The Staggering Amount of Data Facebook Messenger Collects about you.

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When you search on Google, if you are doing it as 'you', you will be fed a set of links that is tailored to you. Try a Google search on another machine (not one of yours) and see how the results vary.

So someone like Robin will probably be fed links that suit a lifelong Tory, and is unlikely to find contrary views in search results. It's like buying the Telegraph, but not realising that it is very biased towards the right.

If this isn't resolved, it doesn't bode well for freedom of thought and critical thinking.
As I was watching the chaos in the US last night, the commentators were saying the same thing, that the people involved were only receiving information from one side. They also said that a lot of type of people involved were moving away from watching Fox 'News' as they thought they were going soft. :oops: :$

I can't see a way in giving people a balanced view of the world, if there is such a thing. The internet, because of things like Facebook and Google etc, and the methods of collecting data, they can be more precisely targeted for advertising aims, or political aims. Particularly with political extremes, at a certain point the individual will move away from mainstream sources of different information from any side because it is contrary to what they and their 'friends' believe, and once you are in a bubble listening to only what you want to hear, or believe, I can't see a way of convincing people with extreme views or beliefs, that there is an alternative if they have cut themselves off. If there is no dialogue and discussion, there is very little expectation of change.

The US in particular atm moment seems to have a very extreme divided nation, and I don't see how they bring opposing sides together when some no longer believe any facts that are put in front of them. It is not just the US though, I hear conspiracy theories about Covid that just make me think WTF! :oops: :$ :rolleyes: :banghead: Some people will actually have to get it, or have a family member catch it and possibly die to admit that it is real, and even then they may try to argue that they didn't actually die of Covid because the Government are somehow trying to cook the numbers. Which would actually be a detriment to the Government to have high numbers in every way, but that doesn't get in the way of a good conspiracy they have seen online, and all their 'friends' believe. Trump didn't like the number of infections going up, so tried not to test as much, because if you don't test the numbers don't go up do they! :oops: :$ :rolleyes: But has settled on ignoring it, and the results speak for themselves. :(

When I meet people who say they don't know anyone who has had it, I tell them I have a former employer who died from Covid, and they say what, he was in his 60's, he probably died from something else, I say no, he went into Hospital with Covid, got worse, and before he died put a picture of himself on Facebook in the ICU telling any deniers who didn't believe in it, that it was real, and that was what he had, and sadly later died from. You tell people that, that a person who died from it told people what he had before he died, and they just shrug their shoulders. It doesn't fit into their world view, so it is not real. If a dead person telling you what he was going to die from has no effect, then what hope is there changing the minds of people like that. :( And that is just one subject.

Btw, I know that the above is from my POV. I sadly know that I am out of step politically with a lot of the UK population. The last two elections have shown me how much I don't understand this country, and the motivations and beliefs of the majority of people living here. Que sera sera.
 
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If you denigrate and destroy MSM, you get rid of editorial control. (you can also seek to control the MSM, giving you the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Express, amongst others)

Getting rid of editorial control is critical in promoting people like Trump and Boris.

Speak directly to the people, without having any filters or safety nets. Then fire up the conspiracy theories against the MSM, the BBC, whatever goes against you.
 
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When you search on Google, if you are doing it as 'you', you will be fed a set of links that is tailored to you. Try a Google search on another machine (not one of yours) and see how the results vary.

So someone like Robin will probably be fed links that suit a lifelong Tory, and is unlikely to find contrary views in search results. It's like buying the Telegraph, but not realising that it is very biased towards the right.

If this isn't resolved, it doesn't bode well for freedom of thought and critical thinking.
As I was watching the chaos in the US last night, the commentators were saying the same thing, that the people involved were only receiving information from one side. They also said that a lot of type of people involved were moving away from watching Fox 'News' as they thought they were going soft. :oops: :$

I can't see a way in giving people a balanced view of the world, if there is such a thing. The internet, because of things like Facebook and Google etc, and the methods of collecting data, they can be more precisely targeted for advertising aims, or political aims. Particularly with political extremes, at a certain point the individual will move away from mainstream sources of different information from any side because it is contrary to what they and their 'friends' believe, and once you are in a bubble listening to only what you want to hear, or believe, I can't see a way of convincing people with extreme views or beliefs, that there is an alternative if they have cut themselves off. If there is no dialogue and discussion, there is very little expectation of change.
.... The bottom line is very simple - People believe what they want to believe regardless to a large extent of what they are told. They are thinking freely, just not necessarily the same way as someone else with an opposite view.
 
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.... The bottom line is very simple - People believe what they want to believe regardless to a large extent of what they are told. They are thinking freely, just not necessarily the same way as someone else with an opposite view.
You are a wonderful exemplar! People only think they “believe what they want to believe” and then they boast about being “freethinking” :(. Dunning Kruger muchly :(.
 

sirch

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The bottom line is very simple - People believe what they want to believe regardless to a large extent of what they are told
How do people become radicalised? How do people become part of conspiracy theory groups or cults? People are influenced by the information they receive, very few people have strong analytical skills and so tend to cleave to a set of beliefs and can be steadily moved in one direction or another by subtly changing the message around their beliefs over time.

I realise that debating this with you is pretty pointless because you believe what you believe but if you need hard evidence that people can be influenced, look no further than advertising and marketing. Businesses would not spend millions of pounds on advertising if it didn't work.
 
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You are a wonderful exemplar! People only think they “believe what they want to believe” and then they boast about being “freethinking” :(. Dunning Kruger muchly :(.
.... Please brush up on your English - I wrote "People believe..." and then "They are freethinking..." and not that I was.

You might think you know me but you most certainly do not - You merely make judgements (which of course you are entitled to) and ironically appear to believe what you want to believe about me.
 
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no different then many other systems of late, just google your name or open google settings and look at hte history section, it will show you every single thing you have clicked from a google search, every video and image you looked at etc

Same for loyalty cards like tesco club cards its to allow targeting marketing and evaluate patterns etc

Phones monitor what you do just like siri hence targeted marketing, have you never mentioned something before that you know you have not typed but then get an email advert for this not long after.

I know companies have even worked on face recognition advertising so electronic billboards can change the advert suited to you as you walk towards them !
 
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How do people become radicalised? How do people become part of conspiracy theory groups or cults? People are influenced by the information they receive, very few people have strong analytical skills and so tend to cleave to a set of beliefs and can be steadily moved in one direction or another by subtly changing the message around their beliefs over time.

I realise that debating this with you is pretty pointless because you believe what you believe but if you need hard evidence that people can be influenced, look no further than advertising and marketing. Businesses would not spend millions of pounds on advertising if it didn't work.
.... I agree with you.

People being what they are means that many are too easily influenced. But have you noticed that those who complain the loudest about secrecy and privacy are the ones who generally are against the status quo. Or that they might have something to hide.

The hypocrisy of it is that these same people want 100% transparency in everyone else. It's Big Brother paranoia. 'Fingerprint File' a great track by The Rolling Stones and the first song in BBC1's excellent 'The Serpent'. Incidentally it is very useful and helpful that the iPlayer logs what you view and can make suggestions for other programmes s you might enjoy.

I bought something via Instagram the other evening because Instagram was able to feed me with something I was interested in and no doubt was directly due to knowing more about my purchases history. The supplier was a family business and I spoke to the founder on a free 0800 number. It is an aid that is certainly an improvement to quality of everyday life and I was able to buy an extra one at heavy discount as a present for my daughter. It's a win-win or rather a win-win-win in this case.
 
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.... Please brush up on your English - I wrote "People believe..." and then "They are freethinking..." and not that I was.

You might think you know me but you most certainly do not - You merely make judgements (which of course you are entitled to) and ironically appear to believe what you want to believe about me.
You might think you know yourself and are in control of what you believe. But none of us are. Confirmation bias is a powerful phenomenon. As are the many other subtle influences that guide our gut feelings. Nobody is immune. It's an interesting area to read up on. Unless you're already too far down the conspiracy path. And "the articles are all part of the hoax".
 
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You might think you know yourself and are in control of what you believe. But none of us are. Confirmation bias is a powerful phenomenon. As are the many other subtle influences that guide our gut feelings. Nobody is immune. It's an interesting area to read up on. Unless you're already too far down the conspiracy path. And "the articles are all part of the hoax".
.... That is interesting. However I think it quickly gets to the point where it's chasing its own tail - I know you know I know you know ad infinitum and becomes purely intellectual and academic.

How well do you want to know yourself? There are very likely things about yourself you may not like! But it's who you are.

Btw, I'm not at all into conspiracy theories - I think they are merely speculation to support a view already decided.
 
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.... The bottom line is very simple - People believe what they want to believe regardless to a large extent of what they are told. They are thinking freely, just not necessarily the same way as someone else with an opposite view.
They aren't thinking freely.

They only think they are.

Try looking at media outlets from other countries.
 
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They aren't thinking freely.

They only think they are.

Try looking at media outlets from other countries.
.... Sure but if you think you are thinking freely, are you not consequently thinking freely? It's up to the individual to decide for themselves.

Where do you draw the line? Every single event in your life has an influence on how and what you think. For example, I have a great mistrust of hospitals due to the death of my 4yo son and The High Court judged in my family's favour.
 
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Something bad happened in my life, but I don't tell others how to behave relating to it. I look at odds and probability.
 

sirch

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those who complain the loudest about secrecy and privacy are the ones who generally are against the status quo
It seems to me that they are "against" the rampant commercialisation/commodification of personal information and if that's what you mean by status quo then the "the state in which before" is not static and does not apply to the current state of affairs, it is changing faster than legislators can even understand, let alone legislate for and so of course there is a "protest" movement against something which is largely uncontrolled and benefits a very few individuals at the expense of the vast majority.
 
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Something bad happened in my life, but I don't tell others how to behave relating to it. I look at odds and probability.
.... Same here, I don't tell others how to behave either. I simply recognise and acknowledge that events in an individual's life can have an influence on their individual attitudes.
 
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.... Same here, I don't tell others how to behave either. I simply recognise and acknowledge that events in an individual's life can have an influence on their individual attitudes.
Whereas I'm saying that I look wider than my personal experiences. I agree events and experience can influence attitudes, but only if you let them.
 
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Whereas I'm saying that I look wider than my personal experiences. I agree events and experience can influence attitudes, but only if you let them.
.... And similarly, data about you which is then used to tailor what you are presented with can influence attitudes, but only if you let it.

Granted that a lot of people are like sheep and are too easily influenced - This is also exploited by both the establishment and those who are anti establishment. Mr Hitler was an expert at influencing the German populus of his era.
 
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.... And similarly, data about you which is then used to tailor what you are presented with can influence attitudes, but only if you let it.

Granted that a lot of people are like sheep and are too easily influenced - This is also exploited by both the establishment and those who are anti establishment. Mr Hitler was an expert at influencing the German populus of his era.
I do my best to not let it.
 
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.... And similarly, data about you which is then used to tailor what you are presented with can influence attitudes, but only if you let it.

Granted that a lot of people are like sheep and are too easily influenced - This is also exploited by both the establishment and those who are anti establishment. Mr Hitler was an expert at influencing the German populus of his era.
Ah, someone who thinks that they are above being influenced, which we would all like to think we are, but probably are not totally. Otherwise they wouldn't bother with advertising if people were able to decide they would not be influenced by it. ;)
 
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Ah, someone who thinks that they are above being influenced, which we would all like to think we are, but probably are not totally. Otherwise they wouldn't bother with advertising if people were able to decide they would not be influenced by it. ;)
.... Agreed that I am not entirely and absolutely above being influenced but, like @Pound Coin, I do my best not to let it. My point was that the vast majority of people allow themselves to be influenced by advertising.

I wish the TV companies could monitor which adverts you hit the mute button on and then only serve you the types of adverts you don't mute.

Instagram offers you the option to select not to see similar ads you are served with and I like that.

Facebook isn't a problem because I use very strong ad blockers and don't see ads on Facebook. I don't care what they know about me.
 
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.... Agreed that I am not entirely and absolutely above being influenced but, like @Pound Coin, I do my best not to let it. My point was that the vast majority of people allow themselves to be influenced by advertising.
The only way to not be influenced by adverts is to not see any, ;) which is fairly impossible for virtually everyone, in the Western World at least. :rolleyes:

I wish the TV companies could monitor which adverts you hit the mute button on and then only serve you the types of adverts you don't mute.

Instagram offers you the option to select not to see similar ads you are served with and I like that.

Facebook isn't a problem because I use very strong ad blockers and don't see ads on Facebook. I don't care what they know about me.
Good job as they probably know quite a bit as the opening post highlighted. ;)
 
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As I understand it, one of the reasons that Siri is not as good as Alexa and Google Assistant is because Apple keep and use very little data on you. Which makes it harder to adequately answer a request.
 
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Apple keep and use very little data on you.
Apple collect a huge amount of data and they are going to use it soon too hence there decision to fall out with Facebook recently as Apple is in the middle of developing it's on advertising platform to rival Google Ads, Facebook Ads etc.
 
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Which is why Trump is very angry at the moment. Because he'd paid a lot of money for votes where they'd promised he'd win. But he's made so many enemies, that it was not enough this time round.
Do you actually mean he has been double crossed! Well I never! Whatever next- will he be taking a truth serum?
 
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As I understand it, one of the reasons that Siri is not as good as Alexa and Google Assistant is because Apple keep and use very little data on you. Which makes it harder to adequately answer a request.
Wouldn't the actual computing power and AI available (behind the app) have more to do with that! :thinking: Most of the time, I would think, these things with being asked for general information rather than information relating to the user, Siri/Google/Alexa, what is the weather like? Play songs by the Spice Girls? ;) :LOL: Etc.
 
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Which is why Trump is very angry at the moment. Because he'd paid a lot of money for votes where they'd promised he'd win. But he's made so many enemies, that it was not enough this time round.
Trump is very angry because he lost of course, and his life may well start to have more legal consequences now he will not of the shield of the Presidency, (hopefully) but with regards to paying for votes, he has probably got any money back with his scam of getting money to 'fight the fraud', which was just a way to grift the American foo, sorry, people, for cash. Money has just gone into his pockets for a fight that had no basis to be fought, and so had no chance of winning, bar a coup, which he got pretty close to doing. :oops: :$ Russia must think they did good business in the 2016 election ;) with what has happened to American society and 'Democracy'.
 
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Nod

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Do you actually mean he has been double crossed! Well I never! Whatever next- will he be taking a truth serum?

He tried - it rejected him.
 
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Apple collect a huge amount of data and they are going to use it soon too hence there decision to fall out with Facebook recently as Apple is in the middle of developing it's on advertising platform to rival Google Ads, Facebook Ads etc.
Facebook need the ads to make money. Google too. Apple don’t, they make money in their normal business activity. how much do you pay Facebook each year for their services?
 
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Wouldn't the actual computing power and AI available (behind the app) have more to do with that! :thinking: Most of the time, I would think, these things with being asked for general information rather than information relating to the user, Siri/Google/Alexa, what is the weather like? Play songs by the Spice Girls? ;) :LOL: Etc.
What Is your favourite Spice Girl song?
 
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I forgot to add to my post I have nothing I’m worried about in what they can collect so really don’t care, it funds them and means the services are free, yes if you think too much about it then it’s scary to think how easy your browsing, searching history is logged and used but hey I’m sure 99.9% of us really deep down don’t have anything to care about or hide anyway so don’t overthink it
 
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I forgot to add to my post I have nothing I’m worried about in what they can collect so really don’t care, it funds them and means the services are free, yes if you think too much about it then it’s scary to think how easy your browsing, searching history is logged and used but hey I’m sure 99.9% of us really deep down don’t have anything to care about or hide anyway so don’t overthink it
There speaks someone with no bank account or credit cards or phone or relatives etc etc.
 
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I forgot to add to my post I have nothing I’m worried about in what they can collect so really don’t care, it funds them and means the services are free, yes if you think too much about it then it’s scary to think how easy your browsing, searching history is logged and used but hey I’m sure 99.9% of us really deep down don’t have anything to care about or hide anyway so don’t overthink it
Oh, I think what is going on in the US at the moment is a clear indication that actually 99.9% of us actually have a lot to care about. The use of personal data and habits is insidious and has changed our world significantly for the worse. Be wary.
 
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Facebook need the ads to make money. Google too. Apple don’t, they make money in their normal business activity. how much do you pay Facebook each year for their services?
I don’t pay Facebook anything. Apples new business model is to charge a minimum of $1.50 per click, that will be more expensive than most google ad campaigns and much more expensive than Facebook, Instagram etc. adverts cost per click.
 
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I don’t pay Facebook anything. Apples new business model is to charge a minimum of $1.50 per click, that will be more expensive than most google ad campaigns and much more expensive than Facebook, Instagram etc. adverts cost per click.
Sorry, but you do, you just don’t realise Facebook is fleecing you :)
 
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Wait until Donald Trump's threatened social media platform of his own is up and running now Twitter has banned him permanently, you certainly would be fleeced on that and almost certainly scammed as well. You would have to get to be an expert on conspiracy theories too.
 
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