Beginner Real World Back Button Focusing?

The AF sensitivity is what it is - the focus mode doesn't change it, at least with my Df tests..
Well since the AF sensor in the Df is abysmal to begin with - I have one too - it's hardly surprising you don't notice any difference. Quite why Nikon chose literally the worst performing AF sensor for the Df out of their parts bin is a mystery... according to Nikon it gives the user a more 'considered' approach to focusing. For 'considered' read 'slow and occasionally inaccurate'...
I found it so bad I bought a D750 to supplement it for some jobs after having 'downsized' from D3 and D3x back in 2015 (and the D3/D3x sensors weren't that fabulous either, compared to the D4 or D850).
Try something a bit higher up the food chain and the differences become quite obvious.
 
Well since the AF sensor in the Df is abysmal to begin with - I have one too - it's hardly surprising you don't notice any difference. Quite why Nikon chose literally the worst performing AF sensor for the Df out of their parts bin is a mystery... according to Nikon it gives the user a more 'considered' approach to focusing. For 'considered' read 'slow and occasionally inaccurate'...
I found it so bad I bought a D750 to supplement it for some jobs after having 'downsized' from D3 and D3x back in 2015 (and the D3/D3x sensors weren't that fabulous either, compared to the D4 or D850).
Try something a bit higher up the food chain and the differences become quite obvious.
If I ever find an actual need for AF I'll be sure to check the specs before buying my next camera. I'm 79, have cataracts and can't get the surgery due to medication for a separate issue, so that time may be soon!
 
If I ever find an actual need for AF I'll be sure to check the specs before buying my next camera. I'm 79, have cataracts and can't get the surgery due to medication for a separate issue, so that time may be soon!
I’m a bit of an old timer, I shot nearly 20 years with only manual focus.
And I’ll confirm that the time for AF is ‘always’, I’m pretty good at manually focussing a camera, and I’ve never had an AF camera that wasn’t at least twice as fast and accurate as me.
 
I’m a bit of an old timer, I shot nearly 20 years with only manual focus.
And I’ll confirm that the time for AF is ‘always’, I’m pretty good at manually focussing a camera, and I’ve never had an AF camera that wasn’t at least twice as fast and accurate as me.
I have! Actually, I think it was a particular lens that was front focussing, but just saying. ;)
 
I’m a bit of an old timer, I shot nearly 20 years with only manual focus.
And I’ll confirm that the time for AF is ‘always’, I’m pretty good at manually focussing a camera, and I’ve never had an AF camera that wasn’t at least twice as fast and accurate as me.
One opinion is as valid as another.
 
One opinion is as valid as another.
Actually it isn't. It's literally the opposite. While I would value - or at least consider - the opinions of those who can demonstrate a knowledge and experience of photographic technique, I won't do the same for some random who picked up a camera yesterday.
 
One opinion is as valid as another.

Actually it isn't. It's literally the opposite. While I would value - or at least consider - the opinions of those who can demonstrate a knowledge and experience of photographic technique, I won't do the same for some random who picked up a camera yesterday.

Today I've experienced the two extremes while out with some film camera enthusiast friends:

Firstly using a 1950s folding 120 roll film camera - measuring the distance from subject to camera with a rangefinder, manually setting the focal distance on the camera's lens (together with the shutter speed and aperture after taking a hand-held light meter reading) and finally taking the shot.

Then using one of Canon's last 35mm SLR film cameras featuring eye-controlled AF point selection - you just look at the AF point in the viewfinder to select it (the camera instantly tracks where your eye is looking), then take the shot.

So from the ridiculous to the sublime! Yes, both these cameras are capable of taking some very nice photos, but I know which one of the two is quicker, easier and therefore more efficient. So which of my cameras was the most enjoyable to use today? They both were... but then again, today was all about having photographic fun rather than having to reliably deliver saleable photographs to a client as soon as possible. So I think it's very much a case of horses for courses.
 
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Today I've experienced the two extremes while out with some film camera enthusiast friends:

Firstly using a 1950s folding 120 roll film camera - measuring the distance from subject to camera with a rangefinder, manually setting the focal distance on the camera's lens (together with the shutter speed and aperture after taking a hand-held light meter reading) and finally taking the shot.

Then using one of Canon's last 35mm SLR film cameras featuring eye-controlled AF point selection - you just look at the AF point in the viewfinder to select it (the camera tracks where your eye is looking), then take the shot.

So from the ridiculous to the sublime! Yes, both these cameras are capable of taking some very nice photos, but I know which one of the two is quicker, easier and therefore more efficient. So which of my cameras was the most enjoyable to use today? They both were... but then again, today was all about having photographic fun rather than having to reliably deliver saleable photographs to a client as soon as possible. So I think it's very much a case of horses for courses.
That's not really about respecting or giving equal weight to the opinions of people who are ignorant of the subject under discussion though...
 
I shall continue to enjoy my photography my way, and ignore the trolls.
Edit: I would hope everyone else is like-minded, and respect each other.
 
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That's not really about respecting or giving equal weight to the opinions of people who are ignorant of the subject under discussion though...
No, but that doesn't stop it being factually correct, regardless of personal opinion. TBH, I find personal opinion on most forums is often worth pretty much what you've paid for it! ;)
 
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I shall continue to enjoy my photography my way, and ignore the trolls.
Who's trolling? This started as a discussion about back focusing... You stated you couldn't tell the difference, but then went on to admit that you don't consider AF to be important to you personally and that furthermore, you use a camera with possibly the worst-performing AF module on the market today. Your experience in the matter is therefore not as relevant to the conversation as those who use the technique often and with multiple platforms...
 
When using BBF does it make a difference if you use AF servo or AF single given the camera continually focuses if the button is kept pressed?
 
When using BBF does it make a difference if you use AF servo or AF single given the camera continually focuses if the button is kept pressed?
The difference (for me) is the ability to stop AF quickly when needed. Birdcage veils or a face through harp strings are two examples that come up often for me
 
The difference (for me) is the ability to stop AF quickly when needed. Birdcage veils or a face through harp strings are two examples that come up often for me
Thanks, do you therefore use AF servo or the equivalent on your camera?
 
I have mine now setup for both shutter button focus as AF-S, for static stuff.
Then the back button is set to AF-C with eye tracking.
It means it's always set to landscape mode, but by using the back button it will focus on people and or track the subject especially useful for the children running around.
Best of both worlds.
 
I have mine now setup for both shutter button focus as AF-S, for static stuff.
Then the back button is set to AF-C with eye tracking.
It means it's always set to landscape mode, but by using the back button it will focus on people and or track the subject especially useful for the children running around.
Best of both worlds.
How doesn’t the AF kick in on the shutter button whilst you’re mid AFC on the back button? I can’t think how you’d press the shutter without it going past the half press point :thinking:
 
How doesn’t the AF kick in on the shutter button whilst you’re mid AFC on the back button? I can’t think how you’d press the shutter without it going past the half press point :thinking:
Just doesn't, the back button just over rides the shutter button and when in use the shutter button is only a shutter button.
 
I shall continue to enjoy my photography my way, and ignore the trolls.
Edit: I would hope everyone else is like-minded, and respect each other.
Can you clear something up please.
Are you maually focusing a digitla camera? If so what camera and lens? and have you compared your manual focus to autofocus hit rate?
 
Can you clear something up please.
Are you manually focusing a digital camera? If so what camera and lens? and have you compared your manual focus to autofocus hit rate?
For most of my digital work I use a Nikon Df. My most used lens is a 55 f/1.4 Zeiss Otus. Others that get a lot of use are three Micro-Nikkors - 55 f/3.5 Ai, 105 f/4.0 Ai and 200 f/4.0 AiS - an 85 f/1.4 Otus and a 50 f/2.8 Schneider PC/TS. I have too many other cameras and lenses to list here.
For my shutter release AF vs BBF comparison, I used the Df and an AF Nikkor 80-200 f/2.8D ED (2-ring.) I was not concerned with performance per se, only the difference between the two methods. All I can say about the hit rate is that nearly every test shot was well focused.
 
Can you clear something up please.
Are you manually focusing a digital camera? If so what camera and lens? and have you compared your manual focus to autofocus hit rate?
Had I known that you had no purpose in asking the question, I would not have wasted my time answering!
 
I have been using BBF for the last 10 yearsI find it is easier for me to use as I am disabled. But its not everyones cup of tea.
 
I don't use BBF, never have, half pressing the shutter button to track birds in flight seems to work fine for me.

Reading through this thread makes me think how I've ever managed, I have to wonder what I might've achieved if I could have only 'got the hang of it' ;)
I tested BBF and realised (for my purposes) it's pointless.
It seems more like a fad or an internet trend, or a "cool and down with the kids thing" more than anything else.
It is apparent however, the guy who coined the technique, has set himself up as an all knowing aficionado regarding all things AF.

As others have said (and I agree with), it really is down to what works for you.
 
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I can't honestly remember not using BBF on a DSLR. To try to explain why I like it is like asking why I'd walk in a straight line or step off on my left foot or tie my shoelaces in a certain way (ie not together!)
 
Just to add a variation. As I indicated in an earlier post, I set BBF for my Canon 5D4; one button single spot AF and one for multi-spot and tracking. This still works well for me though I do not often use my DSLR now. I have used my Sony A6600 ML for 12 months now and did not set up BBF but have been impressed with its fast focussing and tracking. So much so, I am inclined to leave it as it is. Whatever anyone chooses, it needs to suit the camera, the photographer and the way they work. In the end, it is what gets the best results for you.

Dave
 
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