2014-2015 Slimming Thread

But doesn't fat also slow it down, so you could say mix it with milk?

I've seen lucozade bottles with fructose as well as glucose. Any good for preworkout?
 
omens said:
But doesn't fat also slow it down, so you could say mix it with milk?

I've seen lucozade bottles with fructose as well as glucose. Any good for preworkout?
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Fat would slow it down too - it's also digested in the stomach. Should be a solid food, not liquid. But...that's over twice the calories of protein, might as well just eat the chicken! :)

Sounds like that lucozade is sucrose (table sugar) - which is a one part fructose to one part glucose blend. Essentially, they are trying to make the drink sound healthier lol.
 
Phil Young said:
Maltodextrin is great for pre workout as it's the fastest digesting carb so I'd go for about 45g worth pre workout (30mins).

Only that, water and whey doesn't really make sense from a biology point of view, even though that's ALL protein powders...If the stomach is empty, all that will happen is the whey / Maltodextrin / water mixture will go to the small intestine where the protein isn't digested. It's actually a bit of a pointless exercise taking whey; for you to digesr it, it needs to stay in the stomach. For that you need solid protein such as chicken, which of course then defeats the object of having the whey...
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Some of the whey protein must be of some use, there is no way I could have developed the muscle I already have on my limited amount of protein from food.
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This was taken back in the summer as you can see my legs need to catch up with my arms etc. When I was training over 10yrs ago I'd say my legs were bigger than they are now and my upper body was smaller. Upper body seems to have responded well to my latest training regime, where as legs haven't. Diet has changed somewhat as I now have to avoid a lot of foods due to psoriasis, hence why it is quite limited.
 
so what use is whey and protein drinks for slimming getting really confused trying to keep up
 
I use whey protein purely because I can't possibly eat anymore food than I already do, so I drink it as a meal replacement whilst trying to build and maintain muscle mass. Whilst I may not be in need of slimming as much as others, I would like to reduce my bodyfat percentage further especially as I seem to carry some on my lower back. Perhaps I'm too old, they say the metabolism slows as you get older, I reckon mine has stalled. :) As Phil has said, slimming isn't so much about exercise as it is dietary intake.
 
bobsbabes said:
so what use is whey and protein drinks for slimming
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Very good question...

I'm not sure they are any good...not how they are advised to be taken. Most of it will be waste when taken on an empty stomach with water...

You don't actually need much protein to maintain so a typical man will only need a modest amount to build muscle anyway.

But!

There's a lot of big guys that endorse products or have a certain value of their apparent usefulness because of their size - as if it was impossible to achieve without it...
 
When I first started training, my protein intake would have been from meals only so quite limited and the muscle mass I gained was limited. It was only after starting on protein shakes that size results started to happen. There is a lot of stuff on the market that is overpriced and if taken as the directions describe wouldn't even last a week. I don't touch those, I buy mine in 5kg bags which last well over a month or more and cost little more to buy than a 900g-1kg tub of the well known brands. Some brands would go straight through me, urine would be bright yellow almost fluorescent:eek:. But the stuff I take now seems fine.
When I was 16 (same height) I weighed 9.5 stone. When I first started weight training at around 18 with no protein drinks and a not so brilliant diet, it went up to 11.5-12 stone. I remained around that weight until I started on the protein drinks and a much better diet food wise and now over 14.5 stone.
 
When I first stsrted training I tried lots of things and whey protein was something that stuck for the 4-5 years I was training. I believed it worked for me and got me some muscle. I didn't KNOW but I believed.

Now, having studied the body and nutrition, honestly, I'm not going to be closed minded due to arrogance, I still don't KNOW, but I have a different belief based on knowledge of the anatomy & digestive system.

I can't see if taken on an empty stomach with water, how useful whey protein is - it will bypass the stomach and go straight to the intestine and that's it for protein digestion...if it's not digesting, it's wasting.
 
Can I just apologise for previously thinking you must be a right little geek, purely assessed from the content on your IT related posts

nilagin said:
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.
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Oh crap, not who I thought you were :exit:
 
Phil Young said:
LOL he is a geek...just a big, cool one lol
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IT, geek, me. I know absolutely nothing about IT. Switch on laptop log on and surf the net is my limit. Not sure who I'm being confused with.
Back to whey protein. If it's worth is limited, I can only assume I have good genetics. I've known other people put in as much effort and not take it and their results have been limited.
 
Phil..... I've had 2 weetabix instead of 4 today. I also had a large mug of PMA too....... "I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix, I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix,I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix" :LOL:
 
Russ77 said:
Phil..... I've had 2 weetabix instead of 4 today. I also had a large mug of PMA too....... "I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix, I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix,I won't be hungry just because I've only had 2 weetabix" :LOL:
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Lol...it'll probably be a couole of hrs...then you'll be hungry again.

You won't be beat!!!
 
nilagin said:
If it's worth is limited, I can only assume I have good genetics. I've known other people put in as much effort and not take it and their results have been limited.
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It's like anything - sticking to what you should be doing 90% of the time is the tough part. I'd bet that you stuck to what you should have been doing more than they did.
 
Phil Young said:
Lol...it'll probably be a couole of hrs...then you'll be hungry again.

You won't be beat!!!
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Just getting to the point now I'm thinking I *need* to eat so I don't think I've done too bad......
 
Phil Young said:
Well said with the 'need'.

It's a good way to think.
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That's what I'm trying to do now.... think if I need to eat or just fancy eating something.

The biggest battles I face are:

1) My just is BORING! I spend long periods with nothing to do which I find leads to random acts of eating.
2) My desk is on the floor above the canteen but it's like a mezzanine floor so first thing in the morning you get hit with the smell of sausage, bacon etc.

With regards to point 2, I would normally "treat" myself to a sausage, bacon and hashbrown roll on a Friday morning. For the time being I'm knocking it on the head as it's only that I fancy a roll and I definitely don't need it!

Oh yeah..... got my packet of wine gums ready for the gym at lunchtime :LOL:
 
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Right, good discussion RE whey protein.

Ok, not being one to let arrogance stand in front of the right answer...

After a lot of reading I can conclude that I'm wrong in what I thought about whey - It's protein bonds are of the kind that are pretty much readily absorbed. This concludes that regardless of it being in the stomach or not, it's readily absorbed in the intestine.
 
Phil Young said:
Ok, not being one to let arrogance stand in front of the right answer...

After a lot of reading I can conclude that I'm wrong in what I thought about whey - It's protein bonds are of the kind that are pretty much readily absorbed. This concludes that regardless of it being in the stomach or not, it's readily absorbed in the intestine.
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Phil, we've not spoken before but I've been lurking in the thread and really appreciate you admitting your error. :)
 
After reading you comments, I was beginning to question why I'd been taking it for many, many years as a supplement between meals to increase my protein intake with considerable gains. Fair play to you Phil for admitting you were wrong (well not wrong, just ill informed possibly). Those muscles need feeding immediately after intense training and whey is the, erm, way, to do that.
 
gazmorton2000 said:
After reading you comments, I was beginning to question why I'd been taking it for many, many years as a supplement between meals to increase my protein intake with considerable gains. Fair play to you Phil for admitting you were wrong (well not wrong, just ill informed possibly). Those muscles need feeding immediately after intense training and whey is the, erm, way, to do that.
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Yeah it took me 2 days researching to get to the definitive answer, which lies in the chemistry of the proteins.

Proteins need digesting before they can be absorbed by the body. They are digested by enzymes into amino acid peptide bonds.

Whey protein is actually made up mostly if tripeptide bonds which essentially means it's pre-digested and ready for absorption with very little effort from our enzymes.

This is most likely the way the biological value is determined - more tripeptide bonds = faster absorption.

If however, the whey is consumed with a protein that is solid, this will naturally cause it to be much slower since the stomach will keep everything in (mostly) until a complete liquid type thing is formed.

Sorry for any confusion folks, hope that is a definitive answer.
 
Had my official weigh in today not as bad as I thought 15.6 which although awful is the same as it was on my last we weigh in 4/12 so actually I am really pleased with that :)


Bad breakfast slice of dried white toast was in a rush but wanted something before school run as I swam straight after.
Lunch whole meal toast 1 and cooked cherry toms on tops quick and easy ( but very messy seeds everywhere lol)
 
Not too bad, bread is useful when you don't eat too much :) don't try to under eat and make that last as long as possible though - a slice of toast will only get you through an hour or so, so when you're hungry follow that :)

Nice start.
 
Am down 1kg today. First time in a month that I've weighed myself. Slow progress but it's still progress.

Forgot to add last night, I've jumped a little in incline bench press from 27.5kg x 8 reps which is all I could manage two weeks ago. Had to miss last week's workout due to work commitments (so focussed on running instead). Managed 27.5 x 12 without issues so went to 30 kg and pumped out two sets of 10 reps.
 
Phil Young said:
Yeah it took me 2 days researching to get to the definitive answer, which lies in the chemistry of the proteins.

Proteins need digesting before they can be absorbed by the body. They are digested by enzymes into amino acid peptide bonds.

Whey protein is actually made up mostly if tripeptide bonds which essentially means it's pre-digested and ready for absorption with very little effort from our enzymes.

This is most likely the way the biological value is determined - more tripeptide bonds = faster absorption.

If however, the whey is consumed with a protein that is solid, this will naturally cause it to be much slower since the stomach will keep everything in (mostly) until a complete liquid type thing is formed.

Sorry for any confusion folks, hope that is a definitive answer.
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Well that's certainly good news, it's nice to know I haven't been wasting my money all these years. Just need to find some variation in my diet now for stuff I can eat that doesn't antagonise my psoriasis.
 
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nilagin said:
That'ste="Phil Young, post: 6034160, member: 39200"]Right, good discussion RE whey protein.

Ok, not being one to let arrogance stand in front of the right answer...

After a lot of reading I can conclude that I'm wrong in what I thought about whey - It's protein bonds are of the kind that are pretty much readily absorbed. This concludes that regardless of it being in the stomach or not, it's readily absorbed in the intestine.
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That

Well that's certainly good news, it's nice to know I haven't been wasting my money all these years. Just need to find some variation in my diet now for stuff I can eat that doesn't antagonise my psoriasis.[/quote]
Tried sunbeds? I understand UV helps with that...
 
Salon sunbeds are the wrong sort of UV light, they are UVA, where as treatment lamps are UVB. I have a small hand UVB held lamp which is ok for small areas so it takes a long time to treat large areas and I end up getting fed up trying to use it before it really sees any improvement. Problem for me is, this time of year the psoriasis seems to get a lot worse and spread further. I probably shouldn't be eating the blueberries and raspberries, but I'm trying to keep a good intake of healthy fruit and veg that I actually like the taste of. I find something that will get it under control and some of it will actually clear, then the next winter it comes back and a lot worse and the treatment I was using no longer works.
 
Here's tonight's dinner Phil.......



It's fairly typical in terms of portion size.

Please don't tell me to cut it down as I don't feel particularly full after eating it :LOL:
 
nilagin said:
Salon sunbeds are the wrong sort of UV light, they are UVA, where as treatment lamps are UVB. I have a small hand UVB held lamp which is ok for small areas so it takes a long time to treat large areas and I end up getting fed up trying to use it before it really sees any improvement. Problem for me is, this time of year the psoriasis seems to get a lot worse and spread further. I probably shouldn't be eating the blueberries and raspberries, but I'm trying to keep a good intake of healthy fruit and veg that I actually like the taste of. I find something that will get it under control and some of it will actually clear, then the next winter it comes back and a lot worse and the treatment I was using no longer works.
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Hydrocortisone cream??
 
Hydrocortisone is too mild for psoriasis. I suspect nilagin will have had various treatments incl topical eg dovonex or even immunosuppressants.
 
Going to unsticky the 2013 one and sticky this one if you want?
 
Not sure if I'm allowed to post here - nothing I need to lose, and already 8% body fat. But for those trying, I'd recommend this blog from Dr. Peter Attia. Just read the "start here" and "about me", and take it from there. My background was cycling 10 hours a week, eating "perfect" and still 16% body fat and struggling with weight. I've read probably 20 or 30 books since then, totally reformed my idea of what a correct and healthy diet is, but the site below is the one that kicked off my thinking and research.

May be useful for some.

http://eatingacademy.com
 
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