitude on the southern hemisphere is Africa or South America the problem just isn't there or is not as bad. So clearly when the ecosystem is destroyed it leads to further issues such as no rainfall.
 
I'm thinking of applying for a grant of a few million to study the unbalancing effect that building large cities has on the rotational equilibrium of the Earth.

After all billions of tons of concrete and steel must have some effect.

Could be the start of whole new movement!:LOL:
.
 
LongLensPhotography said:
Well the major problem with Sahara is complete deforestation and erosion of soil. Once there is sand it is more or less game over regardless of rain. I am not sure if any work is being done to plant any forests or trees to stop the spread and then slowly recover the land but that should be #1 to do.

If you look at the same latitude on the southern hemisphere is Africa or South America the problem just isn't there or is not as bad. So clearly when the ecosystem is destroyed it leads to further issues such as no rainfall.
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The question that raises is have you ever actually been to the Sahara , personally I haven’t but I have been in desert areas in Egypt and I certainly wouldn’t call them sandy as in rolling sand dunes . Our common perception of a desert area is as usual media based and totally wrong with sufficient rainfall you can make the desert bloom again. As far as im aware most desert areas are rock and dust
 
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