wedding togs with children

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joescrivens

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How do you guys find it having children and working every weekend? If those children are at school during the week it means you hardly ever get to spend time with them at all - how does that work in your families?
 
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I was thinking about this the other day and I began wondering "what if".

One scenario - what if, you're halfway through shooting a wedding and you get a call to say your little one has had an accident/become ill/whatever and been taken to hospital? What do you do? For me I know the answer and I'd suspect any other parents would say the same but then rushing off would mean messing up someones big day - what would you do? Obviously if I was shooting a wedding my phone would be off, but ignore that sort of thing, you've got the call, its serious and and there you are halfway through. How would you deal with it?
 
Although I don't do weddings, I suppose it's like anything where your weekends are 'taken' so to speak...

I used to fish pretty much every weekend, both days, travelling up and down the country, leaving at some stupid times and not getting home until late evening. I couldn't imagine that kind of commitment these days now I have a nipper - I spend enough hours through the week at work not seeing him get up or getting home after he's gone to bed, so those weekend days are precious. However, it was my choice to do this on the weekend whereas working togs rely on their weekend work - the distinction between having to earn money and how much money you want to earn must be hard to define...
 
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I've often thought of this and it's really the main reason I wont contemplate making a jump into paid shoots. If you've got a contract with someone you're leaving yourself wide open to law suits if you dissapear.

Personally, I know my wife would cope with the kids and leave me to shoot for a minor emergency, but in a life or death situation I'd be straight to the kids and whatever happened in court would be secondary (if it got that far).
 
Ste Manns said:
One scenario - what if, you're halfway through shooting a wedding and you get a call to say your little one has had an accident/become ill/whatever and been taken to hospital? What do you do? For me I know the answer and I'd suspect any other parents would say the same but then rushing off would mean messing up someones big day
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I think any parent would be the same. I know that no matter what I was doing, if something happened to one of my kids, they would be my first and only priority. And I think most people would be understanding in that situation, even of they don't have children themselves.
 
So what do guys do that work on the rigs? They can't just down tools and nip home.
 
So far this year my daughter has been in 2 accidents. i am here for her but her dad alas can't just nip home when anything happens.
It's like anyone who work just the weekends., not just photographers.
 
Or soldiers on active duty or people on space stations? Thats totally irrelevant though as we aren't talking about rig workers or astranauts are we?
This is one reason why I don't do weddings, personally I believe any wedding photographer parent who didn't leave a job in order to go to their injured/seriously ill childs bedside is probably inhuman and doesn't deserve reproductive organs but that's just my opinion, nothing is more important to me than my little girl ;-)
 
gumbo-67 said:
It's like anyone who work just the weekends., not just photographers.
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oh I know, but this is a photography forum, I'm asking the photographers, if it were a general web forum I'd ask all weekend workers.

I'm asking because it could be me in the future and am curious about what it is like
 
I think I would need to qualify the situation first.

Ditching a wedding because a child has cut their finger would be a no, getting a call that they've been run over by a train and are in ICU would be a different matter.
 
EspressoJunkie said:
But I'm sure that if it was a serious situation they would make every effort to get to their child as soon as was possible.

Any parent would get to their child as quickly as they can, no matter what.
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Yep, if its a flying day (Mon to Fri) you'll usually be able to get the first chopper home regardless of whether it's due to go to your platform or not.
 
its a job, you do the work when you have to. If you don't like that, move on. You choose to become a wedding photographer, and with it comes working at weekend. Same for shop workers, opticians, Nurses referees, footballers etc.
 
Richard King said:
its a job, you do the work when you have to. If you don't like that, move on. You choose to become a wedding photographer, and with it comes working at weekend. Same for shop workers, opticians, Nurses referees, footballers etc.
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Well that's obvious. But what is it like? Do you have other times you get to see your kids that week workers don't?? Like maybe you're there after school when others are still at work etc?
 
I am having a great time second shooting. the photographer is was working with was encouraging me to take on weddings as the primary photographer.

My first Daughter arrived in May this year, now that weddings are causing massive friction on our home life as I am never at home, so I am having to give them up.

I really like my day job. its more stable than being a wedding photographer and now that I have seen the industry I'm sure I would be better off in my day job. That being said I am REALLY going to miss shooting weddings, but hopefully I will have more free time to spend with my family and sort through the tens of thousands of images I have collected.

Stuart
 
Thought that's what the other half was around for, and Grandparents.

Kids get better after illness etc... running out on a job will kill your reputation and kill your business.

You have a job during the week ? Stick to it. Then you won't have that problem.

shall I run and hide? Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Family? If it's anything like the one near us I'll get a cat.... Less hassle. less expensive.

Thing is if you are self employed you have to put job first or you will all end up homeless and up the creak. Family has to pitch in if you self employed.
 
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I'd think you'd get to see the kids during the week if you are full time at it. I know you are going to want to get as much work as possible but you will have to edit and pp at some point so do that at home and see the kids at same time.

Like you I plan to do this eventually. My Missus understands I will work weekends but it's not going to be every weekend! I'd like to meet a wedding tog who is booked every sat and sun of the year!

But to my family it's better than at the moment where I get sent away for months at a time to afghan etc.

If something happened to either of my boys I would be home as soon as I could. Even from afghan, being the RAF they are much more accommodating than the army for things like that.
 
your immediate family is more important than any job

it is not a question of not being able to pay the bills, because your immediate family is more important than bills

you choose your job by your own free will, if it doesn't work out you cut your cloth financially to fit your income, if flippin burgers allows your immediate family to become your priority, so be it.

we all have to make compromises, your family does too, its where you draw the line that matters.
 
i shot a wedding when my wife was 8.5 months pregnant, it was our friends wedding and she was there as a guest. I'd already said that if she went in to labour i'd stay and finish the wedding. Labour can take a while.

As for editing etc, that is the tricky part especially with the hours I work. I find that photography editing takes place from midnight until the early hours. I just cut down on the sleep, getting 3-6 hours a day when a job is on.

My day job is stable, and with the new bingo game released on Facebook it looks like we're going to be doing even better so I'd be stupid to leave it. So, I have to make do. You really need to want it to do it. It's not easy!
 
Daryl said:
Thought that's what the other half was around for, and Grandparents.

Kids get better after illness etc... running out on a job will kill your reputation and kill your business.

You have a job during the week ? Stick to it. Then you won't have that problem.

shall I run and hide? Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Family? If it's anything like the one near us I'll get a cat.... Less hassle. less expensive.

Thing is if you are self employed you have to put job first or you will all end up homeless and up the creak. Family has to pitch in if you self employed.
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I couldn't agree more Daryl, particularly in a business where you are judged on results, and a "no show" for whatever reason will kill the business.
We know a couple with two young lads, and the missus does hardly anything (off loads the kids to her parents), but she makes endless calls to her OH (who has a very responsible job), meaning that he has to dash home for "emergencies".
Having a family and running a business put different demands on people, and responsibilities have to be recognised, and decisions taken.
 
Daryl said:
Thought that's what the other half was around for, and Grandparents.

Kids get better after illness etc... running out on a job will kill your reputation and kill your business.

You have a job during the week ? Stick to it. Then you won't have that problem.

shall I run and hide? Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Family? If it's anything like the one near us I'll get a cat.... Less hassle. less expensive.

Thing is if you are self employed you have to put job first or you will all end up homeless and up the creak. Family has to pitch in if you self employed.
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the thread seems to have swerved to be about when a child has an emergency, that's not really what I wanted to discuss.

I want to hear from parents who have to work weekends and if they feel it has meant less time spending with their children and if they regret it or not. If they have found that they have time at other parts of the week instead and if this is enough.
 
Surley that is only a question you can answer? as it is entirly dependant on how your kids are developing and much parenting you feel your kids need and how the dynamics of your domestic life are working.

Stuart
 
stu_the_flat said:
Surley that is only a question you can answer? as it is entirly dependant on how your kids are developing and much parenting you feel your kids need and how the dynamics of your domestic life are working.

Stuart
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doesn't hurt to get others views though, I won't know until it happens, how it will affect me.
 
Raising kids is the most important job in the world, finding a balance between work or hobbies that take time away is a judgement call. Being 100% available for kids isn't good either, they have to realise that the world does not revolve around them, however you only get one opportunity at it, so make it count, the rewards are worth it.
 
The job I have now is the first job where I haven't worked weekends, never thought about it really, had a few things happen on a Saturday, did I Webber run out of work, no. Kids were sting by a swarm if wasps when I was at work wife took them to hospital, I didn't leave work, there was nothing I could do. Then when I gotthe job I am in now and the wife got a job working Saturdays one of my daughters fell and fractured her shin, I didn't phone the wife she was at work and again nothing she could of done, so just got on with it.
 
I spent the last 4 months as an assistant/second shooter and was away.... a lot (main tog was 2 hours from me). I have 3 boys, the middle one has a heart condition, which is always a niggling worry in the back of my mind. I almost never had my phone on me, only checking in when the couple were having their meal. I too would have dropped everything if any of my kids had been in a serious accident. I suppose it depends on what you consider serious. A bump to the head I would think my hubby could deal with, maybe even a broken limb that was plastered and sent home (although a few years ago my middle boy broke his elbow in 2 places and ended up in traction for a month - something I would have rushed home for).

My kids are a little older now, 11, 8 & 4 in Nov, I doubt I could be away as much if they were babies. My youngest is not in school (I home schooled the other 2 until last year) and so I spend the days with him and edit in the evenings once the kids are in bed. So far it suits me. Anything I earn from photography is supplementary to my hubbys wage so even if my business was to take off I would probably make sure I don't book up every weekend. Hard to say for sure right now as am just starting out.
 
My partner died suddenly when my children were 6 and 9 (while I was working) I was lucky enough to have family to help look after them on days when I had wedding booking.
Now they are grown up so it's not a problem, in fact I suspect they are looking for someone to keep an eye on me now...
 
joescrivens said:
the thread seems to have swerved to be about when a child has an emergency, that's not really what I wanted to discuss.

I want to hear from parents who have to work weekends and if they feel it has meant less time spending with their children and if they regret it or not. If they have found that they have time at other parts of the week instead and if this is enough.
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That's my fault, and reading your original question properly it appears I've partially derailed a direct question thread and not added to an interesting debate about wedding photographers with kids - I'm sorry for that.

By way of apology I'll answer your question from my perspective. I currently work 8.30 am till 5.00 pm Monday to Friday in a job I hate. I get stressed and due to health issues I'm drained after every day at work - it feels to me I'm giving my best to make someone else very rich. I am therefore slowly working towards working for myself in photography - it's slow but I'm getting there. Unfortunately I don't have lots of spare money and certainly no capital but I have at least managed to invest in pro gear so on that score I'm advancing at least. I do photography jobs in my spare time and at weekends and I'm now getting busy at last. At some point I'll have enough work to justify leaving my 'day job' or at least that's the plan (a lot more work to do before then).

The way I see it - I'll most likely have to work a lot harder. I'll be working less convenient hours, probably most weekends. However I know I'll be less stressed (well, I'll still be stressed but it'll be different, it's my stress not someone elses stress) and at least I'll be doing something I enjoy. As a family our quality of life will be better. As for time spent with my little girl, the aim is not necessarily to have more time with her, but the time I do get to spend with her will be better. Instead of a grumpy and tired misery she'll have her dad back. That makes all the hard work worth it.

Some of these ideas may sound naive to some, well I'm not daft and I do know how things work, but these are aims and goals. It's got to be worth a punt. I know there are sacrifices to be made but it's got to be better than dying young of a stress related heart attack, miserable and pennyless, and having never had any quality time with my family.

The idea is to be able to book work around family commitments as much as possible - so I'd be able to go see her Christmas nativity play or easter parade etc. That isn't an option right now. We'll be able to have family holidays which we just can't right now.

The other thing is, if I succeed there will be something for my little girl to be involved with should she wish, when she's old enough, she'll have that option which is more than she'll have if things stay the way they are now.
 
Daryl said:
Thought that's what the other half was around for, and Grandparents.

Kids get better after illness etc... running out on a job will kill your reputation and kill your business.

You have a job during the week ? Stick to it. Then you won't have that problem.

shall I run and hide? Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Family? If it's anything like the one near us I'll get a cat.... Less hassle. less expensive.

Thing is if you are self employed you have to put job first or you will all end up homeless and up the creak. Family has to pitch in if you self employed.
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This suggests to me you don't have anyone in your life. Daryl I see your point but I'm not talking about chicken pox or something less important like that. What if your beloved child was in a serious RTA and was on life support - are you seriously suggesting you'd finish your wedding commitment before attending the hospital? As it happens we don't have anyone - it's me and my partner and my daughter, nobody else. I'd be on my way to the hospital before the camera hit the floor, the only time this would be different is if it simply wasn't physically possible to get to her.
 
Ste and Joe. A & E stuff of course you you drop and go.

Right I tell the true story.

Isle of Wight late 80's a chap had built up 1 mini lab 7 Pro lab on the Island and employed a few of us. We could run the biz no probs with out the boss around

The Boss's wife was having a baby and they had lots of close family to help and be at hand.

there was some complications, turned out not so serious but every phone call he closed and ran home.

Closed a biz that was the only one on the Island and very busy.

Trouble is he would not let his staff stay there to carry on with the jobs. He also would not let any of us have keys... and many days we turned up and he did not because of the wife demanding him to be there.

so what happened. This business could have been fantastic and groown to a great size.

clients got ****ed off and sent work to the mainland. they even askled me if i wanted to set up on my own and give me their business. I was young and loyal so said no.

The story end was, business folded as ran home for every call. Lucky it was never serious..

but he lost the company. he then had huge debts and lost the house and all the other bills of LIFE.

so you tell me? Debt! No money! No help from Banks, Growing family soon to be homeless?

YEAH RIGHT You will stay married for a long time with all those extra pressures.

After screwing up his and everyones life and putting extra stress on relitives he went into depression.

STE. I have lots in my life fella... But I will not loose what gives you a life and family food on table to drop a shoot or job for every call that may or may not be life threatening.

you evaluate the seriousness of the situation.

My boy falls out of a tree and breaks his arm. I will ask is he ok? check everything is cool and see him when i get home.

I would not run out on a job because of that or Flu. It would have to be serious.

Oh and three of us lost good jobs......
 
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Joe, I have the next few weekends either working the two days or having most of one day eaten up by work (mainly travelling might I add, which adds to the frustration). I'm not relishing not seeing my little boy.

It annoys me that as an employee, there is a certain pressure to conform to standards of flexibility that are often set by singletons who can spent whatever time they want to at work. I know there is supposed to legislation in place to support working parents but as is the case with where I work (a small company, 70 people), it's often overlooked that you are a parent and you're lumped in with the singletons as either a 'can do' person, or a 'can't' person. Because the singletons are available then the parents are expected to be as well. At least until you highlight the issues....

Thankfully, I do have some flexibility (some days I finish early, some days I can work from home) but if you're working for yourself like you're obviously aiming to do, then it's obviously going to be you who decides when you work and how long your hours are.
 
Had to work so many weekends over the last few years. I do however look after my three children during the week so i'm kind of lucky in that respect.

means so much when we have a family day out at the weekend from time to time though.
 
As a full time mum of 2 and a full time tog, I don't mind working weekends as it gives me some time away from the kids it also gives my husband some alone time to bond with them (and he can then see just how hard it is).

If I've not got a wedding booked in for a weekend , I've usually got photo shoots but I do limit the number and do make sure I also book weekends off so we have some good family time.
 
Joe, you are fortunate that you can see your kids everyday, take it as blessing that even a kiss goodnight whilst they are asleep should be enough for any parent who is working hard, mainly to provide for their futures.

Analysing every scenario of professional photography is not good for your mind.
 
tiler65 said:
Joe, you are fortunate that you can see your kids everyday, take it as blessing that even a kiss goodnight whilst they are asleep should be enough for any parent who is working hard, mainly to provide for their futures.
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I'm of a different frame of mind to this. I'm a very hands on parent. If I had to work all day and all weekend and the only time I got to see my children was to kiss them goodnight whilst they were asleep just so I could provide a future for them financially I wouldn't see that as having a life at all.

That's not a judgement on those that choose that life. It's just not for me.
 
Ste Manns said:
That's my fault, and reading your original question properly it appears I've partially derailed a direct question thread and not added to an interesting debate about wedding photographers with kids - I'm sorry for that.

By way of apology I'll answer your question from my perspective. I currently work 8.30 am till 5.00 pm Monday to Friday in a job I hate. I get stressed and due to health issues I'm drained after every day at work - it feels to me I'm giving my best to make someone else very rich. I am therefore slowly working towards working for myself in photography - it's slow but I'm getting there. Unfortunately I don't have lots of spare money and certainly no capital but I have at least managed to invest in pro gear so on that score I'm advancing at least. I do photography jobs in my spare time and at weekends and I'm now getting busy at last. At some point I'll have enough work to justify leaving my 'day job' or at least that's the plan (a lot more work to do before then).

The way I see it - I'll most likely have to work a lot harder. I'll be working less convenient hours, probably most weekends. However I know I'll be less stressed (well, I'll still be stressed but it'll be different, it's my stress not someone elses stress) and at least I'll be doing something I enjoy. As a family our quality of life will be better. As for time spent with my little girl, the aim is not necessarily to have more time with her, but the time I do get to spend with her will be better. Instead of a grumpy and tired misery she'll have her dad back. That makes all the hard work worth it.

Some of these ideas may sound naive to some, well I'm not daft and I do know how things work, but these are aims and goals. It's got to be worth a punt. I know there are sacrifices to be made but it's got to be better than dying young of a stress related heart attack, miserable and pennyless, and having never had any quality time with my family.

The idea is to be able to book work around family commitments as much as possible - so I'd be able to go see her Christmas nativity play or easter parade etc. That isn't an option right now. We'll be able to have family holidays which we just can't right now.

The other thing is, if I succeed there will be something for my little girl to be involved with should she wish, when she's old enough, she'll have that option which is more than she'll have if things stay the way they are now.
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sounds good, I get the point of it being more about quality of time than quantity.
 
joescrivens said:
I'm of a different frame of mind to this. I'm a very hands on parent. If I had to work all day and all weekend and the only time I got to see my children was to kiss them goodnight whilst they were asleep just so I could provide a future for them financially I wouldn't see that as having a life at all.

That's not a judgement on those that choose that life. It's just not for me.
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When I was a kid, my dad worked shifts. I didn't see him when I got up to go to school and when I got home he wasn't there either. As it happens my dad was a terrible dad anyway so it's probably a good thing but that's not the point. Looking back I feel like I missed out. A lot. I remember going to school and hearing other kids talk about what they did with their dads over the weekend and I couldn't participate. Whenever we did see him he was bad tempered and if I'm honest we were terrified of him.

I am determined not to be like that, even now working my crappy job I spend as much time as I can playing with Julia my daughter. Whenever we can we go out, even if it's just to the local shopping centre window shopping. One of Julia's favourite things is to go to certain toy shops - she doesn't beg for things she just likes to look (I'm sure that will change!!) but the point is we make sure we do spend that time doing the things she likes to do. We occassionally go for 'chippies', eating out is another of her favourite things. It makes her day to spend a few hours doing these simple things with her mummy and daddy. I could be at home doing my own stuff like my dad would have done when I was a kid or I can spend the time with my little girl.

When I'm working for myself although I won't really have more time, I'll still do these things, we'll encourage her to get involved with stuff she's interested in and I'll book work around her requirements as much as possible in order that she has a full life. Being self employed means I will be able to have an hour or two midweek, some weekends and I will be able to have holidays (that's mainly a money thing more than a time thing)

I'm rambling a bit, but I'll tell you a story. My mother and father owned a small shop a few years ago. My dad was 75 and my mum in her 60's. They both worked from 7 am till 9 pm in that shop. Then my dad would do the books till around 11 pm. They never had a day off - he even opened a few hours on Christmas day. When I was ill in hospital, they couldn't come visit - what about the shop! I nearly died but the shop was more important.

Instead of an active retirement after working all their lives, my mum died young suddenly, and finally my dad sold up and has now retired, a lonely old man with regrets. What was the point?

There are more important things in life than work - your family being topmost. Money is important of course (don't we know it) but it's not everything. And Daryl, I am sorry I didn't want my post earlier to sound so derogatory. However, a business is great but not more important than everything. I'd gladly give up everything I have for my daughter, any good parent knows this is true. They're your number one priority, and responsibility. I wasn't suggesting you ditch all your clients for a little johnny who fell out of a tree and grazed his knee. My question was if you got the call that your kid was on life support following a big accident, or something as serious. Not being able to 'do anything about it' is irrelevant surely, you'd want to be there and sod the consequences?
 
Weekends can be the worse times to have spare time as that is when everyone else has spare time so everything takes longer, is more crowded etc,.
As long as you get time off in the week and don't work every single weekend it is okay for me. I did shift work until my son was 10 or so and worked every other weekend (12 hour days or 12 hour nights). However I got lots of time off in the week which was used well.

If you have a 9-5 job and work every weekend you may find you just don't get the time you want and something will have to give. This is not even just about kids, I don't understand people who work all the hours possible, when do they do what they want to do? I would hate to look back at my life when I retire at 75 (realistic age these days!) and think all I ever did was work (especially if working for another company)
 
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