Wedding Equipment Advice...

[existent]

A friend of mine asked me to do the photography for their wedding next summer in Cyprus.

I already talked to them and they know what to expect. I.e. possibly not as good as the other photographers in Cyprus, but I think I can do similar job. I should mention that the industry standards aren't same as it is here (which makes it easier for me ).

Instead of a payment, they offered to buy me some of the lenses/equipment I need for the wedding which works out for me as well.

Now, the reason for the thread... I am not 100% sure which lenses I should be going for?

Wedding ceremony and reception will be outdoors at night, and there will be a pre wedding session at a different location, again outdoors...

I know f2.8 zooms seem to be the popular choice but they are also a bit expensive :|

My current equipment is 450D, 10-22, 24-105mm , 60mm f2.8 and a cheap flash.

I am planning on buying a new body by next summer and won't sell the current one until after the wedding so I could have 2 bodies.

2 things I am planning on asking are the 85mm f1.8 and 580EXII flash...
I will need some sort of diffuser or something to bounce to flash outdoors to avoid shadows... any recommendations on this? I can't seem to find a lot about outdoor night wedding photography...

I am hoping 24-105 will be my main lens. So the question is, can I do it with an f4 lens, or an f2.8 is a must?

also, what other lens/equipment I should be considering? longer telephoto?

I know there is still a year to go, but being enthusiastic about it, I can't help start thinking about it already

 

[J4MIE_P]

Ideal set-up would be (Obviously pick and chose what you need/ require) Ideally all of it (I'm talking a Canon setup here to help you)

2-4x Cameras capable of high ISO's (eg. 5D ideally as it's full frame, but 40,50D etc)
2x Wide Angle Zooms preferably F2.8 (17-40 F4, or 16-35 F2.8)
2x Mid-Range Zooms (24-70 F2.8, or 24-105 F4)
2x Telephoto Zooms (70-200 F2.8, or 70-200 F4)
Some Prime lenses (eg. 35, 50, 85, 100, 135)
Flashguns (580, 430, etc)

Again that's a pretty much you SHOULD have if you are looking to go pro with this, again you might slowly build to this level.

Again as a beginning out type job, at LEAST 2 camera bodies and I'd say 24-200mm range of focal lengths at F2.8
If you are at the back of the ceremony what's a 60mm F2.8 gonna do? (It'll be great indoors for your low light stuff with flash)

 

[existent]

Ideal set-up would be (Obviously pick and chose what you need/ require) Ideally all of it (I'm talking a Canon setup here to help you)

2-4x Cameras capable of high ISO's (eg. 5D ideally as it's full frame, but 40,50D etc)
2x Wide Angle Zooms preferably F2.8 (17-40 F4, or 16-35 F2.8)
2x Mid-Range Zooms (24-70 F2.8, or 24-105 F4)
2x Telephoto Zooms (70-200 F2.8, or 70-200 F4)
Some Prime lenses (eg. 35, 50, 85, 100, 135)
Flashguns (580, 430, etc)

Again that's a pretty much you SHOULD have if you are looking to go pro with this, again you might slowly build to this level.

Again as a beginning out type job, at LEAST 2 camera bodies and I'd say 24-200mm range of focal lengths at F2.8
If you are at the back of the ceremony what's a 60mm F2.8 gonna do? (It'll be great indoors for your low light stuff with flash)

Thanks for the list.. As I said, I will be doing this for a friend and not considering going pro or anything just yet.. (unless I really enjoy it).

My main concern is f2.8 vs f4... Investing in f2.8 glass would be costly for a one time event. So I'd like to stick with f4 if possible. It will be outdoors but it should be lit properly...

 

[J4MIE_P]

Again having F2.8 (even if it's just one lens will play a massive advantage, or even if you get yourself a 50mm F1.8 prime at £99 ish.

As you will probably need some low light fast lenses when it starts to get darker. Even the 50mm F1.8 stopped down to about F2.8 onwards is nice and sharp so thats an idea.

 

[vaizki]

With f/4 and flash at night.. your shots will probably look like they were shot in a nightclub as the background will be very very dark or blurred.. This is why I got the Sigma 30/1.4 but it's a lens that required a lot of practise for me to get a hang of DoF at large apertures.

If you get the 5D2, there might be hope with f/4 as you could go up to ISO 3200. Then again, the 10-22 and 60mm lenses will not work on it as they're EF-S lenses. But the 24-105 is not very wide on a crop body.. You've got quite a mixed bag there!

A very cost effective first step is to go outside and try taking photos outside at night in lighting similar to what you expect to have.

 

[Dman]

I know f2.8 zooms seem to be the popular choice but they are also a bit expensive :|

This is why pro wedding togs have these lenses, and it's why you might not do a similar job as you state you might. The fact that the wedding is at night points to a real struggle, unless your camera can handle high ISO (I'm not familiar with Canon bodies so can't comment), or unless you buy some nice fast glass. An f4 lens won't be any use whatsoever unless you use flash throughout, but then you need to be confident with what you're doing with regards to flash. You mention bouncing, but what if there's nothing to bounce off?

Even 2.8 will make for a tough wedding if the lighting isn't great and the ISO performance isn't up to scratch. A wedding at night is the last thing I'd want if I'd never done a wedding before, but if they're happy with the fact you're not a pro and will just do your best, then the pressure's off.

Sorry if this sounds negative, but you really need to be prepared for a really tough night, as it seems it might be just that.

 

[existent]

This is why pro wedding togs have these lenses, and it's why you might not do a similar job as you state you might. The fact that the wedding is at night points to a real struggle, unless your camera can handle high ISO (I'm not familiar with Canon bodies so can't comment), or unless you buy some nice fast glass. An f4 lens won't be any use whatsoever unless you use flash throughout, but then you need to be confident with what you're doing with regards to flash. You mention bouncing, but what if there's nothing to bounce off?

Even 2.8 will make for a tough wedding if the lighting isn't great and the ISO performance isn't up to scratch. A wedding at night is the last thing I'd want if I'd never done a wedding before, but if they're happy with the fact you're not a pro and will just do your best, then the pressure's off.

Sorry if this sounds negative, but you really need to be prepared for a really tough night, as it seems it might be just that.

Body wise, I am hoping to get a 7D, 5DmkII or a future release (60D ), so should produce clean images at iso 1600 at least...

I will have couple of primes for sure - both for the low dof shots and hoping it will help at night... I am thinking about 50mm f1.4 and 85mm f1.8.

I was just looking at some of the pictures I took at my cousin's wedding last year, and they look pretty good. I had the kit lens with the built-in flash for that. I am hoping the lighting will be similar.

To be honest, I am confident about the reception bit. The lighting may be problematic with the ceremony but if it is similar to the other venues, it should be bright enough.

 

[Raymond Lin]

2.8 is not fast enough at night if you want shots with nice atmosphere. I often shoot 2000 to 3200 iso with f/1.4 to f/1.8 on the 5D2 with flash. I do that because i like to capture the light in the room as well. But I need a lens that does wider than 50mm and faster than 2.8, and that doesn't leave me much choice!!!!!!

 

[steve.82]

5d2, 70-200 a good flash and a fast prime I would suggest. What's your budget?

 

[LongLensPhotography]

You could get away with 2x bodies and 2x primes like 35mm f/1.4 (or f/2 at least) and 85mm f/1.8 plus 2x 580EX mk1.
5D series is very nice, but I can't see a reason why 450D can't do a decent job as a second.

f4 zoom should be capable for >90% shots, particularly with 5D mk2 high ISO capabilities.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

2.8 is not fast enough at night if you want shots with nice atmosphere. I often shoot 2000 to 3200 iso with f/1.4 to f/1.8 on the 5D2 with flash. I do that because i like to capture the light in the room as well. But I need a lens that does wider than 50mm and faster than 2.8, and that doesn't leave me much choice!!!!!!

2.8 is OK for wideangles, where longer exposures are acceptable. f/2 is minimum for anything past 35mm in that darkness.

 

[existent]

5d2, 70-200 a good flash and a fast prime I would suggest. What's your budget?

I am still researching the prices there. Once I get a figure, I'll ask for %60 - %70 of it... which I think should get me couple primes and a flash...

Myself, I would say, a new body and another prime...

You could get away with 2x bodies and 2x primes like 35mm f/1.4 (or f/2 at least) and 85mm f/1.8 plus 2x 580EX mk1.
5D series is very nice, but I can't see a reason why 450D can't do a decent job as a second.

f4 zoom should be capable for >90% shots, particularly with 5D mk2 high ISO capabilities.

So do you think 30mm + 85mm primes would be better choice then 50mm + 85mm?


I am hoping to go back to Cyprus for the Christmas break. If I do, I'll make sure to visit the venue to see the lighting.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

So do you think 30mm + 85mm primes would be better choice then 50mm + 85mm?

50mm and 85mm are too close together, particularly if 50mm is on crop and 85mm on FF. I think 35mm will give you more choice.

 

[Greywolf]

I am not a wedding photographer, but I have done 3 weddings for friends, relatives. The main two lenses I used were the 24 - 105 and a Sigma 70 - 200 f2.8


I'm photographing my stepson's wedding in Spain at the begin of September

My kit will be

Canon 7D
Canon 40D (backup)
nifty 50 f1.8
Canon 24-105
Canon 100mm macro 2.8 IS
Sigma 70-200 f2.8
Canon 580EX Flashgun
reflector
Tripod if I can afford the weight
many cards,
many batteries
Chargers

 

[gman]

Just a small point which I never see mentioned, but try and get high capacity rechargeable AA batteries for the flash unit, say at least 2800mAh. (better still get one of those external power thingys)

I did a wedding reception about 2 weeks ago using flash and shooting at 6fps was testing my flash unit to the max!

As for the lens etc, I'd go for the Canon EF 24-70mm f2.8L USM and also the speedlite flash unit. It's an expensive lens but at least your setup allows you to go wide with the 10-22 (where the flash will be more effective) and longer with the 24-70mm (where the flash won't be so effective but you have the fast lens).

Besides, it's not just the speed that you want but also greater creative choice with the shallower depth of field.

Forgot to mention, if you are going pro then I'd choose the 5D MkII over the 7D. The 7D is far too high a pixel count on a cropped sensor and regardless of the new "gapless" technology, I believe that not only will it create more noise but the quality of each pixel will suffer a little also. Just my opinon.

 

[existent]

50mm and 85mm are too close together, particularly if 50mm is on crop and 85mm on FF. I think 35mm will give you more choice.

Sigma 30mm it is then

I am not a wedding photographer, but I have done 3 weddings for friends, relatives. The main two lenses I used were the 24 - 105 and a Sigma 70 - 200 f2.8


I'm photographing my stepson's wedding in Spain at the begin of September

My kit will be

Canon 7D
Canon 40D (backup)
nifty 50 f1.8
Canon 24-105
Canon 100mm macro 2.8 IS
Sigma 70-200 f2.8
Canon 580EX Flashgun
reflector
Tripod if I can afford the weight
many cards,
many batteries
Chargers

Thanks for the list Greywolf. Was it difficult with 24-105 or the flash helped out with the f4 lens?

Just a small point which I never see mentioned, but try and get high capacity rechargeable AA batteries for the flash unit, say at least 2800mAh. (better still get one of those external power thingys)

I did a wedding reception about 2 weeks ago using flash and shooting at 6fps was testing my flash unit to the max!

As for the lens etc, I'd go for the Canon EF 24-70mm f2.8L USM and also the speedlite flash unit. It's an expensive lens but at least your setup allows you to go wide with the 10-22 (where the flash will be more effective) and longer with the 24-70mm (where the flash won't be so effective but you have the fast lens).

Besides, it's not just the speed that you want but also greater creative choice with the shallower depth of field.

Forgot to mention, if you are going pro then I'd choose the 5D MkII over the 7D. The 7D is far too high a pixel count on a cropped sensor and regardless of the new "gapless" technology, I believe that not only will it create more noise but the quality of each pixel will suffer a little also. Just my opinon.

Even though 24-70 would be ideal, I think I'll try to stick with 24-105 with a couple of fast primes.. I recently bought the 24-105 and I can't justify replacing it for a one-time event.

I would definitely prefer the 5d over 7d even though it would mean replacing my ef-s lenses. Being a landscape guy, 5d makes more sense... But the cost is always an issue . At the same time, I have almost a year to find one...

 

[Raymond Lin]

What gear you can get away with and what you can do a good job with is night and day difference. Some venue yiu can get away with f/4, some you will be struggling with even a 2.8.

 

[steve.82]

Just a small point which I never see mentioned, but try and get high capacity rechargeable AA batteries for the flash unit, say at least 2800mAh. (better still get one of those external power thingys)

I used lithiums on my last wedding. I got 12 so there would be enough for 3 battery sets, at's still going strong on the first set a few months on!

I've been plotting kit changes for the next one too so may as well chime into this thread...

I just sold my 400d and 18-55 IS (my backup)

This leaves me with a 50D, 70-200L f2.8 IS, 50 f1.8 and a cheapo Jessops flash.

Kit I'm looking at for the next (mid September), a 5D mk1 or 2 (fund dependent), a 10-20 (on the way) and a decent flashgun (or 2 or 3) with relevant off camera kit, softboxes and tripods etc.

My plan is to keep the 10-20 on the 50D and use the 50 prime and the 70-200 on the 5D which should cover the focal range relatively nicely. Maybe pop the 70-200 back on the 50D for the candids. I managed all the group shots and formals last time with the 70-200 on a crop sensor (checked for suitable space at the venue beforehand) so hoping this will be even more suitable on a 5D.

 

[Raymond Lin]

I know people always preach on about photography is not about the kit, it’s the photographer. Well, this is one field of photography where I think the kit can make or break you. Weddings.

I have upgraded my kit substantially in the last 2 years and it shows in the work I produce. The kit gives you options and opportunities to shoot at conditions that you wouldn't dream of perviously, conditions where it makes an average photo into a portfolio shot.

I went from

30D + kit lens + 50/1.8 + 550EX

to

30D + Tamron 17-50 + 50/1.8 + 550EX

to

5Dmkii x 2
16-35L 2.8
24-70L 2.8
50/1.4
85/1.8
135L 2.0
580EX mkii
550EX

35L 1.4 should be purchased this week.

If you give me a 30D with a kit lens now, I might be able to see the shots but there is no way I could capture them all in the same detail as what I have now. Also, running 2 cameras with 2 lenses simultaneously means you are much less likely to miss a shot. Wedding moments are just moments, miss it and its gone, and changing lenses takes time.

 

[Arkady]

These were taken with "nothing-to-bounce-off" on-camera flash with f/2.8 lenses outdoors about 30 minutes after sunset in Afghanistan - darkness falls about as quickly there as it does in Cyprus once the sun has set fully.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/arkady001/sets/72157622651946823/with/4093362360/

As you can see, in order to freeze the action, you need reasonably fast shutter speeds, which means you can't balance for ambient light very well...the background fades to black pretty effectively.
No matter how you do this, with only one light-source you're going to be a bit FUBAR'd - I would seriously consider hiring more lights to add as much illumination as you can to this event.

 

[Greywolf]

The inside shots were nearly all taken with the 24-105 and flash.

At the 1st wedding I did in the church (no Flash) I used the 70 - 200 firmly clamped on a tripod with a shutter release. It was an absolute pig because there were no decent sight lines.

As far as batteries go I use sony eneloop rechargeables. Once charged they hold their charge for weeks. BUT I always carry two sets of duracell or similar non-rechargeables just to be on the safe side.

Please bear in mind that I am NOT a pro. I help out friends amd family who ask.

 

[existent]

These were taken with "nothing-to-bounce-off" on-camera flash with f/2.8 lenses outdoors about 30 minutes after sunset in Afghanistan - darkness falls about as quickly there as it does in Cyprus once the sun has set fully.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/arkady001/sets/72157622651946823/with/4093362360/

As you can see, in order to freeze the action, you need reasonably fast shutter speeds, which means you can't balance for ambient light very well...the background fades to black pretty effectively.
No matter how you do this, with only one light-source you're going to be a bit FUBAR'd - I would seriously consider hiring more lights to add as much illumination as you can to this event.

True.. Compared to here, since you usually get clear skies, light disappears very quickly once the sun goes down the horizon.

I was looking at some of the pictures from some other wedding photographers from Cyprus and the ambient lighting seems to be reasonably bright. I am pretty sure they don't use any extra lighting but the reception venues usually have lighting similar to flood lights at least where the bridge/groom stands and the dance area.

The inside shots were nearly all taken with the 24-105 and flash.

At the 1st wedding I did in the church (no Flash) I used the 70 - 200 firmly clamped on a tripod with a shutter release. It was an absolute pig because there were no decent sight lines.

As far as batteries go I use sony eneloop rechargeables. Once charged they hold their charge for weeks. BUT I always carry two sets of duracell or similar non-rechargeables just to be on the safe side.

Please bear in mind that I am NOT a pro. I help out friends amd family who ask.

I appreciate all the info mate. I am no where near pro either so hearing from a fellow amateur helps

 

[SimonBalaam]

This is a great thread. Going to be very helpful to me hopefully (although i'll be using Nikon kit) as I will be doing my brother in laws wedding in a little under 2 years (I know a long way off). His in Cyprus too at around 4pm in July.

 

[existent]

apologies for bringing back an old thread, but I am trying to finalize on the lenses I need so I can tell them what to buy for me.

I now have a 5DmkII as my main body, together with 450D as backup/secondary.

I will be using 24-105mm on the 5D as main lens, but not sure what can I use on the 450D?

some of the lenses I am considering are:

1. 50mm f1.4 + 85mm f1.8
2. 135mm f2
3. 70-200mm f2.8 or 70-200mm f4 IS

Because 70-200 is much more expensive, I may rent it for the wedding and ask for the primes...

50+85 looks like better value but they cover the similar range as 24-105, so maybe 135 might be a better choice for the candid shots?

 

[seriousrikk]

Remember - you don't want to have to be changing lenses during the wedding - ie as the action is happening.

50 1.4 would be my choice to put on the 5D - it is far more suited to the night time wedding with good ambient light than the 24-105mm. Use the 450D with the 24-105 and flash where needed. Or put a 100mm F2 or 135mm F2 on the 450D and use that for the tele work.

 

[existent]

Remember - you don't want to have to be changing lenses during the wedding - ie as the action is happening.

50 1.4 would be my choice to put on the 5D - it is far more suited to the night time wedding with good ambient light than the 24-105mm. Use the 450D with the 24-105 and flash where needed. Or put a 100mm F2 or 135mm F2 on the 450D and use that for the tele work.

I definitely agree. I would be happier without any extra lens to carry...

5D with 50 is not a bad idea either...

 

[Radiohead]

Do they know how much this is likely to end up costing them and that for less that the outlay they can pay someone else?

 

[existent]

Do they know how much this is likely to end up costing them and that for less that the outlay they can pay someone else?

That's the thing... I am trying to make sure it costs less than what it would cost to pay others. Bear in mind, this is in North Cyprus and there arent many choices...

 

[Rutherfordium]

Do they know how much this is likely to end up costing them and that for less that the outlay they can pay someone else?

your first wedding and you're going to charge them the cost of a 135L?! I'm sure they could get a pretty decent experienced photographer for that £700+ quid.

And I think renting a 70-200 then asking them for the 135 might look a bit cheeky, to me it would sound like you're no longer covering your costs but getting a nice kit upgrade for yourself.

If they're aware that they're effectively paying you a fee then fair play, you should be getting paid for the work, but if they think they're just covering your costs then I think just charging them to cover the rental would be fairer.

 

[david1701]

85 on crop will do for candids as its like a 135 on ff just lacking in the lovely DoF

 

[existent]

your first wedding and you're going to charge them the cost of a 135L?! I'm sure they could get a pretty decent experienced photographer for that £700+ quid.

And I think renting a 70-200 then asking them for the 135 might look a bit cheeky, to me it would sound like you're no longer covering your costs but getting a nice kit upgrade for yourself.

If they're aware that they're effectively paying you a fee then fair play, you should be getting paid for the work, but if they think they're just covering your costs then I think just charging them to cover the rental would be fairer.

They asked me if i want to do their wedding and offered to buy me some o the equipment i will need.

I am trying to get away with the minimum stuff as I don't like asking for it. I even asked what's their budget for it. And believe me, if I were trying to get a kit upgrade I'd ask for 24L or similar wide angle lens. I don't have much use for lenses like 135L. I am trying to decide what's the minimum I can get away with: hence why i dont want to ask for a 70-200. 135L is a bit cheaper but still a lot.

I'd be happy with a 50mm or a 85mm. I am just trying to hear others opinions