Rapid Fixer

Barney

Barney

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Can anyone recommend me a rapid fixer, reason being is that the tank I used to develop my sheet of 4x5 uses up 1600ml of developer and fixer etc, I used nearly half a bottle of ilford to make a couple of ltr.

Is there a similar product that is more cost effective for bulkier use ?
 
Rapid fixer is usually taken to mean ammonium thiosulphate rather than sodium thiosulphate; it fixes in less time (say 90 secs not 10 minutes). This is a result of the chemical. The only way you can make up less solution is to use a rotary tank or a smaller one. Unless someone recommends a fixer that is diluted more...
 
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And I do assume that you are reusing fixer, not throwing after a single use? Some developers are single use; stop baths and fixers are not.
 
Thats the one Stephen, Rapid.

The illford I paid 25 quid for the ltr bottle and its 4+1

No doubt I will be wasting a lot, the dev tank I have holds 12 sheets of film, but at the moment using up 12 sheets is not realistic

Today I should have used my normal fomapan routine Ei 50 and 6.5 minutes 25-1, but its a new process and thought I should give myself more time. The hole for filling is quite small and I wasted a fair bit of fixer sloshing about, the developer I chucked.
 
I have two tanks. One I have never used (Jobo) which takes 1,500ml.
The Patterson tank with a MOD54 takes 1000ml and I believe the Stearman Press takes 475ml, so a third of where you are now. none of which take 12 sheet but that's not an issue if you aren't doing 12.

I did 2 in the MOD54 the other day. It takes up to 6 but I didn't plan on shooting any for a while and was keen to see what I had got.
 
Get a Stearman Press tank and junk the Yankee. And Ilford state that 5l of fixer will process 600 36exp films; I haven't checked that in 5x4 terms, but one rule of Thumb (Albert Thumb was a grammarian of Classical Greek, but his rule has nothing to do with photography) is that 1 36exp 35mm film is about equivalent to 4 5x4 sheets. So not expensive if you reuse and don't slosh it around. And Ilford reduce the capacity if you don't use an acid stop bath...
 
StephenM said:
Get a Stearman Press tank and junk the Yankee. And Ilford state that 5l of fixer will process 600 36exp films; I haven't checked that in 5x4 terms, but one rule of Thumb (Albert Thumb was a grammarian of Classical Greek, but his rule has nothing to do with photography) is that 1 36exp 35mm film is about equivalent to 4 5x4 sheets. So not expensive if you reuse and don't slosh it around. And Ilford reduce the capacity if you don't use an acid stop bath...
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Will do.

Four sheets is plenty, that would take me two days to shoot four films, and that would be bang at it non stop. :D

I use an acid stop bath but have been considering that I may be leaving it in there too long, are the any adverse effects possible from over stopping.
 
Are we talking about leaving film I the stop for 10 minutes, 10 hours, 10 days or 10 years?
 
StephenM said:
Are we talking about leaving film I the stop for 10 minutes, 10 hours, 10 days or 10 years?
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a couple of minutes maybe I read somehwere its all over in ten seconds but have not been brave enough to try that
 
It is, if the stop is efficient.

I'm tapping on a tablet, with letters getting changed and missed, and this will be long so I don't ho back and correct.

Putting the film from developer into waterstops newdeveloper from coming into play. Most developers requirealkalibeconditions, so acisstopbsthzstop them dead. Exceptfotprdevelper in the emulsion which stops when exhausted or thdavidgets to it.

Thdgixerremoves undeveloped silver, so that rwally does stop develoment permanently.

Many typos zi see, maycorrscttomorrow.
 
Generally you get about 10 rolls of film per litre of fixer (40 sheets) so what you made today will last another 28 sheets

I use adox 1 litre powder fixer, its really cheap and I buy in bulk from first call as it never goes off

Ilford have great films but their chemistry although very good is on the pricey side
 
P.s based on your chair pic first picture you can get away with a water stop bath. At such long dev times and dilutions most is probably exhausted and no need to stop the dev asap
 
Thanks for all your considered opinions and advice guys,

much appreciated and first pint is on me. :D
 
Barney said:
Will do.

Four sheets is plenty, that would take me two days to shoot four films, and that would be bang at it non stop. :D

I use an acid stop bath but have been considering that I may be leaving it in there too long, are the any adverse effects possible from over stopping.
Click to expand...

You definitely should not over fix with rapid fixer it will start to dissolve the silver image . You will lose shadow detail first.
 
I believe this is on point for the thread - Can rapid fixer simply be diluted more and the fixed for longer? I seem to recall using 1+9 rather than the bottle recommendation of 1+4 for ilford rapid fixer?

And further, what sort of fixing times are people using for 1+4 dilution fixing at 20C? I am currently fixing for around 4 minutes with 10s agitation, 10s stand (give or take).
 
Woodsy said:
I believe this is on point for the thread - Can rapid fixer simply be diluted more and the fixed for longer? I seem to recall using 1+9 rather than the bottle recommendation of 1+4 for ilford rapid fixer?

And further, what sort of fixing times are people using for 1+4 dilution fixing at 20C? I am currently fixing for around 4 minutes with 10s agitation, 10s stand (give or take).
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Yes, the bottle states 1+4 or 1+9. I usually do 1+4 and 4 minutes with 10s agitation then add 30 seconds every time I reuse until I get to around 6 minutes then bi and start again.
 
Woodsy said:
I believe this is on point for the thread - Can rapid fixer simply be diluted more and the fixed for longer? I seem to recall using 1+9 rather than the bottle recommendation of 1+4 for ilford rapid fixer?

And further, what sort of fixing times are people using for 1+4 dilution fixing at 20C? I am currently fixing for around 4 minutes with 10s agitation, 10s stand (give or take).
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Absolutely, however that removes the advantage or RAPID. So why not use standard fixer.
Dilution tends to be proportional to time double one double the other , that would be a reasonable starting point.
You will not cause any harm by looking, soon after the start of fixing the film is largely insensitive to light. If it has not cleared carry on.
The rule of thumb is that fixing time should be double the clearing time.

I have more than once refixed films that were found to have unclear areas when dried, with perfect negatives as a result.

Fixing is the process of removing the residual unexposed silver halide from the film,, it makes no difference,within reason, if it takes two steps to achieve this.
It only wastes your time, thee result is the same.

Rapid fixer does not do a better job than regular fixer, the difference is time not quality.
Many proprietary fixers have contained a mix of both sodium thiosulfate and ammonium thiosulfate, they all work equally well, they just have different fixing times.
Most have additions of allum to harden the gelatine, and sodium metabisulphide to acidify the solution (this neutralises any developer carry over)
 
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Agfa 304 Rapid Fixer

Water at 50°C(approx) 750ml
Sodium Thiosulphate 200g
Ammonium Chloride 50g
Potassium Metabisulphite 10g
Water to 1 litre

Sodium Thiosulphate is endothermic, which means that the solution cool significantly as it dissolves, hence the warm starting temperature.

Use FS for films, may be diluted 1+ 1 for paper.

Capacity approx 40 10x8 sheets Fibre based paper per Litre
Films approx 10 rolls of 35mm or 120. 40 sheets of 5x4, per litre

DON'T use Fixer after it has been used with film to fix paper.

The big bottle that fabric softener comes in are ideal for storing fixer, they have a wide top I think they are 2.5 litres,

At current prices this fixer works out under £2 per Litre.

Always use old undeveloped film, 35mm film leaders, to test the clearing time.

Ian
 
Woodsy said:
I believe this is on point for the thread - Can rapid fixer simply be diluted more and the fixed for longer? I seem to recall using 1+9 rather than the bottle recommendation of 1+4 for ilford rapid fixer?

And further, what sort of fixing times are people using for 1+4 dilution fixing at 20C? I am currently fixing for around 4 minutes with 10s agitation, 10s stand (give or take).
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I thought that the 1+9 was for paper.
 
Terrywoodenpic said:
You definitely should not over fix with rapid fixer it will start to dissolve the silver image . You will lose shadow detail first.
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Food for thought.
 
Barney said:
I thought that the 1+9 was for paper.
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There's a lot more silver halide in film than paper, per sq metre, so it is better to use at the stronger concentration for films.

Barney said:
Food for thought.
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With Warm tone papers in Rapid Fixers image bleaching is quite fast, 4 or 5 minutes that's in fairly fresh rapid fixer, the actual emulsions are very much finer grained compared to films.

As mentioned earlier the rule of thumb is fix for twice the clearing time.

Ian
 
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