Disappointing First Sales Interaction with Fotospeed

Geoff Moore

Geoff Moore

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Several months ago I enjoyed a cracking presentation from a technical Sales rep from Fotospeed, who went through several papers and options. The presentation was very enjoyable, informative and the business ethos really resonated with me. Fotospeed go above and beyond to help consumers looking to print at home' was the message I took away with me. Moving forwards a few months I'm now in a position to do my own printing at home rather than sending to 3rd parties,I have decided on 3 paper types, which Fotospeed can provide at circa £50-70 per 25 sheets

As Fotospeed are pushing hard on their advertising online and in social media channels, with the likes of The Tog Cast and Youtube and a gaggle of celebrity photographers endorsing and receiving sample papers, I sold on giving them my business. As such I wanted to make use of thier FREE ICC profiling they provide on their papers, which they are keen to stress is FREE (which actually isnt free)

So I asked Fotospeed sales, If could they supply me either free or at cost a sample of the three papers I want to use at a size that is suitable for them to profile against. Perhaps I took the reply the wrong way, but I was informed "we unfortunately cannot open a A4 pack and send a sheet of each paper however we do have test packs available but as the papers you are interested in are spread across 3 different test packs this wouldn’t be the best option for you. What I would suggest is cutting a sheet of A3 paper in half to make some A4 profiling sheets"

Am I being too sensitive on this? I do feel somewhat disappointed that Footospeed are unable or unwilling to to make purchasing and using their paper selection as easy as they like to make out from their advertising, after all even their about us page states "Everyone at Fotospeed is dedicated to ensuring that your requirements are met." obviously not everyone.

Regards
Geofff 'Butthurt'
 
Thanks for the comment Paul. :)
I have previously read your post when making my final decisions on printing at home and it went some way in to reassuring me of my decision to want to use Fotospeed, along side the presentation, that I thoroughly enjoyed by one of their technical sales reps.
Perhaps its a business decision to get people to spend monies on test packs, but I have no need, I know what paper I want to use and I want to be able to use their 'Free' ICC profiling service, its just disappointing that fotospeed's process to enable a customer to enjoy that requires pre-purchase of either the paper in bulk or a test pack thats not required.

Regards
Geoff 'Still Salty' :)
 
Dear Mr. Still Salty ... ;)

Not sure what printer you have but their generic profiles are pretty good so if you have an irresistible urge to print these would at least give good results. As you intend to get the paper anyway I can't see the issue with cutting one sheet in half to produce the profile prints on. If you require 3 test packs to cover the requirements imo that way leads to madness, as you will be tempted to try all of the papers and trust me it doesn't end well :eek: (yep been there, done that ...).

They tend to turn the profiles around quite quickly so you wouldn't be waiting too long. In the past some companies did supply free test packs but not sure any do now as its been a long time since I looked. Anyways, I need you to support fotospeed, I've no idea what I'd do if I couldn't get their platinum baryta paper!! :D
 
Hey Paul.
Dont worry, I wont be running any boycott Fotospeed campaigns anytime soon. So you Baryta is safe for now....

I'm aware of the generic profiles, I have a canon Pro 10S btw. but I like to know that there are no compromises, as such a bespoke profile is the only guarantee that I wont keep wanting, or think i'm missing out, so I suspect I'll have to bite the bullet, unfortunately :)
Regarding the sample/test packs I have already had the same thought I quite agree, And think more options would only lead to greater indecision.

Still, on reflection the limitation Fotospeed are pushing on to people does give me an idea of a business idea - Custom Paper Selection Packs :) Out of adversity comes opportunity and all that

Regards
Geoff
 
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I know nothing about photospeed but I was wondering what size paper were they charging £50-70 per 25 sheets. That to me seems extremely excessive amount. As for going to a presentation why? all these presentations are to hook you on buying their stuff.

Guess they have hook line and sinkered you into believing theirs is the best
.
Sounds like the time share con, won't let you leave until you sign up for something and possible pay there and then. Oldest trick in the book offering something for nothing to get you to attend. Once attending, slick well trained sales staff get you to believe in anything to make a sale

Geoff I hope you havn't fallen for it. Whatever you do never never sign up for anything there and then

have a look at
http://www.ilfordinkjet.co.uk/products/inkjet-paper/smooth-gloss.html

a really great photo quick drying paper and a lot cheaper than the one you quote I suspect. I would not use anything else
 
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Thanks for the comment Bazza. For A3 Art paper that is the going amount give or take a little. I too know nothing about photospeed however Fotospeed are a well established paper provider for in the UK for home printing among other things.
I'm pleased to say that yo are wrong about me being hook, line and sunk? :) I'm well aware of the various alternatives and options from other suppliers.

There is no con, to fotospeed, just very aggressive marketing at the moment and a mission statement that's not been backed up by action in my opinion on my first commercial dealings with them, as its only the once I can assume this is not the rule, as others on here have had exemplary customer service from them. Time will tell of course

Regards
Geoff
 
Geoff
I have a suspicious nature and where marketing is concerned even more so. My thoughts are they want to get into your wallet and see how much they can extract. i did a short selling course with BT and it really opened up my eyes on presentation especially. The golden rule is not to sign up for anything or pay without going away first to think about it. Checkout what else is available and do a comparison in your own time
 
Geoff Moore said:
Thanks for the comment Bazza. For A3 Art paper that is the going amount give or take a little. I too know nothing about photospeed however Fotospeed are a well established paper provider for in the UK for home printing among other things.
I'm pleased to say that yo are wrong about me being hook, line and sunk? :) I'm well aware of the various alternatives and options from other suppliers.

There is no con, to fotospeed, just very aggressive marketing at the moment and a mission statement that's not been backed up by action in my opinion on my first commercial dealings with them, as its only the once I can assume this is not the rule, as others on here have had exemplary customer service from them. Time will tell of course

Regards
Geoff
Click to expand...

Have a look at Marrutt as well. They do some great paper including Hahnemuhle fine art cotton rag. Similar prices £70 odd for 25 sheets of A3+.
https://www.marrutt.com/inkjet-papers/fine-art

They also do a full sample pack for £5.57.
https://www.marrutt.com/inkjet-papers/marrutt-sample-inkjet-paper-packs

or if you're just interested in the fine art papers, you can get a sample pack of 6 papers for £1.65

They also do free profiling.
 
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Geoff Moore said:
Several months ago I enjoyed a cracking presentation from a technical Sales rep from Fotospeed, who went through several papers and options. The presentation was very enjoyable, informative and the business ethos really resonated with me. Fotospeed go above and beyond to help consumers looking to print at home' was the message I took away with me. Moving forwards a few months I'm now in a position to do my own printing at home rather than sending to 3rd parties,I have decided on 3 paper types, which Fotospeed can provide at circa £50-70 per 25 sheets

As Fotospeed are pushing hard on their advertising online and in social media channels, with the likes of The Tog Cast and Youtube and a gaggle of celebrity photographers endorsing and receiving sample papers, I sold on giving them my business. As such I wanted to make use of thier FREE ICC profiling they provide on their papers, which they are keen to stress is FREE (which actually isnt free)

So I asked Fotospeed sales, If could they supply me either free or at cost a sample of the three papers I want to use at a size that is suitable for them to profile against. Perhaps I took the reply the wrong way, but I was informed "we unfortunately cannot open a A4 pack and send a sheet of each paper however we do have test packs available but as the papers you are interested in are spread across 3 different test packs this wouldn’t be the best option for you. What I would suggest is cutting a sheet of A3 paper in half to make some A4 profiling sheets"

Am I being too sensitive on this? I do feel somewhat disappointed that Footospeed are unable or unwilling to to make purchasing and using their paper selection as easy as they like to make out from their advertising, after all even their about us page states "Everyone at Fotospeed is dedicated to ensuring that your requirements are met." obviously not everyone.

Regards
Geofff 'Butthurt'
Click to expand...


I’ve been using Fotospeed for years and have always been very happy with their service and products. Their baryta paper is pricey but superb for Monochrome prints.

You could always try Permajet and see if they would oblige you with a similar request as their range of papers is similar and they also offer a profiling service like Fotospeed.
 
Their test packs do have a big "Free ICC profiles" label on the front but then the small print says 'excluding test packs"! I can understanding them excluding the test packs; they don't want to be flooded by people requesting six, eight or more free profiles at a time on papers they might not actually go on to buy.
 
Marrutt do some great 2 for 1 offers as well, not always the papers advertised is the one you want but if you phone then they have always done the deal for me.
 
Please correct me if I've misunderstood your first post, but given you know which 3 papers you want then you've got to buy them to make up a stock to do prints with? So then with that in mind the ICC profiles are free, given you've got buy the paper anyway. They do charge for non-fotospeed papers.
 
Hi Stu.
The point im making is in three parts, the first is, in order get the 'free icc profile' I need to cut one sheet of A3 from each of the 3 packs I intended to purchase from Fotospeed in half. Then print the test print on each A4 cut and send back to Fotospeed for them to provide me the profile. Thus its not really free.
(The smallest size they will accept for profiling is A4)

The second point is, I was more than happy to buy 3 sheets of A4 in the paper types I will be using, I even asked them for a price to acheieve this, but Photospeed wont or dont want to provide me that option, they suggested (although they agreed its not ideal) that I would need to buy 3 packs of test samples of which 20+ papers I will have no use for.

The third point is the Marketing and Sales pitch Fotospeed are putting out at the moment that they are championing the concept that people can print at home, and they they are there for you every step of the way and will do everything they can do to help, as such when this is tested its obvious on this first interaction with their sales team this isn't the case. I wonder if I had a social media following or gravity within the social sphere if my request for 3x A4 pieces of paper, (which I was happy to pay for) wouldn't have been to much problem form them at all.

Alas, its no longer a problem, I have not spent £200+ on papers with Fotospeed, But have purchased from else where, thanks to other recommendations above. Obviously this loss of purchase to Fotospeed is neither here not there, but I just feel disappointed that I fell for their marketing and sponsoring of 'celebrity' photographers on twitter and Youtube etc.

Regards
Geoff
 
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Has this different suppler thrown in some free A4 sheets for profiling?

Personally I'd have bought some A4 packs anyway, there's going to be times when A3 is too large.
 
Geoff Moore said:
Hi Stu.
The point im making is in three parts...
Click to expand...

Hey Geoff.

Is it then (so I understand) that you wanted to check the ICC profiles with the test paper before purchasing the A3 packs of what you needed? I appreciate it's not free in the sense you have to print on the paper and then pay for postage to them but the actual profiling itself is free on their own papers so I don't think it's unreasonable for them to say it's free, given I think it's £20 on other manufacturers papers? And if not and you have bought the paper anyway, then it's basically postage which I think cost me 79p or so when I sent mine.

You raise a good point though in terms of 'celebrity' photographers in our genre, I do always think they get preferential treatment but as we know it's all a numbers game and companies use that to their own advantage. I mean I have no standing with any company whatsoever (and prefer to keep it that way so I can just do what I want) so I totally get what you mean. You only have to look at the latest rising star of Kase Filters to see if they sponsor a few good well known photographers then everyone else buys to be seen to be keeping up with the jonses.

Cheers, Stu.
 
Hi Stu. Kinda.
In essence, up front I would have had to buy 3x packs of A3 papers.
From each of these packs one sheet would need to be cut in half, a test print then done and sent back to Fotospeed in order to profile my printer per paper type.
Thus leaving me with 24 1/2 sheets per pack. For the project I'm working on I would then need to purchase an additional pack of each papers, as I need 25 of each.

So, x3 A4 samples which I was happy to pay for would have worked out perfect. As I could have printed the full 25 pc run x3 with confidence.
 
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Geoff Moore said:
Hi Stu.
The point im making is in three parts, the first is, in order get the 'free icc profile' I need to cut one sheet of A3 from each of the 3 packs I intended to purchase from Fotospeed in half. Then print the test print on each A4 cut and send back to Fotospeed for them to provide me the profile. Thus its not really free.
Click to expand...

Just to add another perspective to this, I've paid for profiles from different providers (not Fotospeed) to be made in the past and in every case I have used sheets of paper from the paper stock I had bought to make prints from. Which I have incorporated into how much paper I might need to buy.

With this background, when reading the adverts from Fotospeed for "free profiling" it would never have occurred to me that this covered anything more than the same service I had previously been paying for, i.e. the profiling part, so for me, from what you describe, the service really is free, as it would save me the cost of getting a commercial profile made.

I suspect that anyone who had previously paid for a profile would think the same way, but maybe if they are aggressively targeting "new" printers, they need to be clearer that the free profile "only" includes the profiling.

I realise you offered to pay for a few extra sheets for the profile, but also I think I can understand their reluctance at doing this, as it adds an extra layer of complexity into a free service, where you obviously want to keep the costs down.
 
Geoff Moore said:
Thus leaving me with 24 1/2 sheets per pack. For the project I'm working on I would then need to purchase an additional pack of each papers, as I need 25 of each.
Click to expand...

I think you would be very lucky to achieve 75 prints over three different papers successfully at first attempt without wasting a single sheet, you would probably end up buying more anyway.

Personally I would have purchased the three packs if I had made the decision, used generic profiles to produce profiling prints, then waited for the free icc profiles before continuing with the printing.
 
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