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I too hope the OP will return and update us
Here's another one you could quote, from an ancient photographer called Garry Edwards. "Lost sheep masquerading as sheepdogs"As it was too late for the OP to receive my offer of a better camera, I can only hope it went well - It'd be nice for the OP to share his experience and maybe some images.
And during my recent forced sabbatical - i had time to study a little ancient philosophy:
Here's a couple of quotes from Marcus Aurelius that some might find useful:
For the OP
The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them know anything about the subject.
It ought to be easier on the internet to spot the opinions of those who know nowt, but unfortunately it isn't.
And for my new 'friend' (you know who you are):
If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.
I would have posted Saturday when my ban ended - but I was busy running a portrait photography workshop.
I would have posted Saturday when my ban ended -
Apparently nowadays it’s considered rude to point out when people are spouting nonsense.Wait! What? .. You got banned? seriously.. haha its like the old days.. wedding threads and people getting banned... Well done you
Strange that - I do it all the time and haven't been banned - yetApparently nowadays it’s considered rude to point out when people are spouting nonsense.
I joined the staff when I was asked, because I realised my own personal kind of Yorkshire "forthright" would probably see me with more short forum holidays than time available for posting. It's only the constraints of keeping (marginally) professional about how I word things that stops it even now...Strange that - I do it all the time and haven't been banned - yet
I think that this highlights the problem with wedding photography threads, which always seem to end badly.Just to elaborate on the suitability of gear for weddings.
I’d never choose to shoot a wedding on an entry level camera. Simply because they often make things more difficult than they ought. (I’d never recommend shooting anything with an entry level camera - they’re not designed for taking pictures).
@SwissPhot
A word about weather resistance - the bride will be in a dress that cost thousands of ££s, will have spent over an hour on hair and makeup. If I absolutely need her outside in the rain, it’ll be for 2 minutes with a brolly, and a brolly or a plastic bag are all I’ll need to protect even the least weather resistant camera.
Cameras with ‘old sensors’ aren’t gonna suddenly be incapable of taking photos. As long as the photographer is aware of the limitations of the camera. I was shooting weddings with 7d’s when many amateur gear snobs were spouting that the sensor was incapable of anything beyond 800 ISO, oddly it never seemed to bother my customers that their wedding album contained images that had some noise in the shadows.
In conclusion: you’ll need 2 cameras you’re familiar with, a couple of fast zooms, or primes, and a spare just in case. A speedlight, though 2 or more is better with a remote trigger.
If I was doing it again tomorrow I’d want a couple of R6’s, cos they make my life so easy. But that doesn’t mean I couldn’t do it with a couple of 40d’s.
Whilst what you say makes sense, I'd mention I dont know a single wedding photographer who started with 20k worth of gear, nor for that matter any mechanic (and we've two in the family) who started with thousands of pounds of snap-on tools. They bought a cheap tool kit to start their training and built up from there, often on credit with the snap-on van that goes around.I think that this highlights the problem with wedding photography threads, which always seem to end badly.
People just don't understand what can go wrong when photographing weddings, which is anything and everything!
Cameras jam up for no reason, and so do flashguns. I've never had an actual fault, but when the camera doesn't work because a setting has been accidentally changed the result is the same, no camera, and then the backup comes out of the bag. Anyone who hasn't had that problem has very little real-world experience.
These problems are far more likely to occur with entry-level cameras, which tend to be small and fiddly, especially for people like me who have large hands. And, speaking of back up equipment, ideally it should be identical. I've never had that myself, when I did wedding photography my main camera was a D3 (fine in the pouring rain) and my second camera was a D700 (same image quality but with slightly different layout and not protected against the weather) and my flashguns weren't identical either, but with a lot of experience (as I was a full-time pro) these differences weren't a big problem. But even swapping lenses could be a challenge, sometimes the zoom control was push-pull, sometimes it was twist, and even this slowed things down a bit - all lenses should have identical controls too.
But, if we explain in a wedding thread that the starting point is £20K in equipment it doesn't go down well, and someone is bound to say that a phone is good enough (which it may be if the photographer is just a guest and expectations are very low) and that an entry-level camera is a real luxury. This wouldn't happen with other specialties, for example if someone wanted to start a small business doing van deliveries nobody would suggest that an old rust bucket of a Transit van is good enough, everyone would accept that a new Mercedes costing £35K is the absolute starting point. My own youngest son is an agricultural mechanic, his Mercedes van carries over £60K in tools, nobody would suggest that he could manage with a toolkit. from a pound shop . . .
What people don't always get, when they ask questions on a forum, is that some responders know what they're talking about and others don't,and there's no way of knowing which is which, and the people who do know are likely to say things that they don't like.
And, of course, it isn't just about equipment, skill and knowledge and the ability to produce the right results under all lighting and weather conditions, it's also about handling the people. Many "photographers" complain about "Uncle Joe" spoiling their shots by getting in the way, taking his own shots. I never had that problem, I just had a quiet word and told them to keep out of my way. I'm not a people person and don't even understand the concept of tact, but I never allowed anything or anyone to get in the way of the job that I was paid to do. Just a couple of times I had to go further, and to say, in a very loud voice, that if they did that just once more I would go home and leave them to finish the job, and peer pressure and embarrassment would work the miracle - how many amateurs would do that?
I accept that. My first solo wedding was over 60 years ago at the age of 16, a neighbour asked me to be their photographer, I didn't charge much and I fancied her sisterWhilst what you say makes sense, I'd mention I dont know a single wedding photographer who started with 20k worth of gear, nor for that matter any mechanic (and we've two in the family) who started with thousands of pounds of snap-on tools. They bought a cheap tool kit to start their training and built up from there, often on credit with the snap-on van that goes around.
Every body has to start somewhere. I would guess most wedding photographers started by doing friends or family weddings with the gear they happened to have, be that a top of the range or entry level. Then word goes around, Fred took nice pics at his brothers wedding, ask him. It builds from there.
Theres a lot of camera "snobbery" go to any camera club to see it in action, first question you'll often get asked is what camera do you have? Say any non top of range and get a frown in return. The fact is pretty much any entry level camera is more than capable that producing a stunning wedding album, even on the auto setting, in fact most compacts could do it these day.
Ok they may not be weather sealed, but I've been doing weddings over 50 years, and I can not remember a single time I've been standing out in the pouring rain with a B&G, shes paid a £150 for a hair-do, £100 for make-up and a £1k for a dress, not happening.
Pro cameras are generally better, better in low light, safer with dual card slots and built tougher, but then I dont knock nails in with my camera, and I've never had a card fail at a wedding... and I have flash for low light
As it was too late for the OP to receive my offer of a better camera, I can only hope it went well - It'd be nice for the OP to share his experience and maybe some images.
And during my recent forced sabbatical - i had time to study a little ancient philosophy:
Here's a couple of quotes from Marcus Aurelius that some might find useful:
For the OP
The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them know anything about the subject.
It ought to be easier on the internet to spot the opinions of those who know nowt, but unfortunately it isn't.
And for my new 'friend' (you know who you are):
If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.
I would have posted Saturday when my ban ended - but I was busy running a portrait photography workshop.
A most important consideration is in boldface printIn conclusion: you’ll need 2 cameras you’re familiar with, a couple of fast zooms, or primes, and a spare just in case. A speedlight, though 2 or more is better with a remote trigger.
If I was doing it again tomorrow I’d want a couple of R6’s, cos they make my life so easy. But that doesn’t mean I couldn’t do it with a couple of 40d’s.