Adobe haters, I have a question for you

Catherine Bowlene

Catherine Bowlene

Messages
51
Name
Catherine
Edit My Images
No
So it's basically why are you Adobe haters? :D
I'm asking that because the other day I saw a relatively old article called "If everyone hates Adobe [blah-blah-blah]" (here is it if you are interested- https://fstoppers.com/apps/if-everyone-hates-adobe-why-it-pulling-record-profits-438608). While I know this headline is a huge clickbait and Fstoppers does that a lot, there was also a similar post from Petapixel (https://petapixel.com/2020/02/04/adobe-this-is-why-photographers-are-hating-on-you/). Since both the authors may be biased, I thought it would be interesting to know people's opinion on here. Do you avoid using Photoshop or Lightroom because of the same reasons that were mentioned in the articles (their price, the subscription system, the lack of attention towards their users' feedback) or are there any other reasons for you? And what are your alternatives then?
And if you do not share this opinion at all, what do you think about it? Do you agree with some points or does it seem to you like an attempt to throw a dirt on Adobe's name?
 
I'm not a hater but they won't see any more of my money on their current model.

I have Lightroom 6 - perpetual licence. I got it and I think it's good software but when they moved to a subscription model it didn't suit me.
I might be interested in upgrading for new features but my use is sporadic - sometimes it's months between use. So the idea of paying and annual sub, even on monthly payments doesn't interest me.

If you shoot more or you earn your living then the sub is great value. Getting new features or big fixes asap is also a good thing.
I understand why Adobe wanted to move to a predicable revenue stream and incremental releases rather than hoping that major releases would gain substantial numbers of one off upgrades. It just doesn't suit me.
No hate :)
 
Undoubtedly good software, but I don't want to join a subscription model.

I bought Elements 10 and used that for a couple of years but it had limitations (layers and Pano stitching mainly) so I moved to Affinity Photo which I'm more than happy with.
 
Last edited:
If you just use Lightroom and Photoshop, it might be bearable. I use(d) InDesign and bits of Illustrator. £79 a month.

So, bye bye Adobe, hello Affinity.

I used to upgrade every two versions so Adobe got quit a lot of my money. No more.
 
OK, as all your posts so far are asking questions about various software and what it does, I imagine you're some kind of market researcher and not a photographer at all. Maybe I'm wrong? If that's the case I apologise.

I think the subscription model is only of benefit to people that use them either a LOT or professionally. For them, it will work out cheaper as they have updates on tap without further expenditure. Although I imagine that like me, the majority of amateur photographers would prefer to buy the software outright.

Expensive software has ALWAYS been cracked and pirated and sensibly priced packages less so. I think Adobe should make the full purchase price more affordable so that more people will buy it outright and then replace/upgrade every few years as they need to. That would be too honest though, so it won't sit well with the board and the bean-counters.

It's a sad fact, that huge numbers of people will subscribe and forget; be it the gym, the swimming pool, the golf club, the photography club etc. so that in the long run the business makes profit without effort. That's why auto-renewal is favoured too - they effectively just help themselves to your money even though they know that you're not using the facilities on offer.
 
I think the point to note here is most of the users(obviously not all) but a vast number of users are NOT professionals and do not earn an income from their photography.
that said they still think and rightfully so that their pictures can be improved using editing software. There is a solid market for the software I use On1 and when I made the switch from lightroom/photoshop I was bulls***ted with advertising that said "we are not a subscription platform" which they now are. I am seriously looking at going back to adobe and wished I had stayed where I was. I think this question has probably kickstarted my move back to Adobe. just my honest opinion cheers Mike
 
Sky said:
OK, as all your posts so far are asking questions about various software and what it does, I imagine you're some kind of market researcher and not a photographer at all. Maybe I'm wrong? If that's the case I apologise.
Click to expand...
Wish I could be one, haha! But no, I'm an amateur photographer and a typical beginner who asks tons of questions out of curiosity (and sounds stupid). I do landsapes and occasional shootings for my friends and family, so I'm far from calling myself a professional photographer. Although I enjoy consuming information about editing and different styles and so on. Photography is a hobby for me, not a job, but I enjoy getting knowledge and either discussing things or reading through different discussions. It's just that I don't have any irl friends who would be into photography, too
 
Catherine Bowlene said:
Wish I could be one, haha! But no, I'm an amateur photographer and a typical beginner who asks tons of questions out of curiosity (and sounds stupid).
Click to expand...

My apologies, I'm glad to hear you're one of us. Welcome to the world of photography - a place where only other photographers can understand you. :ROFLMAO:
 
Sky said:
My apologies, I'm glad to hear you're one of us. Welcome to the world of photography - a place where only other photographers can understand you. :ROFLMAO:
Click to expand...
Thank you :D I also enjoy reddit, but this forum looks kind of more credible to me, idk why
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sky
Ask questions Ask questions then when you think you know it ALL ask some more. Learning is the most important part of this Photography game/lark enjoy your time here and if you don't know ASK!!!!!!!!!
 
The subscription model works well for me and its tax-deductible anyway so that's even better

Many amateurs I know have more gear than me and spend more on their gear than me, they also travel for photography far more than I do, so less than £10pcm to edit seems like a bargain

Dave
 
I used to use Adobe's Creative Suite Design Standard at work (Photoshop, Illustrator, Indesign, Acrobat Pro) to prepare technical illustrations. This wasn't something I'd do every day, and I didn't care much about new features, but if I upgraded my PC I might buy the current version of the bundle, for which I had good pricing via a site arrangement, and leave it installed for maybe 5 years. Today, the Creative Cloud rental for a single year would cost me about as much as a perpetual licence for that bundle. For my purposes this would amount to a 5-fold price hike. The cost simply wouldn't be justified when I could do much the same with the three Affinity packages and some free PDF utilities, for less than a single annual Adobe subscription. People who used to use Creative Suite every day and routinely bought all the upgrades may make a different calculation when moving to Creative Cloud, though some still dislike software rentals on principle.
 
Last edited:
The vast majority of the Adobe CC suite is professional software aimed squarely at professionals. If, like me, you earn your money from using their software day in day out, it pays for itself very quickly. It would be false economy to use anything else to be honest. I can imagine many/most amateur photographers wouldn't want to spend the money on it, but only in the same way they also wouldn't want, or need, to spend £10,000 on the latest high-end Mac Pro.

As in most things in life, you get what you pay for.
 
I use Affinity, which is as good as PS by all accounts. I would like a LR equivalent from which I could export RAW files to Affinity. Also Affinity doesn’t have non-destructive raw editing, or very good batch processing, which kind of sucks. I would go with Adobe if it wasn’t for their sub model, but for pros it’s a bit of a no-brainer to go with Adobe if you ask me.
 
I am all for bashing adobe for the subscription model, the cloud gobbling up our data and bugs that seemingly never get fixed. That's all and good and hopefully they will have to hear these voices and react to some extent.

As for the practical side of things it simply gets the job done and it can be done in multiple ways. Go and beat that.
 
I pay my money every month and am continually keeping an eye out for anyone who can do DAM, Develop and Print all in one. I'd even settle for DAM & Develop.

When LR was standalone versions (2, 3, 4, 5 & 6) every new version had to have something worth upgrading to. Same for Photoshop. They had to come up with innovative new features and things to tempt previous version users to upgrade. Most people I know would skip at least 1 version.

When they went subscription model, that all basically just stopped. The Content Aware filter in Photoshop and... er... the Dehaze slider(?) in LR are pretty much the only features useful to me that have been added in the last 5 years. If you look at what was delivered 2010 - 2015 in the standalone versions and compare it to what "innovation" we've seen 2015 - 2020 it's mostly been "performance fixes" that seem to have no effect, and UI changes & renames to move stuff around a bit to make it feel shiny.

2010 - 2015 = LR3, 4, 5 & 6. If you assume £120 per version, that's £480. (Reality is that it was cheaper because you got a discount price for upgrading. Even cheaper if you skipped versions)

2015 - 2020 (and beyond!) = LRCC at £10/month = £600. I know PS is in there but I don't use PS for Photography so value to me is much less. AFAIK, Photoshop has had even less love over the last 5 years.

I'm not happy about Adobe, but there is simply no alternative. Good news is that I don't think it'll be long because while Adobe stagnate and bask in their wealth, the other companies are innovating and working hard to compete. For me Luminar, On1, and X5 all have excellent image editors that offer nothing more than I need, but DAM is lacking and the equivalent of the print module is non-existent.

If the price ever goes over a tenner a month, I'll be saying goodbye unless they actually offer some innovation in their tools.Or maybe I won't... Maybe I'll just moan and groan on an internet forum and pony up the money like a good little sheep... :eggface:
 
Harlequin565 said:
2010 - 2015 = LR3, 4, 5 & 6. If you assume £120 per version, that's £480. (Reality is that it was cheaper because you got a discount price for upgrading. Even cheaper if you skipped versions)

2015 - 2020 (and beyond!) = LRCC at £10/month = £600. I know PS is in there but I don't use PS for Photography so value to me is much less. AFAIK, Photoshop has had even less love over the last 5 years.
Click to expand...

Photoshop is a very major part of the deal and a bread and butter for most photographers. Maybe there are genuinely people who only do basic adjustments on ALL of their work or accept major compromises but the news is that you don't have to accept these limitations like with standalone 2010-2015 or pay quite a bit more for Photoshop CS whatever. So it is cheaper, isn't it?

However it is true that the most impactful updates stopped at LR v7 and theres is certainly nothing new interesting in V10. On the other hand by v7 it was already a mature product, which wasn't quite the case at v5 and v2-3 were rather poor looking back.
 
No hater, I just don't like subscription software, and I don't want frequent updates that change how the software works. I still use LR6, and will move to another supplier when that is no longer good enough.
 
Just want to add my name to all the "subscription-model haters". I can't imagine better software than Lightroom but shelling out £10 pm is a no-no for me. I make do with v6.14. There's only one feature in more recent versions that I wish had and that's having blacks and whites sliders in the various "editing" features (eg brush, grad filter, radial filter) instead of shadows and highlights.

And there's a misconception in several of the above posts - that professionals are more willing to throw their money at adobe than amateurs. If amateurs realised how easy (!) it was to earn a living from photography these days, they would know that wasn't true!
 
jerry12953 said:
There's only one feature in more recent versions that I wish had and that's having blacks and whites sliders in the various "editing" features
Click to expand...

That is seriously my no 1 or no 2 most used local adjustment and worth every pound.
 
Whilst I have an Adobe subscription plan, I don't really agree with the business model. However, I lessen the impact buy buying top ups in the black-friday, new year and prime day deals, and occassionally find offers for a free month's subscription which pushes the payment date back a bit each time.
 
Recently Amazon were selling the 12 month PS/LR subscription for £84.
Can't complain at that price, not many people on here would miss 7 quid a month.

Strange how people judge the value of things, moan like mad about a few quid for software then buy a pint or a coffee.
 
Adobe would probably get much less flack if they'd offered both a perpetual licence and a rental, rather than forcing a subscription on all new users. Packages like Capture One and MS Office (for now) are available via either route. But someone at Adobe has done the maths and figured out that a cash cow they can keep milking is worth far more than keeping everyone happy on the internet.
 
But they own the tripod. It won't be taken away from them and broken in two if they suddenly don't have money.
 
Last edited:
I use 4 of the many apps that form the CC suite, I could use them all if I wanted but have no need for the others, unless I want to play around. As a part time self employed Graphic Designer I need to be using Adobe software, I have used it at every printers that I have worked for over the years so it all comes natural to me, everything just works as it should.
I did try the trial versions of Affinity when I left my previous employer and went it alone, but I could not get away with them, it was just natural for me to go back to CC.

FWIW if you get a trial of InDesign / Illy or such they will send you an Email for a discount :) works out at £30 a month for the whole lot, and as Woof says above it is tax decutable.
 
Pound Coin said:
But they own the tripod. It won't be taken away from them and broken in two if they suddenly don't have money.
Click to expand...

They're not somehow conning you by making out its a rent to buy scheme, you know the score before entering into the agreement.
 
Last edited:
tijuana taxi said:
They're not somehow conning you by making out its a rent to buy scheme, you know the score before entering into the agreement.
Click to expand...
So, because you know the agreement, that makes it OK?

Does it still phone home and stop working if it cannot reach Adobe?
 
Pound Coin said:
So, because you know the agreement, that makes it OK?

Does it still phone home and stop working if it cannot reach Adobe?
Click to expand...

Yes, you agreed to pay for the service, stop paying and its end of, seems fair enough to me.

Sorry, don't understand the second line
 
I hate adobe because i generally hate subscriptions for software.
but I still have LR subscription mostly due to my laziness to work out an alternative. but LR does everything just well enough with ease of use! there is nothing else like it tbh.
 
tijuana taxi said:
Yes, you agreed to pay for the service, stop paying and its end of, seems fair enough to me.

Sorry, don't understand the second line
Click to expand...
The second line is about the software checking with Adobe that your subscription is up to date. If it is not, the software stops working. This is my big complaint with subscriptions. Once you have edited a lot of photographs, you lose all that work if you stop paying so you have to pay for ever, not just a year.
 
john.margetts said:
The second line is about the software checking with Adobe that your subscription is up to date. If it is not, the software stops working. This is my big complaint with subscriptions. Once you have edited a lot of photographs, you lose all that work if you stop paying so you have to pay for ever, not just a year.
Click to expand...

Surely it doesn't delete the previously edited files in your catalog
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top