Unimpressed with Firecrest filters

[AJQS]

Well this is not what I thought I'd be posting. I needed to go back to 100mm filters for my Fuji 10-24mm, ad planned to make it a once only purchase - how wrong that was! So instead of the lee Seven5 system I now had Firecrest filters and the Aluminium holder - and I don't like any of it! The holder can't be turned to align the filters unless you loosen the screw that holds it onto the lens, that is a guaranteed way for very expensive and heavy filters to end up crashing to the floor, OK so I have a lathe, I could modify the system by grooving the adapters and turning the lock screw down to match the groove, but that's for another day. The main thing that bothers me is the grads themselves - they are far too refelctive and the grad is far too soft.



Photo of a white wall with the 1.2 grad. I can see the lens clearly reflected in the filter, and the gradation takes up the entire image - from a 10mm ultrawide! Never seen that from any other filter.

Things don't improve much in the field...



Same grad and Firecrest 13 stop ND too. Reflecting the pathetic amount of sun that's peeking through a cloud behind me.

Add to that, the first time I used the 0.6ND it scratched in the filter holder! The only positive is that the filters are dead neutral.

Weighing up whether to buy the very expensive Firecrest holder system with it's light blocking cover (obviously hitech are well aware of the poor performance of the firecrest filters in this regard), which to be honest looks like a lot of faffing about when on location, try lee or progrey grads in the aluminium holder or some other mix and match. The firecrest grads are all going back, though the solid ND I think I'll keep hold of for now as it's infinitely better than the Lee version.

Thoughts on alternatives?

 

[mickledore]

Don't tell @Mr Perceptive
He thinks the sun shines out of Firecrest filters. It obviously does but perhaps not in the way he means

 

[AJQS]

Don't tell @Mr Perceptive
He thinks the sun shines out of Firecrest filters. It obviously does but perhaps not in the way he means

Does he have the fancy pants holder for them?

 

[mickledore]

Not sure what you mean by fancy pants. He ( and I) have the aluminium one.
My only Firecrest is a 13 stop screw in 72mm.
I didn't splash out on Firecrest grads. Thought they were waaaay too expensive for the use I'd get so settled for the bog standard ones.
I've a tendency to bracket exposures rather than use grads, but sometimes they are a necessary evil.

 

[mickledore]

Forgot......I know what you mean about the holder and it's fixing to the ring. Could be better.

 

[69Bonni]

Ooohhh that's not good at all is it Alan!
Are you going to send them back as not fit for purpose?

 

[AJQS]

Grads on their way back. Holder will be following shortly I think, the more I study it the less I like it. Trouble is I don't know if the firecrest holder will vignette or not on the 10-24.

 

[mickledore]

Alan......We went through this vignetting liklihood a about the time the T2 was released. I remember using my 10.24 and David's filters on Birkenhead docks. We posted the results on here but where abouts is anyone's guess.
I "think" we decided that you could use a screw in CPL and filter (say a 10 stop) then add the holder on top and you'd only get vignetting between 10 - 12 mm. I seem to remember it may have been in a thread you started.
David will have chapter and verse when he comes along.

 

[Dave Semmens]

Does the ND have a gasket fitted?

Mine was delivered without one when I bought it from Amazon and I had to chase them to get one sent out.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

Don't tell @Mr Perceptive
He thinks the sun shines out of Firecrest filters. It obviously does but perhaps not in the way he means

I have ND screw in's and the resin grads in the 85mm holder, I agree that holder isn't perfect, but not had any of the Firecrest Grads so can't comment on them.

 

[AJQS]

Does the ND have a gasket fitted?

Mine was delivered without one when I bought it from Amazon and I had to chase them to get one sent out.

Yes, Mine was supplied with the gasket (though I had to stick it on myself and it's wonky as hell it does work as intended). The problem isn't so much a leak of light as reflections off the grads - I'd swear there is no multi-coating on them of any sort personally with that amount of reflection. Resin filters don't have this issue (well, they can do if you get very unfortunate lighting conditions - in 7 years it;s only happened to me once)

I have ND screw in's and the resin grads in the 85mm holder, I agree that holder isn't perfect, but not had any of the Firecrest Grads so can't comment on them.

Save your pennies would be my advice, they are no use on crop.

Alan......We went through this vignetting liklihood a about the time the T2 was released. I remember using my 10.24 and David's filters on Birkenhead docks. We posted the results on here but where abouts is anyone's guess.
I "think" we decided that you could use a screw in CPL and filter (say a 10 stop) then add the holder on top and you'd only get vignetting between 10 - 12 mm. I seem to remember it may have been in a thread you started.
David will have chapter and verse when he comes along.

The firecrest holder is 100mm so is the one I have. The normal 100mm is just workable as supplied on the 10-24 with the wide angle adapter. The firecrest holder is a different design incorporating a CPL into the adapter ring and using step up rings to attach it to smaller lenses. There is an alternative direct ring for 72mm lenses but I suspect it'll still stick out too far and cause vignetting. You can put a few Seven5 filters in front of a 10-24 as long as you don't use any kind of holder other than your fingers, so not ideal, I did just this last week though with a 0.6 and a 0.9 grad at different angles in order to get the shot - however I'd prefer a hands free solution.

 

[Gambit]

Good timing I was about to stump up money for a firecrest kit! What are the alternatives or best solutions ?

 

[mickledore]

Sorry Alan. All these heroine derivatives that I'm on are addling my brain. Think I should lie down more!
I looked at the holder with built in CPL but not for very long. Seemed a lot of money to solve a problem that didn't really exist.

 

[Retune]

Do their 100mm grads and NDs have anti-reflection coating? This is what they say about the NDs:

Because the ND effect comes from the coating itself, we’ve gone to great lengths to protect it. On our rectangular filters the coating is sandwiched between two pieces of bonded glass. This protects the coating completely and allows us to lap and polish the filters to the highest tolerance in the industry, meaning your filters will have the lowest possible distortion. On our circular filters, the coating is featured on the outside of the filter because the ring protects the filter. This allows us to add anti reflective and hydrophobic coatings to the outside of our circular filters.

http://www.formatt-hitech.com/learn-neutral-density

To me this suggests only the circular filters do.

 

[AJQS]

Good timing I was about to stump up money for a firecrest kit! What are the alternatives or best solutions ?

Lee Grads have always worked well enough, I'm now keen to try Progrey Titan filters though as these are supposed to be properly coated, however they are very expensive.

Sorry Alan. All these heroine derivatives that I'm on are addling my brain. Think I should lie down more!
I looked at the holder with built in CPL but not for very long. Seemed a lot of money to solve a problem that didn't really exist.

Yeh it's a shame you can only buy it with the polariser. whether you want it or not, that's what pushes the cost up.

Do their 100mm grads and NDs have anti-reflection coating? This is what they say about the NDs:

Because the ND effect comes from the coating itself, we’ve gone to great lengths to protect it. On our rectangular filters the coating is sandwiched between two pieces of bonded glass. This protects the coating completely and allows us to lap and polish the filters to the highest tolerance in the industry, meaning your filters will have the lowest possible distortion. On our circular filters, the coating is featured on the outside of the filter because the ring protects the filter. This allows us to add anti reflective and hydrophobic coatings to the outside of our circular filters.

http://www.formatt-hitech.com/learn-neutral-density

To me this suggests only the circular filters do.

Yep, I'd agree. They certainly don't behave like multicoated filters.

I spoke to Hitech this morning, I am returning the standard holder and getting the firecrest holder instead, they reckon they have tested it with no vigentting on the Fuji 10-24mm so we shall see.

 

[Retune]

A bit of Googling suggests anti-reflection multicoating seems to be the exception rather than the rule for 100mm filters, but I can see some by NiSi and Haida that are.

 

[AJQS]

A bit of Googling suggests anti-reflection multicoating seems to be the exception rather than the rule for 100mm filters, but I can see some by NiSi and Haida that are.

And Progrey Titan. I'm Going back to Lee for the time being, tried and tested as it were.

 

[tijuana taxi]

Sorry Alan. All these heroine derivatives that I'm on are addling my brain. Think I should lie down more!
I looked at the holder with built in CPL but not for very long. Seemed a lot of money to solve a problem that didn't really exist.

Don't like to mock the afflicted, there again I probably do really

What is a heroine derivative? Something like Joan Of Arc's first cousin or maybe Grace Darling's sister

Hope you getting on ok and the opiates are keeping the pain down a bit. Didn't have the heart to tell you the other week that I had heard it was rather a painful procedure

 

[Gambit]

Can anyone direct me to which or the firecrest 100 filter holders is the updated and better one with the gaskets and additional countermeasures to prevent light leak? Can't seem to locate which one. I'm only after solid ND filters so will go ahead and buy a firecrest aluminum holder system but with solid ND filters.

 

[Gambit]

Reading reviews on the Nisi v5 and apparently the latest version is good, I might get the nisi holder and firecrest ND solid glass filters

 

[mickledore]

Don't like to mock the afflicted, there again I probably do really

What is a heroine derivative? Something like Joan Of Arc's first cousin or maybe Grace Darling's sister

Hope you getting on ok and the opiates are keeping the pain down a bit. Didn't have the heart to tell you the other week that I had heard it was rather a painful procedure

@tijuana taxi Thanks Rich. Everyone told me it would be painful, and took great delight in doing so!
The knee isn't really too bad - not as bad as I was expecting. I'm walking without crutches, including stairs both ways.
Only two problems

• They put a tourniquet on my thigh and that has turned my upper leg scarlet. Hellish sore - more than the opiates (see what i did there?) can cope with.
• The Warfarin (rat poison to the uninitiated) derivative that I am on to thin my blood is sending me away with the fairies. It's like being in Haight Ashbury in the late 1960s. Peace man!

Outcome is not much sleep so I'm not really with it at present. I'm so bad I nearly accepted an invite to watch the Europa Cup Final and free beer at a neighbour's....til I realised it was Man. U. A narrow escape there!

 

[chrism_scotland]

Reading reviews on the Nisi v5 and apparently the latest version is good, I might get the nisi holder and firecrest ND solid glass filters

I've been wondering about the Nisi, I'm selling up my larger Lee SW150 kit as I no longer have a "special lens" which needs the bespoke adapter ring, the Nisi kits look pretty good but I wasn't sure how good their filters were.

 

[GreenNinja67]

I have the new Firecrest holder and a 0.6 soft & 0.9 soft ND grad Firecrests which I used for the first time on holiday in North Devon 2 weeks ago.

I found the whole kit to be superb actually.

but this was on FX Canon L lenses.

The holder vignettes on my 17-40 up to 20mm but that's an ok price to pay I feel.

They worked really well on the sunsets I was shooting and were completely neutral.

I found the 16 stopper too dark to be honest so that may be back up for sale soon.

 

[AJQS]

I have the new Firecrest holder and a 0.6 soft & 0.9 soft ND grad Firecrests which I used for the first time on holiday in North Devon 2 weeks ago.

I found the whole kit to be superb actually.

but this was on FX Canon L lenses.

The holder vignettes on my 17-40 up to 20mm but that's an ok price to pay I feel.

They worked really well on the sunsets I was shooting and were completely neutral.

I found the 16 stopper too dark to be honest so that may be back up for sale soon.

I take it you didn't get the 77mm direct fitting mounting ring then? How would you rate the build quality - many complain about looseness of fit. I haven't pulled the trigger on one yet, though I will, just need to wait for all the sales and refunds to settle down on my card so I can see how much money I actually have left!

 

[GreenNinja67]

Build quality's very good in my opinion. The filter slots are rather tight but an Allen key is supplied to loosen them which I have done. I've not had any experience of other makes though

 

[AJQS]

Can anyone direct me to which or the firecrest 100 filter holders is the updated and better one with the gaskets and additional countermeasures to prevent light leak? Can't seem to locate which one. I'm only after solid ND filters so will go ahead and buy a firecrest aluminum holder system but with solid ND filters.

There is only one firecrest holder http://www.formatt-hitech.com/hardware/firecrestholder - I would strongly advise against the regular aluminium holder if you plan on stacking plain NDs - even with just the one it's a bit iffy. See the gap behind the gasket thanks to the machined section of the holder?

 

[chrism_scotland]

I take it you didn't get the 77mm direct fitting mounting ring then? How would you rate the build quality - many complain about looseness of fit. I haven't pulled the trigger on one yet, though I will, just need to wait for all the sales and refunds to settle down on my card so I can see how much money I actually have left!

I've had the Firecrest Holder (pre-ordered it actually!) and only sold it when I moved across to the bigger Lee Kit, its a nice piece of kit although it can be a little fiddly at times.
When I wasn't using "Big Stop" filters I tended not to bother with all of the plastic covering the holder as I found it hard to get filters in and out of, very handy having the built in Polariser though so I'm considering getting one again now that I'm moving back to a smaller filter setup.

 

[Gambit]

Almost sold on the nisi v5 holder kit, consensus seems to be good with no issues about dropping filters and lock mechanism and light leak issues either.

 

[AJQS]

I've ordered a firecrest holder, 72mm direct adaptor and step rings for the other lenses. £240 - ouch! Coupled with Lee Medium grads at £190, this has been an expensive week!

 

[an1uk]

I ended up returning the Firecrest holder due to the faff factor, and that I found it difficult to properly insert a square ND after positioning a grad. I'm sure it will work well for some though, and the polariser included in the kit is superb. Ended up getting a Lee holder and a neck warmer with a bungee on the end as light leak protection.

 

[AJQS]

Overall I like the Firecrest holder, Well maybe like is too strong, it's the one I dislike the least. There are issues - we all know the slots are too tight, if you slacken the screws then they will fall out, great idea guys. Same with the screw that hols the retaining clip in, it's loose as supplied, an necessarily so, if you tighten it the clip doesn't move. That is guaranteed to ping off on location somewhere. The moulding on the vented end caps leaves a lot to be desired, they are really difficult to fit and remove from the covers, the solid ones are fine. The gasket on mine doesn't seal the filter on one side. The price point of everything Hitech I've tried thus far should really be much, much lower than it is as the engineering is actually only at Chinese ebay stuff level.

That said I've been doing some testing outside with the firecrest 13 ND in the front slot to see how well the covers work, and as long as you keep the sun out of the frame it's fine, no light getting behind the filter that I can see, but it is glaring off the front very badly with the sun in the frame.

 

[justinminns]

Almost sold on the nisi v5 holder kit, consensus seems to be good with no issues about dropping filters and lock mechanism and light leak issues either.

I tested the Nisi V3 and V5 and while the V5 is much improved, I found the whole set up fiddly. Unless you are using 82mm lenses you have to use a step up ring before screwing the adaptor on which means not only do you have two things to fiddle with in the field you can't leave the rings in place. The Nisi design is clever but I can leave my Lee adaptors on all the time so in use the chunky simplicity of the Lee holder is way better... imo obviously

 

[AJQS]

Just a little comparison, this is a Lee Medium 0.9ND grad in the standard hitech holder, absolutely no reflection whatsoever and I even had a light on behind it, to really bias the test in favour of the firecrest, and it still fails miserably. So yeh. forget firecrest, buy Lee.

 

[Muzzieman]

Sorry Alan. All these heroine derivatives that I'm on are addling my brain. Think I should lie down more!
I looked at the holder with built in CPL but not for very long. Seemed a lot of money to solve a problem that didn't really exist.

It solves the problem of vignette with Uwa lenses. I have recently upgraded from the old hitech holder to the new version. It is much better. Has a built in gasket for zero light leaks. The fire crest filters are the best I have ever used. And I've used them all.

 

[an1uk]

Just a little comparison, this is a Lee Medium 0.9ND grad in the standard hitech holder, absolutely no reflection whatsoever and I even had a light on behind it, to really bias the test in favour of the firecrest, and it still fails miserably. So yeh. forget firecrest, buy Lee.

Did you try same on Firecrest with other side facing out? Probably won't make a difference but just wondering in the interests of science.

 

[AJQS]

Did you try same on Firecrest with other side facing out? Probably won't make a difference but just wondering in the interests of science.

Yes, no difference.