Developing 120 Film

RichardH

RichardH

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Richard
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Hi all,

I have been developing 35mm film (colour and b&w) successfully for the past year. No issues other than the usual hiccups with the first few rolls. Colour is using Tetanal C41 at 30C exactly as per the instructions (8 min Dev, 6 mins Blix, I stray and do an Ilford rinse, 1 min Stabliser). Have been very successful with it to date.

I recently bought a Pentax 67, and have just shot my first roll of Portra 160 120 film. I am pretty certain I exposed the film well when shooting, using the inbuilt meter. Loading the film into the Paterson tank was a bit different, but no real issues. I followed the usual guidelines, and it was a total fail. Totally underexposed film. I am clueless how this happened. My only concern with the procedure was the fact the film was not in a canister but with a loose end when I took it out of the camera. But I understand that is how it is and it should be protected by the paper backing.

Any ideas would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Richard
 
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Hi Richard,

Firstly welcome to the best bit of the forum. Without wishing to teach my grandmother to suck eggs etc have you checked the meter in the 67 against a known light-meter? As you say the camera is new to you it may be worth sending it away for a CLA just to make sure its all functioning as it should be.

Are the film stock and chemicals new, do you have a roll of b&w you can throw through it just as a test? It's also possible that the iris may be stickiy/slow.

Did you buy it from a dealer or the well known auction site?

I hope it's something simple and easily sorted, I really like the 67, awesome cameras I some times take mine out with the Pentax Auto 110, from the sublime to the ridiculous :D
 
Definitely check the meter. Those built in ones on the older 67s can be a bit dodgy.

Doesn't sound like you messed up getting the film out as that would have resulted in light leaks/streaks.
 
Thanks for the quick response. Just checked the light meter against a canon 6d over a range of shutter speeds, and it is pretty close. The 67 is overexposing a tad. So that won't be it. I bought it from a reputable dealer (I think - Mr Cad near Victoria) with a 3 month guarantee. The film was new and the Tetanal is about 2-3 months old. I developed some 35mm just yesterday, and it was fine. I am beginning to wonder if there is a light leak, though the camera looks in close to mint condition.

RaglanSurf said:
Hi Richard,

Firstly welcome to the best bit of the forum. Without wishing to teach my grandmother to suck eggs etc have you checked the meter in the 67 against a known light-meter? As you say the camera is new to you it may be worth sending it away for a CLA just to make sure its all functioning as it should be.

Are the film stock and chemicals new, do you have a roll of b&w you can throw through it just as a test? It's also possible that the iris may be stickiy/slow.

Did you buy it from a dealer or the well known auction site?

I hope it's something simple and easily sorted, I really like the 67, awesome cameras I some times take mine out with the Pentax Auto 110, from the sublime to the ridiculous :D
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RichardH said:
Thanks for the quick response. Just checked the light meter against a canon 6d over a range of shutter speeds, and it is pretty close. The 67 is overexposing a tad. So that won't be it. I bought it from a reputable dealer (I think - Mr Cad near Victoria) with a 3 month guarantee. The film was new and the Tetanal is about 2-3 months old. I developed some 35mm just yesterday, and it was fine. I am beginning to wonder if there is a light leak, though the camera looks in close to mint condition.
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I've bought quite a bit of stuff from Mr Cad and they're pretty good. i suppose it's possible the iris is a little sluggish, I would have though a light leak would have produced an obvious streak rather than across the whole image. Any chance you could post up an example?
 
Nothing to show. Totally clear negative, which probably means the whole reel had been totally exposed to light?

RaglanSurf said:
I've bought quite a bit of stuff from Mr Cad and they're pretty good. i suppose it's possible the iris is a little sluggish, I would have though a light leak would have produced an obvious streak rather than across the whole image. Any chance you could post up an example?
Click to expand...
 
Clear negative with film markings (manufacturer, film name etc.), or completely blank piece of cellulose?
 
RichardH said:
Nothing to show. Totally clear negative, which probably means the whole reel had been totally exposed to light?
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No, if it was exposed to light the begs would be totally black, are the edge numbers still there?
 
Its been a while since I processed b&w so not sure here because I've never done this, but is there a chance you put the fixer in first then dev?
 
Have you checked iris and shutter actually work by opening the back and watching what happens when you hit the shutter release?
Sounds like no light is getting onto the film plane. Can the dark slide stay in place when you use the camera?
Matt
 
Hiya I only have experience of colour neg processing in a machine. If like previous poster mentions that negs are completely blank with numbers only and no images then film is unused. Check to see if the base colour of the film is similar to other films processed. If lighter developer is dead. If similar dev is ok. Our machine developer can die overnight. This is usually a problem with bleach contamination or too much air... hope this helps
 
Edge numbers are there.

MatBin said:
Have you checked iris and shutter actually work by opening the back and watching what happens when you hit the shutter release?
Sounds like no light is getting onto the film plane. Can the dark slide stay in place when you use the camera?
Matt
Click to expand...

Hmm can't fire the shutter with the back open, but I've looked from the front and the iris seems to be opening as you would expect on different apertures. Don't understand this question...?

Can the dark slide stay in place when you use the camera?

Bluekwack said:
Its been a while since I processed b&w so not sure here because I've never done this, but is there a chance you put the fixer in first then dev?
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It was Colour film, and absolutely certain the chems were in the right order.
 
Also as a side note if your 120 film is very loose you will get fogging at top and bottom of negs strip ta
 
Wow. It was literally perfect yesterday. I have those collapsible bottles and try to eliminate most of the air every time.

All. I have thought of something which I thought was unusual. I usually presoak the negs in 30C water. When I poured it out to add the developer, it came out a strong green colour. Never seen that before. Is that a factor or a red herring?

nicspics said:
Hiya I only have experience of colour neg processing in a machine. If like previous poster mentions that negs are completely blank with numbers only and no images then film is unused. Check to see if the base colour of the film is similar to other films processed. If lighter developer is dead. If similar dev is ok. Our machine developer can die overnight. This is usually a problem with bleach contamination or too much air... hope this helps
Click to expand...
 
If you develop 35mm with no problem there's no reason you would struggle with 120. That's mean there's a problem with you initial exposure. Colour is really forgiving too. So you're camera must be under-exposing by a large amount! A problem with your meter or maybe you just set to the wrong iso by mistake?
 
Hiya ta my dev smells awful and looks purple when dead but that is machine based. So if you have numbers etc and they are same density as your 35mm and there are no images afraid it is a camera fault. If you look closely at negs if totally no images then possibly failed aperture etc or dark slide still in place. If dodgy shutter would expect something really faint or very overexposed..
 
Don't think so. ISO was bang on - I checked. And as I said, the meter was very close to the meter on my Canon.

Lemaildetom said:
If you develop 35mm with no problem there's no reason you would struggle with 120. That's mean there's a problem with you initial exposure. Colour is really forgiving too. So you're camera must be under-exposing by a large amount! A problem with your meter or maybe you just set to the wrong iso by mistake?
Click to expand...
 
RichardH said:
Yes all the numbers are on the top and bottom of the film.
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Then the processing was fine I think, so my guess is the film has not been exposed, so no light got to the film. Which means either the iris didn't open, the shutter didn't fire, the film wasn't wound on or some other unknown reason. If the iris is working correctly the shutter sounds like it's not working.
Not sure if the dark slide can stay in place and allow you to wind on and shoot but something is stopping light getting to the film, it was wound on film side to lens wasn't it, not paper side?
Matt

Scrub the dark slide idea, it doesn't have one, my mamiya does so I assumed yours had one too.
 
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RichardH said:
Edge numbers are there.



Hmm can't fire the shutter with the back open, but I've looked from the front and the iris seems to be opening as you would expect on different apertures. Don't understand this question...?

Can the dark slide stay in place when you use the camera?



It was Colour film, and absolutely certain the chems were in the right order.
Click to expand...

Ah sorry I assumed it was b&w
 
Ignore my ignorance but did you fix it before developer and bleach mistake :) many of us do these in start
 
Hiya when you unpack film you have to remove a tab to unravel film to load..... then after using film when you remove film there is a tab that you can lick to wrap around film when taking out of camera to keep it light tight... sometimes the paper around film says processed and unprocessed hope this helps ta nick
 
RichardH said:
Didn't see a sticky bit, but I kept the film fairly tightly wound and was developing it soon after.
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Can you confirm that you loaded the film on the left hand side as you look at the back and removed it on the right hand side - the wind on lever side.
 
The shutter made its usual massive noise each time. The film had fully wound onto the other reel when I opened the back. As I said early, the iris (aperture) seems to work. Bewildered.

MatBin said:
Then the processing was fine I think, so my guess is the film has not been exposed, so no light got to the film. Which means either the iris didn't open, the shutter didn't fire, the film wasn't wound on or some other unknown reason. If the iris is working correctly the shutter sounds like it's not working.
Not sure if the dark slide can stay in place and allow you to wind on and shoot but something is stopping light getting to the film, it was wound on film side to lens wasn't it, not paper side?
Matt

Scrub the dark slide idea, it doesn't have one, my mamiya does so I assumed yours had one too.
Click to expand...
 
Yes I saw that. Didn't know you had to lick it. I didn't unroll it, but it was loose. I did cut off most of the backing paper in order to get the film onto the real.

nicspics said:
Hiya when you unpack film you have to remove a tab to unravel film to load..... then after using film when you remove film there is a tab that you can lick to wrap around film when taking out of camera to keep it light tight... sometimes the paper around film says processed and unprocessed hope this helps ta nick
Click to expand...
 
Hiya putting film onto processing reel? Or camera reel did you see tab first or last (Have to go now for a bit) ta nick
 
RichardH said:
Yes I saw that. Didn't know you had to lick it. I didn't unroll it, but it was loose. I did cut off most of the backing paper in order to get the film onto the real.
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When you loaded the film onto the spiral was the tape holding the film to the backing paper at the beginning of the film or at the end of the spool.
 
I saw it onto the cameral reel, and placed it into the hole in the spool. I think I cur it off before I loaded the film on the processing reel.

nicspics said:
Hiya putting film onto processing reel? Or camera reel did you see tab first or last (Have to go now for a bit) ta nick
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RichardH said:
I saw it onto the cameral reel, and placed it into the hole in the spool. I think I cur it off before I loaded the film on the processing reel.
Click to expand...

Something doesn't sound right here, but I can't quite put my finger on it.

You shouldn't have to cut anything when loading 120 film onto dev. reel, just pull backing from film.
 
Hiya from the above either film in wrong way round(forgot that idea so credit to previous poster) or camera fault worth reloading film and paper onto spools and reloading in camera taking note on directions etc and worth checking shutter works and also speeds of shutter ta nick
 
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