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  1. Paule23

    Paule23

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    Name:
    Paul
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    Hi All

    I am after your advice on a travel camera. I'm off to New York for 2 days in a month or so and want to take a small(ish) travel camera with a decent (20x plus) zoom and great IQ.

    Ive got an SLR (Canon 70d), but it's just too bulky. I'm off to an American Football game and there are restrictions over everything you can take in, including camera kit (you can take an SLR but are limited to a 6 inch lens so my 400mm is out).

    I've also got a Panasonic LX100 and love it for the IQ, but would like more zoom, although if the general consensus is this would be better overall than a compact with more zoom I'd be happy to stay with the LX100, I suppose I'm after the LX100 IQ with zoom of say a TZ70. Does such a thing exist?

    Ideally I'm after something smaller than a compact system camera, so looking for a great high zoom compact (but it doesn't have to be pocket small, I usually take a bag of some sort wherever I go). What are your suggestions? Budget is flexible, but for this thread lets say £300 max (happy to go second hand).
     
  2. woof woof

    woof woof

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    Alan
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    If you want quality approaching MFT and a long zoom range I think you're going to have to look at 1" sensor cameras.

    The SLR sized 1" superzoom bridge cameras may be too big for your brief but there are compact camera 1" cameras such as the Panny TZ100, I have one. I think it's 24-240mm equiv. Quality is not as good as MFT if you go looking for the differences but for a whole picture at normal-ish pc screen size or prints up to A4 or maybe larger when viewed normally I think it does well.

    PS.
    The TZ100 is actually 25-250mm equiv.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
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  3. cambsno

    cambsno

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    Simon
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    Do you need the zoom? I went to NY this year armed with a 20mm, 50mm and 85mm prime on the d750 and then the Fiji X100T (35mm). There were possibly the odd occasion when it would have been nice to not to have changed lenses but overall I would take the same again if going. 20mm was useful for on the street and the wide angle view - have a feeling I only used the 85mm on top of the Rock and shooting Chrysler from the ground, actually the 35mm of the Fuji was perfect much of the time and is a DX sensor so great IQ and low light.
     
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  4. tijuana taxi

    tijuana taxi

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    Rich
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    How about a small bridge camera, my wife has a relatively old 2010 Panasonic FZ45 which produces a decent enough photo.
    Given its age I reckon a more modern counterpart would be pretty good, think they call them a superzoom
    This looks ok https://www.amazon.co.uk/Panasonic-DMC-FZ72-Camera-16-1MP-60xZoom/dp/B00E0YFOKI/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

    This is a SOOC heavily compressed jpeg at a comparative full frame focal length of 152mm, think it goes up to something like 600mm (25mm lens at 24x optical zoom)
    P1000197.JPG
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
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  5. Paule23

    Paule23

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    I should have known this thread would make it harder than easier ;-)

    I'd not considered a bridge camera, but I suppose it is the gap in my camera collection (well, assuming I don't go for a zoom 1" sensor, maybe another gap?). You were right to comment on the size though, it does put me off, although I mentioned I will have a bag with me I suppose I'm not after anything too bulky, leading me to a compact zoom again.

    Re. whether I need the zoom, I think yes, I know for general walkabout stuff then the 24-75 of the LX100 would be great, but I still find myself missing the extra zoom sometimes. I'm also planning on taking in a Jet game and would love to get closer to the action (I will be way up in the cheap seats). I know there's the argument to just enjoy the game and let the pros do the real shooting, but I'd like some shots of the game I've taken, and will need some pretty decent reach to get there.

    Given the IQ of the LX100 would I be better to just stick with that and crop?
     
  6. woof woof

    woof woof

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    Alan
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    Dunno :D

    I have a 1" camera, MFT and a Sony A7. I haven't compared my Panny 1" directly to my MFT cameras but I have compared it to my Sony A7 and I found that it lacks dynamic range and if I look closely the Sony is sharper... so there are no surprises there :D

    Another thing to consider is the aperture you'll be shooting at as I doubt you'll be shooting at f1.8 to f2.8 at an equiv zoom of 200 to 300mm with a bridge or superzoom 1" camera? Or maybe you will? I do know that my Panny TZ100 can't do that and that means using a higher ISO and possibly a much higher ISO once you get to an acceptable shutter speed.

    I think it's worthwhile starting at the end result and working backwards from there. You say you'd like to take some pictures at a sports event and I assume that'll mean a long zoom and possibly a higher ISO. The next question will be your output and viewing and any cropping. Is the shot going to be a whole image, a slight crop or a heavy one and how are you going to view the picture? On screen only or are you going to print and if so how big? And then there's the quality you're willing to accept.

    Just looking at my Panny TZ100 shots there's a few I took at ISO 12,800 and after normal processing they're perfectly fine for on screen viewing at a normal viewing distance. If I zoom in to 100% there's grain and softness but no objectionable colour noise. I haven't printed any high ISO shots from my TZ100 but I expect they'll be ok for whole image prints but fine detail at 100%? Not so good :D

    I like to take two cameras on holiday, usually my Sony A7 with a compact prime (35mm f2.8) for general use and the best quality and a compact camera with a zoom for the wider and longer shots especially in good light.
     
  7. Snapsh0t

    Snapsh0t

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    Jonathan
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    I'd go with the TZ100 that Alan recommended as it's very compact for a 1" sensor camera with a 10x zoom.
     
  8. woof woof

    woof woof

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    Alan
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    Dunno if I'm recommending it :D Just saying that a 1" compact may be an option and the only one I have experience of is the Panny TZ100 :D For all I know Sony or someone else make one that's better :D

    There's a TZ100 thread here...

    https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/panasonic-tz100.653653/

    Some of my pictures have been removed by photobucket, I'll try and load them direct from my pc but may not have time until later.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
  9. woof woof

    woof woof

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    Alan
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    The question of zoom v crop got me interested, so...

    TZ100 whole picture at max zoom, 250mm equiv.

    P1000534-S.jpg

    GX7 with 12-35mm f2.8 at 35mm, (70mm equiv) and cropped for the same FoV.

    P1100779-1000.jpg

    TZ100, 100% crop.

    P1000534-c-100.jpg

    GX7 cropped to 375%.

    P1100779-375-1000.jpg

    The TZ100 whole picture is 14.3mb, 5472 x 3648, at 240dpi = 57.91cm x 38.61cm.
    The GX7 crop to the same FoV is 822kb, 1259 x 839 at 240dpi = 13.32cm x 8.88cm.

    Hope that helps.

    PS.
    My own conclusion is that if all you want is a picture 1000 or 2000 pixels wide for screen viewing maybe you can crop a MFT picture taken at 35mm (70mm equiv) to something like 100% or even a bit more and end up with a picture that compares to a picture taken with a 1" camera at an equiv focal length of 250mm but if you want to crop even further or produce a larger print maybe you'll be better off with the 1" camera.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
  10. Byker28i

    Byker28i

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    Take the SLR for the photography, don't try to photograph the football game, just enjoy the occaision?
    I shot New York with a 5D mk3 and 24-105 lens.
     
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  11. Paule23

    Paule23

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    The point is I'm trying not to take the SLR!

    I think the best compromise might be to stick with what I have, and not worry about the game. The LX100 is great as a walk around (potentially not wide enough for landscape, but my SLR is a crop sensor anyway so I'm normally only at c.28mm wide anyway). Maybe buy tickets for one of the London NFL games and use my SLR there, that way I don't have to cart a whole load of kit across the Atlantic, especially when I'm trying to keep down to a carry on and laptop bag.
     
  12. wez130

    wez130 Steak,wedges and a pint

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    Trade the Canon 70D in for a Sony A6300/6500, best of both worlds then, APSC sensor for good quality, then 18-105 lens for nice zoom. Not sure about length of longer zooms though.
     
  13. tijuana taxi

    tijuana taxi

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    Can't see you getting in with or being allowed to use a DSLR at the London games, no doubt house rules will be the same as for proper football.
    Live music venues are the same, usually say no interchangeable lens cameras, bag and body searches are common these days.

    I went to see Evanescence recently at the Hammersmith Apollo and despite very tight security I was allowed in with a Fuji X-E1 and 27mm lens (small APSC mirrorless camera)
    Ended up as I always intended leaving the camera in my rucksack when I checked it in the cloakroom.
    Only had it because I went early for a wander around town to take a few photos
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017 at 7:43 AM
  14. Byker28i

    Byker28i

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    And I was trying to make the point of take what you are used to, rather than go with something new you may struggle to get the best out of as you'll be unfamiliar with it. What walkabout lens have you got for the 70D
     
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  15. Paule23

    Paule23

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    I've got a nifty fifty, but for walk around mainly use a Tamron 24-70 VC. I could take this fairly easily, it's not ideal for the walk around bag I want to take which is a fairly thin messenger style bag, but is would fit.
     
  16. Byker28i

    Byker28i

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    Hum, I think you'd need wider for New York on a crop camera. I used my 24-105 on my full frame 5D mk3, just looked at my photos, most were at the 24mm end, so around 15mm on a crop? Perhaps your LX100 would do?
     
  17. Paule23

    Paule23

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    Yep, I'm thinking more of sticking with the LX100. Why pay more for a camera with more zoom but less IQ? I don't want the bulk of the SLR, even with say a small 10-22mm lens.

    Decision made (for now!) - stick with the LX100, and don't worry about the close ups of the game.
     
  18. woof woof

    woof woof

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    The LX100 has as far as I know a slightly bigger crop factor than MFT and as a result there'll maybe be a touch less image quality but even so I'd expect a 100% crop of a distant subject (maybe something between 1000-2000 pixels wide) to be ok for screen viewing so all is not necessarily lost for game shots. If you're cropping more than that or want to produce a larger print a 1" sensor camera with a longer zoom will probably be the better option.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2017 at 5:01 PM
  19. Byker28i

    Byker28i

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    Good move, if you want to photograph at the game, capture the atmosphere as a reminder. Crowd reaction, overall size shot etc. And enjoy your trip. New York is so expensive, but two days shouldn't break the bank :D
     

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