Told off by boss today...

ekimeno

ekimeno

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Mike
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...for doing photography business stuff during work hours.

The nature of my 'main' job is such that I'm often spending large chunks of time doing nothing because my work is done and waiting for more work to come in. Other times I'm working my butt off and working overtime if need be. It all balances out in the end and my boss, I assume, understands this.

During these down times, I'll often be emailing customers or organising upcoming jobs etc for my small by rapidly growing photography business. I know very well that I shouldn't really be using my main job's time to be earning extra money elsewhere... so it's really a case of just making sure I'm not caught... my morals are a bit flexible!

Today, however, I was caught! My boss found a print out that had something to do with my own business. Now I'm really careful not to get caught, but I think that he had probably gone scrounging in my recycle paper bin under my desk after I'd left work the previous day. I've seen him doing this before with one of my other colleagues...

Anyway, he confronted me saying he'd found this print out. I apologised and he said he didn't want me doing this and to keep my business stuff away from his company. I felt really guilty and told him that it wouldn't happen again.

But later on this evening I started thinking that in the grand scheme of things, who actually gives a flying f***. He's a selfish, mean b*****d who always tries to make everyone as uncomfortable as possible. I think that a little leeway might have been given by someone who was nicer - perhaps a little jokingly this theoretical nicer boss might have winked and told me not to get caught again and I would have respected this.

But this grumpy old fart always has to take the most extreme approach. Sure I could have been sacked, but I know he wouldn't want to do that because I'm pretty damn good at what I do there... I think I need to find something where the boss is cooler and just more chilled out. Either that or my boss really should retire or bugger off somewhere else! :bang:

Thanks for listening. C&C welcome ;)
 
Using your boss's time (and consequently money) to run your own business is theft pure and simple. If I was him and caught you again you'd be out the door.
 
Steep said:
Using your boss's time (and consequently money) to run your own business is theft pure and simple. If I was him and caught you again you'd be out the door.
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Agreed - I won't be doing this again. He's made himself quite clear.
 
I would have argued the print out was one i brought into work and my activities took place in my lunch break. He wouldn't be able to argue that unless it's in your contract of employment not to do what you were doing. Moot point now but worth remembering...
 
Steep said:
Using your boss's time (and consequently money) to run your own business is theft pure and simple. If I was him and caught you again you'd be out the door.
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Employer's discretion is a key to both a successful business and a happy workforce.

Surely your work enforces a 'XX strikes and you're out' policy on certain behavioour (it'll be in the contract)?

Steep, wind your neck in! To say it's theft is stupid. Legally/technically it might be if you had some arsey lawyer going at you and you'd done a Nick Leeson, but surely there's a reasonable way to placate him over such a small matter – do a FOC photoshoot of his kids for him for example? Brownie points are always worth their weight in gold.

I'm not saying all bosses should let their employees do whatever they want willy-nilly, but come on, this is making a mountain out of a molehill don't you think?

Don't just ditch the job over one incident. Bosses can be grumpy barstewards simply because they have been there and got the T-shirt.

Mine's a doddle to work with: I breeze in when I want (within the realms of normalcy), work to a deadline in a way that I see fit providing it doesn't casue probs for other departments, and basically enjoy my job and give him no hassle. I'm lucky maybe, but if he's the only fly in the ointment, then is it all that bad?

The other route is to chin the **** and do a runner with the company kitty and the fit receptionist!!! :)
 
hepburn said:
I would have argued the print out was one i brought into work and my activities took place in my lunch break. He wouldn't be able to argue that unless it's in your contract of employment not to do what you were doing. Moot point now but worth remembering...
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until he checks the internet and printer logs


i agree with steep on this one,
 
I'm not with Steep, not 100% anyway.

I think if he spends time doing his own photography stuff in work time to the detriment of his job, then yes, definitely.

But if he works extra in other areas, surely this should balance it out. Give and take IMO.
 
specialman said:
Employer's discretion is a key to both a successful business and a happy workforce.

Surely your work enforces a 'XX strikes and you're out' policy on certain behavioour (it'll be in the contract)?

Steep, wind your neck in! To say it's theft is stupid. Legally/technically it might be if you had some arsey lawyer going at you and you'd done a Nick Leeson, but surely there's a reasonable way to placate him over such a small matter – do a FOC photoshoot of his kids for him for example? Brownie points are always worth their weight in gold.

I'm not saying all bosses should let their employees do whatever they want willy-nilly, but come on, this is making a mountain out of a molehill don't you think?

Don't just ditch the job over one incident. Bosses can be grumpy barstewards simply because they have been there and got the T-shirt.

Mine's a doddle to work with: I breeze in when I want (within the realms of normalcy), work to a deadline in a way that I see fit providing it doesn't casue probs for other departments, and basically enjoy my job and give him no hassle. I'm lucky maybe, but if he's the only fly in the ointment, then is it all that bad?

The other route is to chin the **** and do a runner with the company kitty and the fit receptionist!!! :)
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Wahey - you're my new hero. (y)

To be honest I've been looking for another job for a couple of weeks already and this incident is one of many where he's been a real meanie. My company's staff are not a happy workforce - its so bad that there's an audible sigh whenever he leaves the office. No one likes him and everyone speaks poorly of him.

Your job sounds great - it's the way I'd love to be able to work. Perhaps I'll enlighten him with this alien concept him when I hand in my resignation.
 
Marcel said:
I'm not with Steep, not 100% anyway.

I think if he spends time doing his own photography stuff in work time to the detriment of his job, then yes, definitely.

But if he works extra in other areas, surely this should balance it out. Give and take IMO.
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Your last point is the way it is - my work is almost flawless and to the praise of our clients and partners. My bosses attitude is mind-boggling.
 
Ok, my point was that your employer pays you to work say eight hours a day, for that eight hours you're taking his money, if you use that time to work for your own instead of his interests then you're stealing from him. To take it onto a more general point and away from ekimeno so that it doesn't turn into something it shouldn't. It's all very well to say there should be give and take or that the boss should be more reasonable but see it from his point of view, he has a right to expect you to work to your contract and if you're willing to steal from him in this way, in what other ways are you also willing to do it?
How many people would be happy to have their boss dock their pay, because he felt like it?

specialman, I believe that in this world you should take responsibility for your words and actions, treat others as you would like them to treat you, hopefully with respect and honesty.
 
Steep, just want to check with you...

If I post on this forum during work hours, is that stealing?
If I log in to my bank account during work hours and move money from my current account to a better interest rate savings account, is that stealing?
If I email a customer from my own business telling them that their prints should arrive in 3-5 working days, is that stealing?

Just would like to understand where you would draw the line...
 
ekimeno said:
Steep, just want to check with you...

If I post on this forum during work hours, is that stealing?
If I log in to my bank account during work hours and move money from my current account to a better interest rate savings account, is that stealing?
If I email a customer from my own business telling them that their prints should arrive in 3-5 working days, is that stealing?

Just would like to understand where you would draw the line...
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clearly it is a question of degree
if your work is peaky and troughy
then a bit of idle surfing in slack periods is ok

I think you cross the line when you start do work on your own account then that is a click too far
The problem is - suppose the email to the private customer develops into an email exchange - and you get sucked into a protracted conversation, there must be a temptation to put the day-job to one side while you sort out the (private) query.

Slightly more far-fetched
suppose your job involved travel
you're passing a (private) customer so decide to pop in to drop off some prints
you trip and fall, injuring yourself so you can't work
your employer suffers the loss even though it was because you were working on your own account.

some would argue that a little light photo-copying isn't stealing either
how about "borrowing" a ream of copier paper because you've run out at home and the shops are shut

I guess you see things differently when you've sat both sides of the desk!

just my opinion of course, your mileage may vary
 
mmcp42 said:
clearly it is a question of degree
if your work is peaky and troughy
then a bit of idle surfing in slack periods is ok

I think you cross the line when you start do work on your own account then that is a click too far
The problem is - suppose the email to the private customer develops into an email exchange - and you get sucked into a protracted conversation, there must be a temptation to put the day-job to one side while you sort out the (private) query.

Slightly more far-fetched
suppose your job involved travel
you're passing a (private) customer so decide to pop in to drop off some prints
you trip and fall, injuring yourself so you can't work
your employer suffers the loss even though it was because you were working on your own account.

some would argue that a little light photo-copying isn't stealing either
how about "borrowing" a ream of copier paper because you've run out at home and the shops are shut

I guess you see things differently when you've sat both sides of the desk!

just my opinion of course, your mileage may vary
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I get where you're coming from and all valid points. I can understand from my bosses point of view that one small infraction could mean the tip of an unseen iceberg... :thinking:

So the question really is how do I get across to him that it isn't as bad as he might think? Because really it isn't. I might spend literally 5-10 minutes a day doing my own private stuff during work hours and might similarly spend 20-minutes at lunch time.

Perhaps simply asking him to be more lenient is an option - actually spell out to him the fact that I get my work done and often go above and beyond the call of duty. Ask him to cut me some slack...
 
ekimeno said:
I get where you're coming from and all valid points. I can understand from my bosses point of view that one small infraction could mean the tip of an unseen iceberg... :thinking:

So the question really is how do I get across to him that it isn't as bad as he might think? Because really it isn't. I might spend literally 5-10 minutes a day doing my own private stuff during work hours and might similarly spend 20-minutes at lunch time.

Perhaps simply asking him to be more lenient is an option - actually spell out to him the fact that I get my work done and often go above and beyond the call of duty. Ask him to cut me some slack...
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To be honest i would accept the bollicking and not do it anymore
I think if you return to the conversation your boss is more likely to keep an eye on you
Let it be and don't get caught! :shrug:
 
birdy961 said:
To be honest i would accept the bollicking and not do it anymore
I think if you return to the conversation your boss is more likely to keep an eye on you
Let it be and don't get caught! :shrug:
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I agree.

You were in the wrong, you got caught.. leave it at that and be more careful next time :)
 
ekimeno said:
Perhaps simply asking him to be more lenient is an option - actually spell out to him the fact that I get my work done and often go above and beyond the call of duty. Ask him to cut me some slack...
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Sometimes talking to someone will help - good communication on both sides solves more problems than grumbling and not letting someone know that they are upsetting or irritating you in some way.
 
birdy961 said:
To be honest i would accept the bollicking and not do it anymore
I think if you return to the conversation your boss is more likely to keep an eye on you
Let it be and don't get caught! :shrug:
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So, not do it anymore, but don't get caught...??? :shrug:
 
I would suggest not to do your private work in someone elses time.

However if you do feel the urge don't get caught:nono:

Covers my bases I think :LOL:
 
birdy961 said:
I would suggest not to do your private work in someone elses time.

However if you do feel the urge don't get caught:nono:

Covers my bases I think :LOL:
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Fair enough :naughty:

______________________

Thanks everyone for their views. Glad to know that I'm not a complete a***hole for doing this, but at the same time, I can see how my boss might start not trusting me. Food for thought. (y)
 
Speaking as someone that owned a business and employed office and factory staff...

You got off lightly. I'd have suspended you and investigated just how much work you were doing. Then you would either be re instated with a warning or dismissed.

If someone came to me and said they had loads of spare time I'd have found them other duties. If there were no other duties (as with our receptionist) then it was agreed openly what other things could be done in work time - not done by stealth.

Any boss that is worth their salt will know who pulls their weight and who takes an easy ride. In my business the workers got the best pay rises and promotion. Those that did the minimum got the minimum back.
 
RobertP said:
Speaking as someone that owned a business and employed office and factory staff...

You got off lightly. I'd have suspended you and investigated just how much work you were doing. Then you would either be re instated with a warning or dismissed.

If someone came to me and said they had loads of spare time I'd have found them other duties. If there were no other duties (as with our receptionist) then it was agreed openly what other things could be done in work time - not done by stealth.

Any boss that is worth their salt will know who pulls their weight and who takes an easy ride. In my business the workers got the best pay rises and promotion. Those that did the minimum got the minimum back.
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(y)

I work for a small (staff wise) company, and the boss here is great, I'm sure he knows I spend some of the day on here, but his words to me "if the work gets done and we're making money, I don't really care"

In return, I do work bloody hard inbetween posting on TP :naughty: and we have a laugh in the office :)
 
If someone works hard for you then you look after them.

You also have statistics from the server for time spent surfing web sites too ;)
 
I must be real lucky.
I am a remote member of my team (they are based in Liverpool and I'm just outside Brum)
For the most part, my day job keeps me busy (very busy) but I am logged on to TP most of the day.
When it does go quite, I have worked on my website a few times.
My boss knows and has made it clear that as long as I don't take the pish, or any of my deadlines slip, he doesn't care.
I guess the difference is, unlike RobertP, my boss isn't running the company, just trying to make sure that his teams stuff gets done!
 
Too right you should have been told off! If you're going to run your business in works time then you've got be to very very careful that you're not caught ;) I wouldn't be suprised if it amounted to gross misconduct which means you could be fired with no notice period.
 
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If you're being paid to do a job then how can it possibly be right to be doing something other than what you're being paid for at the same time - at least without some prior agreement. I wonder how many of you who think it's OK to work on your own project whilst being paid by an employer would feel if the tables were reversed. Would you be happy if you found out the person you were paying was actually not working for you at all but working for themselves?
Personally I would have given the OP a verbel warning on the first occassion, a written warning on the second occassion and the sack if it happen yet again after that.
 
Well it depends. If I was his boss and he was a good worker, regularly staying back for unpaid overtime, and working harder than he should on occasions to get the job done to fit a timeframe, then yeah of course I'd allow it.

Using physical resources (like the photocopier) I would discipline for, but if he was a good worker of mine, I would tell him it's not on, and not to do it again. Doing his own thing when there's nothing else to do is one thing, but taking the pee isn't.
 
if i was your boss mike id say yeah do your own thing man , im like that , a right mr nice guy ....
 
but if i was alice cooper....................
 
ekimeno said:
Perhaps simply asking him to be more lenient is an option - actually spell out to him the fact that I get my work done and often go above and beyond the call of duty. Ask him to cut me some slack...
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A cleaner, simpler solution would be to ask if you can have all the extra hours you do as time in lieu for when things are quiet - that way you do your own stuff at home and your boss, if he's not already, will be aware of the times you do go the extra mile.
 
Another thing you need to be aware of is the company's code of conduct - I am sure many employees don't tend to bother to read it but it is very important.
For instance, it is quite common to have a section in the code which relates to doing something not work related. Many companies will do see this as being very important and they can choose to restrict your ict facilities, restrict other facilities, demote you or even sack you!
Some companies also class it as stealing (as previously said) and sometimes fraud if you lie about how many hours you have been working (work related work). I know someone who had to sack an employee as he was lying about how long he worked for - he was told it was fraud and was escorted off site by the site police! he was lucky not to be charged with fraud!

Just be careful that's all :LOL:
 
Steep said:
Using your boss's time (and consequently money) to run your own business is theft pure and simple. If I was him and caught you again you'd be out the door.
Click to expand...


A bit harsh, but you have a point to a certain degree...

G.
 
apparently, i have performance review on tuesday.
i suspect it will be a chance for our transport manager to try and make me feel small and boost his already oversized ego.
i tend towards the t**t him one ,line of thought at the moment.:cautious:
when i mentioned it to one of our office bods, she just said "mark,.stay calm, keep your temper"
. she knows me too well.
reviews , are another of his new initiatives.
i suspect , in a few months,the way things are going, he,ll have no more drivers to review.:LOL:
 
To be honest, your boss was in the right. The way he weant about telling you may not have been the best or most diplomatic though.

Get your CV to a few companies if you aren't happy :)

A lot of people say they don't like the company they work for but many do almost nothing pro-active about it. It's like that in the place I work for, staff morale is quite low but only a small percentage are out getting interviews and looking to escape (me being one of them ;)). All I'm saying is if you want to change something do it today.
 
Steep said:
specialman, I believe that in this world you should take responsibility for your words and actions, treat others as you would like them to treat you, hopefully with respect and honesty.
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Is that a dig at me for my comments or just general observation? This forum mallarky tends to leave me wondering if everyone's getting the hump with each other or that their comments are simply getting lost in translation...

I agree with you on the above by the way :)
 
specialman said:
Is that a dig at me for my comments or just general observation?
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Absolutely not a dig m8, just an explanation of why my opinion is what it is.
 
Col_M said:
A lot of people say they don't like the company they work for but many do almost nothing pro-active about it. It's like that in the place I work for, staff morale is quite low but only a small percentage are out getting interviews and looking to escape (me being one of them ;)). All I'm saying is if you want to change something do it today.
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I am changing my situation - interview on Wednesday and Thursday coming up. Similar companies but more money and higher status roles. It's about time I move on anyway. :wave:
 
FACT ..... "Blue and white collar" theft (No hedging, we ALL know what it is!) cost companies £$€ billions...... no ignoring it! This gets passed on to the consumer, that causes...... I'll not go on!

I think ekimeno's last post sums up his entire frustration and was working towards this anyway. There are ways and means to deal with this kind of thing - some managers have it, some don't!
 
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