Some advice for a noob please

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sr666

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Hi there I'm hoping that someone could be able to help me if possible

I've been into photography for a few years now but never really understood it all. Anyways I bought a D3000 and having just looked on the Ken Rockwell site it appears that the camera's not too good at all.

I understand it's a camera with a crop sensor which I understand means it only captures part of an image compared to a full frame?

Anyways I've been trying to take pictures of mine and friends cars with varying amounts of success as the pictures will show (these are my best shots I think but compared to others on here they're awful)

The 3rd pic was only a quick snapshot wasn't majorly thought out but came out better than some of my others







I'm looking into getting another camera lens but I don't really know what I'm looking for so any help would be appreciated. I'm on a reasonably tight budget so I've been looking into the Nikon 35mm 1.8 lens so if anyone has used it I'd be happy to hear?

My pics seem to be coming out quite flat and I'm wondering if a faster lens would help at all?

My kit contains a

D3000,
18-55mm kit lens,
Tripod,
CPL Filter,
Fluorescent filter,
Lens Hood

Any advice / tips gratefully received

Thanks

Ryan
 
Firstly, Ken Rockwell is a wa..... You gear is capable of producing great pictures.

You do need to learn a little about the technical side of photography, but what you need to also understand, is that you take photos of what you point the camera at*.

It sounds so obvious, but think about it, what's the first phot of? A car and some bushes. What did you want a photograph of? A car.

So the 1st issue is to set up the shot somewhere that looks genuinely good, then you need to consider the lighting and reflections. Because ugly shaped light patterns will spoil your car photos.

I'd suggest light painting if you're on a budget.

Just noticed the question at the end, your photos are flat because they're shot in flat light, you can do a little in pp to boost contrast etc, but you need to learn to 'see' the light, light direction and quality directly creates shadow quality, shadows create form.

*classic beginner mistake, we have tunnel vision, and point the camera at a 'subject' rather than looking at the whole frame to see what we're capturing.
 
Another lens wont really help in this case and you will just be even more frustrated. firstly there is nothing wrong with the camera the D3000 is more than capable of producing much better shots than you are seeing here, same with the kit lens i.e. not stellar quality but more than capable.

What you need to learn is how to expose your shots properly (How to use the light) this is the most important thing of all. Its generally the reason for a "Flat" shot.

Then learn all about your lens and the different effect of focal length and depth of field on any particular shot.

Watch your backgrounds.

A good understanding of DoF and where in the shot to set your focus point will transform your shots.

Get familiar with your camera controls and the relationship between what you set your lens at (Aperture Value) and its corresponding shutter speed (Time Value).

Have a look at other peoples shots and study the composition of there work. Question it, "That shot looks brilliant" - WHY? What stands out ? How is the subject lit ? etc etc.

Use your Tripod where possible.

No one can answer you fully in a short post and others will come on and add even more insight, you just have to take on board as much as you can and have patience and above all, fun. Dont get down, we were all c**p at one time or another and some days I look at my shots and realise I still can be. :bang:


Okay and while I was typing this Phil has come in and given you good advice too. See! you're ahead already.
 
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Ok cheers. I'm only just starting to get into the world of photography. Could someone point me in the direction please of where I can find an explanation as to DoF as that's something I read about a lot.

Light painting is that the technique where you set a long shutter speed and shine a torch or similar behind the car to create patterns?

I'm planning on going to the New Forest next week with a few friends so I'll hopefully be able to try some new things there. I've had a look into a chap called Karl Taylor's website and I think I've picked up a few tips there but nowhere seems to specifically cater for explaining car photography if that makes sense :(

I'll take my tripod too. Is it the case that I need to turn VR off as the camera will compensate for something that isn't there or is that a myth please?

Phil V a very noob question but what is PP please that you mentioned? I'm thinking it's a photo editing program but I'm likely miles off

Thanks for the replies it's appreciated I'll be off to browse the internet for some more examples of what I want to achieve although I suspect a lot of the pics will be with far more expensive equipment / studio lighting etc
 
Rule of photography number 1: dont out listen to a thing Ken Rockwell says


Rule of photography number 2: see number 1


Nothing wrong other the gear, its the person using it. Spend the time to learn the camera, learn about exposure, metering and lighting, and learn about composition.

As mentioned, photography is more than pointing a camera at something and clicking.

Its about understanding the environment, understanding what you want to achieve and how you are going to go about it.

I suggest you do some reading, use youtube, whatever works for you and learn how aperture, ISO and shutter speed interact and when its necessary to change them. Once you got that, do the same about composition.

Hopefully in a few weeks you will have some more understanding and your pictures will improve.

Edit..

PP is post processing.. Not a program, just the process of editing

Don't even consider light painting until you have the basics of exposure, you'll be in for a world of hurt if you start trying to do stuff like that

Loads of info on here about DOF, also lots on youtube..

This might help

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUbjkMm_v-A

Also on that channel are lots of videos about using the nikon d3100. Some of it will also be relevant for the d3100, so might be worth a watch.
 
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sr666 said:
Ok cheers. I'm only just starting to get into the world of photography. Could someone point me in the direction please of where I can find an explanation as to DoF as that's something I read about a lot.

Light painting is that the technique where you set a long shutter speed and shine a torch or similar behind the car to create patterns?

I'm planning on going to the New Forest next week with a few friends so I'll hopefully be able to try some new things there. I've had a look into a chap called Karl Taylor's website and I think I've picked up a few tips there but nowhere seems to specifically cater for explaining car photography if that makes sense :(

I'll take my tripod too. Is it the case that I need to turn VR off as the camera will compensate for something that isn't there or is that a myth please?

Phil V a very noob question but what is PP please that you mentioned? I'm thinking it's a photo editing program but I'm likely miles off

Thanks for the replies it's appreciated I'll be off to browse the internet for some more examples of what I want to achieve although I suspect a lot of the pics will be with far more expensive equipment / studio lighting etc
Click to expand...


You are spot on, its short for POst Processing, or editing afterwards in a program. A whole range available from freebies like Picassa and Gimp to the full blown expensive kit like Photoshop and a plethora of options in between.
 
sr666 said:
I'm planning on going to the New Forest next week with a few friends so I'll hopefully be able to try some new things there. I've had a look into a chap called Karl Taylor's website and I think I've picked up a few tips there but nowhere seems to specifically cater for explaining car photography if that makes sense :(
...

Phil V a very noob question but what is PP please that you mentioned? I'm thinking it's a photo editing program but I'm likely miles off ...
Click to expand...

Try here for starters (y)

PP is post processing, not any specific program but the help you can give your photos with software. Learn to shoot first though;)
 
sr666 said:
Thanks for the replies it's appreciated I'll be off to browse the internet for some more examples of what I want to achieve although I suspect a lot of the pics will be with far more expensive equipment / studio lighting etc
Click to expand...

Huge misconception, don't get all hung up on your gear or other peoples, go do what we have said and your shots will speak for themselves.

PP is Post Processing BTW. i.e. photoshop, lightroom, Picasa etc etc.
 
I've been on the Ken Rockwell site too. I used to think he was O.K. until I read his advice that you never need to shoot in RAW format. Now I hear he says that a D3000 is "not too good at all" and, as a result, I am well on the way to forming the opinion that he is, well, erm... a bit of a twit (feel free to replace that last vowel if you wish).

Photography is like many other activities : learn the basics first and the advanced stuff will be so much easier to learn. Your camera is fine. For the time being it is all you need.

Practise makes perfect. Enjoy it as well.
 
As others have said, the gear is fine. I found myself shooting a wedding with a D3000 last month & it produced some very good pictures.
 
sr666 said:
Thanks guys I'm off browsing. Back later :D

Thanks again :)
Click to expand...

Good advice above (y) Excellent tutorial here on the basics of camera control, by Pookeyhead http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=440126

I'll just add, taking statics of cars looks like the easiest job in the world, but getting good pictures is much harder - especially black ones!

Good location, good light, good reflections, and preferably not black ;) Then usually a bit of time in post processing to tidy things up.
 
sr666 said:
Hi there I'm hoping that someone could be able to help me if possible

I've been into photography for a few years now but never really understood it all. Anyways I bought a D3000 and having just looked on the Ken Rockwell site it appears that the camera's not too good at all.

I understand it's a camera with a crop sensor which I understand means it only captures part of an image compared to a full frame?

Anyways I've been trying to take pictures of mine and friends cars with varying amounts of success as the pictures will show (these are my best shots I think but compared to others on here they're awful)

The 3rd pic was only a quick snapshot wasn't majorly thought out but came out better than some of my others







I'm looking into getting another camera lens but I don't really know what I'm looking for so any help would be appreciated. I'm on a reasonably tight budget so I've been looking into the Nikon 35mm 1.8 lens so if anyone has used it I'd be happy to hear?

My pics seem to be coming out quite flat and I'm wondering if a faster lens would help at all?

My kit contains a

D3000,
18-55mm kit lens,
Tripod,
CPL Filter,
Fluorescent filter,
Lens Hood

Any advice / tips gratefully received

Thanks

Ryan
Click to expand...


im sorry to say this mate but the camera isnt the issue its as always the person behind it. 1st off most camera are crop sensor unless your spending 1000's.

i would say check your settings are correct. dont use auto if you understand aparture priority this will allow you to alter you DOF. and use the CPL finter 90degrees from the sun to remove the reflections from the car.

i hope this helps, any other issues use the link below mate.
 
barratt1988 said:
im sorry to say this mate but the camera isnt the issue its as always the person behind it. 1st off most camera are crop sensor unless your spending 1000's.

i would say check your settings are correct. dont use auto if you understand aparture priority this will allow you to alter you DOF. and use the CPL finter 90degrees from the sun to remove the reflections from the car.

i hope this helps, any other issues use the link below mate.
Click to expand...

I understand that and yeah you're right. I'm certainly no pro photographer but there's only one way to learn :)

So just to confirm, The higher the aperture number the more blurred the background or have I got it the wrong way round again?

Thanks
 
The smaller aperture number will give the smallest DOF, my Nikon 35mm goes down to f1.8, which is it's smallest number but that equates to it's largest opening of the aperture blades, the larger the number the smaller the opening of the aperture blades which give's more DOF, DOF allso increase's the further away from your subject you get, for example if you want a small DOF, get close to the subject with a small f number and a long distance to any background behind your subject the better as it will go out of focus more and more the further the background is away from you and your subject.
 
Once you have learnt the basics of how your camera works you will need to consider a few more things to get the best results photographing cars. Here are a couple.

Location: Choose somewhere that is right for the subject, your first image is in a field which is not a natural location for a car! Choosing the right location, especially when using available light, can make or break the image.

Reflections: Your subjects above are black cars and will reflect more than most colours, so you need to be aware of your surroundings, i.e. the grass and trees reflecting in the bodywork of the first shot, or the block paving and the building in the last one. Overly polished bodywork will reflect more, while the car may look great, the final photograph won't necessarily so. A circular polarising filter can help with reducing some reflections and help boost some colours too. Most of all its back to location though.

Hope that helps, you have a bit of learning to do, but once you have the basics you will learn from experience, just keep taking photos and post them up if you want constructive criticism.
 
That's great thank you :)

I'm out with a few friends tomorrow with different colour cars so I may well give them a go then report back :)

I knew a black car was a bad idea haha
 
sr666 said:
I understand that and yeah you're right. I'm certainly no pro photographer but there's only one way to learn :)

So just to confirm, The higher the aperture number the more blurred the background or have I got it the wrong way round again?

Thanks
Click to expand...

the smaller the number the wider the aparture, the more light you will get into the sensor . this also means the more blurry the background will be and the faster the shutter speed will be
 
sr666 said:
That's great thank you :)

I'm out with a few friends tomorrow with different colour cars so I may well give them a go then report back :)

black cars are a pain all round as they dont stay clean either lol
I knew a black car was a bad idea haha
Click to expand...
 
Thanks folks I'll have a quick look and see what I can learn,

Grabbed this pic today, I tried getting into the more scary world of manual modes etc then I realised I'd had the settings sent to Vivid which was sending the camera into fits :(

After a few tweaks on the camera itself I've come up with this



I realised I've missed the rule of thirds completely so that's something else to work on

C and C always welcomed :)

Thanks

Ryan
 
That could be it actually yes (P,S,A and M are marked up I was using the A) so after looking into it yes that was the right one.

I wasn't using vivid settings intentionally I was speaking to a friend who is a professional photographer but for music gigs etc and she suggested it as apparently the standard Nikon settings in these modes are quite washed out so she uses the vivid settings.

I've reset the settings back to normal since :)
 
barratt1988 said:
The word manual isnt something you should associate with an amateur unless you mean aparture priority n so on? Set the camera t9 shoot raw and standard colour as apose to vivid and such. Let pp handle the colour tweaks
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Are you sure?

I'm sure all the thousands of members here shooting M day in day out for fun would live to know why they shouldn't. Likewise the pros shooting AV etc?

There's also a school of thought that says doing your PP 'in camera' is an easier workflow, and means you spend less time in front of a computer, therefore more behind a camera.

Though I'm in the 'shoot Raw' camp personally.

It's still not where the OP needs help though.
 
sr666 said:
Thanks folks I'll have a quick look and see what I can learn,

Grabbed this pic today, I tried getting into the more scary world of manual modes etc then I realised I'd had the settings sent to Vivid which was sending the camera into fits :(

After a few tweaks on the camera itself I've come up with this

http://s285.photobucket.com/user/southernracer666/media/_CSC0406_zps94d8cb42.jpg.html

I realised I've missed the rule of thirds completely so that's something else to work on

C and C always welcomed :)

Thanks

Ryan
Click to expand...

The biggest problem with this shot is the car is green rather than black, because the brighter light bouncing off the grass has a massive green reflection

Options?

Shoot the shadow side of the car but be aware it might 'flatten' again.

Use a black or white panel as a 'reflector'

Shoot from slightly higher to minimise the effect.

Shoot on a black/ neutral surface rather than grass.
 
So to add to the remarks about the improved shot.

The lighting is much punchier than the originals, and the background cleaner - so that 's a massive improvement.

What is it lacking?

What did you want it to say about the car?

A car parked in a field with bushes in the background says;

family
caravanning
off road

I'm presuming that your lowered, black coupé was actually begging for:

moody
aggressive
sexy

I know it's a cliché, but an industrial setting or rock / cliffs would suit the car much better.

I may have said this earlier, but the photograph starts with the concept, most people think it starts when they lift the camera to their eye.
 
Phil V said:
So to add to the remarks about the improved shot.

The lighting is much punchier than the originals, and the background cleaner - so that 's a massive improvement.

What is it lacking?

What did you want it to say about the car?

A car parked in a field with bushes in the background says;

family
caravanning
off road

I'm presuming that your lowered, black coupé was actually begging for:

moody
aggressive
sexy

I know it's a cliché, but an industrial setting or rock / cliffs would suit the car much better.

I may have said this earlier, but the photograph starts with the concept, most people think it starts when they lift the camera to their eye.
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Thanks I'll try and break down what I was / am trying to achieve with the pics. Ignore the 3rd picture I posted that was a snapshot so wasn't thought out.

The pic of the P reg black Celica was taken purely to try and emphasise the look of the car itself, so yes you're right in the concept. Where we live there's not much around and I am slightly concerned about going down a small road in case someone comes out of nowhere and ends up hitting a car. Probably not likely to happen but it plays on my mind slightly

From various places I've read that if you get down to floor level / slightly higher then you end up giving the car a more moody look and being a black car that's what I was going for.

So with what you said about industrial setting I'm guesing you don't mean an industrial estate I'm thinking more along the lines of airport hangar in the background so it'll still be on tarmac etc?

I've tried and got an effort like this with my previous cars but I've tended to find that black cars are as said much harder to photograph :(





The last one was taken when I first got my camera and was in my Photobucket account and was just an impulse shot on Auto mode I think :(

I'll have a think about what you've said and try and work that into what I'm after

I apologise I probably sound really thick :(
 
barratt1988 said:
The word manual isnt something you should associate with an amateur unless you mean aparture priority n so on? Set the camera t9 shoot raw and standard colour as apose to vivid and such. Let pp handle the colour tweaks
Click to expand...

I think its actually a word you should associate with amateurs, its the best way to learn. In this day and age of cheaply mass produced electronics there is no such thing as a manual only camera. Now dont get me wrong the auto modes are brilliantly clever nowadays and shouldnt be dismissed but they wont teach you much about exposure control. The temptation to stick cameras on auto and never take them off it is too great for a lot of beginners and the thought of full manual is just 'too scary/too much like hard work' (delete appropriate) :naughty:.

However the big advantage of manual on modern Digitals is that you see immediately if the shot is too dark/light etc and you can then immediately see the effects of any changes you make to correct it. Most togs my age (lets just say I'm over 30 and leave it at that :crying: ) had to learn in manual only and then wait for your prints to come back from the lab to know if you had nailed a shot or not and you couldn't send off the film to be developed and printed till you had shot all 36 shots on the roll so it could be weeks before you saw your successes / failures. So don't shirk from the technology embrace it.

Todays brilliant cameras with all kinds of lovely instant review tech there has never been a better time to use manual.
Steep Learning = Quick Learning. (y)
 
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I feel the main thing re manual exposure is to know how to use it and when you may (or will need) to use it.

The histogram can be a great tool, providing you know how to use it.

Normally I shoot in one of the "auto" modes (aperture or shutter priority) however in tricky lighting or when the subject itself (like car head lights shinning into the camera lens) may influence the exposure measurement by the camera, I will switch to manual exposure..
 
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The histogram is that the small graph like thing which explains the light in the picture?
 
Phil V said:
Are you sure?

I'm sure all the thousands of members here shooting M day in day out for fun would live to know why they shouldn't. Likewise the pros shooting AV etc?

There's also a school of thought that says doing your PP 'in camera' is an easier workflow, and means you spend less time in front of a computer, therefore more behind a camera.

Though I'm in the 'shoot Raw' camp personally.

It's still not where the OP needs help though.
Click to expand...


If the guys struggling with the basics why on earth would he shoot manual?

And if your going to use pp then your workflow will always be slower but that is something you learn and therefore speed up. ACR is such a great tool a few clicks and on to the next photo.
 
barratt1988 said:
If the guys struggling with the basics why on earth would he shoot manual?
Click to expand...

Because if he sticks to an auto mode and lets the camera do everything for him he may never learn anything about exposure, which lets face it is paramount in photography. If he uses manual he will see the effect of changes he makes to either shutter or aperture values immediately, (the great advantage of modern SLRs with review screens.)
In fact because of the instant viewing technology there has never been a better time to shoot manual and I would urge all beginners to give it a go. They will learn quicker and become better photographers for it.

Same applies to Phil's comment re. PP and he should as said, try to get it right in camera.
Look ,we all use PP to tweak images and most experienced Togs use AV mode but to encourage newbies to rely on Auto Modes and fixing there cock ups in Photoshop etc is, I think, counter-productive and will have an adverse effect on learning the craft.
 
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