Anti-photographer attitudes

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Dan
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Every time I think about this it makes me feel so angry..

I like London street photography, but it's not an option at the moment so I decided to explore Aldershot and get some decent exercise.

Q2M - Westgate by Daniel Cook, on Flickr

First day out I'm taking photos, near an outdoor shopping complex and a security guard comes out tells me it's private land and I can't take photos, ok fine. He escorts me off the property onto the street - I ask him where the private property ends so I don't make the same mistake again. He persists to tell me I can't take photos of the buildings because it's private, even though I'm now on public land, he feels the need to watch me as he walks away.

Westgate by Daniel Cook, on Flickr

Next day I go out again, the sun is shining and I'm feeling good. I do a few laps of the high street, then on passing the entrance to an indoor shopping arcade a guy with a fluorescent jacket comes out. He follows me down the street I turn left, and I stop, he stops. So I start moving again and so does he, at which point I just turn around and walk the other way..

So feeling annoyed, I decide to head home, walking down the street I step behind a vehicle to let an elderly woman with a walking frame past, there's a guy in the vehicle who gets out of his BMW and asks if I'm 'taking photos'.

Street Q2M by Daniel Cook, on Flickr

.. almost makes me want to channel the anger into taking photos of all the actual crime that goes on in Aldershot - I assume drug dealing is an actual crime.
 
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Know your rights and stick to them. Don't let some Neanderthal hassle you just because he's a security guard or wearing a yellow vest. If you're on public property you're perfectly within your rights to take photographs - ask him to call the police if necessary and they'll put him in his place.
 
Know your rights and stick to them. Don't let some Neanderthal hassle you just because he's a security guard or wearing a yellow vest. If you're on public property you're perfectly within your rights to take photographs - ask him to call the police if necessary and they'll put him in his place.

By this point of time my mood is ruined, it's a shame it has to come down to this.
 
You could always beat them at their own game and wear a fluourescent jacket yourself:
'Stephen [Gill] says he got the idea for the series because he wears a fluorescent jacket when he's taking photographs and doesn't want to draw attention to himself - when he wears his fluorescent jacket, he says, nobody gives him a second glance.'
 
By this point of time my mood is ruined, it's a shame it has to come down to this.

I can understand that, but even if I never got the photos I was after, I would still have to educate the tosser. I get really angry with obtuse, stupid people. I vote for an IQ cull. ;)
 
I can understand that, but even if I never got the photos I was after, I would still have to educate the tosser. I get really angry with obtuse, stupid people. I vote for an IQ cull. ;)

I shall keep my dark humour to myself :D
 
I have been stopped in arcade and shopping malls a couple times before. After I showed the security person my photographs and what I was photographing they left me alone. Normally I just claim I am just a tourist looking to get a few shots.
At which point they wouldn't want make a tourist feel unwelcome right? ;)

Last time got stopped in Bristol's Cabot circus, was just shooting this
48448987757_f1e79affcb_b.jpg
 
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You could always beat them at their own game and wear a fluourescent jacket yourself:
'Stephen [Gill] says he got the idea for the series because he wears a fluorescent jacket when he's taking photographs and doesn't want to draw attention to himself - when he wears his fluorescent jacket, he says, nobody gives him a second glance.'
LOL! I was going to suggest that myself - there are loads here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=official+photographer+vest&ref=nb_sb_noss



Thanks very much for those links, I will get one as hate being told to move on when trying to take images while in town.
 
Sorry you had so much grief, waste of time talking to the Neanderthals, too thick to understand.
Nothing new though, I remember getting a free gift from AP that was a lens cloth with photographers rights written on it.
 
Its weird how experiences vary so much. I shot my LRPS in Leeds a couple of years back, which included a shot on a tripod in an obvious shopping centre. A guard came over asking what I was doing, I told him, showed him on the back of the camera what I was trying to do, we had a laugh, he radio'd he colleagues and left me alone to shoot

In Manchester too a Police Officer came over to ask what a group of us were doing, I told him, he advised there had been muggings of photographers and said we should stay together in twos+ if we could, we had a laugh, he left us to it

I don't really shoot that must 'Street' with people in it, but when I've done so I've never been asked about it let alone had anyone complain

So sad to hear of others' negative experiences :(

Dave
 
In a very small and now mostly empty shopping centre where I live they have what I would
Call a SAS member on guard , Full kit , sunglasses ( Inside ) the whole kit and caboodle
It's as much as I can do not to laugh , He defiantly thinks he is jack the lad
 
probably best to snipe shots with pocket cameras in these types of areas,

the security are probably bored out of their brain, they see you and think hey someone i can moan at and burn some of my mind numbing shift.
 
You could always beat them at their own game and wear a fluourescent jacket yourself:
I sometimes wear my old yellow jacket when I'm out looking for pictures and it really does seem make me "invisible"! In any case, I generally use long lenses and do my best to stay out of my subjects' view. None of these techniques work every time, of course. :naughty:

Older woman sitting on wall Heavitree Road Exeter DSC01496.JPG

Woman with phone P1130336.JPG

Men in queue at Exeter Bus Station G9 P1013138.JPG
 
Re the INTU video , Looks to me like the " Photographer " deliberately went and looked for a reaction , Why on earth would anyone want to video a static face covering sign ?
 
I've got to avoid these situations because I can't help myself when some jobsworth starts spouting the law.
I'd end up getting arrested....

Me too, but not everyone feels like that and I know of people who would really be upset and intimidated by these thugs.
Usually bullies and not so brave if you can capture them on their todd in the car park when they knock off ;)
 
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I think I have told this story before but my son was photographing using a tripod outside a well-known London Hotel at night (he thought the lighting made a great image) and was taking a wider view. A similar security guard stepped forward but after my son insisted he was in a public place etc, the guard then threatened to use force by smashing up his camera. At this point a man stepped forward and identified himself as a plain clothed policeman who made it clear that he could already arrest the security for threatening criminal damage. He ordered the security guard to clear off and leave my son to continue his legal photography. My son thanked him and he said that he had to now go elsewhere but would brief a nearby uniformed officer to keep an eye on him to ensure no further interference. My son told me that the photograph turned out not to be very special but was very pleased that his rights were upheld.

Again I have said previously that for many of these "private" areas, you can get permission if you ask in advance. It pays be be a club member or student as they are more concerned about why you are photographing. It is best not to capture clearly recognisable image of individuals unless you have their permission.

Dave
 
I think the technical term for the bloke who made those two videos is "plonker". :naughty: :banghead:
 
Unbelievable. Meanwhile, there's a few shoplifters taking advantage of the distraction, two houses being burgled round the corner, a child being abused by her 'uncle' a car being stolen, another being broken into and someone is calling with an emergency and being told that all their officers are busy at the moment, please hold. :mad: :banghead:
 
Oddly enough I have photographed inside the Intu Derby, in the videos above (or Westfield as it was back then). I just sent them an email before I went asking if was ok and the were fine with it, even gave me a pass in case anyone asked. I do think some people, not including the OP in this, go out looking for a reaction.
 
probably best to snipe shots with pocket cameras in these types of areas,

the security are probably bored out of their brain, they see you and think hey someone i can moan at and burn some of my mind numbing shift.

Yes, most certainly. :)




DSCF3082.jpg

Ignore the composition, I was just testing to see how close I could get, without being noticed.

I wanted to try my new camera out today, just to see if I could get photos unnoticed. I was using the Fuji XF10 compact camera, it is a tiny little thing.
I was stood just a few feet away from these people, they did not even notice me. I was pretending the camera was a phone, and I was texting or something, well every other person was on their phone, so I did not stand out.

PS

I was so close, you can see my shadow. lol


DSCF3106.jpg

I was right next to this chap, I lifted the camera as though I was reading a text. He never even flinched, I was just another person reading his texts, or so he thought.




DSCF3100.jpg

Ignore the composition, I was just testing to see how close I could get, without being noticed.

There were police standing at the doorway talking, I stopped and pretended to read a text message. I took a photo, they had no idea I did so. Again, just another person reading his texts. :)
 
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The two police officers clearly do not know the the law but the photographer is not helping himself. No one should be put off street photography which is legal. I do carry identification which indicates than I am an amateur photographer and, on the couple of occasions I have used this, it has worked fine. Normally when out in the street, I wear a badge with my name and Camera Club name which re-assures most people. However, I am always with at least one other photographer. Far from being threatened, we sometimes have people approaching us asking to be photographed.

Dave
 
I think I have told this story before but my son was photographing using a tripod outside a well-known London Hotel at night (he thought the lighting made a great image) and was taking a wider view. A similar security guard stepped forward but after my son insisted he was in a public place etc, the guard then threatened to use force by smashing up his camera. At this point a man stepped forward and identified himself as a plain clothed policeman who made it clear that he could already arrest the security for threatening criminal damage. He ordered the security guard to clear off and leave my son to continue his legal photography. My son thanked him and he said that he had to now go elsewhere but would brief a nearby uniformed officer to keep an eye on him to ensure no further interference. My son told me that the photograph turned out not to be very special but was very pleased that his rights were upheld.

Again I have said previously that for many of these "private" areas, you can get permission if you ask in advance. It pays be be a club member or student as they are more concerned about why you are photographing. It is best not to capture clearly recognisable image of individuals unless you have their permission.

Dave
I hope your son reported the actions of the guard to the hotel manager.
 
Probably, they make these videos to wind up the police and security etc, but he hasn't committed any offences....
You're probably right, although I wonder if a sufficiently determined prosecutor could use section 1 of the Protection from Harassment Act 1997 (legislation.gov.uk) in this case.

Of course, that would rely on the definition of harassment, which is hard to find in the legislation. The only definition I could find is in Workplace bullying and harassment - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk) where they define it as "behaviour that makes someone feel intimidated or offended", so if a security guard claimed that was how he felt about being photographed, then there could be a case to answer. :wideyed: :exit:
 
Speaking to someone in the Police a while back and they said that big shopping centres are considered to be at risk of terrorist attacks - think about it, huge numbers of people moving around (normally anyway), it would only take a couple of suicide bombers to cause massive casualties. Witness to that would be the Manchester Arena attack and the subsequent enquiry. That’s why security are nervous and will jump on people they perceive as acting suspiciously. Whether a middle aged man (or whatever) with a camera is actually likely to be planning an extremist attack is irrelevant, they have to act irrespective of demographic, or at least be seen to be.

I’m not justifying the over zealous actions of some security folk, but I can understand the rationale for moving people on.
 
Speaking to someone in the Police a while back and they said that big shopping centres are considered to be at risk of terrorist attacks - think about it, huge numbers of people moving around (normally anyway), it would only take a couple of suicide bombers to cause massive casualties. Witness to that would be the Manchester Arena attack and the subsequent enquiry. That’s why security are nervous and will jump on people they perceive as acting suspiciously. Whether a middle aged man (or whatever) with a camera is actually likely to be planning an extremist attack is irrelevant, they have to act irrespective of demographic, or at least be seen to be.

I’m not justifying the over zealous actions of some security folk, but I can understand the rationale for moving people on.
I get that, but a terrorist isn't likely to hang around looking suspicious or drawing attention to himself.
I think the police like to use the "current climate" for a lot of things, rightly or wrongly....
 
Know your rights and stick to them. Don't let some Neanderthal hassle you just because he's a security guard or wearing a yellow vest. If you're on public property you're perfectly within your rights to take photographs - ask him to call the police if necessary and they'll put him in his place.
I wish I shared your optimism, if the police's handling of the pandemic guidelines are anything to go by. Then you could be in for a surprise at best or arrest at worst
 
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