Do I give up my studio?

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KerryPhotoGirl

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Name
Kerry
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i opened a studio 3 years ago and have struggled to pay the overheads ever since. I tried portable and it didn't work for me-I hate it, too much can go wrong. I do the odd wedding but it seems like people don't want to pay very much.
I have a 1yo and another baby on the way and I seriously am feeling very depressed about my profession. I love photography, I love the work I do but I am fed up of working and spending time away from my family to pay rent and bills and not take a wage. I'm not a very good business person-it's just not in me. I've worked so hard to keep it going and want to keep it so when kids are at school I have something for me that I love but I just feel like I am constantly treading water. Any advice? Has anybody else felt like this and how has your situation been turned around? Thanks, x
 
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The way I see things develop in the last 15 years,
elitism is the only way to go. In an area (or time)
where/when a photographer could be busy, now,
no other option is left than the best gear, the best
skills and the will to work for nothing.

My son's school best buddy has a bigger brother
that will marry in mid August. Olivier (now 17 years)
knows this family very well since 5 years, he wanted
to do the job and was offered a somewhat fair amount
for the wedding by the fathers of the couple. The big-
ger brother insisted that a cousin covers the day with
his point and shoot as he will do it for free. My son did
not take this too easily.

As I said somewhere else on this forum, where we are,
some 15 toggers are competing on the market and none
is really making a decent living. If it was not for our well
developed corporate clientèle, I would not go on with this
trade and not have prepared my sons to take over.

Many trades and crafts are pushed out of the market
place with this globalization trend, photographers are
among the victims.

Enjoy your family and your motherhood as this world
needs a lot more happy people.
 
It's very sad, Kerry but if your space can't earn its keep, I reckon it should probably go. The other option would be to spend more time making the studio earn its own way but with the children, time is at a premium and the cost of child care would negate any extra earnings that more time there might raise.
 
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ADDENDUM

A few thoughts and traps…

— Technologies are developing so well that it is almost a shame at this time.

— If the major gear makers want to sell there stuff, they have to show a trade
where fun and good things are to be hoped for.

— Olivier was attending a 5 year photo program in an art and trade school. He
begged me to take him out of there as he felt he was learning nothing after 4
months of 4h/day commuting. He declined the school offer to let him jump up
in the fourth year class after seeing his portfolio.

Crazy times, really!
 
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You'll get more advice if you hit report and ask a mod to move this thread to the Business forum.

Would business mentoring help? There used to be lots of free advice available for that kind of thing. There's bound to be folk offering paid advice too.
Can you take someone on - possibly as a partner - to help run the business side of things and turn it around? (I doubt it, but I thought I'd ask).
Can you sublet the studio? Or get in on the huge model photography scene - see PurplePort, Model Mayhem etc - and let it by the hour?

KerryPhotoGirl said:
I do the odd wedding but it seems like people don't want to pay very much.
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Don't take this the wrong way but this suggests that maybe your skills could do with improvement. Have you ever asked anyone for an in-depth portfolio review?
 
As you've already identified, it isn't about photography at all, it's about business, and if you're not good enough at business you have just two choices.
Stop, or learn.

Ours is a grossly overpopulated proffession, simply because the entry barrier is far too low - anyone can spend what is, in relative terms, a tiny amount of money and call themselves a pro photographer. That person is then running a micro business that competes with the real world of pro photography.
Think of another one-person micro business, making deliveries in a van.
The van will probably cost £20,000, not counting maintenance and a backup - how many "pro" photographers put in that level of investment?
And the driver has real experience - how many photographers have any real experience?
And the driver has at least passed a driving test - how many photographers have had any real training?

That's what I mean by a very low entry barrier, the barrier is much higher even for white van man.

Now, you can either accept that this is the world that you've entered and struggle, by competing with people who will work for less (and there are plenty of people who even work for free) or you can do something about it, by promoting yourself as a real professional, turning out top quality work, charging high rates and doing less work for more money. If you do that then your only real competition will be people whose work is equally good, who are just as professional and just as determined as you are to make their business work - the people who are grubbing around right at the bottom end of the market won't be able to compete, and you'll have a totally different client base to them, because better clients don't hire poor photographers and "cheap" clients only hire cheap photographers.
 
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Running a business isnt for everyone, so if you arent making much money, and its making you unhappy then stop ...
 
Mr Bump said:
How about sharing your premises with maybe another photographer?
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Don't know why I didn't suggest this! It's exactly what Mrs Nod does to pay the rent and service charge on her (yoga) studio. Of course, it's pretty hard to break yoga mats or other props compared to studio lights etc. but it's certainly an avenue and potential revenue stream worth exploring.
 
Mr Bump said:
How about sharing your premises with maybe another photographer?
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Trouble is you may then have problems with each of you competing with clients.

Frankly if you're struggling and it's getting you down then I would say it's just not worth it as in the end you will probably be forced to pack it in.

And if you're not a very good business person then you're on a hiding to nothing.
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They are always banging on about business plans on things like Dragons Den and they have a point. I've known a few people who have their own businesses and have staggered along, hand-to-mouth for years because I think they felt that packing it in was throwing away everything they had invested, the longer you go on the more you feel you have to loose. But if you treat it as a business, have a plan which sets out what you expect to invest and earn, you know when to stop because you are not hitting your targets.
 
Way back when, I was struggling to make enough to support a growing family... to the point I gave up and took another job. In the end, I don't regret it at all. Now photography is just an expensive hobby I do because I love it... I make a little money here and there to fund purchases/equipment, but I don't have to worry about it and I don't go looking for it really.
 
I recommend listening to a podcast called photography marketing masters by Nigel Merrick. He gives great advice on how to keep your business running well, stop slumps, keep customers, pricing advice and the list goes on.

You could look into renting the studio out by the hour to others who may want to use it. There are many places who do this.

If it's the business that you struggle with then you will always struggle as these days skill with a camera doesn't often come in to it.
 
Thank you so much got everybody's advice. I was having a bad morning and this post has made me realise how badly I don't want to give up just yet. I feel I am a strong photographer, especially in the town that I am based. It is the business side I struggle with and obviously need to be putting more time into this. As it stands the studio does cover its overheads-it's just always a worry in the back of my mind where it is going. With two kids and childcare I couldn't make money from any other job I took anyway so will throw myself into the business world as much as I can. Forgive me for posting in wrong place-not quite got my head around the app yet! Thanks again for taking time out to reply-I don't have many fellow photographers around me much anymore! Xx
 
Though not too local but I wonder if the business networking that British Junior Chamber offers might help expand your business knowledge.

By not too local the nearest to you seems to be Liverpool

http://www.jciliverpool.org.uk

Or indeed whether there is a business mentoring service in your area?
 
Don’t give up
your establishing yourself (most important)
its also time to reinvent
find a bread and butter gig (montessori,schools,dance competitions,graduations etc
Lessen the info on your website
Keep weddings A and B rather than ABCD
don’t go on saying how passionate you are..... let the shoot and the photos do the talking.
invite passer byes to look in your window i.e. create a scene
start a photo/studio course for local teenagers
Don’t give up..
 
KerryPhotoGirl said:
I love photography, I love the work I do but ... I'm not a very good business person-it's just not in me.
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And that sums up your problem, Kerry. It also explains why the only sensible thing to do is to let go of your studio now, before #2 is born.

In the real world as opposed to the internet, anything else is just putting off the inevitable and making that even harder when you finally have to face it.
 
KerryPhotoGirl said:
@OldCarlos yes this is me. Website needs some updating as this isn't my best work anymore. Will get it brought up to date and ask for some critique in the near future. Thanks for the advice xxx
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A few tips for your website, please take this as constructive.

Your slideshow on the home page cycles too fast, you don't get enough time to look at the picture, let alone read any content. It instantly creates a poor user experience for a potential client as what I'm trying to read keeps disappearing.

The website isn't very friendly for my iPad, the social bar covers the content and makes it difficult to read.

Importantly, your blog hasn't been updated since April 2014! This is a great way to increase traffic to your site and show recent work. Families will share blog posts on social media and this will increase awareness of your brand. If you want to save your business, create a blog post today!

Your gallery is large and cluttered, it takes a long time to load.
You should show less of your work but make sure whatever you show is you best work and that it is current.

I hope you find this helpful
Mark
 
You have a skill and a passion, but clearly you have newer priorities at present.

So get someone else to critically appraise the business, look at sharing the facility, but dont be afraid to walk away for a few years whilst your kids are growing up.

You have the skills. They wont go away, but stressing over this will affect your enjoying the early years of their lives when they really need you.

If you have another bundle of joy on the way, then your time and stress are going to be heightened. You dont need to put extra pressure on yourself. Children are only young once.


Consider taking a career break. 5 years, 10 years. You decide.

That will release the financial burden of the studio overheads and hopefully make you happier.

And in years to come, that will be what your kids remember you for.
 
a) you say you are 'proud to specialise in weddings' , but you also offer portraits , pet potraits, parties and product photography , how does that qualify as specialising in anything ? I'd suggest honing down your main offer

b) you are also proud of your prices (I'd have said its an odd thing to be proud of) which are £25 with a 5x7 then plus upsell ... so the question is how long does the average sitting take (including your processing time .. and how many of those sittings then lead to a decent level of upsell ... it may be that you don't actually need more jobs, you just need to increase the per client spend

c) ref the website DONT WRITE EVERYTHING IN CAPITALS as it comes accross as SHOUTING and is quite off putting to read.

d) the facebook link on the website takes people to your personal facebook page, not to a business page
 
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Like I said-my website needs updating. I appreciate everybody's feedback on my website but I was initially asking what others would do in my situation, rather than a critique. I didn't post my website-somebody else found it and posted it [emoji85]. Once I'm in a less vulnerable and sensitive position I.e not pregnant, hormonal and generally s***ting myself about my future, I will be asking for critique on a new and improved website.
This has been a really good thread for me-taken everybody comments on board. The ones that have told me to quit have made me realise I'm not ready yet and the constructive critique has made me realise I need to research more, ask for feedback/help and get my s*** together before I give up on myself! Xxx
 
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No matter what if your fit and well thats all that matters, good luck with the child as I am sure it will bring you much joy, and you get to use the camera :)
 
Hi Kerry

Lots of good points above, but let's tackle the trickiest bit - your photos on your website - they are just not very good or contemporary and to keep in business you really need to up your game a lot :(

Lack of business acumen aside, if your product isn't great people aren't going to want to pay much, if anything, for it

I looked at the Weddings bit as that's probably the easiest to market to and get an increase in business, and I didn't see a single photo from a Wedding anywhere, even the downloadable pdf has no photos on it; and that's just crazy and no wonder bookings are low

I was also confused by the 'WE' you talk about endlessly, when it sounds like its just you, but this really confused me...

Quote - KRP is very proud to specialise in wedding photography

Yet on your Home page you offer services as below, so there is no specialisation is there and that's probably off-putting to many as you're an average jack-of-all-trades
  • Portrait Photography
  • Newborn Photography
  • Wedding Photography
  • Events Photography
  • Product Photography
  • Modeling Agency Portfolios
  • Pet Portraits
My suggestions:
  1. if the business isn't making enough money to draw a wage its not a business, so stop it
  2. take a few weeks/months to relax and shoot just for yourself to rekindle your joy of photography
  3. then take a long hard look at what you really want from it, and that may not be a business at all, but if it is
  4. specific photography training is needed in just 1 or 2 of the above genres, no-one can do all of them well, so decide what's a best fit and really produce some more modern cracking work in that (those) fields
  5. make a plan and work on a relaunch after also taking lots of business & marketing training/advice
  6. put together a strong, even if limited, portfolio of cracking images rather than the ones you have at the mo then with a reworked website all SEO'd up...
  7. relaunch :)
That might well take a year or more but it'd be time well spent, and if you decide business is not for you, then don't worry about it or feel like a failure just make sure you enjoy photography and look for some other way to make money, or don't bother at all if you don't really need more money, just enjoy yourself & your family :)

Good luck

Dave
 
DG Phototraining said:
  1. if the business isn't making enough money to draw a wage its not a business, so stop it
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That - and when you write your business plan for business.2 , make sure that delivering an income is the first aim of the business not am afterthought - a business that covers its own costs but doesnt support your "wage" after the set up phase is basically a hobby or a liability.

I'd say there are two parts to ensuring profitability

a) the income side , ie are your prices based on predicted custom sufficient to provide your income after all necessary costs are deducted ? (there are various ways to work that out but the simplest is to work out what you need to live per annum, add all your necessary costs of doing business and divide by the predicted number of clients ... is this figure competitive to your area and market ? If it is great, if its too low fanntastic you can increase it and the ammount you take out in income, but if its too high you either need more clients or lower costs , what you don't reduce is your core need income.

b) on the cost side is every cost of doing business i) absolutely necessary and ii) the best possible deal (which doest always mean cheapest) - a clasic example here is the studio , rent/bills etc probably make up a great deal of your business costs , but if you are offering weddings , parties , and portraiture out and about as well as studio portraits and the studio is only washing its own face , then your business would be more profitable without it . (another clasic area for costs getting out of hand is gear, where it takes a veery hard eyed look to differentiate between what you need and what you merely want.)

Lastly a point i found a little odd from your previous post was where you said other jobs would be uneconomic due to child care costs... surely that is also due for running your own business as it isnt practical to shoot a wedding or spend a decent ammount of time in the studio whilst also doing your own child care.
 
DG Phototraining said:
Hi Kerry

Lots of good points above, but let's tackle the trickiest bit - your photos on your website - they are just not very good or contemporary and to keep in business you really need to up your game a lot :(

Lack of business acumen aside, if your product isn't great people aren't going to want to pay much, if anything, for it
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I don't agree with this. The photos aren't that bad, I've seen a lot worse. I know photographers out there who take awful photos but they're making a tonne of money from it and a lot of people can't tell a good photo from a bad one anyway.

As has already been said, it's mostly down to the business side of things. I found the layout and setup of the website a bit confusing which isn't good but it's probably only a small part of the bigger picture.
 
connersz said:
know photographers out there who take awful photos .
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'Mediocre photographer but excellent business acumen' will always beat 'amazing photographer but only mediocre at business'
 
big soft moose said:
'Mediocre photographer but excellent business acumen' will always beat 'amazing photographer but only mediocre at business'
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True - but what's wrong with her trying to be a better photographer too? Its not hard is it, go on a course with a good photographer and copy what good photographers do! Or at least come close to what they do and you've upped your game a lot easily, you don't even truly have to understand the technique only copy it

I've seen worse as well, but those photos are 5+ years out of date styling-wise and they are all just 'lit' there's no technique other than stick a flash in front and fire, its old hat and boring photography, which isn't making it desirable

Dave
 
DG Phototraining said:
True - but what's wrong with her trying to be a better photographer too?

Dave
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Because at the moment her priority is getting her business back on track. The photos might be out of date but people are still buying this kind of thing.

If she's going to contemplate doing a course it should be in business skills not photography.
 
DG Phototraining said:
Then take a break, reinvent and come back all guns blazing :)

Dave
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We spent all of our savings pre baby setting up the studio-if I take a break I don't think my OH will be giving me a second shot at this.
I will have to throw myself into it before baby no 2 arrives. Update my website, try and be more creative with my shoots and become a good business person quickly.
As long as it ticks by until the children are at school I can cope with that. It's just stressful sometimes and would be easier to give up x
 
connersz said:
If she's going to contemplate doing a course it should be in business skills not photography.
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Well we'll have to disagree on this one then

I think it'd be far easier (and quicker) to learn a few more modern & wow techniques, that she could then market to all those she's already sold to and friends thereof, than to start to learn how to write a Business Plan for example (which I've never done btw)

And to the OP - I wish you well whatever you decide to do :)

Congrats on baby #2 as well

Dave
 
You are going to need to have some cover presumably when the happy day arrives, so consider taking a partner into the business (who you can trust), who perhaps has the business skill in particular as well as photo skills that you lack. You have the studio and established business.....quite likely someone would want to partner you in this, given you have premises, a bit like Dragons Den; they put some money into the business for a share of future profits. And you gain from their business expertise.
 
shreds said:
You are going to need to have some cover presumably when the happy day arrives, so consider taking a partner into the business (who you can trust), who perhaps has the business skill in particular as well as photo skills that you lack. You have the studio and established business.....quite likely someone would want to partner you in this, given you have premises, a bit like Dragons Den; they put some money into the business for a share of future profits. And you gain from their business expertise.
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Also possibly share/let out part of the premises to an artist or picture framer?
 
DG Phototraining said:
True - but what's wrong with her trying to be a better photographer too? Its not hard is it, go on a course with a good photographer and copy what good photographers do! Or at least come close to what they do and you've upped your game a lot easily, you don't even truly have to understand the technique only copy it

I've seen worse as well, but those photos are 5+ years out of date styling-wise and they are all just 'lit' there's no technique other than stick a flash in front and fire, its old hat and boring photography, which isn't making it desirable

Dave
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Theres nothing wrong with improving both ... but improving business skills will show the greater return. That said i'd definitely agree with you that part of the improved business should be focussing on mastering one or two areas rather than trying to be a jack of all trades

The other thing as regards stuff like websites is that proffesionals hire proffesionals they don't try to do everything themselves ... its amazing how photographers will regularly get upset about web designers trying to do their own photography instead of hiring in a pro or buying images, but when a photographer wants a website they frequently go downthe DIY route
 
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