Buying a 'Grey' import camera body Yes or No?

[TheBigYin]

someone mentioned grey importes "by proxy" earlier

that'd be me. Don't get in a huff - it's pretty easy to tell the Shills - apart from them registering specifically to say how good XXX company was, then never posting or replying again, they often have (ahem) non-matching IP addresses when compared to their supposed UK locations. We DO have one or two little "behind the scenes" tools to check things on the staff you know... it's not simply getting a green name-badge, a bad attitude and the keys to the big banhammer cupboard...

I must admit though, I've also asked the same question as BSM and StewartR have of a couple of the grey importers, with exactly the same response... i.e. no response whatsoever - indeed they stopped replying to any further emails I sent.

 

[StewartR]

Can you explain that further? A corporate body, such as the ones we are discussing, pays the VAT on import. The value on the invoice from the supplier to the UK "grey importer" is a financial transaction between the two companies. HMRC will not actually approach the end user for any VAT, it will be an issue between the the supplier, the importer and HMRC and it will probably be the UK seller that is penalised. You aren't the importer, you have bought a camera from a UK company

I think there's been a misunderstanding here.

If you buy from a company which holds stock in the UK, then the situation is as your describe. The company is the importer and is liable for payment of VAT and any applicable import duty. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that there are ways of evading those taxes, but that's a separate issue.

However, most "grey" retailers don't actually hold stocks in the UK, and their terms and conditions of sale make it clear that the purchaser is the importer. For example, here's what DigitalRev say:

By purchasing a product through the site, you agree that such purchase and the import of such product complies with the laws of the country to which you have requested DigitalRev Limited to ship the product, and agree that you will be considered the sole "Importer" of the product to your country for all purposes, including customs regulations and copyright and trademark laws.

And Simply Electronics say:

You agree that you are the sole importer of the product(s) and are responsible for all import duties and taxes, and any related levies for the purchase of your product(s).

I think that's pretty clear?

 

[Mitzyboy]

that'd be me. Don't get in a huff - it's pretty easy to tell the Shills - apart from them registering specifically to say how good XXX company was, then never posting or replying again, they often have (ahem) non-matching IP addresses when compared to their supposed UK locations. We DO have one or two little "behind the scenes" tools to check things on the staff you know... it's not simply getting a green name-badge, a bad attitude and the keys to the big banhammer cupboard...

I must admit though, I've also asked the same question as BSM and StewartR have of a couple of the grey importers, with exactly the same response... i.e. no response whatsoever - indeed they stopped replying to any further emails I sent.

Heh heh! No, the last thing you will see is me getting in a huff ..... but I could have seen how you might have drawn that conclusion, hence why I mentioned it

I think the bottom line to this discussion is that none of us really know. I can only draw conclusions from what I read and my experience (albeit a while ago) with HMRC. I tend to try and work on evidence rather than try and guess .... the discussion on this subject, here and elsewhere, will go on for a long time

 

[Mitzyboy]

I think there's been a misunderstanding here.

If you buy from a company which holds stock in the UK, then the situation is as your describe. The company is the importer and is liable for payment of VAT and any applicable import duty. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that there are ways of evading those taxes, but that's a separate issue.

However, most "grey" retailers don't actually hold stocks in the UK, and their terms and conditions of sale make it clear that the purchaser is the importer. For example, here's what DigitalRev say:And Simply Electronics say:

I think that's pretty clear?

OK, I understand thanks

 

[StewartR]

Now on the issue of invoice values, I'm not sure we are aware of actually how much (for instance) Canon UK pay to Canon Far East for their camera stock. We dont know either how much the "grey importers" pay their suppliers. So we are taking a huge leap to assume that the grey importer suppliers are misdeclaring invoice values. Just suppose that the difference in UK sales prices is down to excessive profits by the mainstream supplier chain. It's a possibility isn't it, we cant deny that

Evidence against your theory:
(1) When sales taxes and import duties are stripped out, mainstream retail prices in the UK are actually pretty similar to those in the USA, Japan, and other EU countries.
(2) B&H Photo Video in New York used to offer their customers a choice of 'regular' imports or 'grey' imports, at least for some equipment. The difference in price on a $1000-£2000 lens was typically $10 or $20. So little, in fact, that they eventually decided it wasn't worth bothering with.

Note that I haven't said anything about prices in Hong Kong. I don't have any data on mainstream retail prices in HK, because as far as I can see all the big HK retailers are geared up to sell to the UK and EU. (Domestic demand is clearly going to be relatively small for them.) It's possible that wholesale costs in Hong Kong (and only Hong Kong) are ~20% lower than they are in the UK, EU, USA, Japan etc. But if that were the case, then B&H would have been able to offer their customers much bigger discounts on 'grey' imports by buying from HK.

The evidence isn't solid, I grant you. But using Occam's Razor, I think the simplest theory which fits all the data is that the mainstream supplier chains in the UK, EU, USA and Japan are not making excess profits.

 

[JYC]

HK domestic market prices can be easily checked on price.com.hk

It's considerably cheaper over there than it is from HK sellers to the UK

eg. Nikon D750 is 10200 HKD (£910) while HDEW sell for £1069

 

[chuckles]

It's considerably cheaper over there than it is from HK sellers to the UK

eg. Nikon D750 is 10200 HKD (£910) while HDEW sell for £1069

Which is, as far as I'm concerned, how they make their profits whilst being in competition against the 'Official' Importer.

 

[big soft moose]

Can you explain that further? A corporate body, such as the ones we are discussing, pays the VAT on import. The value on the invoice from the supplier to the UK "grey importer" is a financial transaction between the two companies. HMRC will not actually approach the end user for any VAT, it will be an issue between the the supplier, the importer and HMRC and it will probably be the UK seller that is penalised. You aren't the importer, you have bought a camera from a UK company. e.

see this is where you are completely wrong , with the possible exception of Hdew, the grey sellers arent Uk companies - SLR hut and Kerso are based in the states, Panamoz, and Digital Rev are based in Hong Kong or Kowloon as are the majority of others . In nearly every case when you buy from a grey seller other than Hdew you are the importer so its you who is liable for the VAT and the import duty where relevant. (the big boys are generally honest about where they are based , the less reputable ones are more disingenuous in using virtual offices to pretend to be UK based when they aren't

What generally happens is that they send you the parcel and it either gets through customs unchecked (or misdeclared) , or it doesnt. If it doesn't the parcel is held at customs and you get a bill for the VAT (and any relevant duty) and the parcel won't be released to you until you pay it. Most of the big boys guarantee to refund you if this happens, or to take care of the payment for you directly, some of the less reputable ones won't and will just leave you out of pocket

 

[big soft moose]

I must admit though, I've also asked the same question as BSM and StewartR have of a couple of the grey importers, with exactly the same response... i.e. no response whatsoever - indeed they stopped replying to any further emails I sent.

I also asked SLR Hut to clarify their position on restocking fees (vis a vis their policy being a contravention of the CCR) , I did get a reply but it just said "please ring us to discuss this matter" - I responded by asking them to commit in writing as its important to know where you stand on these things and a comment in a phone call wouldn't be worth the paper its not written on .... nada.

 

[Mitzyboy]

see this is where you are completely wrong , with the possible exception of Hdew, the grey sellers arent Uk companies - SLR hut and Kerso are based in the states, Panamoz, and Digital Rev are based in Hong Kong or Kowloon as are the majority of others . In nearly every case when you buy from a grey seller other than Hdew you are the importer so its you who is liable for the VAT and the import duty where relevant. (the big boys are generally honest about where they are based , the less reputable ones are more disingenuous in using virtual offices to pretend to be UK based when they aren't

What generally happens is that they send you the parcel and it either gets through customs unchecked (or misdeclared) , or it doesnt. If it doesn't the parcel is held at customs and you get a bill for the VAT (and any relevant duty) and the parcel won't be released to you until you pay it. Most of the big boys guarantee to refund you if this happens, or to take care of the payment for you directly, some of the less reputable ones won't and will just leave you out of pocket

No, not completely wrong ....... I'm not going spend time searching every import company to see where they are registered, but straight away from my experience HDEW has a registered UK company office in the UK, and Ian Kerr (Kerso / Flash Camera) was based in Scotland last time I spoke to him, not the USA and he states clearly on his site that all goods are sent from Scotland in 1 - 2 days with "no hidden charges or taxes". Thanks for saying I'm completely wrong by the way, but seemingly you're not completely right either

Sending parcels wrapped in gift paper and described as spare parts is not dealing with someone that is very professional, and as always the best way to buy is to research and look for reviews on the internet. You'll immediatel discover examples of people who have beenturned over in this way, and know to avoid them

 

[big soft moose]

you will note that I said with the exception of Hdew - however although Ian Kerr lives in Scotland (at least part of the time) he told me personally that his company was based in america during a discussion about whether they were VAt registered ... admittedly that was a few years ago so it could have changed recently

not withstanding though you are still completely wrong about who the importer is when you buy from a grey dealer overseas - if they ship it to you from Hong kong/US/ anywhere outside the UK then you are the importer not the company that ships it to you

 

[rob-nikon]

With HDEW even though they are based in the UK it's states on their website customers are the importer and they import on your behalf making means of clearing customs. It's on the terms and condition page under a title like intellectual rights.

It's an interesting point about self declaration as the importer should declare it not the seller. How many grey items do come from the Far East wrongly labelled on the declaration label and only import paid if it gets caught.

I can understand the reasoning behind people's decisions to buy grey but the problem is if uk shops disappear then it's internet shopping only. Even trade shows are supported by the likes of canon UK, nikon UK, sigma UK so would they be as bothered to attend and support them?

 

[Mitzyboy]

not withstanding though you are still completely wrong about who the importer is when you buy from a grey dealer overseas - if they ship it to you from Hong kong/US/ anywhere outside the UK then you are the importer not the company that ships it to you

I havent been talking about buying from a grey dealer overseas, I've been talking about buying an imported camera from stock in the UK, and thats what the comments I made about the VAT being paid when the goods are declared on importation into the UK came from.

 

[Mitzyboy]

With HDEW even though they are based in the UK it's states on their website customers are the importer and they import on your behalf making means of clearing customs. It's on the terms and condition page under a title like intellectual rights.

It's an interesting point about self declaration as the importer should declare it not the seller. How many grey items do come from the Far East wrongly labelled on the declaration label and only import paid if it gets caught.

I can understand the reasoning behind people's decisions to buy grey but the problem is if uk shops disappear then it's internet shopping only. Even trade shows are supported by the likes of canon UK, nikon UK, sigma UK so would they be as bothered to attend and support them?

I think the whole procedure being discussed is becoming a little grey . I cant speak for every piece of equipment that HDEW (as you mentioned them) sell, but I can say that what I bought was UK stock delieverd in 3 days. Now, with the turnover of goods they must have, they arent going to import one camera or whatever, so a customs entry is done for a consignment of goods, VAT being paid into the UK at the time. In that circumstance, the entry has already been done. I've done them myself back in the day, it used to be a horrible job but now all done electronically of course. So although we can all draw our own conclusions as to that statement, it doesnt seem to me in HDEW case that there is likely to be any kind of VAT fraud or liability. I dont know for other companies, I havent resea5rched them

Anyway, we could discuss this forever, we're never all going to agree

 

[rob-nikon]

I think the whole procedure being discussed is becoming a little grey . I cant speak for every piece of equipment that HDEW (as you mentioned them) sell, but I can say that what I bought was UK stock delieverd in 3 days. Now, with the turnover of goods they must have, they arent going to import one camera or whatever, so a customs entry is done for a consignment of goods, VAT being paid into the UK at the time. In that circumstance, the entry has already been done. I've done them myself back in the day, it used to be a horrible job but now all done electronically of course. So although we can all draw our own conclusions as to that statement, it doesnt seem to me in HDEW case that there is likely to be any kind of VAT fraud or liability. I dont know for other companies, I havent resea5rched them

Anyway, we could discuss this forever, we're never all going to agree

I'm not saying they are committing any fraud,evasion or avoidance. I never even mentioned that. I was pointing out the fact that even if stock is in the UK their website states customers are the importer (whether its in bulk or a single item) just like other HK based grey sellers. It's something some may have not seen as the T&Cs page isn't one many read. It's an interesting point as responsibility for declaration lies with the importer not the seller so it's very likely the seller isn't doing anything wrong.

 

[Mitzyboy]

I'm not saying they are committing any fraud,evasion or avoidance. I never even mentioned that. I was pointing out the fact that even if stock is in the UK their website states customers are the importer (whether its in bulk or a single item) just like other HK based grey sellers. It's something some may have not seen as the T&Cs page isn't one many read. It's an interesting point as responsibility for declaration lies with the importer not the seller so it's very likely the seller isn't doing anything wrong.

I understand what you are saying, sorry if I confused the issue, but unless we are saying that HDEW have either hundreds of cameras posted to them individually and misdescribed to avoid duty / vat for which the buyer is liable, then the other alternative when the stock is already in the UK is that they were imported into the UK commercially, VAT & duty paid in the proper way. All cargo is manifested when shipped. Therefore when it arrives in the UK all manifested cargo has to be customs entered by the importer. They cant show you as the importer on the entry, as they dont know who "you" are and "you" dont have a VAT number anyway. Large importers have what are called deferment accounts. They quote a number on entry and they pay their account monthly. There is one other option which is a bonded warehouse where goods imported dont pay duty and are warehoused. Then the vat and duty is paid when the goods are removed. The cost of doing that is very expensive and I cant see its a viable option for them. So .... if the stock is already in the UK then the VAT & Duty has already been customs entered and paid, bearing no risk to the individual buyer

Therefore, no I dont fully understand why HDEW have that on their site, but I'm guessing its covering all angles legally ...... but with 30 years experience in the Customs and the freight industry where I specialised in imports from the far east, I know that the likelyhood of HDEW managing to bring equipment into the UK and then selling them after they have been imported (which is what they puport to do with a 3 day delivery supporting that) is very very very small indeed. Sorry that I refer to HDEW all the time. As with Kerso they are the only two I have real experience of dealing with.

All I am saying it that there surely ARE spurious suppliers around, as there are in any industry. BUT, I am also saying that there is a way of buying imports that doesnt have the risks that dealing with those suppliers

Totally off topic, one of the best cars I ever owned was one that was imported direct from Japan. The manufacturer said it was unfit for UK use, but history told us that in fact the car was perfectly fine in the UK, save having a reversing light fitted. They began to import them themselves 10 years afterwards

 

[Mitzyboy]

Just to lighten things a little, just got this message pop up on a Canon Photo group on Facebook. I'm sure this is right above board and fully guaranteed

SALAAM ALAYKUM BROTHERS AND SISTERS,

WE STRIVE TO OFFER YOU OUR COMPANY PRODUCT, WE SELL ALL KIND OF LATEST CAMERA, LENS, TV AND MUSICAL INSTRUMENT E.T.C .......... WE SELL ALL OUR PRODUCT AT AFFORDABLE PRICE.

SERIOUS BUYER SHOULD ADD ME UP OR INBOX ME.

Nikon D300s 12MP DSLR Camera... $950
Nikon D3X FX 24MP DSLR Camera ...$1500
Nikon D3 12.1MP DSLR Camera....$1200
Nikon D90 12MP DSLR Camera.....$500
Nikon D700 12MP DSLR Camera .....$650usd
Nikon D7000 16.2 MP Digital SLR Camera ...500usd
Nikon D800 36.3 MP Digital SLR Camera .....800usd

canon EOS 5d Mark III 22.3MP Digital SLR Camera....$1,200usd
Canon EOS 5D Mark II 21MP DSLR Camera..700

To Place Order with our company, send inquiries to the following name & email contacts For More Inquiries and Information About Our Products, Kindly Contact us At:

MAY ALMIGHTY ALLAH BLESS YOU, AS YOU ORDER ANY OF THIS PRODUCT.

 

[stu.artd]

I ordered a lens from HDEW. It was confirmed as in stock in the UK, arrived 2 days after I placed the order and I have been given a VAT receipt which is totally accurate regarding the lens cost and VAT applied.

 

[OldCarlos]

research and look for reviews on the internet.

You can't rely on that method. Many of the sellers (particularly the more dubious ones who pretend they are in the UK) threaten review sites with legal actions to get negative reviews removed.

 

[Mitzyboy]

Well, it's served me well for years so I'll stick with it, thanks

 

[big soft moose]

Just to lighten things a little, just got this message pop up on a Canon Photo group on Facebook. I'm sure this is right above board and fully guaranteed

SALAAM ALAYKUM BROTHERS AND SISTERS,

WE STRIVE TO OFFER YOU OUR COMPANY PRODUCT, WE SELL ALL KIND OF LATEST CAMERA, LENS, TV AND MUSICAL INSTRUMENT E.T.C .......... WE SELL ALL OUR PRODUCT AT AFFORDABLE PRICE.

SERIOUS BUYER SHOULD ADD ME UP OR INBOX ME.

Nikon D300s 12MP DSLR Camera... $950
Nikon D3X FX 24MP DSLR Camera ...$1500
Nikon D3 12.1MP DSLR Camera....$1200
Nikon D90 12MP DSLR Camera.....$500
Nikon D700 12MP DSLR Camera .....$650usd
Nikon D7000 16.2 MP Digital SLR Camera ...500usd
Nikon D800 36.3 MP Digital SLR Camera .....800usd

canon EOS 5d Mark III 22.3MP Digital SLR Camera....$1,200usd
Canon EOS 5D Mark II 21MP DSLR Camera..700

To Place Order with our company, send inquiries to the following name & email contacts For More Inquiries and Information About Our Products, Kindly Contact us At:

MAY ALMIGHTY ALLAH BLESS YOU, AS YOU ORDER ANY OF THIS PRODUCT.

Message them back and ask if the deals are really Kosher , i'm sure that will go down really well....

 

[big soft moose]

You can't rely on that method. Many of the sellers (particularly the more dubious ones who pretend they are in the UK) threaten review sites with legal actions to get negative reviews removed.

... and pay shills to put loads of glowing reviews on in order to skew the percentages ... of course doing your research properly does work if you cast a wide enough net rather than just looking at say Trust pilot and saying "ermagerd dodgy dave's devices has a 98.7% rating I must buy the 1DX hes offering for £250"

 

[OldCarlos]

 

[big soft moose]

I'm not saying they are committing any fraud,evasion or avoidance. I never even mentioned that. I was pointing out the fact that even if stock is in the UK their website states customers are the importer (whether its in bulk or a single item) just like other HK based grey sellers. It's something some may have not seen as the T&Cs page isn't one many read. It's an interesting point as responsibility for declaration lies with the importer not the seller so it's very likely the seller isn't doing anything wrong.

I don't know for sure, but my suspicion is that that is to cover themselves in case they don't have the goods to fulfil a certain order in the UK and have to ship it direct from konkers

 

[TheBigYin]

shills and legal threats are very common, yes. We've even been on the receiving end of both right here at times... usually they get the "considered response from the case of Arkell vs Pressdram (1971)"

 

[big soft moose]

shills and legal threats are very common, yes. We've even been on the receiving end of both right here at times... usually they get the "considered response from the case of Arkell vs Pressdram (1971)"

Was that case law for the misuse of teaspoons act 1956 which clearly states " we don't give a toss about your whining twangpole, go and play on the motorway"

 

[TheBigYin]

not quite


(added for the non Private Eye readers )

 

[big soft moose]

lol - the misuse of teaspoons act is a Barryboys thing which follows the same basic principal , (as you might imagine a site dedicated to taking the p*** out of badly modified cars gets a fair number of legal threats , mostly along the lines of "you has photographed my number plate and put it on the internet, this is private information so i'm going to sue you under the data protections act an that" - the responses from BB admin generally follow the same theme as Private Eye )

 

[OldCarlos]

not quite


(added for the non Private Eye readers )

Haha Love that final reply from PE

 

[Mitzyboy]

I've got to say ..... no offence meant ... that one could put up any reasoned arguement you wanted for SOME importers being completely good at what they do, and someone would find some unsubstantiated reason for why it's a terrible idea.

As I said before, we will never agree on this ... but all I can tell you from a personal point of view is that I have purchased four cameras over my camera progression, a 10D from New York direct, a 7D from Kerso, a 5Dii from someone on here and finally a 5diii from HDEW. I have not had an issue of any kind whatsover with any of the purchases. Of course those stating on here, other photographic forums, and the internetty in general might all be telling porkies, but my position is that I doubt it. I have also seen "professional" reviews on amazon and the like, it does happen for sure. Photographic forums from established members? Not so much i think.

I run a car forum, and we also get threats of legal action and even physical abuse from time to time. It can be dealt with, but it isnt pleasant.

 

[NewStreetPhoto]

All I can say is that you take your chances buying from anyone who's not subject to UK trading standards legislation, something I learned the hard way. I bought a Canon 5Dmk3 from a grey importer, it went wrong, and yes they did repair it, but they also sent it back as "Lithium ion battery packs" which it clearly wasn't. They also didn't return the power supply or the battery, which I had to replace alone with a hefty customs bill to get my camera back. Since the company is only a holding company for the main operation in Hong Kong there was basically nothing I could do other than take them to court in Hong Kong, which I couldn't afford [something they where well aware of] It was a bloody expensive lesson, but I learned it, and no mater what anyone sais in this discussion I won't be doing it again. The fat is that yes, there's a good chance that you will get a real camera and that things will be ok, but would you buy a car on the same basis? That maybe it will be ok? People buy second hand cars on that basis because there something that could be worth thousands for a couple of hundred pounds, not saving 150 quid, it's a no brained. Save up the extra cash and buy it from a retailer you know you can trust and that you can take to court I'd something does go wrong, or buy used with a valid guarantee. There's not a force on this earth that would make me buy from one of those sharks again!

 

[big soft moose]

All I can say is that you take your chances buying from anyone who's not subject to UK trading standards legislation, something I learned the hard way. I bought a Canon 5Dmk3 from a grey importer, it went wrong, and yes they did repair it, but they also sent it back as "Lithium ion battery packs" which it clearly wasn't. They also didn't return the power supply or the battery, which I had to replace alone with a hefty customs bill to get my camera back. Since the company is only a holding company for the main operation in Hong Kong there was basically nothing I could do other than take them to court in Hong Kong, which I couldn't afford [something they where well aware of] It was a bloody expensive lesson, but I learned it, and no mater what anyone sais in this discussion I won't be doing it again. The fat is that yes, there's a good chance that you will get a real camera and that things will be ok, but would you buy a car on the same basis? That maybe it will be ok? People buy second hand cars on that basis because there something that could be worth thousands for a couple of hundred pounds, not saving 150 quid, it's a no brained. Save up the extra cash and buy it from a retailer you know you can trust and that you can take to court I'd something does go wrong, or buy used with a valid guarantee. There's not a force on this earth that would make me buy from one of those sharks again!

To be fair that was simply electronics according to your previous posts - though i'm no fan of evading tax you can't really lump simply into the same category as people like panamoz or hdew who do at least exhibit much better customer service than you've experienced here

 

[Mitzyboy]

, but would you buy a car on the same basis? That maybe it will be ok? People buy second hand cars on that basis because there something that could be worth thousands for a couple of hundred pounds, not saving 150 quid, it's a no brained. Save up the extra cash and buy it from a retailer you know you can trust and that you can take to court I'd something does go wrong, or buy used with a valid guarantee. There's not a force on this earth that would make me buy from one of those sharks again!

Since you mention it, yes! I bought a grey import car from Japan. Almost the best car I have ever owned, and kept it for 13 years. Never went wrong .... not even once in those 13 years

If you bought from simply electronics then I can understand your angst. You only have to google them to see that there are problems associated with them. Even so, sorry you had such a problem. As big soft moose said, HDEW & panamoz are a little different. Painting them all with the same brush though is a little unfair when you see the good reviews some of them get

 

[Blured eyes]

Ok I have read through all pages and now my eyes hurt. No one so far has mentioned CPS.
I am still not exactly clear on what guarantee I would be getting with a canon body from HDEW because being a canon CPS member I send my stuff direct to canon (not just an authorised repairer ) for a guaranteed 3 day turnaround and if that cant be done then I get free loan equipment.
But if I were to buy from HDEW grey then the guarantee is via their own separate scheme which involves me sending to Glasgow and joining the back of the que and waiting (how long)

 

[rob-nikon]

Ok I have read through all pages and now my eyes hurt. No one so far has mentioned CPS.
I am still not exactly clear on what guarantee I would be getting with a canon body from HDEW because being a canon CPS member I send my stuff direct to canon (not just an authorised repairer ) for a guaranteed 3 day turnaround and if that cant be done then I get free loan equipment.
But if I were to buy from HDEW grey then the guarantee is via their own separate scheme which involves me sending to Glasgow and joining the back of the que and waiting (how long)

I'm guessing your CPS is provided by Canon UK so that probably answers the question but the easiest way to confirm would be asking via CPS.

 

[Mitzyboy]

Ok I have read through all pages and now my eyes hurt. No one so far has mentioned CPS.
I am still not exactly clear on what guarantee I would be getting with a canon body from HDEW because being a canon CPS member I send my stuff direct to canon (not just an authorised repairer ) for a guaranteed 3 day turnaround and if that cant be done then I get free loan equipment.
But if I were to buy from HDEW grey then the guarantee is via their own separate scheme which involves me sending to Glasgow and joining the back of the que and waiting (how long)

Its a one year Canon guarantee with two years extended with their own provider through Canon repair centres as far as I know .... but I cant answer your question further than that

On buying from HDEW I asked the samer question, and this was their reply (signatory removed)

"
We do import our stock from outside of the UK, however all of the products we sell are UK specification.
You will get a three year warranty which covers you for mechanical faults, breakdown, parts and labour and this will be repaired in the UK through a Canon approved repair centre. The first year of the warranty will be with canon and the next two years will be with us as your retailer.
Therefore we do not class our products as 'Grey Imports' as they come with a warranty valid in the UK and they are sold to UK specification."

 

[Blured eyes]

You will get a three year warranty which covers you for mechanical faults, breakdown, parts and labour and this will be repaired in the UK through a Canon approved repair centre. The first year of the warranty will be with canon and the next two years will be with us as your retailer.

I suppose that I will have to call canon and ask, its the and this will be repaired in the UK through a Canon approved repair centre part because I send my stuff direct to canon and being a CPS member I get fast a turnaround, but if I sent to approved then I wait in the que.
I wonder who has needed a grey canon repair in this forum and actually sent it direct to Canon- Elstree rather than an-other repair centre

 

[JYC]

Presumably if you are a pro and it matters that much then saving a few quid to risk your livelihood is not a good idea