Wireless Radio Triggers?

AllFallD0wn

AllFallD0wn

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Nick
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Hi all,

Posted this in lighting, didn't get any responses, so I'm hoping to get a bit of one here.

Basically, I've bought a Minolta flash (5400, to be precise), and it doesn't work with the wireless these days.

A quick google tells me I need some wireless radio triggers. Any advice on what to get? Some photos on eBay showed like a 3.5mm Jack lead, and there are no sockets like that on either my camera (a390) or flash gun.

So what do I need, and can I keep it cheap (preferably ~£20 off eBay?)?

Thanks!
 
I have no personal experience of that particular flash, but as it's an old one you need to check the trigger voltage before using it on a set of triggers as most will only handle 12v and many old flashes put out 300+ volts.
 
AllFallD0wn said:
Been using it fine for 3 days...Minolta film stuff and Sony digital stuff is fully interchangeable
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It's your camera, you can do what you want with it :lol:

Just because it works doesn't mean it isn't doing damage, but like I said, if you're happy to risk your camera for the sake of saving a few quid over buying a proper flash then there's nothing anyone can do to stop you ;)
 
Flash In The Pan said:
It's your camera, you can do what you want with it :lol:

Just because it works doesn't mean it isn't doing damage, but like I said, if you're happy to risk your camera for the sake of saving a few quid over buying a proper flash then there's nothing anyone can do to stop you ;)
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What I'm trying to say is uh....what damage?
 
AllFallD0wn said:
What I'm trying to say is uh....what damage?
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Well, if it is 330 volts and you're putting it through something designed to handle, say, 12v (I'm not up on what the Sony is rated to) then you stand a fair chance of frying something, perhaps just the hotshoe circuitry, but who knows? :shrug:
 
Flash In The Pan said:
330v is probably the trigger voltage, so don't be trying it on your camera's hotshoe :eek:
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I disagree. I think it's the voltage for the external battery pack which supplies power straight to the capacitor. The 5400 is a fairly recent flash which provided TTL to the Dynax range so the trigger voltage is probably only 5V. I'd be very surprised if there's a single TTL flash with a dangerously high trigger voltage. Too many people here give scare stories without actually knowing the facts.

Jonathan
 
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Snapsh0t said:
I disagree. I think it's the voltage for the external battery pack which supplies power straight to the capacitor. The 5400 is a fairly recent flash which provided TTL to the Dynax range so the trigger voltage is probably only 5V. I'd be very surprised if there's a single TTL flash with a dangerously high trigger voltage. Too many people here give scare stories without actually knowing the facts.

Jonathan
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That's what I would have thought. The flash takes its power from its own battery pack and then dumps that power into the light, so surely it wouldn't put any electricity into the camera?
 
Allfalldown - I know Phottix does Minolta/Sony fit triggers and they are very good, much better quality than the cheapo fleabay ones. You can buy from it's online store
 
AllFallD0wn said:
That's what I would have thought. The flash takes its power from its own battery pack and then dumps that power into the light, so surely it wouldn't put any electricity into the camera?
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That's exactly what it does, but like I said it's your camera....
 
Bluetooth said:
According to http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html the trigger voltage is 4.7v, so it should be ok with the ebay triggers.
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No, according to that site the trigger voltage for the 5400HS is 4.7v, so unless the op was wrong initially when he said it was a 5400 he has it's a different flash. Just because they have similar names doesn't mean they are the same - for example a Chinese Vivitar 285HV puts out under 6volts, an earlier Japanese version of the same flash puts out over 200 volts.
 
But the Vivitar 285 is from the pre-TTL era so needs to be checked. The 5400Xi and 5400HS (I can't find any evidence of a plain 5400) are both TTL flashes so will be low voltage.
 
Snapsh0t said:
But the Vivitar 285 is from the pre-TTL era so needs to be checked. The 5400Xi and 5400HS (I can't find any evidence of a plain 5400) are both TTL flashes so will be low voltage.
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As I said, it's worth checking first before putting any unknown flash on your camera or triggers.........
 
AllFallD0wn said:
That's what I would have thought. The flash takes its power from its own battery pack and then dumps that power into the light, so surely it wouldn't put any electricity into the camera?
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Think about a light switch - there's 240 volts across it but the switch is designed to handle it. All flashes convert the battery voltage into a high voltage to charge the capacitor (the conversion causes the whining noise some flashes make). The capacitor is then discharged into the flash tube to make the light. Old flashes used the camera as the switch for this high voltage and the camera basically used a mechanical switch to do the job. As FITP correctly says, using the wrong Vivitar 285 will put this old-fashioned high voltage into your modern camera and fry it. Newer flashes have a load of electronics in them, just like the cameras, which run at voltages less than the battery voltage. The camera is only required to switch the low voltage as the flashes have an internal electronic switch for the high voltage.

If a flash can provide TTL signals for the camera then it will be safe to use (unless anyone can prove me wrong). If it has three of four extra contacts on the hotshoe or uses Minolta's dedicated flash shoe then I believe it will be safe.

I hope this sheds a little light (sorry!) on the potential problem.
 
Flash In The Pan said:
No, according to that site the trigger voltage for the 5400HS is 4.7v, so unless the op was wrong initially when he said it was a 5400 he has it's a different flash. Just because they have similar names doesn't mean they are the same - for example a Chinese Vivitar 285HV puts out under 6volts, an earlier Japanese version of the same flash puts out over 200 volts.
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Yes, it is the 5400HS.
 
Snapsh0t said:
Think about a light switch - there's 240 volts across it but the switch is designed to handle it. All flashes convert the battery voltage into a high voltage to charge the capacitor (the conversion causes the whining noise some flashes make). The capacitor is then discharged into the flash tube to make the light. Old flashes used the camera as the switch for this high voltage and the camera basically used a mechanical switch to do the job. As FITP correctly says, using the wrong Vivitar 285 will put this old-fashioned high voltage into your modern camera and fry it. Newer flashes have a load of electronics in them, just like the cameras, which run at voltages less than the battery voltage. The camera is only required to switch the low voltage as the flashes have an internal electronic switch for the high voltage.

If a flash can provide TTL signals for the camera then it will be safe to use (unless anyone can prove me wrong). If it has three of four extra contacts on the hotshoe or uses Minolta's dedicated flash shoe then I believe it will be safe.

I hope this sheds a little light (sorry!) on the potential problem.
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The flash is TTL capable, it has 4 pins on the bottom which connect directly to sony's hotshoe without any adapters to change it, and I believe it was produced sometime between 1993 and 1999. Hope this helps
 
As Bluetooth discovered, the trigger voltage is 4.7V so it's 100% safe to use.
 
Snapsh0t said:
As Bluetooth discovered, the trigger voltage is 4.7V so it's 100% safe to use.
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Thanks for this. Also the nice description of how the flash works - I had been wondering ;)

So I presume the capacitor charges to the 300v and then it discharges 4.7 into the trigger?
 
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No, the discharge is always at the high voltage. The trigger voltage will always be low and activates an electronic switch (probably a component called a triac or thyristor) that discharges the high voltage from the capacitor to the flash tube. The same component is used to stop the discharge when the camera (TTL flash) or the flash's sensor (auto mode) says the correct exposure is reached.

This is just the bare basics of what, these days, is a seriously complex piece of kit...
 
Snapsh0t said:
No, the discharge is always at the high voltage. The trigger voltage will always be low and activates an electronic switch (probably a component called a triac or thyristor) that discharges the high voltage from the capacitor to the flash tube. The same component is used to stop the discharge when the camera (TTL flash) or the flash's sensor (auto mode) says the correct exposure is reached.

This is just the bare basics of what, these days, is a seriously complex piece of kit...
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Right, so the trigger voltage (4.7v) is pushed out, which then activates something else that shoves the rest out to make the flash. I guess one problem with the old flash is that because of the new camera firmware, the TTL doesn't work right (the flash has TTL, but the camera can't use it because it's not programmed to), but it's nothing big, really. I just adjust the aperture if its over/under exposed.

Got it :)
 
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