do we expect ZERO equipment depreciation..?

[shapeshifter]

not a rant - but a genuine question

I'm not taking a dig at any Seller nor Buyer but this comment got me thinking.....

''...I'd want to buy it for the same price I could resell it at...''

..? the item is now owners (n+1) and is now older with further usage

I can appreciate rare/scarce or desirable kit 'may' even increase in price due to availability
but I would expect some reduction in price upon resale of anything else

.............. this is surely ''renting - for - free''.......................

If you go back to the early mid 70's it was possible and normal to get almost all of the money back on selling equipment due to inflation well in to double figures. I remember selling an OM1 for more than I paid for it after 18 months of ownership. It used to be the case of "if you don't buy it now it will only go up in price" completely the oposite of now. But in those day's you had to do a day's work and save up to buy things not like now where it is expected that future generations will pay for it !

Over 55's only for the like button please.LOL

 

[Phil V]

If you go back to the early mid 70's it was possible and normal to get almost all of the money back on selling equipment due to inflation well in to double figures. I remember selling an OM1 for more than I paid for it after 18 months of ownership. It used to be the case of "if you don't buy it now it will only go up in price" completely the oposite of now. But in those day's you had to do a day's work and save up to buy things not like now where it is expected that future generations will pay for it !

Over 55's only for the like button please.LOL

What a load of cock from the generation who had the best of everything.
From an under 55 with 10 years left on his mortgage who'll maybe get to retire at 65, but will probably have to wait till his wife is 70 (10 years later) to really enjoy it.

We're the generation picking up the tab for the life you thought you'd paid for.

 

[Phil V]

But back on topic; no one should expect zero depreciation, but some people have an innate sense of entitlement.

There are sellers though who refuse to accept the effect of the grey market on their equipment value.

 

[cambsno]

Would you think the same if you were to sell say a Canon 70-200 L lens that you bought for £1200 and were being offered £700 for the year later? Of course you wouldn't. It's ridiculous. By the way the point of feedback on these forums is to build trust and my items are exactly as described. I would say if i'd used them as it'd make not much difference to the price of them. The point i'm getting at is that no-one would expect to see such a loss on a lens so why is it justified with studio lights?

Lenses are different. They can be used for years and years. They will always depreciate less than a body or accessories. Its supply and demand.

 

[scottduffy]

True mate but lights should last a long time too.

 

[gman]

I always feel that I have to sell low but buy high. I've never liked haggling, not saying it's wrong or anything, just something I don't like doing.

 

[Phil V]

True mate but lights should last a long time too.

But it's not really about the % loss.

If you were a buyer, what would you want to save to miss the warranty?

I feel for you, taking that % loss but if you take the postage costs off your original purchase price so you're comparing apples with apples, it's not a huge loss to you really, and given the warranty issue, I don't think it'll be easy to get what you really should for them.

In fact, to be blunt, without a warranty I can buy Godox branded lights that are almost identical, brand new for less than you'd accept for your 'used' lights.

 

[scottduffy]

Point taken. The lights are gone now anyway so it's all done and dusted. Maybe I should have thought more before buying them as in hindsight I just don't have time for them or photography really.

I know warranties are important to some but honestly not to me. I've never had anything fail on me in a short period of time whether a tv, hoover, camera or lens. Most things last and work as the should I've found.

 

[Alastair]

On the infrequent occasions I use the Classifieds, I've found that the Wanted section is the best way as a buyer of getting something for the price you want to pay. It's certainly the best way at the moment of not over-paying for something you want - there are too many overpriced "No offers" listings.

The biggest problem still to be addressed with the Classifieds is below asking price offers that are later withdrawn (often quite quickly), this pushes the seller into discounting the asking price unnecessarily and can start to resemble a Ditch auction of there are a couple of players gaming the system and taking the p***. There is a valid case for an off-screen system for negotiating bids that's only reported publicly once an offer has been accepted - not the PM system though, it would need to be a system with Big Brother oversight.

 

[shapeshifter]

What a load of cock from the generation who had the best of everything.
From an under 55 with 10 years left on his mortgage who'll maybe get to retire at 65, but will probably have to wait till his wife is 70 (10 years later) to really enjoy it.

We're the generation picking up the tab for the life you thought you'd paid for.

What do you mean "what a load of cock"? are you saying what I have posted is untrue? have you actually read it correctly. Items did not devalue anything like they do now. Seems a bit of weird post !

I suggest you read the post again before drink a gallon of strong coffee.LOL

 

[Phil V]

What do you mean "what a load of cock"? are you saying what I have posted is untrue? have you actually read it correctly. Items did not devalue anything like they do now. Seems a bit of weird post !

I suggest you read the post again before drink a gallon of strong coffee.LOL

What I'm saying is that whilst those prices were rising, so was your income, and your pension and savings too, and the value of your home. Simple economics.

Unfortunately now prices are fairly steady for lots of things, indeed when it comes to technology, they're dropping in real terms. And wages aren't rising either, unfortunately house prices are, so you have a huge benefit of living with that inflation, that those of us younger than you will never see.

Your generation got early retirement and second homes, the kids of my generation will be lucky to get on the housing ladder and will maybe never retire.

So what's 'cock' is the notion that people today want everything on tomorrow's money, I'd argue that your generation took more than your share out of the economy leaving not much left for those who follow.

 

[OldCarlos]

I'd argue that your generation took more than your share out of the economy leaving not much left for those who follow.

Phil, In general, most of the older generation saved then purchased, unlike today where credit cards are the norm.

Not sure how `we` are taking more out of the economy than we put in?

I was brought up with the mentality & common sense to live within my means, that many these days simply don't do.

 

[Phil V]

Phil, In general, most of the older generation saved then purchased, unlike today where credit cards are the norm.

Not sure how `we` are taking more out of the economy than we put in?

I was brought up with the mentality & common sense to live within my means, that many these days simply don't do.

Your generation was able to take advantage of house purchases where the average house price was less than twice the average salary. You put money into pensions that gave very generous terms, many baby boomers will have a comfortable retirement as long as their working life. i wouldn't necessarily say anyone's taking out more than they put in, but the maths certainly supports that you had it easier than today's youth could hope for.

 

[Gremlin]

Phil, In general, most of the older generation saved then purchased, unlike today where credit cards are the norm.

Not sure how `we` are taking more out of the economy than we put in?

I was brought up with the mentality & common sense to live within my means, that many these days simply don't do.

I was always taught the same, if you couldn't afford something you saved till you could, none of these pay day loans etc. which throw people
into unrepayable debt, when they default.
I always remember a couple of friends who moved in together and got one joint account so they could hopefully managed
their joint income, then moaned because they only had one overdraft and couldn't live like that !!!!

 

[DeadpanDodo]

Your generation got early retirement and second homes, the kids of my generation will be lucky to get on the housing ladder and will maybe never retire.

Quite true, but you missed out the free further education that was provided to that generation too.

I was brought up with the mentality & common sense to live within my means, that many these days simply don't do.

How can today's young generation live within their means when, if they go to university, enter the workplace with £27,000 of tuition fee debt, and a likely similar amount of living expense maintenance loans around their necks?

Phil is right, my kids generation are likely to struggle to ever afford to buy a home of their own, and may well never get to see retirement, as the age limit keeps on increasing.

I don't resent the "baby boomer" generation for enjoying their good fortune for being born when they were, or for them enjoying their prosperity. But it continually annoys me that they are unable to recognise their own good fortune, nor comprehend that it is today's generation (and tomorrow's) that is now struggling to pay for it.

 

[Alastair]

How can today's young generation live within their means when, if they go to university, enter the workplace with £27,000 of tuition fee debt, and a likely similar amount of living expense maintenance loans around their necks?

I just caught the end of means-tested grants for the first two years before the Student Loan Company took over. Thankfully I was in and out before tuition fees. I can't imagine how anyone can cope with the debt they create. If you graduate with £40k of debt how will you ever repay it?

Timed it right to just make the housing ladder. Again, haven't a clue how the next generation will manage it with the boomers ploughing savings into buy-to-let and rents driven up to beyond mortgage levels.

But I keep getting told to save for my pension.. I'm likely to be in my seventies before pensionable age at the rate the goalposts are moving. There's precious little return on pension investments. And it's a gamble I'll live to enjoy what there is.

I don't resent the "baby boomer" generation for enjoying their good fortune for being born when they were, or for them enjoying their prosperity. But it continually annoys me that they are unable to recognise their own good fortune, nor comprehend that it is today's generation (and tomorrow's) that is now struggling to pay for it.

+1, they look at £40k of student debt and think back to how they cleared twice that on the profit from their first house - without realising that with £40k of debt you can't raise the deposit, you can barely cover the rent.

 

[kendo1]

Quite true, but you missed out the free further education that was provided to that generation too.



How can today's young generation live within their means when, if they go to university, enter the workplace with £27,000 of tuition fee debt, and a likely similar amount of living expense maintenance loans around their necks?

Move to Scotland
My kids will be debt free when they leave university (one just finished last week, one finishes next year),
partly due to free tuition, both having part-time jobs, and Bank of Mum and Dad.

It's called 'planning'.

 

[Phil V]

Move to Scotland
My kids will be debt free when they leave university (one just finished last week, one finishes next year),
partly due to free tuition, both having part-time jobs, and Bank of Mum and Dad.

It's called 'planning'.

Planning that involves moving to a country with a completely different set of priorities.

 

[kendo1]

Planning that involves moving to a country with a completely different set of priorities.

The right priorities.
Education should be the top priority of any forward thinking society.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Getting back to the OP, depreciation is a business concept, not one amateurs should be concerned about. Even some companies would plan their costs to right off the purchase price immediately, even if the cost was amortized for tax purposes. As did councils not that many years ago.

Cameras are worth what ever you can get for them, very few are anything like an investment prospect.
It is only recently that digital cameras have anything like a reasonable second hand market place, even then it only functions at the better end of the market.

The world at large has moved from an inflation based one, to a virtually static one. This is to the detriment of all long term planning and investment, including pensions, savings and house ownership. Neither the governments, banks or stock exchange , or indeed businesses have any idea how to manage or plan in this new situation. The private individual with debts or with money in hand has even less idea. And frankly there is no one out there with any better ideas.

 

[Blank_Canvas]

Of course in the 70s and 80s the Nikons and Hasselblads of the the day were not turned out of the factory as frequently as they are today. They also held their value better.

 

[FlyingShrapnel]

of course - but my question was ..'' is it reasonable to purchase and expect NO depreciation when selling on .....''

i think that will depend on the time scale between buying and selling, if it was like a week to a month, probably reasonable as the item has barely been used even though number of owners has increased by one. Whereas expecting to sell at the same price as purchase a year later is a little optimistic...

 

[strumstrum]

I never buy gear thinking I am going to sell for the same price I paid, I over depreciate if there is such a thing, I once purchased a body brand new, I shot less than 200 shots didn't get on with it sold it less than a month later for £100 less.. I don't mind too much I have always had the 'I am the cheapest' attitude.