Dilema - DSLR or Micro 4/3s ?

[amnesia]

Hi all

After progressing with my Fuji S9600 bridge camera for a year or so I have decided that I want to get a little more involved in my photography and purchase a 'proper' camera.

Volcanic ash permitting, I have booked a holiday in Tenerife in early September and would like to re-visit Mt. Teide and make the most of the dramatic landscapes from the summit. The last time I went there I was limited to a fairly average Ricoh compact (although the 28mm wide angle lens was useful). The apartment I have booked also has a perfect view over Los Cristianos to the sea for awesome sunsets so landscapes are definitely on the cards, although I don't want to restrict myself by choosing the wrong body or lens.

I appreciate the main difference between the two is the bigger sensor on a full size DSLR has better low-light sensitivity, and thus you can get away with higher ISO settings, but I have a feeling that I wouldn't use a big, relatively heavy camera as often as a micro 4/3rds.

I have read through all 2000+ posts on the Panasonic GF-1 and I am thoroughly impressed with the images that people are getting out of this little gem. I am tempted to pull the trigger on the kit with the 20mm prime but I am wondering what I would gain or lose over, say, a Nikon S5000 with 18-105 VR lens, or Canon 550D and 18-55mm for around the same money ? I am not worried about the lack of IS on the 20mm lens, and would probably buy the standard Panasonic kit lens before long anyway. Having said that, using the same lens for everything surely helps develop technique and experimentation ?

I am interested in all sorts of photography, but primarily landscapes, pet portraits, and macro I guess. I have a cheap Raynox DCR-250 macro lens that gives good results with my S9600 - I know it's sacrilege to use with a quality prime, but would this work with the Panny 20mm ?

I have 'around' £750 to spend (to also include filters, spare battery, and SD cards etc). I want to buy new rather than pre-owned. I already have a tripod and bags that would fit either format.

Any thoughts ?

I know I am going to get the 'go and try both and see what you like' responses, but are there any reasons that I should consider one type over the other from a 'learning about photography 'point of view ?

Sorry for the long post, but I want this camera to aid my learning of the art, rather than hinder it. I would like to try and sell my images through my website or stock image sites at some point (a long way off I suspect), too.


Kind regards,
Daniel.


Mods - if this belongs in the 'equipment' section, I apologise

 

[Anorakus]

As I understand it, the limitations of the four-thirds system are linked to the small sensor size - limited scope for depth of field effects, and noise at high ISOs compared with the larger sensors found in DSLRs.

The advantage is that the cameras and lenses are smaller and lighter than their DSLR counterparts.

You pays your money..

A.

 

[AndyWest]

I have the GF1 and was going to sell it due to the 2x crop factor and noise above ISO400 but i pulled the plug on the ebay listing as i just couldn't part with it.

This camera suprises me all the time. The longer i use it the more i'm impressed. It's features and image quality far out weigh it's small problems. The 20mm lens is a jem!!! You can get a 7-14mm lens but it's arround £850+ The 14-45 is also very good. I have recently bought a Canon 40D which compared with the GF1 is a monster! (still good though!)

I was in Tenerife a few weeks ago and we stayed at Playa de las Americas and the sunsets over the island were stunning (see my Flickr) Where you are is just up the road so will be as good.

Also the pics i have at Mt Teide are pretty impressive as the air was so clear and the sun was not too strong. Images are not up yet but i need to sort and upload soon.

My pics were taken with a Canon s90 so the GF1 should be even better!

 

[Tracer]

Why don't you compromise and get a 4/3 DSLR - much better handling but still quite small and discreet. There is an Olympus E-620 kit in the classifieds just now here and it is an outstanding camera.

The sensor is not much smaller than the Canon 1.6 crop. My OH has the E410 and doesn't find noise an issue, and the 620 is better (also in-camera stabilisation). It's true that you wouldn't get quite such dramatic DOF effects but this can also work to your advantage - I don't think it would be a problem for your preferred subjects. Also the Olys have wonderful colours, and seem to give the best OOC jpegs of all.

Just a thought... good luck with making a decision.

 

[Voyager]

I'm not a committed digital user yet - but I think the way 4/3s is going looks good.

I can see a lot of good reasons not to be hauling about a huge lump about when taking pictures and I'm not convinced I need a full sized body just to take digital images. My wife has bought a D700 and with the 14-24 it is a MONSTER compared to a Panasonic with the 7-14 both in the hands and in the wallet! The digital Panasonic is not even larger than my film favourite, the Contax G1.

 

[amnesia]

I have the GF1 and was going to sell it due to the 2x crop factor...

Andy, can you please explain what you mean by the 2x crop factor ? Why is this bad ? I realise the sensor is half the effective size of a 35mm camera, but I don't understand why this is a problem, or what crop factor is. Do you not still get the same 12mp image ?

I was in Tenerife a few weeks ago and we stayed at Playa de las Americas and the sunsets over the island were stunning (see my Flickr) Where you are is just up the road so will be as good.

Also the pics i have at Mt Teide are pretty impressive as the air was so clear and the sun was not too strong. Images are not up yet but i need to sort and upload soon.

My pics were taken with a Canon s90 so the GF1 should be even better!

Yes, we're not far from Playa de las Americas, but we're quite high up so should be able to get some good silhouettes at sunset.

Cheers,
Daniel.

 

[grum]

Only problem with the crop factor is that it's hard to get very wide lenses. As 14mm on a M4/3 sensor is equivalent to 28mm on a 35mm camera. The only wide lenses are pretty expensive.

I love my GF1, take it everywhere - can't really see why I need an SLR

 

[amnesia]

Only problem with the crop factor is that it's hard to get very wide lenses. As 14mm on a M4/3 sensor is equivalent to 28mm on a 35mm camera. The only wide lenses are pretty expensive.

I love my GF1, take it everywhere - can't really see why I need an SLR

Cheers... 28mm is as much (or rather, as little) as I need for now I would think.

Any pics using the Raynox with your 20mm ?

 

[grum]

This was taken with the raynox DCR 250 and the 20mm - needs a step up ring though as the 46mm filter size is too small - got one off ebay for a couple of quid.

Here's one with the 14-45 and the Raynox

 

[amnesia]

Cool - nice shots !

I think I am 99.9% there...

 

[PeteStewardson]

I got a GF1+20mm at Christmas, and TBH I keep thinking about selling and buying a D5000 instead. The only reason is not really being able to get used to using the screen and not having a proper viewfinder. It takes great photos, and I've never found the smaller sensor a problem, but I'm not sure it suits me.

So I'd say think carefully how you like to use a camera.

Pete

 

[amnesia]

I got a GF1+20mm at Christmas, and TBH I keep thinking about selling and buying a D5000 instead. The only reason is not really being able to get used to using the screen and not having a proper viewfinder. It takes great photos, and I've never found the smaller sensor a problem, but I'm not sure it suits me.

So I'd say think carefully how you like to use a camera.

Pete

I very rarely use the EVF on my Fuji S9600... I am happier with the screen for the vast majority of the time. I will pop into my local photography shop tomorrow and see how I get on.

Daniel.

 

[Voyager]

As 14mm on a M4/3 sensor is equivalent to 28mm on a 35mm camera. The only wide lenses are pretty expensive.

As the market grows this is sure to change.

I might even finally make a move to one of these when they make a fast 10mm (or wider) prime for this format!

 

[Voyager]

I very rarely use the EVF on my Fuji S9600... I am happier with the screen for the vast majority of the time. I will pop into my local photography shop tomorrow and see how I get on.

Also take a look at the G1 (& GH1) - although they have 'through the lens' viewfinders they also have articulated screens that the GF1 doesn't.

 

[phototuition]

I use full frame for my work (boring product and headshot stuff), Aps-c and micro fourthirds for training and for pleasure... micro fourthirds has it.

IQ and Bokeh are to some degree issues but the size of the gear means I take it with me. I never intended to use the MFT cameras but fell in love with the GF-1 plus 20mm, subsequently grabbed a G1 for £350 with cashback to get the extra battery and 14-45mm (which is a truely sensational kit zoom) also got the 45-200 which focuses quickly but has weak IS and ain't that sharp.

The G1 has a great electronic viewfinder, the one for the GF-1 is useless. With Gf-1 I'd stick with the 20mm most of the time and grab a shoe mounted metal Voightlander 40mm viewfinder.

The G1 is great unmissable at the moment and takes very sharp pix with the kit lens and is great for not too heavy landscape stuff, you'll have it with you when the big ones are lleft at home but if you really want quality for stock libraries etc I'd suggest a D90 rather than a D5000 and get a lens recommendation from one of the landscapers here. The D5000is a bit fancy and for £550 the D90 is my suggestion for Quality.

I think I've rambled a bit.. John

 

[LongLensPhotography]

I very rarely use the EVF on my Fuji S9600... I am happier with the screen for the vast majority of the time. I will pop into my local photography shop tomorrow and see how I get on.

Daniel.

I can see why - they are tiny and not very good. Once you get a proper dSLR you will mainly use the viewfinder and never want to go back.

 

[Overexposed]

I've just sold my Gf1 and 20mm because I couldnt get on with not having a viewfinder - and its not great in bright sunshine trying to frame a shot on the lcd!
It does take good pics though!