What the hell did I do wrong here

What aperture did you use?
Presumably you took the shot at 1/160 or there abouts and aperture was too low so that the background is under exposed.
 
With flash, there are always at least two exposures - the flash and ambient. Here the ambient is simply under-exposed, and the usual fix for that is to drop the shutter speed (assuming you're not in HSS mode). Or reduce flash power.

BTW, for technical questions, full details are usually required. Can't read much in the LR panel.
 
The two flashes lighting your wife are at least two stops brighter than the background.
You had two options
reduce the flash power relative to the background
or increase the background exposure.
In this case the flash exposure was only slightly over exposed, so reducing the shutter speed would be the better option.
 
What Richard said, you need to consider the bg exposure then adjust your flash power for your subject, it's straightforward once you're used to thinking it through.
 
HoppyUK said:
With flash, there are always at least two exposures - the flash and ambient. Here the ambient is simply under-exposed, and the usual fix for that is to drop the shutter speed (assuming you're not in HSS mode). Or reduce flash power.

BTW, for technical questions, full details are usually required. Can't read much in the LR panel.
Click to expand...
Sorry Richard......I thought you guys could see the LR detail.
Flash TTL
Camera Manual
Shutter speed 1/320
Apature f8
ISO100

Would I have been better of in say Shutter priority at whatever but lets say 320 and then let the camera and flash figure the rest out?
 
Phil V said:
What Richard said, you need to consider the bg exposure then adjust your flash power for your subject, it's straightforward once you're used to thinking it through.
Click to expand...
Phil
Hers's the scenario, Model canceled the trip so I asked my wife to stand in (Big Mistake) It should have been the other way around :)
Anyway we decided to still drive the 60 miles to get to the Boat graveyard and when there the weather wasn't that great. Anyway I got all the lighting gear out of the car and set up just to listen to the old lady bitching about this that and anything so in kicked Mr Stress and I basically just started shooting without really taking much time to check the settings etc etc.
Anyway with my fumbling around and now my old lady getting p***ed of at me with my fumbling around we decided to come home. I can still hear my wife saying sarcastically "1, 2. 3 Blur :)
Getting two models on Sunday and now trying to figure out how to leave the old lady at home..............i wish
 
ndwgolf said:
Sorry Richard......I thought you guys could see the LR detail.
Flash TTL
Camera Manual
Shutter speed 1/320
Apature f8
ISO100

Would I have been better of in say Shutter priority at whatever but lets say 320 and then let the camera and flash figure the rest out?
Click to expand...

The advantage of TTL flash exposure control is speed and ease of operation. It will usually give you a decent exposure straight off the bat, first time - and that's very useful in a lot of fast-moving situations when things change quickly and you hardly have time to think, let alone make adjustments and take a test shot.

But when you have more time and control, such as in a set-up situation, then full manual is the preferred option. You can fine tune the exposure better, adjust the flash/ambient balance, and the exposure won't get thrown out when the model changes from a light to a dark top, or you change the background. Even the model moving from the centre to the side of the frame can change a TTL exposure. Also, in TTL it's almost impossible to know what power the flash is operating at, so you can't learn from it.
 
ndwgolf said:
Flash TTL
Camera Manual
Shutter speed 1/320
Apature f8
ISO100

Would I have been better of in say Shutter priority at whatever but lets say 320 and then let the camera and flash figure the rest out?
Click to expand...

No, shutter priority would not have helped you to get the photo that you wanted. Manual all the way if you want to be fully in control of your photos.

Leaving every other camera and flash setting exactly as they were, if you had reduced your shutter speed by one stop (to 1/160s) your background (or rather, everything lit only by ambient light) would have been one stop lighter (that is, twice as light). This might very well have been enough. Many people like the background to be a stop or so underexposed in photos of this nature.
If this still did not give you the flash:ambient balance you wanted you could have reduced your shutter speed by an additional stop (to 1/80s). Your background would then have been another stop lighter (two stops brighter than in your posted example, four times as light).
 
So am I correct in thinking along the lines of shutter speed changes Ambient light and aptitude changes subject..........is that some what correct and as a general rule of thumb have subject only 1 stop brighter than the background.
Ile get there just needing some guidance :)
 
expose for the background fill flash your subject the flash is too harsh IMO the shutter too fast ISO too low. I was always taught that the best way to shoot outdoor flash portraits was like this. It is not an easy thing to do takes a bit of patience and practice.
 
ndwgolf said:
So am I correct in thinking along the lines of shutter speed changes Ambient light and aptitude changes subject..........is that some what correct and as a general rule of thumb have subject only 1 stop brighter than the background.
Ile get there just needing some guidance :)
Click to expand...
You could have kept the same shutter speed, but instead opened the aperture to say f/5.6. That would have given one more stop for the ambient lit background. It would have changed the depth of focus though.
 
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GeeJay57 said:
You could have kept the same shutter speed, but instead opened the aperture to say f/5.6. That would have given one more stop for the ambient lit background. It would have changed the depth of focus though.
Click to expand...
It would have changed the depth of field, not depth of focus - but, more to the point, it would have increased the effect of the flash exposure by the same amount as the increase to the ambient exposure, so would make no difference.

The rule here is simple - changes to either ISO or aperture affect all aspects of the exposure equally.
Changes to shutter speed affect only the ambient exposure
 
Garry Edwards said:
It would have changed the depth of field, not depth of focus - but, more to the point, it would have increased the effect of the flash exposure by the same amount as the increase to the ambient exposure, so would make no difference.

The rule here is simple - changes to either ISO or aperture affect all aspects of the exposure equally.
Changes to shutter speed affect only the ambient exposure
Click to expand...
Thanks for clearing that up..
 
ndwgolf said:
Phil
I got all the lighting gear out of the car and set up just to listen to the old lady bitching about this that and anything so in kicked Mr Stress and I basically just started shooting without really taking much time to check the settings etc etc.
Anyway with my fumbling around and now my old lady getting p***ed of at me with my fumbling around we decided to come home. I can still hear my wife saying sarcastically "1, 2. 3 Blur :)
Getting two models on Sunday and now trying to figure out how to leave the old lady at home..............i wish
Click to expand...

I think I married her sister , they just don't understand.
 
metroman said:
I think I married her sister , they just don't understand.
Click to expand...
No they never will understand.

Not their fault they are not interested in our 'toys'.

Are you interested in needlecraft or Zumba? (Apologies if you are)

Best kept separate!
 
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ndwgolf said:
So am I correct in thinking along the lines of shutter speed changes Ambient light and aptitude changes subject..........is that some what correct and as a general rule of thumb have subject only 1 stop brighter than the background.
Ile get there just needing some guidance :)
Click to expand...

You will Neil (y) As usual, you've rather jumped in the deep end but are doing all the right things - shoot, ask questions, read up, shoot some more, rinse and repeat.

Note Garry's post re shutter speed - it's particularly useful because it allows you to control ambient exposure separately, while flash power obviously only affects flash exposure, so those are your two main controls. Both aperture and ISO affect flash and ambient equally, but also note that when using high speed sync mode (one of the main features of your Profoto B1) that the flash then becomes ambient light, so shutter speed will affect that too.

Also, why did you use two flash heads for that shot? You don't have to use them just because you've got them! And the second flash has killed all the modelling from the main flash giving a flat result. Always start with one light, the main key light. That's often all you want (maybe with a reflector on the shadow side) but only add additional lights on a creative 'needs' basis.
 
Garry Edwards said:
The rule here is simple - changes to either ISO or aperture affect all aspects of the exposure equally.
Changes to shutter speed affect only the ambient exposure
Click to expand...
Thanks Gary
Just a quick one....... if say I increased ISO from 100 to say 640 then increased the shutter speed from 250 to 2000 would that then darken the ambient light?
 
HoppyUK said:
Also, why did you use two flash heads for that shot? You don't have to use them just because you've got them! And the second flash has killed all the modelling from the main flash giving a flat result. Always start with one light, the main key light. That's often all you want (maybe with a reflector on the shadow side) but only add additional lights on a creative 'needs' basis.
Click to expand...
Thats what they had on the Profoto youtube video. One light on the face and the other light as a rim light with the rim light set a +1
But your defiantly right I need to go back to basics and learn how to shoot with one light then progress from there.
I will head out with the beauty dish (easier to travel and handle) and get that working and move onto the rest.
This is my wee collection;

View attachment 29698
 
ndwgolf said:
Thanks Gary
Just a quick one....... if say I increased ISO from 100 to say 640 then increased the shutter speed from 250 to 2000 would that then darken the ambient light?
Click to expand...

Yes, but only by 1/3rd stop - think it through. But what happens to your x-sync speed?

With flash in daylight, you're always juggling two exposures, often hindered by low flash power and the limitations of x-sync shutter speeds. The Profoto B1 has good power and also the option of high-speed sync (with substantial loss of effective brightness) but they're not a get-out-jail free card. The ambient light level sets your working baseline, and you'll have more room to manoeuvre in less than bright sun, ie in shade, or an overcast day, or later in the day. If you can start with mid-range settings on everything, that'll give you most scope - an ideal might be 1/100-ish shutter speed, ISO400, f/5.6-8, flash on quarter power, all options open.
 
Richard
Does the Focal length rule of thumb still apply when shooting flash? What I mean is if I pick say a shutter speed of 1/100 and I am using my 70/200mm at 200mm then I would then need a minimum shutter speed of say 200 ideally 300 (hand held) is that correct?
 
Thanks for all the feedback...........here is the best of what I shot that day and location location location still rules and this is not a nice location for a model/wife shot
Will try again tomorrow.
View attachment 29752
 
ndwgolf said:
Richard
Does the Focal length rule of thumb still apply when shooting flash? What I mean is if I pick say a shutter speed of 1/100 and I am using my 70/200mm at 200mm then I would then need a minimum shutter speed of say 200 ideally 300 (hand held) is that correct?
Click to expand...

It's still a factor, but there are some mitigating conditions. First of all, I would assume you're using VR on that lens so that gives you a comfortable two or three stops buffer. Then the flash duration is going to be faster than shutter speed, quite probably a lot faster. Your only worry is subject movement, if there is any, that might show some ambient blurring around the sharp flash image.
 
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