Shenanigans at the SWPP

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I haven't looked at this thread for a week, and was quite surprised to see it still steaming along at a steady rate.. Has it broken a page count record yet?

Happy Christmas a New Year to all by the way.:)
 
I am hoping that there will be more of you out there on this forum and elsewhere that would consider coming to the H4H events on January 16th. The events are to be held at the Brook Green Hotel in Hammersmith and within easy reach of the Novotel where the SWPP Convention is taking place. This is far from a 'spoiler' but an enhancement as the SWPP have no party on the Saturday night. Please try to support us and contact me at mgrahamedunn@mac.com
Many thanks in anticipation,
Martin
 
While I agree wholeheartedly with Dave's right to defend what he feels to be an organisation that is beneficial to him I wish you would get off the "libelous" mode. If you are a solicitor and are qualified to comment from a position of expertise then fine but if not FFS drop it as it's getting boring.

I'm pleased you feel that the SWPP works for you Dave but I had been contemplating it a couple of months ago and decided to delay my decision. Glad now that I did!
 
Sorry for appearing to disappear, been laid up in bed since Xmas eve with pneumonia.

Not nice, not nice at all, wouldn't recommend it to anyone! :)

I've only popped on to wish everyone a Happy New Year and I hope everyone, both SWPP Members and Non Members alike have a great one!

Watch this space for some interesting developments that has the potential to leave some serious egg on SWPP Management faces. I have been asked to hold off publicising the "event" by a friend and their solicitor until such time as paperwork has been finalised.

As soon as I am able to do so, I'll let you know what has happened.

Until then, have a GREAT New Year everyone!
 
MarkyP said:
Sorry for appearing to disappear, been laid up in bed since Xmas eve with pneumonia.

Not nice, not nice at all, wouldn't recommend it to anyone! :)

I've only popped on to wish everyone a Happy New Year and I hope everyone, both SWPP Members and Non Members alike have a great one!

Watch this space for some interesting developments that has the potential to leave some serious egg on SWPP Management faces. I have been asked to hold off publicising the "event" by a friend and their solicitor until such time as paperwork has been finalised.

As soon as I am able to do so, I'll let you know what has happened.

Until then, have a GREAT New Year everyone!
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Happy New Year to you Mark. I had pneumonia once as you say not nice.

God bless
Dave
 
mike weeks said:
Mark,

not had it myself and hope you are over the worst and that the new year brings what you want. For me a visit to my solicitor, my action against the Jones family starts. They were given due notice and have chosen to ignore it, their choice but it will cost them - dearly I hope.

Mike
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It could end up costing evryone, except of course the solicitors.

I do hope this comes to a swift and peaceful end.

God bless
Dave
 
Dave,

I dont care what it costs, what I want is to have my rights respected. You may be in love with the SWPP and its management but I have seen the other side of the Jones family and how they treat people. Yes there are obnoxious and annoying people amongst the SWPP membership that use the forum but there are also many helpful and friendly members - with them I have no issue, in fact they have my sympathy because one day many of them will find out just how the Jones family can treat you.

Personally the longer it takes and the more embarrasment I have to cause them the better, because every time I read that somebody else has decided not to join or renew their membership that is another 99 celebrations that I have and I will do my utmost to have many more until such time as they do what is required - the choice is with them and they have been made aware of it.

Mike
 
mike weeks said:
Dave,

I dont care what it costs, what I want is to have my rights respected. You may be in love with the SWPP and its management but I have seen the other side of the Jones family and how they treat people. Yes there are obnoxious and annoying people amongst the SWPP membership that use the forum but there are also many helpful and friendly members - with them I have no issue, in fact they have my sympathy because one day many of them will find out just how the Jones family can treat you.

Personally the longer it takes and the more embarrasment I have to cause them the better, because every time I read that somebody else has decided not to join or renew their membership that is another 99 celebrations that I have and I will do my utmost to have many more until such time as they do what is required - the choice is with them and they have been made aware of it.

Mike
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Hi Mike

I would like to respond in a considered manner and will do so later. But for now, I would like to wish you and everyone else on this thread a very happy and blessed New Year.


God bless
Dave
 
Dave Routledge said:
I would like to respond in a considered manner and will do so later. But for now, I would like to wish you and everyone else on this thread a very happy and blessed New Year.
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Dave,

What is the point in quoting someone's entire message and then adding nothing other than a comment that you will comment again later? Can you not contain your enthusiasm until such times as you've managed to put together a coherent reply, rather than just repeating yourself wishing everyone a happy new year?

It will be interesting to see how these varied courses of legal action against the SWPP progress. I wish the litigants the best of luck. I look forward to seeing old swampy get a taste of its own medicine.


Simon
 
Dave Routledge said:
Hi Mike

I would like to respond in a considered manner and will do so later. But for now, I would like to wish you and everyone else on this thread a very happy and blessed New Year.
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Dave,

sorry are you replying on behalf of the Jones family now? As you are not aware of what action is to be taken and over what matter then there is nothing for you to reply to. There is far more being prepared and if it all comes to fruition there are interesting times ahead.

Mike
 
can we keep this thread on track please, talk of legal mumbo jumbo and litigation etc is of real concern to anyone except Mike and the lawyers.
 
I have just had my renewal notice for the SWPP, £198 for both me and Julie; fortunately they have not charged for additional membership of SISEP.
Now for some time I have been questioning what if any benefit we gain from membership. One of our original reasons for joining was for the Partner Societies in particular SISEP and SIFGP as we do very little in the way of weddings.
However in over 12 months nothing has happened to either of these 'Societies' in reality they might as well not exist other than giving the opportunity for a small few to add yet an other 'L', 'A' or 'F' after their name.
With regard to Event Photography Mike Week's EPS has offered me more than SISEP ever will.
I have sourced all my training outside of SWPP and as far as I am concerned received better value; and as far as the forum is concerned I have some serious doubts about its intention and management.
I have witnessed many debacles where disagreement and open discussion have been stamped on not only by the management but by so called 'hero' members.
I have noticed many threads started asking open questions that although they have been viewed many times are just not answered by anybody.
What is worse is the number of ex-members (resigned, booted out, any other reason) who are only that because they questioned the organisation with a view to improvement. MGD questioned the training, MP questioned the judging of awards, MW tried to improve the Partner Societies, ZR questioned the competition rules - I am sure there are many others but as posts relating to dissent disappear I would not know.

TP is a more balanced and helpful Photographic Forum; the EPS forum is the definitive forum for Eventers.

BTW I dont really need 2 copies of their Mag lying around the house never read because there is little of interest in them. Whereas I look forward to our 1 copy of f2 landing on the mat.

I will be going to the SWPP Trade Show(only) because it is good but I will be visiting the BIPP stand.

Having put pen to paper (so to speak) I have answered my own question about whether £198 per year is of any value to us as photographers or only of value to the owners of SWPP.

Ian
 
Question

How many bookings a year can any members directly attribute to being a member of the SWPP or MPA or BIPP
 
Captain Morgan said:
I have just had my renewal notice for the SWPP, £198 for both me and Julie; fortunately they have not charged for additional membership of SISEP.
Now for some time I have been questioning what if any benefit we gain from membership. One of our original reasons for joining was for the Partner Societies in particular SISEP and SIFGP as we do very little in the way of weddings.
However in over 12 months nothing has happened to either of these 'Societies' in reality they might as well not exist other than giving the opportunity for a small few to add yet an other 'L', 'A' or 'F' after their name.
With regard to Event Photography Mike Week's EPS has offered me more than SISEP ever will.
I have sourced all my training outside of SWPP and as far as I am concerned received better value; and as far as the forum is concerned I have some serious doubts about its intention and management.
I have witnessed many debacles where disagreement and open discussion have been stamped on not only by the management but by so called 'hero' members.
I have noticed many threads started asking open questions that although they have been viewed many times are just not answered by anybody.
What is worse is the number of ex-members (resigned, booted out, any other reason) who are only that because they questioned the organisation with a view to improvement. MGD questioned the training, MP questioned the judging of awards, MW tried to improve the Partner Societies, ZR questioned the competition rules - I am sure there are many others but as posts relating to dissent disappear I would not know.

TP is a more balanced and helpful Photographic Forum; the EPS forum is the definitive forum for Eventers.

BTW I dont really need 2 copies of their Mag lying around the house never read because there is little of interest in them. Whereas I look forward to our 1 copy of f2 landing on the mat.

I will be going to the SWPP Trade Show(only) because it is good but I will be visiting the BIPP stand.

Having put pen to paper (so to speak) I have answered my own question about whether £198 per year is of any value to us as photographers or only of value to the owners of SWPP.

Ian
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Ian,

Were you not aware that you get a second Member discount? You pay the first £99 then the second membership is £69.00

Guess the SWPP kind of forgot to tell you that little bit of information huh?

https://swpp.co.uk/secure/join.htm

Click the drop down menu and look what's 3rd option down!
 
Hi Everyone

I intend this to be my last post on this thread. I am finding it difficult to express my thoughts without them being misunderstood. Simon, how about wishing me happy new year instead of pointing out that I had already wished everyone a happy new year in a previous post (which I forgotten about)? Mike I do not represent the Jones family, I do not know not them and am not in contact with them regarding this thread. I was not going to comment upon the deatils of your legal actions, merely my concern that by taking any at all you could be storing up for yourself a course of action that could be very costly in terms of emotions and finances. There does seem to be an element of vindictiveness and bitterness in SOME of the posts about the SWPP. I think it sad that anyone would appear to take delight in its downfall, even if the SWPP are severely damaged, it will not bring a sense of lasting peace to those who wish to see that happen, in the same way that forgiveness and grace would. No one will really win other that the solicitors. If I am wrong about the apparent motives of some, then I apologise in advance.

I pray that no one is damaged or hurt by this and that in the end The SWPP mangemnet team, the Jones family, its members and its ex members will all go on to contribute their own part in making photography a beautiful expression and record of our wonderful world and the life that exists within in.

I apologise unreseverdly if I have offended anyone, in any way with any of the comments I have made here. I wish everyone every blessing and I hope that we become friends in the course of other threads. I mean no harm here, I never have done, I simply wanted to bring some balance to a thread that had it's origin in wanting to caution people against joining the SWPP

Although I do not intend to comment any more on this thread, I will respond to any personal messages, should anyone wish to send one.


God bless
Dave
 
Richard King said:
Question

How many bookings a year can any members directly attribute to being a member of the SWPP or MPA or BIPP
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Its difficult to say, but 4 have come through the SWPP website to firm bookings in the last 2 years, but to my mind membership isn't about those bookings - they're a nice bonus, but if you wanted to talk about value for money I get more then my £99 in discounts alone.

For the record, I chose not to advertise being a member of the SWPP on my own site. If I continue with membership is a subject I'm currently considering
 
MarkyP said:
Ian,

Were you not aware that you get a second Member discount? You pay the first £99 then the second membership is £69.00

Guess the SWPP kind of forgot to tell you that little bit of information huh?

https://swpp.co.uk/secure/join.htm

Click the drop down menu and look what's 3rd option down!
Click to expand...

Well they kept that quiet despite both renewal notices arriving in the same envelope. So they had £30 OTT last year and want the same again this year.

Re Bookings - not a single one. We did get one enquiry in the first month of membersip from one couple who basically wanted Pornographic pictures taken which we refused.

Ian
 
Dave Routledge said:
There does seem to be an element of vindictiveness and bitterness in SOME of the posts about the SWPP. I think it sad that anyone would appear to take delight in its downfall, even if the SWPP are severely damaged, it will not bring a sense of lasting peace to those who wish to see that happen, in the same way that forgiveness and grace would.
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The same could be said about a well known photographic organisation that make late-night abusive phone calls and also attempts to sue customers who do not give three months written notice of intention not to renew.

Given the apparent corrupt nature of management of the organisation and the way in which it appears to condone the cheating carried out by certain high-profile members: is it really any wonder that those disaffected members would see great delight in this flawed, fossilised organisation failing?

Simon
 
Have they changed the rules regarding the 3 months notice?

"3. RULES of MEMBERSHIP.
(a) Membership of the society shall be open to persons who are engaged in the full time photography, or are aspiring photographers, or as shall be accepted into membership by the secretary of ‘SOCIETY’.
(b) A member may withdraw from the ‘SOCIETY’ by giving clear notice in writing prior to the next annual subscriptions falling due, to the secretary, such notice shall not be deemed to have been received unless posted by recorded delivery or receipt is acknowledge by the secretary in writing. On expiry of such notice such members shall forfeit all benefits and interest in the ‘SOCIETY’ as from that date, but shall be liable for any unsatisfied dues or commitments towards the ‘SOCIETY’ including full memberships fees for the year in which the resignation becomes effective.
(c) All members agree to abide by the Rules and Code of conduct of the ‘SOCIETY’."
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3 (b) above only mentions clear notice now? Not a specific period.

ian
 
Captain Morgan said:
Have they changed the rules regarding the 3 months notice?

3 (b) above only mentions clear notice now? Not a specific period.

ian
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Hi Ian,

The SWPP used to enforce a three month's notice period when their customers tried to leave. Here's the thread: http://www.ecademy.com/module.php?mod=club&t=1021326

The long and the short of it is: the SWPP lost the case. Despite losing, Phil Jones still threatened legal action against websites that published news of the case. It makes interesting reading here: http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/stuff/?p=179

Simon
 
...and there I was thinking this had died a death...................
 
Looks like another person has just resigned from the SWPP. Shame really, the SWPP really are not doing themselves any favours at the moment when with a little communication and listening they could not only retain members but increase the membership.

I for one am truly saddened.

Hope someone in Rhyl finally sits up and listens as the SWPP can be so much better and bigger than it is.
 
This is all getting very sad now. I think it is a great shame that SWPP don't deal with this situation in a better way, for the benefit of those who are members of the organisation.
 
Wildsnaps said:
To their credit, at least swampy haven't deleted the thread. It was interesting to see that Dave Routledge makes pointless parable posts over there too. ;)

Simon
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Care to elaborate simon? as I have abosolutaly no voice or ability to see what happens within the society but they are more then happy to keep my money and leave a link from their site to mine,

How Utterly Graciously Kind Of Them! :bang:

Oh and for those that have read my statement at:
http://www.barrydawsonphotography.co.uk/swpp.html

the bottom line where I have received no reply "as yet"

I can see I will not be amending that line any time soon!
 
I am surprised that they haven't taken off the hot link to this site. It would seem that the responses on the SWPP forum thread have been more recently defending the society, and some mentions of the Help for Heroes gig - which would appear to be diffusing the original start up thread.

This is what I mean, it is the poor way that the Society is dealing with the general problem. There are enough guys out there that want the SWPP to do well, and I am sure that there would be a greater respect if the management took the bull by the horns- even more so , as it is so close to their convention.
 
MARK AMIES said:
I am surprised that they haven't taken off the hot link to this site. It would seem that the responses on the SWPP forum thread have been more recently defending the society, and some mentions of the Help for Heroes gig - which would appear to be diffusing the original start up thread.

This is what I mean, it is the poor way that the Society is dealing with the general problem. There are enough guys out there that want the SWPP to do well, and I am sure that there would be a greater respect if the management took the bull by the horns- even more so , as it is so close to their convention.
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But they have no intention to improve :shake:
And they never will so long as they think they are invincible!

they keep getting cocky, and will keep doing so, each time doing something different that will tip another bunch of people over the edge and push them to leave.

and why should they be worried about people leaving? there advertising consisting mostly of fairy tails and pixie dust was enough to fool us into signing up in the first place and will keep people signing up and receiving the same poor service.

The only way that we as members or ex members can actually get them to listen, or make them back step enough to think they should improve involves, like now fighting them on an even and public playing field.

because while your in the society, you have no voice! your in their back yard and they can do what ever they god damn like to you :bat:, and the gates are locked so you cant escape!
 
Barry, just to let you know , that Mr Jones has given a response which is as close as I can see to 'dealing ' with the comments made so far. Wether or not it is going to help remains to be seen.

It is though ,some acknowledegement.
 
BarryDawsib said:
Care to elaborate simon? as I have abosolutaly no voice or ability to see what happens within the society but they are more then happy to keep my money and leave a link from their site to mine,
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Barry, it just goes to show a complete lack of standards on their behalf. Clearly they don't have a set of standard processes in place do deal with dissatisfied customers. When I resigned on the forum, they deleted my thread and revoked my posting permissions on their forum, although I can still read the drivel that is posted therein. You on the other hand, have been banished from the forum, but your thread remains in tact. Nothing like standards! :suspect:

To bring you up to date on what's happening over there, one member has said "Well what do you expect for £99? After all, you get the magazine, access to the forum and the convention is brilliant." There was me thinking that I would have to pay extra for the "brilliant" convention and that it isn't included in my membership fee:bonk:

Of course, the usual bunch of sycophants piped up saying "well said" - I will leave it to your imagination to work out who it was.

Dave Routledge then posted some pointless ramble about a man on a desert island who formed his own photographic club before he was rescued. He didn't indicate in his yarn if this stranded photographer tendered his resignation before he was rescued....

Simon
 
MARK AMIES said:
Barry, just to let you know , that Mr Jones has given a response which is as close as I can see to 'dealing ' with the comments made so far. Wether or not it is going to help remains to be seen.

It is though ,some acknowledegement.
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Beyond where I can see it naturally!
 
I am sure you will find out, for what it is worth. Fairly glib response to be honest, but that is the usual corporate approach.
 
MARK AMIES said:
Tell 'em about the 'Sheeple' Simon!!
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Sounds like you've developed a lisp Mark and you are trying to insult me and there's not a pie man to be seen anywhere!! :'(

Apparently Mr P Jones Esq feels sorry for his genuine customers for he fears that they are being duped by by eloquent posters who appear to be friendly and then turn against them.

I was one of these "genuine" customers and everything was fine until I asked the question on the forum "does the swpp sell its membership details?" at which point I was lynched. It wasn't an accusation, it was a simple question and yet certain "hero" members waded in like soldier ants, defending their Queen.

Simon
 
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