Why you should shoot FILM

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Saw this linked on Ken Rockwalls' site today. A very interesting read it is too.
 
Someone linked to this a while back on the film forum. A very interesting read!
 
Oh the forgotten joy of Velvia. For me the biggest problem with Digital is getting the printing right.I have got some great stuff on disc--but when I want to print a copy it takes several goes to get it anywhere near decent.However being a naturally lazy bugger --the immediacy of Digital is a drug that will be tough to break-----Its that instant gratification thing.The article is spot on though and the cams were oh so solid by comparison.
 
It's wonderful to wax lyrical about film, and be all nostalgic about the magical process of the darkroom. But it's all romantic nonsense. Just like a beautiful classic car is a wonderful notion, it just can't compete with the latest technology for the daily commute.

Bottom line with film, is that it loses on every count. Film is harder to use. More expensive. Slower. There is less control. And the results are not as good. The fact that sloshing about in the darkroom is far more fun than pushing buttons on the PC, does not bridge the gap. Sadly.
 
TIME.......he doesn't mention time pressures though, nor ease of delivery. The days of Red Star delivery of processed trannies are long gone!
 
I'd never really shot film until I started seriously getting into photography. In fact, I'd not shot film "properly" until the end of last year. I never had a camera as a kid, or not one to speak of (an old Kodak 110 film camera was about my lot), so I don't have the same nostalgia about film as other people probably have. Film seems like a lot of fun and there's that whole thing about film being sent off (or taken to Jessops) and you getting it back an hour or a day/couple of days later. It kind of feels more "real" to me than digital for some reason. That said, my digital camera is my mainstay and I love it. I love the results I can get out of it, I love how it looks and no one can tell me otherwise that the D700 isn't a damn sturdy camera. I could use it as a (very expensive) cosh, if needs be! It will always be digital first for me but film is a lot of fun all the same.
 
film is fun, its never going to be as easy as digital, but it is something else to do and feel a bit nostalgic in the darkroom
 
HoppyUK said:
It's wonderful to wax lyrical about film, and be all nostalgic about the magical process of the darkroom. But it's all romantic nonsense. Just like a beautiful classic car is a wonderful notion, it just can't compete with the latest technology for the daily commute.
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no - and I agree to a point. It can't compete for the daily commute, but when you want something that will be that bit special .................
 
HoppyUK said:
Film is harder to use.
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No.

HoppyUK said:
More expensive.
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No. How much film and processing can you get for the price of a new DSLR every two or three years?

HoppyUK said:
Slower.
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Doesn't need to be but sometimes that's a good thing.

HoppyUK said:
There is less control.
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There's plenty of control. Just not as easy as pushing a few keys.

HoppyUK said:
And the results are not as good.
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Theyr'e not as good, they're much better. Digital may just about match 35mm for resolution but medium format and large format are in a different league entirely. Plus negative film has more latitude and dynamic range.

HoppyUK said:
The fact that sloshing about in the darkroom is far more fun than pushing buttons on the PC.....
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Which is why I do it instead of digital.



Steve.
 
steve smith , well said ,,,,and whats more some people actually enjoy using film ,,,,so we do
 
The things digital has in its favour are:

1. Convenience.

For pictures which need to be ready very quickly, it's the obvious choice. In my opinion, newspaper images are the only things which meet this criteria. Although magazine picture editors, etc. think that just because they can have their images now, then they 'need' them now.

In the history of photo-journalism, convenience has won over quality every time. In the 1940s Speed Graphic 5" x 4" cameras were used by most photo journalists. In the 1950s these were replaced with Rolleiflexes - not because the quality was better but because they (and the 120 roll film) were easier to use and process. In 1959 Nikon introduced the F. A 35mm camera system which became the standard tool for newspaper photographers. Now a 35mm negative is no match for a piece of film 5" x 4" or even 6cm x 6cm from 120 film but it didn't matter for newspapers as the quality was enough.

2. Accessibility.

Before digital, you had to be very keen to be an advanced amatuer photographer. Sure, you could shoot your film then send it in for processing and printing but if you wanted the ultimate control, you had to do this yourself. When digital started becoming popular, people already had computers in their homes so it wasn't such a big step to print your own images. Buy an inkjet printer or find some space in your house for a darkroom. If convenience is a factor then the inkjet printer is the obvious answer.

In 2003 I bought a Nikon D100. I stuck with it for a while but didn't get on with it. It wasn't a quality problem as Its results were usually good enough for me but it was the amount of time I spent sat at a computer. I do that at work (where I am typing this now!) so I don't really want to do any more of it at home!

Obviously all people are different and what suits some people doesn't suit others but there is no reason to hate one thing just because you like something else. I have seen loads of great digitally produced images and loads of great film produced images. Equally, I have seen some absolute crap from both mediums too.

So if you like digital, use it. If you like film use that. If you like both then you can have the best of both worlds.


Steve.
 
I don't feel that I'm skilled enough or patient enough to use film.
used to a little when I was younger and just getting interested in photography.
however, if a pro wedding togger uses medium format film...then I'm more or less sold on him/her.
there's a great wedding photographer in nottingham, uses great kit and his results are excellent for the two times I've seen him
 
HoppyUK said:
It's wonderful to wax lyrical about film, and be all nostalgic about the magical process of the darkroom. But it's all romantic nonsense. Just like a beautiful classic car is a wonderful notion, it just can't compete with the latest technology for the daily commute.

Bottom line with film, is that it loses on every count. Film is harder to use. More expensive. Slower. There is less control. And the results are not as good. The fact that sloshing about in the darkroom is far more fun than pushing buttons on the PC, does not bridge the gap. Sadly.
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As Steve Smith said (I know like 3 steve smith's, btw, you must be a common breed :p)

Film isn't necessarily harder to use. It depends on what you were brought up on/what you are used to. I am a digital age kind of guy, and I found film daunting and scary, whereas people I've spoken to who have used film for years and are trying to buy a dslr are overwhelmed by digital and how confusing it is.

It's difficult to compare prices. Digital photography is a lot more of a hit since it is a one off (ish) cost right at the start, whereas traditional photography is spread over a period of time. Take a Canon EOS 1000fn with kit lens - £40. Say you shoot one roll of film a week - £4 - and get it processed next day with 6x4 prints - £5. That's £9 a week. £468 a year, 1900 photos per year.
For people with a reasonably small income, film photography is a nicer prospect because it's a cost that is spread.

Slower, yes, admittedly (not always), but then I rarely mess up a shot on film. I am always happy with my film shots. I take a lot of time and care with film because it's not as disposable as a digital file. As far as processing goes, you can get it dev'd and printed in half an hour at a shop. Not the end of the world.

Less control? Not really.. I'm assuming you're talking about a final outcome.. there are TONNES of things you can do in the darkroom, and photoshop just digitally replicates these things.

Results are not as good? I wonder if you've ever used a medium format camera? You haven't seen detail until you've gone bigger than 35mm!
 
Steve Smith said:
Membership is £10 per year and you get a coupon for £3 off the list price of an official Steve Smith T shirt.
Steve.
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Another one for the fan club (y)

Do the T-Shirts come in bloater size :LOL:
 
Wet Photography was fun and kept me interested for sixty years.
It also Paid for me and my famlies keep and still does, by way of a pension.

However Digital Is fun too. :love:

I have kept some film Kit for old times sake, but as they say I have done that and got the T shirt.
 
I am another film fan, I enjoy working with film and printing in a darkroom. For me however, photography is just a hobby and wouldn't attempt to try and make a living out of it - for one thing I'm not good enough for that, but so long as film is still available I shall carry on using it for the enjoyment it gives.

Unfortunately, what I know about digital cameras you could write on a pin-head, so I'm not able to make a fair comparison as regards to the quality. But with photographers who I've been with, all digital users, I have watched them and do appreciate the advantages digital has to offer.

I agree with other comments about medium-format film. Sadly I don't own an MF camera but I did do some black & white prints from a 6cm x 6cm film and the quality was simply stunning (the film, not my printing). I don't know if digital will ever be able to compare to it.
 
I dunno where all the anti film crap comes from.
Miss-information ?, do peeps spend too much time on digital only forums ?, have they used enough film to actually make a judgement :shrug:
I feel no nostalgia in using it, as an adult born of the digital age and a first camera digital user, I just love film for what it is and what it does, digital ain't all that.....it makes me yawn too much, but choice and opinion is a god given right.

I haven't shot any digital for.....months.

The good news is I've shot a **** load of 120.....:banana:
 
TriggerHappy said:
I'm joining the Steve Smith fan club. Wooo! :LOL:
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Steve Smith is a wonderful bloke. He is my brother in law after all. Or one of them is ;) :D

But if film SLRs are so wonderful, why does nobody make them any more? Because nobody wants them. Ok, Nikon makes one, and so does Canon; they make one each. But they have 15 different DSLRs between them. It's hard to argue those odds.

When talking about film, the whole point about it is doing your own processing and printing. If you don't, why bother? Where's the benefit? And the big thing there is, you need to permanently dedicate a whole room of your house to a darkroom. That is a very big commitment indeed. Since having children, I've not had a darkroom :(

Digital has turned the tables here, in that you can do all your own processing at home today without a darkroom. Just use the family PC :)
 
Supply and demand, hoppy! you're right, few people want them.
There is however a market for them.

And no I rarely do my own processing and printing with film and still enjoy the experience and consider it very different to that of digital.

As you say, I don't have the space in my house for a darkroom, despite the fact I very much enjoy shooting, developing and printing my own film.

I would say that the 2 main benefits of digital are that it is accessible and that it is instant. Not only can I listen to music and write essays on my computer, I also use it as my digital darkroom that can be turned on and off.

Steve Smith said:
It's also a nice new shiny toy to show to your friends!


Steve.
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Also, once you have a 'big' camera, you are considered a professional photographer and you are qualified to charge people to take photos of their wedding in which you consistently blow the highlights, miss the focus and cut off their feet!
 
great thread! Steve Smith for president, how many people do we know that laud film/digital/new/old/man/woman and can still present a reasoned argument for both sides?

Im a digi user, it was the best option for me as Im still new to photography and the sheer amount of stuff I can take photos of, review and correct is astounding. I've taken almost 6000 photos since December and feel like im making progress with my skills because i can shoot away then review what ive done and see where i went wrong. Its a quick hit in terms of cost and results.

BUT as im starting to get a handle not only on my skills but what i want to take photos of im continuously drawn to film. Digital is awesome but theres still something about the way film looks, the texture even the most basic shot has that i havent seen from anything but the highest end digital SLRs. Rose tinted glasses perhaps but if photography is predominantly about the end result surely theres a case for film.

Ok ive not contributed anything to the thread but as a newbie to all things photography and with no nostalgia about film (i didn't get involved with photography as a youngster as film seemed laborious and weird) but as someone who can see some genuine benefits i wnated to say my tuppence worth :D
 
foodpoison said:
And no I rarely do my own processing and printing with film and still enjoy the experience and consider it very different to that of digital.
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You can easily make you digital camera operate in exactly the same way as film, if you prefer it. Select your ISO to 400 or less, and tape it in place. Set record to JPEG, and tape over the LCD. When you've shot 36 pictures, post off your card for processing; you'll get them back in a week. If it's Kodachrome slides, three weeks.

To enjoy the full masochist experience, switch off AF and AE, and tape up your lens at one focal length.
 
fontmoss said:
great thread! Steve Smith for president,
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Yes!.... because we haven't got a president that means he'll be going abroad! (sorry Steve ;) only kidding)

On a serious note your can't turn back the clock, film has had it's day and digital is here. In the same way horse drawn carridges went out and cars came in. Yes theres a few die hards still using them, but you'll never get most people out of the convenience and comfort of their cars, and back to mucking out a stable.
Film was fun, all evening in the dark with smelly chemicals (think health and safety people) wondering if your pics would come out, praying the film would go on the spirals, and cursing if they were still a bit damp from last time, dreading the kids opening the darkroom door at a crucial moment.
Wondering where to buy a new thermometer at 7 o clock on a Saturday night after you just broke yours and you have 10 rolls of film to develop by Monday morning.
Hanging up your films to dry, waiting ages for dust to stick to them, or the cat deciding your film was a new toy in the bathroom.
Then the joy of mixing new smelly chemicals and putting your fingers in them, getting fixer marks on the paper if you didn't wash and dry your hands properly in between, wondering where the hell your print tongs went?.
Trying to find somewhere to lay out 30 wet sheets of 10x8 to dry, your wife telling you "no way are they going on the bed!". The happy hours spent spotting the dust marks and cat claw scratches out of your prints, after your un-stuck the ones that stuck together and trying to wash the developer and fixer stains out of the duvet cover, reading the divorce papers and wondering what it was you did wrong.
Oh the joy we had, do I miss it? No not one bit.
I can shoot pics in the morning, go home and 30 minutes later the computer is printing 30 prints that are dry, clean and finished while I'm having a coffee in the sunshine, trying to stop the cat playing with my D3x. Now thats progress!. Wayne
 
^^^ Haha No idea what you mean Wayne :LOL: :D

Joking aside, that's pretty much how my first marriage ended. Came out of the darkroom at 4am and she'd packed her bags :eek:
 
swanseamale47 said:
Yes!.... because we haven't got a president that means he'll be going abroad! (sorry Steve ;) only kidding)

On a serious note your can't turn back the clock, film has had it's day and digital is here. In the same way horse drawn carridges went out and cars came in. Yes theres a few die hards still using them, but you'll never get most people out of the convenience and comfort of their cars, and back to mucking out a stable.
Film was fun, all evening in the dark with smelly chemicals (think health and safety people) wondering if your pics would come out, praying the film would go on the spirals, and cursing if they were still a bit damp from last time, dreading the kids opening the darkroom door at a crucial moment.
Wondering where to buy a new thermometer at 7 o clock on a Saturday night after you just broke yours and you have 10 rolls of film to develop by Monday morning.
Hanging up your films to dry, waiting ages for dust to stick to them, or the cat deciding your film was a new toy in the bathroom.
Then the joy of mixing new smelly chemicals and putting your fingers in them, getting fixer marks on the paper if you didn't wash and dry your hands properly in between, wondering where the hell your print tongs went?.
Trying to find somewhere to lay out 30 wet sheets of 10x8 to dry, your wife telling you "no way are they going on the bed!". The happy hours spent spotting the dust marks and cat claw scratches out of your prints, after your un-stuck the ones that stuck together and trying to wash the developer and fixer stains out of the duvet cover, reading the divorce papers and wondering what it was you did wrong.
Oh the joy we had, do I miss it? No not one bit.
I can shoot pics in the morning, go home and 30 minutes later the computer is printing 30 prints that are dry, clean and finished while I'm having a coffee in the sunshine, trying to stop the cat playing with my D3x. Now thats progress!. Wayne
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Jeez - that post saved me loads of typing as I could have written it myself (though I don't have a cat)

Film is more 'romantic' just as horses & steam trains are - and as with horses & steams trains there's much more shovelling to deal with too :shake: for absolutely NO benefit

Digi IS the way forwards - living in the past may be fun, but it's less efficient & a waste of time too - a bit like using sticks to light a fire rather than matches

DD - waits for the onslaught of sados living with the dream that uncertainty is fun ;)

:D:D:D

DD
 
Digi is far far far easier than film in many ways and I use it for all my work shoots and have done for all my personal stuff too for nearly two years.

I do miss dropping the films into the lab after the shoot and spending the next couple of hours chilling whilst someone else did all the processing. And then there was no real PP to speak of with most commercial shoots as it was all done by the time the shutter fired.

Film DOES produce a higher quality of image than digital. That's a fact and to deny it is, well it's denial. The thing is that that improvement is hardly ever, if ever at all required.

Film is more fun though and I have some processing kit on it's way to me right now and I'm majorly excited about it. I'm already divorced, I have spare duvet covers and I don't have a cat...... I'm all set. :D

Of course we all know that the real reason people refuse to give film shooting a chance is that they're scared their craft and skill isn't up to the task.

Weeeeeelllll, they're probably right. :LOL:

btw.... the fan club.... I'm in.
 
Film had its day

No not really, Kodak has just introduced a new Ektar film, Fuji reintroducing Velvia and as Steve pointed out in another thread there are lots of companies still making film, paper and chemistry.
Also look at all the people using pin hole cameras and Lomos. Most are young people who, if you are to be believed should all be shooting nothing but digital.

Just because Nikon, Canon etc do not make film cameras does not mean there are none out there. Hasselblad still do (and yes I know they can have digital backs), Alpa, Linhof which are primarily film but can still use digi (best of both worlds).

Plus there is a whole host of Large Format people out there still using film and making some very fine images.

At the end of the day each to there own.

If you use digi great, if you use film then fine, if you use both, then have a paper bag :LOL:,
 
dazzajl said:
Digi is far far far easier than film in many ways and I use it for all my work shoots and have done for all my personal stuff too for nearly two years.

I do miss dropping the films into the lab after the shoot and spending the next couple of hours chilling whilst someone else did all the processing. And then there was no real PP to speak of with most commercial shoots as it was all done by the time the shutter fired.

Film DOES produce a higher quality of image than digital. That's a fact and to deny it is, well it's denial. The thing is that that improvement is hardly ever, if ever at all required.

Film is more fun though and I have some processing kit on it's way to me right now and I'm majorly excited about it. I'm already divorced, I have spare duvet covers and I don't have a cat...... I'm all set. :D

Of course we all know that the real reason people refuse to give film shooting a chance is that they're scared their craft and skill isn't up to the task.

Weeeeeelllll, they're probably right. :LOL:

btw.... the fan club.... I'm in.
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I shot film for 25 years before digi turned up - thank F for digi is all I can say of those 25 'wasted' years

Had I been starting out now with digi as an excited 12 yr old - by now I'd have been... errr... no idea where I'd have been, but it would have been more fun without waiting for someone else to process/FK it up that's for sure

DD
 
25 years of film made you what you are, you can't honestly call it wasted.

My neighbour would like a nice garden but he's too bone idle to do any digging.
He's got the gypsies in, his garden looks like it was stolen from a new build estate and they stole MY washing line and wheel barrow.....and I don't even use digital much.
Wass all that about :shrug:
 
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